Why didn't more Christians respond to Dave & Johnny's REQUEST?

Anyway, we're off topic again.

kosmicjack, if you'd care to continue a friendly (being serious about this) discussion about this, I have the perfect thread here.

Sorry, Ducks, we digressed.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction

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Nadda prob MM.

Btw?

(going on a sideline tangeant myself)

I absolutely LOVED YOU and MIMS on the ATS Mix!

You were straight, to the point, and handled the questions thrown at you with ease.

I loved how Dave and Johnny set everyone at ease! - very relaxing atmosphere.

Were you a bit nervous underneathe it all...because I never heard any indication otherwise; no faultering in your voices.

I have to give credit here not only to yourself, but MIMS. That guy is only 18 years old??!?!? Jeese Louise.

MM? he's 22-23 years younger than us, and he can hold his own quite well. MIMS? If you're reading this...Kudos to YOU and MM!

And just like you said a few posts back: (paraphrasing) "No need for problems from 'the other side', as Dave and Johnny will be discussing with one side...then another."

I think that I could probably talk with these guys in a small group setting.

Yet, to be honest, I'm a bit of a chicken poop. Face to face is one thing, but having to hear my voice played back is another. Self-conscious? Mabey.

I'm outgoing. Yet I have my limits.

Perhaps I'm afraid of what people might think of my 'voice' broad-casted, for all to hear. Perhaps I'm afraid of saying the wrong thing; faultering and wavering in my voice (camera/radio shy) in that people would assume that I'm making things up or otherwise. Stupid phobia

See? I'm only human.

From a line in shakespeare: "Take it in the sense that thou wilst."

In any event.

I do so hope that Believers, Spiritualists, Pagans, etc, will find the voice to complete Dave and Johnny's Interview.

Mabey I might myself...if I get the courage.


[edit on 19-10-2007 by TheDuckster]

reply to post by Blaine91555

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Belated apologies to Blaine91555 for my useage of the word: 'cringe'.

I'm sorry that I presented that word in 'derogitory' means.

I promise to be more mindful of my terminologies.

The word 'cringe', is exactly what I myself, explained in my above post.

I 'cringed' at the thought of expressing myself verbally over the airwaves.

I know (from previous posts, and what MM said) there are reasons as to why Beleivers, et al, can't express their thoughts/feelings in Dave/Johnny's interview.

reply to post by TheDuckster

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Ducks, c'mon, it's not the wrapping on the present, but the package. Who cares what your voice sounds like (and I doubt very much it's as bad as you seem to think it is)? It's the message that counts.

If I hadn't met Dave & Johnny at the UFO Expo, I might have been nervous. Mostly I wasn't. Just a little -- because I'm none too fond of the sound of my recorded voice either.

There's really no excuse for anyone to not participate -- unless they don't have a phone at all. Which I find very hard to believe.

I swear -- no atheists will be on air with you. Nobody will mock you or derail your thoughts. It'll be fun and you'll get to talk about your faith. Isn't anyone going to take up this challenge?

reply to post by MajorMalfunction

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I'm not worried about other atheists being on the board.

It has absolutely NOTHING to do with that.

I'd......love to speak to you all. I'm...umm...

I only have a cell phone now, well...ever since I moved into my new apartment this last Dec. Not a real 'land-line'. Just the cell. Even my kids have their own cell phones. I fear that my voice might break-up because of the cell-phone.

Out of pocket expenses happened...no..REALLY!

And I'm......kinda ...poor right now.

Not through error on my part Seriously.

I would give my interview with Dave and Johnnny, if it could go through on my cell.

My voice is a bit deeper than yours MM. Not raspy...um...jeese..words fail me....uh damn...can't quite get the words.

ok...let me try to explain.

It's not like a 'grandma -type voice'. It's lower in octave than your voice. Definately not a man's voice! Oh hell....

Concidering all that I told you from the above.

Such is my dilemna.

Not a cop-out...just the truth.

But dig this, Ducks, D&J can edit out if your voice breaks up, if necessary.

I didn't really hear any edits on my interview, but it's possible. My memory isn't what it used to be.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction

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If you and D&J can edit out my blurbs...hats off my friend!

Johnny & Dave have asked me to help them with another Thread

I had proposed an idea in this thread

Now I have to find my voice. I have confidence.

I really, really was NOT going to post on this type thread anymore. But allow me to take a shot at this:

#1. Did NOT know about show.
#2. No mic,' either.
#3. The biggest and greatest of all reasons that I have to offer up, as an individual:

When I first came to ATS, I tried to START one of these threads, about the desire to meet on friendly terms and make some helpful suggestions to those who were interested in further knowledge. What a Fiasco!
I can't blame the errors there on anyone but myself, and my ignorance at the time. I've grown a tiny bit in some areas, and leaps & bounds in others. Some of the ATS'ers can be down-right sadistic at times. No amount of apologies in the thread were ever enough to suit certain ones. So, I determined in my own mind, that no amount would suffice.

#4. If I had known and had the equipment; I still would not have participated. I discovered that most of these like-topics end the same way every time; believers keep believing, non-believers continue. Whether mods are aware or not; there seems to be FLAMING on both sides. It is not a calm rational topic between the two opposers. Insofar as Christians being called upon to prove God, Jesus and The Holy Spirit. I think that just as much burden should be on the non-believer. For I am NOT the one who NEEDS proof.(Most Christians do not need proof, if they are more than pew-sitters).

#5. Personally I get tired and I get hurt over what I see as, My Lord being nailed to the cross, again and again. All that believers are required to do, is deliver the msg, once, THEN move on. That does not mean an eternity in Hell for the rejector at that 'very moment.' It probably means (more times than not) that YOU were unable to reach THEM at that time. Maybe, someone else with a little different bed-side manner, WILL come along and reach them. Until then, please leave people alone if they are not interested.

#6. Another hesitation on MY part is, that 'I' find that most of the time, I have to apologize profusely ahead of time on my viewpoints, feelings and love for the mention of MY Maker's Name, in the event that It offends someone. I am tired of apologizing. Why do we NOT see apologies for other sects, etc for possibly offending someone with THEIR beliefs?

For those that have read the bible (for whatever purpose); You will find Jesus arguing the 'scriptures' with the scribes and the pharisees, etc. After that; You do not find Him arguing the Word again. Most of His answers went something like this, "The Word says...," and from there, He just walked in Love.

[edit on 10/20/2007 by janasstar]

[edit on 10/20/2007 by janasstar]

These are exactly the things you should talk about on an interview!

Again, no microphone necessary, D&J will call on your home phone.

All I'm seeing is excuses from the Christians, which I find quite puzzling. People will debate on the forum, but when given the opportunity to state their beliefs without being argued with, they all refuse.

What's going on? Is it really that everyone's faith is so weak they don't want to speak up for their beliefs?

This is really unbelievable to me. All this "faith" and not one volunteer to actually talk about it unfettered by replies to posts that may not agree with them.

Ducks and uberarcanist the exceptions of course.

Typical attacking stance for you. Trashy try at best MM. Why would my faith be less because I don't feel like discussing on air what I've already written on a permanent record more than once? Here I'll do it again - I believe in God. I believe in the sacrifice of Christ and the unmeritorious gift it gave humanity. I believe in a spiritual realm beyond this one. I believe there is more than this life.

Is your "belief" so tenuous you feel the need to repeat your position ad nauseum in order to get yourself firmly believing it? Or is it that you're so militant you just can't stand the fact there are those of us who will continue to believe no matter how many times you take up your arms.

[edit on 10-20-2007 by Valhall]

The impression I get is that the divisions are really telling and that is amognst Christians and that is before other faiths are dealt with on ATS Mix. Atheists are easier to represent because the only variation is between a militant Atheist and the let and let live category which I fall into. I really shouldn't have been surprised by all of this you just cant tell how people who rely on faith rather then facts are going to react.

Somehow MM, I think that the only thing
that you read in the entirety of my post
was that I did not have a mic. Otherwise, all I see is a
continuation of the same old statements and points that
you have made before.

I addressed most of your points, I think. You wouldn't have to apologize in advance for your views, there won't be flaming from anyone because it's a respectful interview of you for your point of view, not a Dawkins style debate, I personally fail to understand how your getting to speak your message in a different format than on the boards where it is guaranteed someone will debate with you is nailing Jesus up over and over again.

I read your whole post. That's why I said it sounded like a bunch of excuses to me.

But I can see that my puzzlement is once again being misconstrued by people as an attack so I had better bow out of this thread. No one is interested in listening to reason anyway.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction

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If that be the case MM,
then I stand corrected
and extend my apologies.

I tried, I gave my info, there wasn't enough others I guess?

But, if they were going to be looking for proof of God, scientific proof, they weren't going to find it from me or any other Christian, it doesn't exist in that way and you can't prove it that way. Therefore theres really no point in trying to do so.

But I did want to give a small history lesson on the early church prior to the nicene creed and constantine, and talk about Arius and his mysterious death (poisoning) by church officials for teaching Jesus and God were two different beings, that Jesus was created by God and thus not God incarnate. Also, that there was a point when Jesus didn't exist; prior to all creation. Christian fundamentalists will disagree vehemently with all of this.

Probably why they killed Arius, then took out some Gospels and dubbed them Apocryphal or "extra and not necessarily the word of God" ?

reply to post by MajorMalfunction

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MM, believe it or not, it's not a faith thing. I don't know how many Christians you need to do a show, but didn't they only use like, 3 Atheists?

Well I signed up for the show, and I'm well spoken and call me cocky darnit but I could've pulled the whole darn show all by myself, and made it interesting to all people, being that it was just an hour's worth of talking!

I was also looking forward to friendly debating the trinity a little bit with any other Christian(s) who signed up for the show, but I don't know. I find it hard to believe, honestly, that I was the only sign up.

No, there must've been at least 1 or 2 others, and so I ask, why was that not enough to do the show? The few, the proud, the Christians? lol

I am issuing a personal callout: I challenge any 2 Christians from this board who know my words and know that I know their words to stand up with me and address the people of the true nature of Faith, not Bigotry and Hypocrisy and Mind Control. Government is Mind Control, it comes from the greek words for Mind and, guess what .. Control, lol.

My second callout is thus: I will stand alone and do one full hour of question & answer, discussion, explanation, and whatever else you can throw at me. I will even have the Biblical citations ready, and should I speak from the Torah, Qu'ran, Zohar, or any other Abrahamic Monotheistic book, such as the Apocryphal (removed) Jewish, Gnostic, and Christian texts, I'll cite that too.

I'll carry that cross all by myself if need be. Just hollar at me U2U.

I truly hope 2 can stand with me on this and issue a trilateral challenge to Johnny to *attempt* a show and see how it goes. U2U me if you'll stand with me, and we will discuss theology.

Edit: in fact, I recall there were only two Atheists on that show? I am one Christian, there was not a SINGLE other Christian? Not ONE? ..

(starting to wonder if this was a partial conspiracy sprung from a lack of desire to interview the opposite of the rebellious parts, towards Faith & Religion. prove me wrong staff! RUNETANG WANTS YOU!)



[edit on 10/20/2007 by runetang]

[edit on 10/20/2007 by runetang]

reply to post by runetang

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Well, I responded. I'm not really interested in debate, I think a roundtable discussion would be more helpful. Certainly there's at least one more Christian out there who did or could respond.

Right, I don't like to debate that much, I'm good at it but I prefer to stay positive, speak positive and speak inspirationally, if you could call it that. But I'll hash it out with some folks on the radio, if thats what the show would be.

But here we are 2 Christians, how many more will step up?

Edit: A roundtable would be better. I think a nice set up would be, to represent the most members of ATS, 2 Atheists, 2 Christians, 2 Pagan/New Age Wiccans? And then how about a single Muslim, and a single Hindu? Maybe a Buddhist if we have one. You know, a republic.

It could be called the First Ecumenical Council of Theism on ATS. (spiffy!)

Heck there could even be a dated, sticky put up in the Faith and Spirituality forum with a poll on it so all the people can vote on who they want to represent what Faiths, and the people who want to be on the show would have their names on the poll. Might need a couple polls, like one for Christian, one for Atheist, one for Pagan, and one for Jew/Muslim. This way all the followers of one group wont drown out the other candidates, which we'd need some from all groups.

[edit on 10/20/2007 by runetang]

Actually Major, I think you should give yourself more credit. You and Madness are both very excellent debaters and are both very articulate. I will venture to say that you are each a hard act to follow.

That being said, I say live and let live...I'm not interested in explaining my religious beliefs to anyone nor am interested in hearing too much in depth about any one person's specific beliefs. Religious Philopsophy - yes. Dogma - no.

Plus, what are the odds that Christians (myself included) would ever really come to a consensus!? There aren't too many variables in Atheism.

[edit on 20/10/07 by kosmicjack]

But Christians know how to withhold certain personal beliefs that their peers may be in opposition to, particularly in the event that the personal beliefs in question are of a very minority nature, in which case .. to remain a part of that Christian council the said individual would have to keep things relatively straight-forward, from the book, without too much personal additions, without too much stories about the personal experiences, unless asked by the host.

The other thing your post provoked me to say is, I understand the want and need to be left alone and quiet. Much like in a Muslim controlled society, even in the Western world, in a metaphor, we still are Dhimmi status, the Christians and Jews here in America at least, because the general public scoffs at us. Our friends thinks its "uncool" or "lame" to speak on God. The youth need some guidance, and who better from fellow youth, at least in my case. I aint that young, but I was under 20 when 9/11 took place.

So I personally see an opportunity to clarify SO much stuff that gets .. misunderstand by people who criticize and try to provoke Christians. Things like why God had so many "killed" in the Old Testament, and why God won't magically appear in the sky and let the world know in every single language of our mankind that God does indeed exist! Then God would say, okay, everyone back to work! And the Devil would've been vanquished, along with all evil, by his mere presence. And so the testing ground, the furnace and anvil we call Earth and living here as people, would cease to be a furnace for the forging of swords that slice through deception and reflect the divine spark, nay, it would lose one of its' very purposes by God for existing to begin with; so that one day we may be worthy through our living deeds to live on forever after we die in eternity with the presence of God.

Think of the kids, man .. lol

[edit on 10/20/2007 by runetang]