Why is a member here allowed to knowingly lie when there have been plenty of complaints?

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Yup, just click on the ATSMix button, just to the left of your "log in/out" button and you can hear interviews with all of the Amigos, chissler, thelibra, Crakeur and myself.

I'm sure more are on their way.

reply to post by intrepid


You mean we have to not only put up with you lot virtually, but also watch you and run the risk of thinking of you as actual, real human beings???

Is this a scene from a horror film - "welcome to your own personal hell"

reply to post by budski



It IS a scary thought...

Springer...

Originally posted by infinite
That's not the case, all issue are addressed at ATS, including minor stuff.

I remember once I asked if I could trade a little of the allotted mini-profile memory for signature memory (an animation in my signature), and someone told me they would ask, and then I never heard anything back.

I don't really care anymore, and that's not the only time something like that has happened, but mods are human like anybody else, and I probably would miss a few messages sent my way, too.


Man, I didn't realize this page had already progressed to 16 pages when I posted that. No idea what's "on topic" now, lol.

[edit on 26-10-2007 by bsbray11]

reply to post by niteboy82



I personally don't think you guys who run and look after this place have ANY need to justify yourselves here.

Seems a lot of people complaining about a "Me Me" situation, forgetting that this is a damn huge forum.

You do a good job, FREE and because you have passion.

You get no complaints from me, and I've been at the end of a few "no one liner' U2U's !!

reply to post by badw0lf


You're right, they don't HAVE to justify anything.
The fact that they choose to do so speaks volumes about how much they care about their members



In order to help myself and "put a human face on things" I'm going to look at the ATSmix.
Just a pity I have to install quicktime, but life's full of little sacrifices



[edit on 26/10/2007 by budski]

I just wanted to weigh in on this for a moment. Many a neocon-fascist spin artist is likely to pop up on sites like this in order to spin our thoughts and theories in the opposite direction. This is rampant and it takes a while for the MODS to research and catch them. Until then just ignore them for they have no relevance aside from their own mind-controlled self reinforcing repetitive delusions.

Tis better to shed a bitter tear in silence for the insufferably stupid, than it is to engage them in an intelligent conversation in which they are incapable of having.

OR:

Cast not pearls before swine.....

I just wanted to add my own newbie .02 here.

I am not even sure that this is relevant anymore, but one thing that I was seeing a few times in this thread was a concern that there is some sort of "flagged troublemaker" list.

While I can't say anything to whether or not that happens here, I was the Admin for a now defunct forum, and am currently a mod at another forum (all womens/mommy forums so nothing on this kind of scale here at ATS), but from my own personal experience, I have NEVER seen anything like this behind closed doors in any of the forums that I have been involved as a staff member at.

Certainly we have had trouble makers and trolls and as a staff we will discuss them and any action that is deemed warranted in dealing with them before any action is carried out, but not in the form of a list of any sort. It has always been discussed on a case by case basis based on their actions and severity of TOS breeches.

With a forum of the size of ATS, I can't possibly seeing this as a feasible option. Their are just far too many members and a list like this would be ungodly excessively large and nearly impossible to maintain.

Anyhow, this is solely my .02 based on my own personal experiences as an Admin/mod in quite a few forums. Take from it what you will, if anything at all, but I just wanted to mention what I have found to be standard.

Take care,
Cindi

Edited because I have that freaking Typo Faerie lurking over my shoulder right now.

[edit on 16/11/2007 by Glencairn]

Originally posted by Glencairn
It has always been discussed on a case by case basis based on their actions and severity of TOS breeches.

With a forum of the size of ATS, I can't possibly seeing this as a feasible option.

Au Contraire, Mon Frair !

That's exactly what we (try to) DO.


Hey, The Staff is a well-oiled machine.....er....

would you believe a moderately-well run, corporate office.....held together by nutz and volts?

uhh....how about a bunch o' sleep deprived maniacs, connected by electrons and a shared vision,
doing what they can? ........ mostly

Their are just far too many members and a list like this would be ungodly excessively large and

nearly impossible to maintain.

nearly....being the operative word.

reply to post by Jbird

Hi,
I just wanted to clear this up a bit. I think that I got typing faster than was conducive to maintaining any sort of clarity that I was trying to achieve. Admittedly, I cause enough chaotically unclear thoughts throught my posts that I frequently end up confusing even myself, so I know that I must make even less sense to others, unfortunately. So, let me apologize for not being conscious enough of my wording to be sure that I was doing what was needed to foster less confusion when I should have worked harder for easier understanding!

My first little bit that you quoted, I wasn't trying to imply that issues are not investigated on a case by case basis, but, from my own experience as an admin/mod at other forums, it strikes me as that is eminently more logical and feasible a way of looking at TOS issues, than to try to maintain a list of troublemakers that, based on membership numbers alone, would be unrealistically difficult to monitor and keep updating, all while keeping tabs on said troublemakers.

For the second quoted bit, I can admit that "nearly impossible" certainly doesn't mean "absolutely impossible". Just that from my perspective and based on my own experience, the odds of it being true that there is a "troublemaker list" being kept and maintained just seems pretty far out there in terms of being a feasible or easily workable method of maintaining order for a forum of this magnitude.

Now, let me quote a few of your words back to you:

would you believe a moderately-well run, corporate office.....held together by nutz and volts?

uhh....how about a bunch o' sleep deprived maniacs, connected by electrons and a shared vision, doing what they can? ........ mostly

Absolutely. Been there done that. I can positively say NO stretching of the imagination there at all! Especially when it comes to the sleep deprived maniacs part.

Please, for the love of all things chocolate, don't try to enlighten me if you found out that that isn't a requirement for being on staff at a forum. Shattered illusions are painful and that is one of the few that I will hold tightly to, kicking and screaming if necessary, to maintain my "happy place" vision of. Taking that away would mean that, well, probably that someone was humoring me and that we AREN'T all sleep deprived maniacs. Excuse me now while I go cover my ears and proceed to sing-song loudly to myself "I can't hear you, I can't hear you..."

Apologies again for not checking my words to make sure that I was being clear with my thoughts.

Take care,
Cindi

Originally posted by Glencairn
With a forum of the size of ATS, I can't possibly seeing this as a feasible option. Their are just far too many members and a list like this would be ungodly excessively large and nearly impossible to maintain.

You would be very surprised Does ever staff member put in thier 2 cents worth? Not always, but any sort of major action ALWAYS has a discussion.

We are not talking about minor warns for excessive quoting one line posts, but serious infractions. Rember that outright bannings and the such CAN only be initated by a SuperMod or Admin/Owner.

One of the reasons almost all of us gravatated to ATS in the first place was the refresing lack of bad manners, profanity etc. that is the hallmark of every other board I have seen. All of us on the staff used to be rank and file members so we know both sides of the street as it were.

We try hard not to make the wrong call and part of that is making major actions a group effort to get other opinions. Boards you were assosiated with may not have done that but here it is the Gospel and its the way we conduct moderation.

Originally posted by Griff
Wow. I honestly didn't mean to cause this much drama for the mods and the members. My only concern was that it seemed to me that some members get rushed by mods when they state their opinion as fact but others are allowed to continue doing it. That was all.

Yeah this seemed to be true on the day of the so called 'Revolution', I stated how much of hoax this event was in regards to actualy bieng anything of relevence and the next day I was unable to log in... and still to this day no-one has given me a reason why... even though my profile is still active I'm unable to get access to it via the normal routes on ATS..... So now i'm using a different profile.

Originally posted by Glencairn
...it strikes me as that is eminently more logical and feasible a way of looking at TOS issues, than to try to maintain a list of troublemakers...

ahh... ok, I get it , Glencairn, my misunderstanding, then. I think we are on the same page, now.

Please, for the love of all things chocolate, don't try to enlighten me if you found out that that isn't a requirement...

Ha, ha.... I can offer no such enlightenment, at this time.

Apologies again for not checking my words to make sure that I was being clear with my thoughts.

Back atcha, maybe we both need some sleep.

BTW, Welcome to the neighborhood.

reply to post by FredT


Ummm...please forgive any sense of rudeness that might be perceived from my posts, this one in particular, but I was defending the staff and agreeing with them.

I get that I don't always make myself as clear as one might wish, but having re-read my own words repeatedly trying to figure out what I wrote that was so confusing, I am honestly just not seeing it.

I just can not see how you could possibly come to the conclusion that any forum that I was/am currently associated with makes decisions willy-nilly based on the whim of whichever mod is floating around at the time. I was explicitly clear that we do not take any major actions without input and discussion from every single member on staff. Isn't that what you are claiming is the procedure for major actions here?

So, how is it that my insignificant little mommy board is in the wrong, while you and your fellow staffers here are doing things the right way, when based on the posted words of staff here it seems that we do things exactly the same on our respective boards? I have got to be missing some significant bit here to be this confused on why you are right and my board is wrong based on what appear to be identical procedures for dealing with major board issues.

Of course there are bits of flexibility to this. The mommy forum that I currently mod at prides itself on our family friendly, "doesn't matter if your kids are reading over your shoulder" atmosphere. So, a mod sees innappropriate language outside of the one adult access only area, they can move it without needing to call a staff meeting to discuss it. Little bits like that are left to the mod to handle individually.

However, if you are going to praise the staff here while denigrating myself and the staff of the forum that I work on, please have a valid basis for doing so. Much appreciated. Thanks.

Take care,
Cindi

reply to post by Jbird


Please think nothing of it. I honestly took no offense from your words and just figured that I had caused mass chaos and confusion yet again.

As to sleep...undoubtedly. I could always use some more than I get!

Thank goodness that you have no enlightenment to offer on that sleep deprived maniacs theory, too. I was seriously worried that illusions were about to be shattered and I was the lone sleep deprived maniac board staffer roaming the interwebz.

Thank you as well for your welcome!

Now, I'll inevitably find that my previous post in response to FredT was also a misunderstanding of my own causing and here I went and just ran off at the fingers. If that IS the case, please accept my apologies, because I'm not the easiest person to understand roaming on the interwebz, and I am likely the source of any misunderstanding. I will also be more than happy to offer another full and public apology if I was in the wrong. Anything less is not fair dealings.

Take care,
Cindi

[edit on 11/17/2007 by Glencairn]

reply to post by Glencairn


Cindi, I actually did not find your posts rude at all so no worries


Sorry to give the impression that every action we take is a group pow wow.

Clearly the scenario you spoke of "profanity in non adult areas" I or any of my fellow mods would take care of it when we saw it, or if we lacked edit power in that particular forum, we would alert it so a SuperMod or regular forum mod could take care of it. The discussion takes place for serious violations of the Terms of the site or repeated and persistent violations of minor ones.

Cheers
FredT

reply to post by FredT


Thanks for your answer. I really am glad that you took no offense. There was honestly none intended, and I was hoping that I wouldn't seem rude when I was not trying to be.

I understand what you are saying about the little modding things not needing big staff meetings to deal with. That truly would be impractical.

It is the same things that you mention as the subjects of group staff discussion before action that take place here that I was trying to explain are what my forum discusses before major actions. That, based on the posts of staff here, and my experience with boards that I have been involved on as staff, it seems like both follow very similar operating procedures in regard to major issues.

The serious TOS violations, persistent breaking of TOS, especially when done by the same person/people, and so forth.

Totally not knocking your procedural operation in those regards. I agree with them and find that they work well.

My whole point, and one which I obviously presented poorly, was that I've seen claims of "trouble maker" lists and I find those claims hard to accept. No forum that I have ever been staff at has kept one of those lists due to the inconvenience of keeping it up to date and also keeping tabs on the people on the list and their actions. Admittedly, it was suggested, but was quickly vetoed based on the inconvenience factors and these forums ran in numbers from 500+ members up into 1100 or so.

That said, I find it even harder to believe that it would be feasible for a forum of this size to keep an up to date "troublemaker" list and keep tabs on every member on that list and all of their actions, when a small 500some member forum discarded the idea due to the impracticality of it.

I'm not saying that you don't have one, I have no idea, you might. I just wanted to point out the impractical aspects of this idea based on my experience.

Take care,
Cindi

reply to post by Glencairn

My whole point, and one which I obviously presented poorly, was that I've seen claims of "trouble maker" lists and I find those claims hard to accept. No forum that I have ever been staff at has kept one of those lists due to the inconvenience of keeping it up to date and also keeping tabs on the people on the list and their actions.

I, myself have Admined some private boards....and to be honest, we did not have a "list" per say, but we had people we continually watched because we believed they were trolls. So it is done on MANY boards, ones that im well aware of.

With that said. I have no idea if that is done here...and I really dont care, as im not a trouble maker or troll...and this is a public board...sooo.

And with THAT said.......im really really glad I dont admin/mod boards anymore!!! You just cant ever win! Damned if you...damned if you dont!

I am fairly new here and my opinion matters naught, however.

I agree with the OP and find that allowing this type of post causes the forum to lose its credibility, an online friend invited me here , and don't care for 9/11 truth twisters much, I can't imagine why he invited me to post at this forum,

As far as TOS goes I see it as not being enforced, in many, many instances.

[edit on 093030p://bFriday2007 by Stormdancer777]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
It looks like the members in the thread are doing a good job of taking that particular member to task for his statements.

The "Close Scrutiny" aspect of the 9/11 Forum refers to personal attacks, not deceptive statements. If there are issues with this behavior we haven't noticed, certainly we'd like to know about that!

This statement sums in entirety the nature of the complaint against the original post which after venturing in, appears to be a valid post.

ATS can be big on fluff at times, and yes I agree to the following statement:

Originally posted by Sekhemet
False, misleading or inaccurate.. by rights that should automatically trash half the posts off of the face of ATS.

Word spin is word spin and the Truth is the Truth. Out of context, in context, etc etc..

I could make a statement about carrots, and say that they cause cancer . And subsequently I could produce proof and documentation that would show that 97% of everyone that ever had cancer ate carrots and we could have an entire thread on that alone.

Is it the basis for a thread? Does it warrant merit? This is the power in ATS and the spirit of this site. We need to self censor that which we deem to be off the hook without being insulting by merely not responding and recognizing fluff when we see it.

The strenth of ATS is in the wisdom and intelligence within its membership, not in the fluff. If this place was all fluff, I wouldnt be here. Each of us, with a discriminating eye, and a passion for truth should seek to embrace truth and discard sham and deception, but must be restrained in being quick to judge what perhaps some of us have yet to come to understand.

The Truth cuts like a knife, and while practicing and respecting the equal status and voice of each member, we will achieve our directive.

Peace


[edit on 23-11-2007 by HIFIGUY]