Do you people actually read the thread before replying?
Blowing your horn about how its our own damn fault, how we were selfish people who had to have the latest big screen, how we should be more responsible.
Well if you had bothered to actually read the thread you would see that the majority of us did not use credit for the latest gadget, we used it for food, electricity, survival. Like I posted on pg 3, my ex husband kicked me and our 1 yr old out of the house, I had no money and no support from anyone, I used my credit to FEED MY CHILD. If you honestly can say I was not responsible and I should pay for my gluttony, then I really dont give a rats tushy what you think at that point.
8 years later, my 2nd husband and I purchased a $130,000 home 4 years ago at an interest rate of 5%, we have 1 2001 minivan that is financed and a 1998 Tahoe paid for. We shop the clearance aisles, clip coupons and hit the goodwill once a week. In other words we do not live extravagant flashy lives nor do we want to, I have never cared about all that crap. I do however care immensely that my child is fed, sheltered and healthy, that is a #1 priority for me and if that means my credit score lowers my value as a human being, so be it.


Until you have walked in my shoes you cannot judge me.

The thing is that the majority of people in the US are living their lives on loan. SUVs with crazy rims, houses, student loans, clothes, jewelry, cell phones, on and on and on. And this is NORMAL. It's normal, but it's also wrong. It's materialism fused with consumerism, and it's dysfunctional. And nearly everybody is stressed out over the specter of having to come up with the necessary funds at the end of the month. It really is nuts when you are hanging out with people and they are talking about the stuff that they just bought. Talking about it like their the owners. "Oh, we just closed on our new house today." Right away you know they are in debt for the next 45 years or so. 45 years! But they have the mind set that they are homeowners. But what happens when they are 30-60 days past due, they come to the harsh realization that they do no own their home. That at any time it can be taken away from them. And slowly they go crazy from the realization that nearly everything around them has a balance due on it. The sad part about it is that those same people will look down on somebody who lives within their means -- someone who goes around looking like they do not own much. It's a very peculiar madness for someone who doesn't own anything to look down upon someone who only owns a few things. I don't understand it but I"ve witnessed it nearly everyday as an adult. Folks talking bad about someone who refuses to buy a cell phone because they do not want to sign a contract, or refuses a pay as you go phone because the cost to operate it is several times more expensive than getting a phone with a contract. Americans have problems -- "I want. I want. I want." Never mind paying for what one can afford.

Can't afford to buy a $12,000 car? Then don't buy it. Don't be swindled into the "Can you afford to pay $250 a month?" deal. If one can pay $250 a month then one can save $250 a month and buy a car in three years time. Or buy a used one. And buying a car is the worst deal because it depreciates 10% the moment it leaves the dealer's lot. So over time, the amount that one is paying for the car becomes greater than the car's value. That's the scam of scams, auto loans. But people want to sign up for that dream.

Remember the days of The Waltons and Little House on the Prairie? Kinda funny, I know, but there was a time when generations of families grew up in one house. They lived within their means, looked out for one another, and handed down the knowledge gained through living life under any circumstances. Fast forward to today. Communication between family members is erratic at best. Lots of secrets and behavior under the pretense that "It's all good." No one passing any information on because, who needs it? They are just going to run right out and get a car loan anyway. And who wants to live in their parents home at 40? For crying out loud. Now kids just want to get out of their parent's home as soon as they can so that they can go and live an MTV lifestyle. Just more suckers signing up for the dream.

The awful truth is that for all the debt that Americans carry there isn't enough money in circulation to completely pay it off. Just more debt creating more debt through refinancing schemes and home equity loans. Awful stuff. But they bought the dream. That American dream that's pushed and sold to the world at large. Yup, they bought the dream alright and the lenders are laughing all day at the bank. A sucker born every minute, and a hustler born every six months to take advantage of them all. Yeah, "It's all good."

Originally posted by greeneyedleo

Yes, there are plenty of "experts" out there saying that using AC in your vehicle does not use MORE gas, then if you have your windows rolled down. I did not just make it up.

Care to post a source for that? As someone who drives some 250+ miles a day around Dallas, and who keeps up with his gas mileage almost every day, I can tell you from experience that the extra drag of running your AC compressor does definitely use more gas than running with the windows down. That's why your engine automatically increases the idle speed when your compressor comes on, to make up for the increased drag.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
As far as my mom. She drives a convertible all summer long - in Dallas. Call her whatever you want.

I never addressed your mother, nor did I call her anything. You just can't help but falsely accuse folks huh? This will be the last bit of time I waste on you.

life is a game; a joke? remove the stimulus and we exist for what?? we exist for the purpose of amusement for some higher power??
what future??

just my random thoughts

Hey all,

I just wanted to take a sec and thank all of you for your contributions to this thread.

All replies, with the exception of the trolls, are very very much appreciated.


I am having a huge lag issue with my wi-fi and I'm sorry if I can't respond to all of your posts right now. I promise, I will try to respond to those addressed to me when my lag issue is over.


Thanks again,
Jasn

Revealing All

Originally posted by SEEWHATUDO
Well if you had bothered to actually read the thread you would see that the majority of us did not use credit for the latest gadget, we used it for food, electricity, survival. Like I posted on pg 3, my ex husband kicked me and our 1 yr old out of the house, I had no money and no support from anyone, I used my credit to FEED MY CHILD.

Everybody can claim mitigating circumstances, and in some cases these circumstances are truly mitigating. The thing is, we cannot tell until we know more about you. So we ask odd questions -- exactly the kind of questions lenders ask when you go to them for credit. How come you had nobody to turn to when your husband kicked you out? No family, no friends? How did that come about? If you'd recently moved to a new area, why couldn't you move back home? Wasn't there some kind of child support you could claim? Some institutional avenue that you could have followed to obtain funds?

Dear lady, please understand: I am not interested in the answers to these questions and I am not asking you to provide them. I merely point out that, if you post personal experiences of this kind on a public board, you automatically raise such questions in people's minds. Notice that they are exactly the kind of questions lenders will ask you, and are asked for roughly the same reasons. A lender invests money in you; your fellow ATSers invest belief and trust. We want to know if our investment is worthwhile. So these are, in my view, legitimate questions.

And replying them just involves posting more personal information. Now you've told us about your cars (two of them! -- only in America could a family with two cars consider itself modestly off) and your supermarket habits. How much more about your personal life will we know before you have justified yourself to your own satisfaction? Is it worth it?

The same goes -- in spades -- for Simius Dei. His credibility unravelled as he told his story and more facts about his life became known. There are now more people in the world who think him foolish, or irresponsible, or even culpably negligent, than there were before. Was that worth it, just to expose a 'conspiracy of credit' even if one exists?

Poor fellow. What price his credit now? Would it improve if a transcript of this thread were placed before a rating agency? Or would it deteriorate further?

Think about that before you reveal any more about yourself to the world.

Until you have walked in my shoes you cannot judge me.

Oh, but we will, we will. And we have every right.

Originally posted by Areal51
"Oh, we just closed on our new house today." Right away you know they are in debt for the next 45 years or so. 45 years! But they have the mind set that they are homeowners. But what happens when they are 30-60 days past due, they come to the harsh realization that they do no own their home. That at any time it can be taken away from them.

The question is:
Is it a luxury to own a home?

My belief is that every family in wealthy countries (US, Europe etc) should have a realistic shot at owning a home. That, to me, is the most basic of rights. We work our lives away at jobs we don't care about; the least we deserve is a home. It doesn't have to be a mansion, and may very well be just an apartment, but a home nonetheless. BMWs, Mercedes, Hummers - that's all extravagance. Widescreen TVs, new-fitted kitchens, and the latest cell-phones - again, these are luxury items. But a home? Nah.

My point is that it's not all black and white. You can be the most discerning, organised spender/saver in the world, you can turn your nose up at material goods, mass consumerism and credit cards all you like, but for 95% of us, unless you have very wealthy family, or a lot of inheritance money, or want to live in your parents basement all your life, owning a home CAN ONLY HAPPEN THROUGH BORROWING!

Thus it becomes clear why the government aren't too worried about combatting rising house prices. They're probably lobbied by the banks not to do so, so that there will always be at least one thing people have no choice but to be in debt over.

Dont Ignore This

I hope I'm not one of those you've chosen to ignore, Simius Dei, because I have something very important to tell you.

Originally posted by SimiusDei
I would love to be able to get a $10,000 dollar SB loan. If I could, my money troubles, while not over, would be greatly reduced.

What I have to tell you is something I heard from a banker, a credit expert in fact, who worked for an international development bank. He was addressing a workshop on -- yes! -- credit mobilization for bankers and finance ministry bureaucrats. I am neither, but I was there.

This is what he said, in the broad accents of his native Bavaria:

'A loan is a funny thing. Before you have it in your hands, it is credit. After that, it is debt.'

A $10,000 loan will not reduce your money troubles. It will compound them.

Even if, despite your poor credit rating, you somehow managed to obtain one at a lower interest rate than your current liabilities, it would be so hedged about with conditions and constraints it would, in effect, further cripple you.

This is only to be expected. Even if we leave your actual rating aside, look at you: you're young, you have a dependent family, no steady income and you have actually stated in this thread that you have a history of lending your own money to borrowers whose ability to repay is questionable.

The degree of 'moral hazard' you represent (to use a banker's term) is extremely high. And this has nothing to do with your credit rating per se. Can you reasonably expect anyone to lend to you without tying you down hand and foot to make sure you repay? It's their money, after all.

I am 26 and thankfully have not truly been thrown to the wolves financially.

I do have a 30,000 bank loan from schooling unrelated to fields that have any demand. This was at a time right out of high school where I definitely did not have the maturity to think into the future regarding the implications.

This is a ruthless world, so maybe not everyone needs large families, new homes and brand new cars unless they sure as hell are financially secure enough to prepare for a downfall.

Area51,

Actually, the price of homes isn't determined by who is and isn't buying them. During the War Against Terror, our home increased in value by about 200 thousand dollars. It was a 100 thousand dollar home. The only reason it increased was not due to demand but rather that the real estate market was being intentionally tinkered with at the top. Before the war, houses in florida sold like hotcakes. Now, there are two houses next door to us that have been for sale for over a year, closer to 2 years. And there are others that haven't sold as well. They are nice florida properties, abutting a golf course with inground swimming pools, and all the amenities, including landscaping. There's an university just a few blocks away. It's prime real estate. No one is buying because the artifical increase in price has essentially locked out most buyers.

cry me a river.

debt does not "sneak up on you"...ok, it can, with unexpected hardships.

the problem is not credit cards. its our affluent lifestyle. people for generations now have not taken care of themselves to a point where they can bear a sudden hardship.

you have to prepare for this and forego luxuries and conveniences that only make you fat and lazy. oh, i speak blasphemy.

you cant convince me that the amount of credit card problems are totally avoidable. people are just spendthrift fools.

[edit on 23-10-2007 by Tynee]