Civil War II: The Coming Breakup of America

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Originally posted by LDragonFire
The freedoms once shared by all Americans are being either eliminated or are being greatly curtailed all in the name of security. Has the government gone too far, yes it seems they are, not only that they continue on this path.

Let me ask you an honest question. What is it that you were able to do fifteen years ago that you can't now? You claim our freedoms have been eliminated. Where? Which ones? Really, while I am very skeptical of our government, I think politicians are scum, I am failing to see where we have lost all of these freedoms that some seem to insist we have lost.

[edit on 18-11-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Freedom of assembly = freespeech zones
we have wittnessed the end of Habeas Corpus and Posse Comitatus these were in existence to protect our right of due process and from the military from patroling our streets. just to name a few.

[edit on 18-11-2007 by LDragonFire]

Posse Comitatus was essentially done away with, unfortunately, with the siege on the Branch Davidians at Waco. This is not anything that just recently happened.

[edit on 18-11-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Posse Comitatus was essentially done away with, unfortunately, with the siege on the Branch Davidians at Waco. This is not anything that just recently happened.

[edit on 18-11-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

I see you point here. Now answer this, is this ok with you?

Before 9/11 the FBI could not send undercover agents into religious organizations to spy, Now after 9/11 if you attend a church or really any kind of club or organization, you can bet there are members of the federal police in your group, all in the name of fighting terrorists.

reply to post by LDragonFire



Do I like it? No.

However, what do you suggest they do? I mean, I can sit and complain, but if I don't have any other alternative ways to accomplish the finding out and capture of people who would love to see the destruction of America, then I shouldn't really say anything. Well, let me rephrase that... I can say something, but of what good is it?




[edit on 18-11-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by LDragonFire

 

Do I like it? No.

However, what do you suggest they do? I mean, I can sit and complain, but if I don't have any other alternative ways to accomplish the finding out and capture of people who would love to see the destruction of America, then I shouldn't really say anything. Well, let me rephrase that... I can say something, but of what good is it?

The people spoke loud and clear during the 06 elections. But what has been done since? What change did congress do, when the "people" clearly stated we want a new direction? Our government is not serving the best interest of "the people" they are not listening, but I don't have any answers of what to do.

Nothing changed, we got the some ol crap, just wrapped in a new box.

Dragon, typically that is what happens. Oh, they all talk like they are going to bring big changes to Washington... Bush did. Yeah, he brought changes. He made it even more derisive than it was before he took office!!!

What I have found to be true about the two major political parties in this country is that their members will say whatever they deem necessary to say in order to get elected. Once they get in there, it's a whole other ball game.They quickly lose any allegiance they claim to have had to their constituients.

reply to post by ChrisF231


America stopped being a democracy in the 1800's when the supream court decided that it could creat law and the other two branches of gov. alowed it to do so! Americans no longer lived in a represintive repuputic but, a judicial dictatorship. That is why Politics in america have become so divisive! The political parties know that by wining elections you get to chose the judges( the dictators ). I call them dictators because they have the power to dictate law and and bypass the democratic process. Knowing the Power of an activist court the parties (and the media) were willing to do anything to win. Now we find that this has culminated in americans being fractured to the point we that we fear and worry more about what our political opposition than we do real enemies! A house divided acan not stand.

I have seen a possible conflict coming for some time, I'm at a loss as to how to fix what is wrong. Here are some older threads I posted a couple of years ago on this topic:
*Revolutionary War Watch* USA
*Civil War Watch USA*



[edit on 18-11-2007 by LDragonFire]

Dragon, what is going to wind up happening, maybe not in our lifetime, is a complete upheaval. I think eventually, things will get to such a point to where people will actively work towards the overthrow of their government.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Dragon, what is going to wind up happening, maybe not in our lifetime, is a complete upheaval. I think eventually, things will get to such a point to where people will actively work towards the overthrow of their government.

This is why I said we will really start hearing about homegrown terrorists. Thought crimes are here, and the government will move against those that oppose it's will.

I think there are already groups of people moving in this direction, It really only takes a small group of people to make enormous change. I'm just waiting for the spark.

Watching and waiting.

reply to post by LDragonFire


In the right hands it only takes 1 bullet to change the world. I’m sure many are on the brink of such an act, only the feds cover it up. One day one will break free and then all hell will break out. They can’t contain the situation forever.

Although what I am at loss with is what will happen as a result of a war, meaning the after effects.
And how long is one expected to last, several years, a decade?

In any case, I don’t think that the outcome will be pretty, no triumphant gain to power by an individual. The country will be torn apart in an un-reparable fashion.

new nations will form, though their integrity is not to be assumed to last for any great deal of time. they will, as i see it, be at war with each other, though in a somewhat more organized way then the initial conflict. It will become a third world region, ravaged by poverty and the constant presance of war.

you will have the rest of the world come to there to distribute food and organize peace keeping operations.

i havent read the book yet, though in only the first 8 pages he talks about the '92 riots a bit, and the way that they were more like a war. that refers to the use of fortresses as a symbolism of taking territory, as well as raiding police stations. the formation of racially based militias, such as the Koreans i think it was who armed them selves with handguns and shotguns.
this can happen again, and maybe next time it will escalate in to the worst case scenario.

reply to post by funny_pom

you will have the rest of the world come to there to distribute food and organize peace keeping operations.

Yes,,,they will come. Like vultures they will come. Like coyotes they will come. Not to aid but to finish the kill and to devour. How many allies do we have any more and how many more are we losing?

The internal threats are only the beginning of our problems.

The PLAN is to bring America down and the rest of the hemisphere up..thats simple. The people that run things, the real monsy bags, the great industrialists and bankers..oh the bankers...and the rest of the people that really count..these people are NOT like you and I..not at all.

They see grand plans for the future that includes us OUT and includes them IN !! We need to be thinned out and managed, just like in any efficient buisness..running with as few people working as hard as possible to make the most profits for the fewest people..THAT is the new way.

Remember when the politicians were arguing about NAFTA and how it would make such great things happen? Well, it did!! It made Mexicans get our manufacturing and textile businesses moved there...it meant that Americans could buy some things cheaper , but at a cost of quality..and the loss of jobs. Almost all of the great Southern paper mills and such are GONE, closed, and the people who worked there found that the only jobs were at McD's!! In my area, western North Carolina, there are Mexicans flooding in everywhere to take the jobs from locals. They will work for a few bucks an hour less, and they don't take off during hunting season..see? So local people hire them.

They are using the social services that used to prop up the very lowest end natives, and competing for these services makes many very angry with the illegals. When the cops catch them driving here, they get a 160 dollar ticket and go right back on their way..no detention, no deportation, just a money making racket for the county. There could very well be a backlash against these people some day when things get really bad, and I dread the fact that many may get hurt. But when it comes down to us versus them, I know that the local boys here are just about fed up now..in really bad times, it would not take much to see scenes of people being driven from town or worse.

I think it will become a matter of local areas adopting local standards to deal with things..and that is good. We need to keep the crooks in Washington away from it as much as possible..after all, it is them who are the cause of all of our troubles.

Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Dragon, what is going to wind up happening, maybe not in our lifetime, is a complete upheaval. I think eventually, things will get to such a point to where people will actively work towards the overthrow of their government.

This is why I said we will really start hearing about homegrown terrorists. Thought crimes are here, and the government will move against those that oppose it's will.

I think there are already groups of people moving in this direction, It really only takes a small group of people to make enormous change. I'm just waiting for the spark.

Watching and waiting.

Well you'll get your wish very soon i think.

There are rumors already that bush is trying to rig the 2008 election, just like the last one. There have been reports that if it looks like he's going to lose the election "no ammount of tampering will save him this time..lol", he will cancel the elections & declair martial Law.

This leaves one very important question though.

If it dose happen. What will become of US Allies like Canada, Australia & England (all of which have a large number of US bases & troops stationed within their borders)...?

If Bush goes all megalomaniac on us, what would he do If our governments decided to cancel any alliance (I can't see our PM condoning & supporting a dictatior).

There are over 50,000 US personel stationed in various parts of Australia "thats double the number of Regular Australian troops we have on active duty". We don't have enough Tanks, Fighters/Bombers or guns to stop them either..lol".

One has to ask, if Civil war starts in the US, will it be confined to the US or will it spread to the Allied countries as well, as Bush tries to expand his Empire.



[edit on 12/9/2007 by Ironclad]

Originally posted by Ironclad

Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Well you'll get your wish very soon i think.

There are rumors already that bush is trying to rig the 2008 election, just like the last one. There have been reports that if it looks like he's going to lose the election "no ammount of tampering will save him this time..lol", he will cancel the elections & declair martial Law.


[edit on 12/9/2007 by Ironclad]

What in the world are you talking about? Bush is not running for office! Theses reports you refer to are just loony-toon. How can anyone believe this? I know in the age of the "net" that anyone can say anything but you don't need to believe it!

I can understand why you want to believe this but get a grip. This time next year there will be a different person elected by the people to take office in the White House.

Roper

the USB swiss bank said it is claiming a $10 Billion dollar loss for a write off..HHMM thinking, the US Dollar is now valued at 68cents and dropping every day or two in value . I know as I check every 2 days at an currency exchange bank online..

When the US dollar / economy collapses prez Bush said he would declare Martial law in the USA..

Talk about all hell breaking loose.. the Civil war II will begin.
just keep tabs on the economy and watch the tyrant Government as it will shoot you in the back and think nothing of it.

I certainly agree with Dragon about our government listening to corp-
orations, and NOT the people. This in itself diminishes some of our rights.

I only wish to provide an example, SpeakerofTruth, of one...
PHARMACY ! I believe that the huge drug makers are benefitting from
thier being in bed with congress, in that when the cops show up at a
"scene", where someone is having some emotional instability, they have
the authority to remove the person by force, to a psych ward. Even when
there has been no crime committed.

THEN, confined against thier will, the doctors diagnose them with all kinds
of 'mental disorders', requiring medication. Anyone who disagrees
with the norm is labeled bipolar, or manic, or depressed, and sets in place
a 'history' of mental illness... so that in the future, this person is automat-
ically confined again, for so much as speaking against the gov.

When enough good people have suffered this indignity, I think it could be
one of the sparks to ignite an uprising! maybe.

In the 70's, our teachers said that "emotions are normal". But these days,
it seems that emotions are being outlawed. Or re-labeled as "disorders",
and subject to meds.

So, watch your emotional outbursts, they will get you locked-up!

That's my take, hope I get some support on this matter... thanks.

reply to post by FRIGHTENER


I belive you're 100 % on the mark and in light of the school shooting in Virginia, gun control advocates are jumping on that bandwagon big time. You might want to watch Alabama for the next year or so. They're trying to get legislation through that will allow college students to be armed. I'm sure they only mean those who pass the background check for CCW but Alabama is a "right to carry" state meaning you don't have to prove a need. They have to prove that there's a valid reason why you can't. The state legislators are the ones initiating this. Could get interesting.

Thanks to the OP for bringing this book to my attention. I have to admit, the book kind of puts a new perspective on Obama's campaign for the presidency.

Exactly, look at how many of the powerful/well known Blacks (Oprah, Newark Mayor Cory Booker, Jesse Jackson, Will Smith and Chris Rock are some examples) are playing race politics in their support for Obama. It is a very very bad thing when people begin to support politicians just because of their skin color and not their beliefs.