Is a police state the end result of capitalism??

reply to post by InSpiteOf


Very well said.

J.

Originally posted by wizard135
Capitalism is an economic system, a police state would be a social system. So do different parts of what make up a society change or affect other parts?

They certainly do, hence the analysis of the "politico-economy" One directly effect the other. What good is political democracy without economic democracy?

Oh, by the way. We do not have a free-market, we live in a mixed economy which allows the government to subsidize certain industries or bail out the economy.

Yup, there has been an upward redistribution of wealth and corporate wealfarism for the better part of 50 years within the US and Canada.

If capitalism were to lead toward a prison state it would probably not be along the Stalinist sense, but most likely in some kind of form where the largest corporations controlled the government and those corporations could decide what we should eat, drink, where, and think.

See: Capitalist N-i-g-e-r-i-a* for a good example.


* = legitimate filter circumvention.

When the engineered collapse of the economy happens all of a sudden, or at least very quickly, comparitively speaking, the cops will become mere troops just as militaristically inclined as real one's. When the cities run out of food and the electric gets cut off, the powers that be will not allow the countryside to be swarmed over by hordes of food and shelter seeking city dwellers, people who are one truckload away from disaster under the best conditions.

The people will be routed into FEMA camps and assigned areas to stay in, and work to be done as well. Don't think for a moment that Uncle Sam is the kind of host that allows langour and laziness to reign: No, there will be work for all, according to ability, to keep idle hands busy and rebellious thoughts away from a tired mind after a hard day helping the Army guys fortify the compound or building new barracks for the never ending flood of new arrivals.

Obeying orders will be expected: The military view is of course top down command, and the civilians at the bottom of the heap are at the very LOWEST level. The cops will take orders from the militray people and will obey any orders given, no matter how locally oriented they are: When it comes down to it, most cops will side with the system and remain safe and keep their families safe, and have a good justification for doing so, if one is of that mindset to begin with, and most cops are.

Also, the local cops will be taken to counties further away than they are familiar with so they can enforrce draconian measures against civilians with less guilt and personal stake in the matter: It is one thing to have your very neighbors and friends on the other side of a barricade, but with strangers it is not quite the same: Guilt can be assuaged by simply placing the people in a category apart from those you identify with as deserving protection. It boils down to that, at it's heart.

The country people, only slightly less dependant on the normal distribution routes for subsistence, will find themselves at many roadblocks and checkpoints and enduring close scrutiny when traveling. Since distance demands personal vehicles in rural areas, the control factors will be heaviest on the highways and even side roads, where any violation of any sort could lead to confiscation of the vehicle and permanent revocation of the license. Of course, the cops themselves would have vast discretion, and the courts less and less as time goes by.

Schools will become locked down education/industrial zones where metal detectors and total zero tolerance policies will be the norm. Dogs with handlers will patrol school hallways starting at the kindergarten level, to ' acclimate ' the tots to the new ' doggy friend ' that smells bad people and allows the good guys to haul them away!! Get the picture?

At higher grades the situation will be grimmer: students that cause trouble, show independence or rebellious streaks, or any ideas contrary to the accepted norms established by the government, will be sent to special training classes to get them ready for a life on an assembly line: Whether it is in a Federal Prison or in some for profit corporation matters little to them: As long as you are working and controlled you are an asset and may be retained. The moment you cease to be an asset and become a burden, you will find out that the plans we face soon will not include a humane and minimal exisitence, but total abandonment, left to ones one to survive. That means off to a speail camp, and that means the end very soon.

At some point, very quietly, the codtors at these camps will begin to cull the very oldest and most needy people, sending them to their eventual resting place a little prematurely, but at such great savings!! The people who now are kept alive by choice on respirators and such will no longer be given that choice, and all measures will be kept to an absolute minimum to revive or retain those unable to contribute to society in meaningful ways. Past contributions are a quaint and silly relic no longer affordable in meager times. You were kept alive and shelterted and fed for your productive years, and now must face the inevitable fate of those no longer able to keep up; either you are eaten by others or left to die in a ditch as the herd goes on. The same will be the fate of millions in the new America that is planned for the near future.

Only humble and desperate populations can be permanently and effectively silenced from dissent and made grateful for the smallest indulgence. People desperate for food for their families will do a lot of things unimaginable to those with a full pantry and a thriving field of staples at their door. The vast majority will kill and steal and ransack, even their neighbors, to feed THEIR family; and the powers that be will clamp down in response to civilian unrest by an immediate opening of these already prepared camps, which will get some kind of non threatening name, such as ' Freedom Shelters ' or " New Beginnings ' or some suchnomenclature meant to hide the nature of the life there.

The rulers envision vast industrial zones where goods are made and the people exist at the most primitive and meager levels possible while maintaining peace among the populations. America will drop to the level of most upper third or second world nations, and Mexico will rise up and increase their lifestyle; Candians will suffer the same fate as America, only slower as many from the southern hemisphere will resist moving to frigid regions by choice, instead concentrating in areas near the major population centers and available facories, etc.

Of course, it is the ruination of America, effectively a coup has taken over and destroyed the Constitution and turned this nation on a course to ruin and despair of a magnitude not seen since the Depression era. The blame will be passed around and it will take years to overcome, and the same bankers and briefcase carrying thieves that are amanging things now will continue to do so, unmolested by the press, which they own, or the courts , which they ignore. ONLY popular uprisings, with the bad guys being chased out of town and a new bunch being installed, can turn this around, and I do not think that we as a nation have the foresight or the guts to actually do anything until it is too late.

Sure, a few will try, but unless 5- 10 million people converge on Washington, D.C. and DEMAND that the whole gang now there be tossed out and new and FAIR and impartial elections held with EVERY citizen legally here allowed one vote, and NONE denied opn voting day if it takes til dawn. ONLY a popular revolt against the status quo, a desperate cry for remedy that portends a crisis if not satisfied by rational leadership, and backed up by the full force and consent of the military so as to retain the Constitution and the type of government we deserve by law will do any good.

A police state is already here, just look around. Oh sure, they have not put the barriers up yet, that takes a few minutes. And you can still drive a good ways without being stopped at a roadblock, but that can change with one order. But the cameras are everywhere and the airports have been turned into scary places on the basis of a lie, and RFID chips stick to our clothes and neighbors are encouraged to tell about ANY actiovity the government doesn't like..it is here.

Capitalism is an economic system not a political system. Democracy will be the cause of the police state. Democratic rule has lead inevitably to socialism. For a socialist system to remain relevant and capable of tending to the needs of society the individual has to be subverted. We can take a quick look at the rediculous mess that is the UK if we need indication of the validity of these statements. True capitalism would probably not see the rise of giant corporations and what-not either. What has brought that about is a trend economically towards corporatism and away from capitalism. US troops breaking strikes in the late 19th and early 20th century are a blatant example. Corporate welfare and legislating AGAINST coporate competition is a more recent and less "obtrusive" example.

The only thing to prevent this is either Anarchy (in the traditional sense, not what modern news and information distribution sources claim it to be, sorry Johnny Rotten) or a Constitutional Republic based upon the principles of inherent and self evident HUMAN RIGHTS, whose government strictly adheres to the limitations set upon them and whose populace chooses to remain vigilante, educated, and well armed enough to provide a proper check of government powers. While at the same time the government chooses to adopt a strict laissez-faire attitude towards the market to prevent the types of Government/Coporate partnerships that have so plaqued the History of the USA and cuased countless war and death for the sake of the power elites who run the whole shibang. The elimination of ANY Central Bank would also be a prime requirement. When private bankers (who also happen to own the largest companies) have the power to create money the whole idea of Capitalism, Freedom, Liberty are destroyed.

So yes. Democracy, Socialist-Corpratism, and of course Shape-shifting Reptilian Vampire Lizard people will lead to the police state.