Originally posted by dbates
If there was more oil to sell, now would be the time to put it on the market. Apparently the world can't keep the oil supply steady, much less keep up with demand.

I'm no economics expert, but wouldn't production increases cause the price to fall? - not something you'd want if you were controlling current production levels and making a killing from artificially high prices.

I heard the oil price is more governed by the amount being refined, rather than extracted, and new refineries are not being developed - is that to keep the prices up?

I don't necessarily buy the peak oil theory. Something just smells fishy.

Seems one of the key mechanisms to put in place to control populations is to restrict mobility. Create oil scares, sky high prices and illusions of scarcity, and people stay put. I remember the UK fuel blockades by the truckers - the country virtually ground to a halt in less than a week or so, and no-one was making 'unnecessary' journeys.

Keep the drones firmly chained to the grindstone to pay for ever escalating costs of energy and their knock on effects. Too much free time on our hands and we may start asking embarrassing questions.

[edit on 24-10-2007 by RogerT]

Well this means that we are to pay more for oil, because the production will be restricted so hey we need to attack and invade Iran so we can have more oil.

A big problem here, isn't that what the invasion of Iraq was about? but still what happen to the Iraqi oil.

Oh well I guess I will be asking Santa this holidays for a sparkling new bicycle.

I agree that we have probably reach some sort of limit... but having lived through the last Oil shortage in the 70s I start to wonder how much is constructed and how much is real.

Good to see this is starting to break into the mainstream... still, what we need is solutions. We need to get over our oil addiction.

It's a huge problem. There's currently NO viable option for alternative energies that will allow us to maintain our current standard of living. Biofuel and hydrogen are BS dead-end technologies for the simple fact that there is no-way to produce either of these fuels without expending more energy than you get out of them. Solar and wind farming are promising, but require MASSIVE investment to get them up and running and still will not be able to provide enough output to match our current energy usage. Geothermal and hydroelectric sources are very geographically dependent.

Long story short; we're boned.

Unless we do something.

We need to make the sacrifices necessary to get all these forms of alternative energy up and running. We need to accept that our current ways of living are wasteful and destructive. We need to do this NOW.
The clock is ticking. We've got less than 20 years.
We're already too late.

No worries-there are plenty of other technologies waiting in the wings when this resource has been exhausted.

More fear rhetoric. "Panic, panic, panic!" We have hybrid vehicles, compressed air vehicles, electric vehicles. There'll be a solution fairly soon to all things "fossil fuels" one way or another.

The problem that no one has been able to put a reliable time frame on just when oil reserves will be down to critical levels . I can remember borrowing an old book from the school library when I was in primary school and reading that by the year 2000 there would be no oil left . We certainly have viable alternative means of generating electricity but the likes of solar powered cars haven't entered the mainstream market place .

If you've read my posts on the topic of fearmongering, you should know that I'm normally very skeptical about any story that involves telling you to be afraid.

This is an exception.

Peak oil is something that we simply aren't fearful enough of.
This is one of the central issues that the media has been trying to divert our attention away from.

What you (and most people) don't understand is that electric cars aren't a solution. They are a step, but they don't solve anything on their own.

Where do you think electricity comes from?
Did you know that over 70% of US domestically produced electricity comes from burning fossil fuels? Less than 5% of current power production is from renewable sources (hydro, windfarms, solar, etc).
That means, when you charge your electric or hybrid car, you are still using fossil fuels to do it.

The majority of the energy that is currently lighting your room, running your computer, keeping your food refrigerated, and allowing for all your communications is coming from non-renewable sources. This isn't just about cars!

So what's needed is a shift over to more focus on renewable energy sources... and that's where things get scary. We currently CANNOT manufacture solar, wind, thermal, and hydro energy capture devices fast enough to keep up with growing demand. We just can't build them fast enough and there's NO work being done to expand production.

We are already too late.
Even if we were to make this a focused priority, we cannot currently replace our energy production facilities by the time fossil fuels become too expensive to be a viable resources. If nothing drastic is done, your electrical bill will likely be ten to twenty times higher in 10 years than it is today. $10 a litre for gas could become a reality (that would be ~ $30 a gallon, or $50 a gallon US by that time).

By all studies I've seen to date, the best we can do is to mitigate the impacts that this will have on all of us. We're going to have to accept the fact that we will face a lower standard of living simply because we've been irresponsible with our energy assets.

We're going to be paying more and getting less.

Originally posted by BitRaiser
This is an exception.

I agree even if there isnt a accurate time frame available. Even if oil doesn't dry I don't think it is a good idea to be energy depended on foreign oil and that is not to mention Saudi Arabia the regime where most of are oil comes from.

What you (and most people) don't understand is that electric cars aren't a solution. They are a step, but they don't solve anything on their own.

Well I said that Solar Powered cars have yet to enter the mainstream market place. I never said that electric cars are some kind of wonder fix.

Did you know that over 70% of US domestically produced electricity comes from burning fossil fuels? Less than 5% of current power production is from renewable sources (hydro, windfarms, solar, etc).

Well here in NZ a lot of our electricity comes from hydro dams of course you run into problems if you have a dry season.

That means, when you charge your electric or hybrid car, you are still using fossil fuels to do it.

The same sort of thing goes for the bio fuels made from corn you have to factor in the amount fertilizer the farmers use when growing the crop for example.

We just can't build them fast enough and there's NO work being done to expand production.

Well then it time to give another job to cheap labour in China.
Solar Power could be be more economical when it comes to power small remote rural areas. Otherwise Nuclear power is your friend.
How are these technology's spouse to go ahead when there biggest advocates are often hypercritical ?
I cant be the only one that has noticed how some environmentalists oppose the construction of the likes of wind farms!

We are already too late.

Well without an accurate time table there is no way of knowing if we are to late or not.



[edit on 25-10-2007 by xpert11]

The advancements in solar panel energy alone are pretty astounding. The EV-1 technology has even come so far as to regenerate it's own battery through friction, last I heard.

I wouldn't cave so quickly. Get some backbone.

Huh ?
I was just clearing up a misunderstanding . Even if electric cars become environmentally friendly that is no guarantee that any one will buy them .

DeadFlagBlues my apologies I thought that you were refering to my above post.
Cheers xpert11.

Originally posted by dbates


. Apparently the world can't keep the oil supply steady, much less keep up with demand.

If this is the case, I wonder why there are so many race meets around the world? Looks a bit like a case of Nero fiddling while Rome burns?

If a new technology was introduced overnight that would render the need for fossile fuels obsolete, the world markets would crash and come to a screeching halt like you would not believe. I know many would think this is a "good thing" but the world system is built around oil and it would not be good. There are technologies waiting in the wings but they will be introduced slowly so that the same companies that are in the oil business can start shifting their efforts and wealth into new technologies. This is best done over a period of time, not overnight.

Again, im not worried. Today its oil, tomorrow it will be something else.