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my thoughts

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posted on Jan, 31 2004 @ 08:38 PM
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hi here r my thoughts
1. the x-22 anti gravity disc really isnt a anti gravity disc, lockheed submitted a patent for a spec op craft that usses six turbine shafts
2. the aurora is a fast moving uav that doesnt go hypersonic sppeds but is like a sr-71 only with stealth like an f-117
3. where r pics or info on lockheeds competitor to the b-2?




posted on Feb, 10 2004 @ 03:22 PM
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please reply somebody



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 09:12 AM
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my thoughts on the Aurora: www.air-attack.com...

I believe it is a hypersonic military space plane (MPS)...



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 10:28 AM
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1. the x-22 anti gravity disc really isnt a anti gravity disc, lockheed submitted a patent for a spec op craft that usses six turbine shafts


I seen this on TV a while back and I dont think the project worked.
Anyway if you ever did see the manuvers a real UFO can perform than you would relize that only an anti-gravity drive could preform such feats.



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 11:52 AM
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Ok first, the aurora is hypersonic.
Second the X-22 is antigrav, if it can hover in place without a lot of force its antigrav.
And third i dont think there is a competitor to the B-2, the b1 there is (tu-160)
Those are my thoughts



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 12:28 PM
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in the book lockheed stealth the book writers mentioned the fact that the b-2 was only a competitor for a lockheed desighned stealth bomber based heavily on Hve Blue. They mention that Northrop won the contract but no pictures or information about the Lockheed bomber were ever released.



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by roniii259
1. the x-22 anti gravity disc really isnt a anti gravity disc, lockheed submitted a patent for a spec op craft that usses six turbine shafts
First off, there is no proof that the X-22 "Disk" exists at all. The Darkstar to which it is attributed was rolled out with much pomp and circumstance and touted as an advanced technology UAV with a great loiter time. But that doesn't explain the multi-millions involved in it's development.
There is almost certainly a black project cloaked somewhere in the shadows of Darkstar, but anti-gravity? It's all guessing at this point.


2. the aurora is a fast moving uav that doesnt go hypersonic sppeds but is like a sr-71 only with stealth like an f-117
The "Aurora" line item on a late 1980's defense budget most likely represents a high-flying, low hypersonic aircraft - if it exists it probably has a crew of 2 and incorporates a design vaguely similar to the SR-71.
Why manned?
In the 1980's & 90's the USAF would not have trusted something that fast and that expensive to go unmanned over a treacherous territory without having a pilot who could have "hands on" to evade or recover from any mishaps.

Here's something to consider;
Chances are the aircraft that stemmed from the "Aurora" line item (if it exists) is still in service but it is thought in some knowledgeable circles that the actual high threat recon work is now being conducted by a hypersonic craft of the "waverider" design.

3. where r pics or info on lockheeds competitor to the b-2?
The ATB (advanced technology bomber) project is what Northrop's B-2 came from. Lockheed's version although there are no pictures to be found on the web was called "Senior Peg" the winning Northrop design was called "Senior Ice".
Senior Peg is said to have been a flying wing design much like the B-2 and supposedly had more extreme saw-toothed trailing edges on the wings.

Northrop won the ATB contract in October 1981, some say because the economy was bad at the time and the Pentagon wanted to keep Northrop afloat as well as Lockheed (who was producing the F-117).



[Edited on 16-2-2004 by intelgurl]



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 02:05 PM
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[quoteIn the 1980's & 90's the USAF would not have trusted something that fast and that expensive to go unmanned over a treacherous territory without having a pilot who could have "hands on" to evade or recover from any mishaps.

you forgeet about a project that skunk works had durring that time called quartz, which was a predecessor for darkstar. this uav carried new stealth and sensor technologies that were just as complicated as a supersonic uav. Further more not all of quartz was declassified, leading to the assumption that parts were used in a project being used currently. I can to this assumption because i talkedd to an intelligence analysier in the AIC or whatever it is called now. I asked him if the aurora or someting with its capabilites was real and he flatly said no, but when i asked him why the sr-71 was brought out of retirement he said it needed to fufill a role that was temporarily unfufilled. In later conversations he told me that uavs were the backbone of the us intelligence aircraft fleet. so from all this info i gained my assumption.



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 03:37 PM
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I am not stating anything for fact here, but it may good to consider this:

The Air Force Intelligence officer you spoke to gave you the answers that he is supposed to give people, even close friends and family. To do otherwise he would or at least should spend the next 10 years in Levenworth Federal Pen.

Regarding the SR-71 being recommissioned because it "needed to fufill a role that was temporarily unfufilled", that would be a standard response to such a question.

What is certain is that before the SR-71 was recomm'ed there were sightings, witnesses to sounds of pulsating jet sounds never before heard around certain AFB's, sonic phenomena dubbed "skyquakes" by the USGS, rumbling across the skies of the southwestern states - (these skyquakes were unlike any known sonic footprint including the SR-71's), etc.

It was after the USGS stated that there were high-flying, extremely high speed aircraft generating this effect that the SR-71's were recomm'ed.
Skyquakes continue to this day to be reported over Nevada, Utah and California... But now when the USAF is called about it they just shrug their shoulders and say, "huh, musta been an SR-71"...

Recommissioning a retired bird like the SR-71 is a small financial burden to pay to keep a top secret recon platform from becoming common knowledge.

As far as a high supersonic or low hypersonic vehicle being a UAV, I have to stand by my earlier statement;
"In the 1980's & 90's the USAF would not have trusted something that fast and that expensive to go unmanned over a treacherous territory without having a pilot who could have "hands on" to evade or recover from any mishaps."

Additionally, it would be a foolish endeavor with 80's and 90's technology, to rely on a satellite uplink, which would have a .5 to 2 second delay, to remotely control a near hypersonic vehicle travelling several miles every 60 seconds over enemy territory, considering it would be loaded with millions of dollars of top secret, advanced technology sensory equipment onboard.

Again this is just my opinion which is subject to being flawed.

[Edited on 11-2-2004 by intelgurl]



posted on Feb, 11 2004 @ 03:47 PM
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I personaly would trust anything intelgurl told me, IF she said she seen god i would beleave her. She has some of the best info. And no Bull-Crap. So if she is telling you, what she thinks is fact , more than likely it is.



posted on Feb, 12 2004 @ 06:22 AM
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acually that guy i was talkin about was/is? an intel guy for the atlantic fleet, or in other words a navy guy. a supersonic uav would not have had to use satellite hookups, it could have used ground stations or an AWAcs controler.



posted on Feb, 12 2004 @ 06:48 AM
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Originally posted by roniii259
acually that guy i was talkin about was/is? an intel guy for the atlantic fleet, or in other words a navy guy. a supersonic uav would not have had to use satellite hookups, it could have used ground stations or an AWAcs controler.

Ground stations may work over friendly territory where you have lots of them, but for an aerospace vehicle assumed to have a range similar to or greater than an SR-71, going deep into enemy territory, ground stations are not an option for this endeavor.

Awacs too have a specific range of operation where accurate glitch free data can be transferred - this would work for a Global Hawk or Predator UAV but it just isn't an option for going west to east over mother Russia at near hypersonic speeds... (an incident that was cited in the Russian media last year which launched a diplomatic inquiry to the US from the CIS - will try to find a non-cyrillic link)

In other words... it still would have to be satellite control...





[Edited on 12-2-2004 by intelgurl]



posted on Feb, 12 2004 @ 07:37 AM
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in fact a declassified drone did fufill this requirements while the a-12 was built, called the d-21
www.simpits.org...
it was first launched off a a-12, then eventually was used off b-52's. this drone was used over china and the ussr and carried ram. If this was built in the late 50's, why couldnt a high performance drone be built in the 1980's?



posted on Feb, 12 2004 @ 12:15 PM
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in fact a declassified drone did fufill this requirements while the a-12 was built, called the d-21
it was first launched off a a-12, then eventually was used off b-52's. this drone was used over china and the ussr and carried ram. If this was built in the late 50's, why couldnt a high performance drone be built in the 1980's?


Actually it's my understanding that the D-21 was not a remotely controlled vehicle as we would think of them today, but rather it utilized an Inertial Navigation System and Automatic Flight Control similar to ballistic missiles. (I think Honeywell made the D-21's INS)

Theoretically, slight navigational changes and self destruct instructions could be made by the LCO of the mothercraft IF range and other considerations permitted.

Because radio control functionality was so vulnerable to range, temperature, atmospheric anomalies, the potential of jamming, etc.... coupled with the fact that the US did not want the top secret craft falling into the wrong hands, Skunkworks installed a barometrically detonated explosive to ensure the craft's destruction should it fall below a predesignated altitude.

There is certainly a very good possibility that something similar to the D-21 is in existence today... I will not disagree with that assertion at all... and just to clarify, by being similar to the D-21 I mean a small, high-speed URAV platform with a wide-ranging sensory suite, launched from a mothercraft...etc.

But regarding the initial thought you had concerning the alledged craft spawned from the "Aurora" defense budget line item, I ask you to consider this:

However enthusiastic the USAF top brass may be over using relatively inexpensive URAV's & UCAV's for recon and combat functions now and more-so in the future - there is understandably less enthusiasm for going unmanned in a more robust recon platform with tens of millions of dollars on-board in classified, highly advanced electro-optical, infrared, and radio frequency (EO/IR/RF) passive/active sensory and imaging systems.

This rationale coupled with the need for realtime in-flight adjustments on an expensive recon platform, combined with the sightings already discussed here, in other ATS threads and particularly several widely reknowned aerospace publications including Janes and ASTW, all seem to point to a manned high-speed recon platform being in existence.

[Edited on 12-2-2004 by intelgurl]



posted on Feb, 12 2004 @ 04:36 PM
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damn good thread guys!



posted on Feb, 13 2004 @ 11:48 AM
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Originally posted by roniii259
[quoteIn the 1980's & 90's the USAF would not have trusted something that fast and that expensive to go unmanned over a treacherous territory without having a pilot who could have "hands on" to evade or recover from any mishaps.

you forgeet about a project that skunk works had durring that time called quartz, which was a predecessor for darkstar. this uav carried new stealth and sensor technologies that were just as complicated as a supersonic uav. Further more not all of quartz was declassified, leading to the assumption that parts were used in a project being used currently. I can to this assumption because i talkedd to an intelligence analysier in the AIC or whatever it is called now. I asked him if the aurora or someting with its capabilites was real and he flatly said no, but when i asked him why the sr-71 was brought out of retirement he said it needed to fufill a role that was temporarily unfufilled. In later conversations he told me that uavs were the backbone of the us intelligence aircraft fleet. so from all this info i gained my assumption.

ronii your naive, first off never trust a military officer to give you info about top secret stuff, you should know that, and second off provide links to your info plz, i find this interesting.



posted on Feb, 13 2004 @ 08:33 PM
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[quote
ronii your naive, first off never trust a military officer to give you info about top secret stuff, you should know that, and second off provide links to your info plz, i find this interesting.

acually he is a civilian worker, and noithing he said was top secret it was the way he twisted the words. The information I got on quartz is in the book lockheed stealth, and it is almost essential in understanding the underworkings of classified projects from the u2 to the uav's of today.



posted on Feb, 13 2004 @ 08:48 PM
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here is a blue printof an aircraft ive never seen before

community.webshots.com...

& here is the vtol craft i was referring 2 earlier
community.webshots.com...



posted on Feb, 13 2004 @ 10:15 PM
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cool pix roniii ~ did the book give more information on these?

The first one looks like a stealthy Global Hawk or Predator - (at least in the IR wavelength, noting the turbofan positioned on top of the fuselage)...
The second one is intriguing - what all does your book say about it?



posted on Feb, 13 2004 @ 10:39 PM
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1) I think I have a picture of the competetor, it's on my other computer though, it doesn't have a modem yet. When I get a modem on it I will post the pic.

2) The Aurora does exist and is hyper sonic.



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