The Hologram Theory is dead

Originally posted by Level X

Now, lets skip to somewhere in Los Angeles - 2007. As I walk toward my sisters office, there sits a lonely picture of her companies CEO who died on that plane.

If his flight didn't hit the building, then where has he been hiding since 9-11??

Thanks for the post Level X. I have a master list of all the passengers allegedly onboard the planes that allegedly crashed.

Could you please give me the name of the CEO and which flight he was on. I would like to compare it to the master list.

The reason I ask is that there were 2 airliners that allegedly crashed into the WTC. American Airlines Flight 11 into the north tower and United Airlines 175 into the south tower.

So looking through the passenger lists there is no passenger listed as a CEO of a company in Los Angeles.

American Airlines Flight 11 (north tower):

There is a EDMUND GLASZER, 41, CFO who lived in Chatsworth,CA.

There is a JUDY LAROCQUE, 50, CEO of a firm in Framingham, MA.

United Airlines 175 (south tower):

James E. Hayden CFO, Netegrity Inc. Westford, MA.

But like I say no CEO of any company in Los Angeles.

If you could give me the name of the CEO who works in your sisters office it would be very helpful in verifying the passenger list.

As you probably know there has never been any insurance claims against either United Airlines or American Airlines in the alleged 911 crashes which is very suspicious. No matter how patriotic anybody is, you still have to show them the money. Know what I mean?

Thanks for your input it is greatly appreciated.

I think actual planes were used in the attacks, at least for the WTC 1 and 2 towers and of course Flight 93.

However, I think it is highly probable that these planes were guided by remote into the towers and Flight 93 was shot down, with all the passengers on the planes, and the "terrorists" were there to ensure that the other passengers did not find out about the planes being remotely controlled, and to create the ruse of a hi-jacking by radical islamic fundamentalists.

I do think the hologram theory is very interesting, and is worth the study and debate about it, but I think it would just have been so much easier to use real planes in the attack, a couple of planes and a few thousand people are nothing to these people that carried this out.

But I am definitely open to more research into the no-planes and hologram theory, I don't believe anything should be automatically ruled out.

BUt if it was a hologram? why not make a hologram of an inferno as well? I mean if you are just scrap all the evidence and sell it to china or whatever, no one will have any proof to disclaim it anyways?
I mean if you had a hologram projector that looked that good, why not use it more often? They can hologram speedboats crashing into ocean liners and what not? There has not been a terrorist attack in the US since 9/11 so I just don't see why they wouldnt use it everytime they needed a new war or some contract to Blackwater or whatever?

Well there was a response Scientifically on the Wing entering the Towers,

Department of Ocean Engineering, Impact & Crashworthiness

The conclusion?

"

Therefore, the wing would easily cut through the outer column. It was also found that the energy absorbe by plastic deformation and fracture of the ill-fated column is only 6.7% of the initial kinetic energy of the wing."

You can find it here

LINK

edit-remove post. Reposed below.

[edit on 16-10-2007 by WASTYT]

Originally posted by Wizard_In_The_Woods
All issues you bring up have been discussed over and over on ATS. But ATS is a busy place and it is practically impossible to retrieve specific info without wallowing through thousands of posts.

Well if it's available on ATS why don't you provide me with the links. If you believe enough in this theory then you'll do so.

Did you see a plane crashing on 9-11 with your very own two eyes, in real life and not just on a television screen?

I was there and witnessed it live on the ground. I worked on Wall St. and Broadway at the time.

How well did you know some of the people on those flights? Can you personally confirm the integrity of their characters?

Didn't know anyone personally, but if you've read through this thread then you would've read that poster Reddragon has a friend who's father perished in one of the planes. Poster levelx also says that the ceo of his sisters co. perished on one of those planes as well.

Regarding the physical impossibility of aluminum aircraft flying at 500 mph slicing into the twin towers, I will say the following. The perimeter columns at WTC 1 and 2 were quarter inch thick steel ca. 14x13” box beams spaced 39” center to center. The window space in between was only 25”. Above and below — every 7’08” — there were 52” wide 3/8” thick steel plates in ten foot sections welded together wrapped around the entire circumference of the towers. This means 62% of the tower outside surface area was solid steel, one half inch thick (two quarter inch plates of beams put together for simplicity of argument) to 7/8” thick beneath the spandrel plate belts (1/4”+1/4”+3/8”) wrapped around the building. Other ATS members hate me for this statement, but it’s a good comparison, if a 9 mm bullet traveling at 500 mph won’t puncture quarter inch steel (let alone half or seven-eights inch) then neither will a Boeing 757/767. Plow over yes, maybe, but poke a hole in it, NO!

This is a well worded response Wizard. You sound like you know what you're talking about. But then how do you explain this?
The B-25 that crashed into the Empire State Building in 1945. Max speed 300 mph, fuel capacity 692 gallons. Weight 20,000 lbs.


Here's the hole it made.

There is bodily evidence or lack thereof proving that there were no planes on 9-11.

Present it.

The presence of holograms is only as real as the eyewitness accounts. If people truthfully did see planes, then they saw holograms.

Prove it.

The 757/767 that hit the WTC.




767 fuel capacity 24,000 gallons. Max speed 530 mph. Weight 400,000 lbs.
757 fuel capacity 11,500 gallons. Max speed 500 mph. Weight 255,000 lbs.

You're telling me that these planes couldn't put a hole into the side of the WTC buildings? That it was impossible for this to happen? I challenge you Wizard.

Good Night.

I find it unfathomable that anyone actually believes there were holograms of airplanes that hit the twin towers. I thought this was a joke at first. If one wants to argue that it was an inside job, or any number of conspiracy theories concerning 9/11 go right ahead. Someone might actually get it right. A hologram theory is about as laughable as someone saying the twin towers were taken down by a pack of flying monkeys. All this proves is that John Lear belongs in a nursing home, and not online spewing nonsense about flying holograms. What's next? David Copperfield made Osama disappear through his immense powers of magic? This idea has made my month. Thanks believers.

Originally posted by Osiris1953

A hologram theory is about as laughable as someone saying the twin towers were taken down by a pack of flying monkeys. All this proves is that John Lear belongs in a nursing home, and not online spewing nonsense about flying holograms.

Many would agree with you Osirus1953. But my wife would not, because there would be:

1. Nobody to take the trash down on Saturdays and Wednesdays.
2. Nobody to fix the well pump when it goes out.
3. Nobody to fix the sprinklers.
4. Nobody to take the palm fronds to the dump.
5. Nobody to entertain her guests with stories about flying saucers.
6. Nobody to trim the olive trees.
7. Nobody to take our grandson to the bike park.
8. Nobody to make Grampas famous tomato salad.
9. Nobody to tell them how to find the north star.
10. Nobody to tell them stories about Bob Lazar.

So while many would believe that I belong in a nursing home, my wife would not. And thats who counts. Right?

Thanks for your post, your input is greatly appreciated.

reply to post by johnlear


Mr. Lear

Thanks for your interest. You did your homework. I hope this solves a piece of your puzzle.

Edmund Glaszer 41, CFO, MRV communications INC. Chatsworth, CA

keep me informed on your progress.

[edit on 16-10-2007 by Level X]

Questions....

Given that 9/11 was a bright and sunny day, how was the integrity of the "hologram" maintained under direct sunlight?

These were largely unpainted/silver finished planes and on the stills of the attacks before they hit the buildings you can see sunlight reflections on the fuselages. Since when did holograms cast reflections of sunlight?

(this is a repeat of what I posted earlier, as noone answered it)

neformore

To go along with your question, which is a good one btw.

Is this.

STANLEY PRAIMNATH, who happens to have survived in the Tower, and sees the WING enter the building. Shamefully, the NO-Plane people are trying to purposely twist what he is saying for their own Agenda.

www.youtube.com...

A Wing entered the Tower, and NO HOLOGRAM could do this.

The best the No plane people could do is try and make it look like he couldn't see the North Tower, but he said a 'portion he could see' and who knows exactly what window he would be looking out upon doing this.

It is shameful. Really it is. The man worked in the Tower and was on the correct floor of the impact.

So I think when one factors in your question, then the Science I quoted earlier showing how a Wing Could go through the Tower, then when one factors in the fact that there are missing people who went on these planes, it becomes obvious.

I have read these pages of posts and replies as a skeptic, which I remain, to all of your conspiracy theories. One often feels that many conspiracy theorists have these degrees of suspicion and distrust for their government because of their own individual lives that did not bud well, leaving them often to blame those closest to them, who were the culprits of their discontent, or that they are simply people without the human trait to believe outside of their own observation. Even being an open-minded individual I find it hard to say I respect your beliefs on the 9/11 attacks.

One thing I believe you all are ruling out is human witnesses to the attacks. New York City residents have reported seeing the planes hit. Perhaps many of you are so tied up on videos and pictures, considering the rest of America witnessed these attacks on T.V. and the internet, that you forget eye witnesses. But if you do a little reading, you'll find physical observation.

Some of you have mentioned powerful secret societies were behind this, even though no name was given. Maybe it was the Bilderburgs, the Council on Foreign Relations, the Bohemian Club (not likely), or the Club of Rome. Should we rule these out? No. But do you honestly think that these 'New World Orders' would conduct such an attack with U.S. politicians sitting present? Are you all really that sure that these people in our government would allow something like this? For what purpose I ask you. To allow themselves to be thrown into a guerrilla warfare? Wouldn't they have researched the militants in the Middle East enough to know it would be another Vietnam? Do you all believe that bin Laden is some fellow Skull and Bones of Bush's, and they chit-chat about Texas weather against the Middle Eastern desert, just shooting the #? Now come on.

Holograms are for comic books and cards. Phone calls from the planes are real. I respect John Lear, and I don't think he should be in a nursing home. But I think many of you allow media, such as videos and pictures, to make your beliefs solid. Just like the hologram issue brought up, that our technology can manipulate anything, so can a person not tell the truth through their mouth. But think about the circumstance of the situation. In that panicked moment of chaos, what eye-witness is going to tell someone that the World Trade Centers blew up with no direct contact? The accounts are there.

The last thing I want to say is that many of you theorists believe the attacks happened to revive patriotism in our country, right? Or am I assuming? Either way, why then would the country allow such human losses in soldiers to continue in a failing campaign that is sucking billions of dollars from our country? Seems a little self-destructive without any good reason, yeah?

what hit the first building ?

that we dont know , we only asume it was AA flight.


what hit the second building ?

acording to the spanish goverments own analys on the fotage we´ve been shown it was a plane roughly the size of the AA plane , but it was fitted with some kind of bigger fuselage or compartment extention beneth the wings that for some reason matches in description to an Army surveilance plane , mark and model nr i dont have at this point ,

to further speculate the impact it self , the spanish goverment stated that flashes can be seen inside the building before impact , in all the close up 9/11 videos of the plane hitting the building , ..... mark the plane.




what brougth the towers down ?


demolition most likely since its the first sky scraper buildings in history of man kind the goes down by fire ,


the impacts it self wouldent have done anything to either building , much less to wtc 7,
WTC towers where made stronger then they originaly intended ,


and a certain frase comes in mind made by the owner for the buildings that THEY decided to BRING DOWN

Regarding the physical impossibility of aluminum aircraft flying at 500 mph slicing into the twin towers, I will say the following. The perimeter columns at WTC 1 and 2 were quarter inch thick steel ca. 14x13” box beams spaced 39” center to center. The window space in between was only 25”. Above and below — every 7’08” — there were 52” wide 3/8” thick steel plates in ten foot sections welded together wrapped around the entire circumference of the towers. This means 62% of the tower outside surface area was solid steel, one half inch thick (two quarter inch plates of beams put together for simplicity of argument) to 7/8” thick beneath the spandrel plate belts (1/4”+1/4”+3/8”) wrapped around the building. Other ATS members hate me for this statement, but it’s a good comparison, if a 9 mm bullet traveling at 500 mph won’t puncture quarter inch steel (let alone half or seven-eights inch) then neither will a Boeing 757/767. Plow over yes, maybe, but poke a hole in it, NO!

1st. a bullet doesn't have the same mass as a 767 with fuel and additional loads.

2nd, if a plane didn't hit the building, I would assume you believe that explosives were used. If explosives were indeed used, how did they cause the perimeter framing to blow toward the explosives? That is what would need to have happened.

There is bodily evidence or lack thereof proving that there were no planes on 9-11. The presence of holograms is only as real as the eyewitness accounts. If people truthfully did see planes, then they saw holograms. Because actual planes would have had corporeal effects, much different from the ones we were shown.

Please prove your statements including the technology available to create a hologram that would meet my previously described conditions EXACTLY.

Originally posted by Osiris1953
I find it unfathomable that anyone actually believes there were holograms of airplanes that hit the twin towers. I thought this was a joke at first. If one wants to argue that it was an inside job, or any number of conspiracy theories concerning 9/11 go right ahead. Someone might actually get it right. A hologram theory is about as laughable as someone saying the twin towers were taken down by a pack of flying monkeys. All this proves is that John Lear belongs in a nursing home, and not online spewing nonsense about flying holograms. What's next? David Copperfield made Osama disappear through his immense powers of magic?

This idea has made my month. Thanks believers.

Well, I had the same thought the first time I saw someone believed a hologram plane blew up the buildings. Now the irony is, this hypothesis is a joke. The problem is that the people presenting the idea aren't in on the joke. Hopefully they'll get the punchline one day.

I use the word hypothesis because using the word Theory gives credence to their argument as it implies evidence of ANY KIND has been presented. There is ZERO evidence of a hologram.

The other funny part is that even if the "no-planers" did disprove the planes existed (never going to happen), it doesn't by default PROVE a hologram plane did it.

My hypothesis is that a group of Decepticons that looked like planes did it. Those evil alien machines had help from flying, purple circus monkeys. Now here's the fun part.... READY??? Prove I'm wrong This is exactly what the hologram people are doing ) FUN STUFF
They believe they are right because you can't disprove a double negative.

I also find it amusing that people would believe a plane hitting a building would look like Wyle E. Coyote hitting the side of a cartoon mountain.

New York City residents have reported seeing the planes hit.

agreed, but take this into consideration:

People also claimed to have seen flight 77 hit the pentagon, yet a 757 did not create the hole in the pentagon. There are witnesses that saw a 757 hit, yet there were witnesses who were trained military personell that said they saw something other than a jumbo jet hit.

There are 8 million residents in NYC and only a relative handful even claim to have seen the plane hit. Many people including some of the first to respond on live news claim it was not a passenger airliner.

You cant believe them all. somebody has to be right.

therefore you do not know what hit the towers.

therefore you cannot say what did not hit the towers based on what you think did.

Originally posted by WASTYT
I was there and witnessed it live on the ground. I worked on Wall St. and Broadway at the time.

Dear WASTYT:

Thank you for your elaborate response. I think you are sincerely interested in 9-11, so please don’t misunderstand what I am about to say.

I believe you when you say you worked on Wall Street/Broadway in NYC on 9-11. I also trust you witnessed the smoking, burning and destruction of the twin towers. You may even have seen explosions.

I however do not believe you physically saw a plane crashing into WTC 1 or 2. I’m saying this simply because your reply was too short. If you had really seen a Boeing roaring into the tower wall, you would have spoken only about it. I’m not calling you a liar. I’m saying that you were misled/terrified into associating a plane crash with a smoldering building.

As for the passengers of the four 9-11 flights. I’m suggesting that those who legitimately did exist, are living — well and high on the hog — under some sort of witness protection program. This is not so far-fetched. A life free from having to work obviously sounds appealing to many, else why the craze to play the lottery?

WASTYT, if you did see the plane, please describe it to the best of your abilities so we can get to the bottom of this.

Greetings,
The Wizard In The Woods

Originally posted by jfj123

Well, I had the same thought the first time I saw someone believed a hologram plane blew up the buildings.

Thanks for the post jfj123. I think there may be a misunderstanding here. Holographs can't blow up a building. Holographs are projected images. They have no substance per se.

The buildings were blown up with a combination of controlled demolition to coincide with the projected image of a holograph crashing into the building and then an hour or so later with a beam of directed energy that produced or caused molecular disassociation characterized by ‘rolling clouds’, 'drifting clouds', 'toasted vehicles' and 'fuming'.

All of these phenomena were present during and after the collapse.
(see: www.drjudywood.com...)

Thanks for your input, it is greatly appreciated.

Originally posted by Wizard_In_The_Woods


I believe you when you say you worked on Wall Street/Broadway in NYC on 9-11. I also trust you witnessed the smoking, burning and destruction of the twin towers. You may even have seen explosions.

I however do not believe you physically saw a plane crashing into WTC 1 or 2. I’m saying this simply because your reply was too short. If you had really seen a Boeing roaring into the tower wall, you would have spoken only about it. I’m not calling you a liar. I’m saying that you were misled/terrified into associating a plane crash with a smoldering building.

So, because his post wasn't a page long graphic novel about his experience, he must have been tricked into imagining a plane? Please...you don't believe him because his testimony is a slap in the face to your whole cause. Sitting at your computer postulating about what you think happened is no substitute for first hand experience.

As for the passengers of the four 9-11 flights. I’m suggesting that those who legitimately did exist, are living — well and high on the hog — under some sort of witness protection program. This is not so far-fetched. A life free from having to work obviously sounds appealing to many, else why the craze to play the lottery?

Sure, for the right price all of these people would gladly be held in captivity for the rest of their lives, never speaking to their family again, never having contact with the outside world. The lottery is a bad analogy here, dude. Wizard, was it you who suggested they were on the international space station? THE HOLOGRAM THEORY IS DEAD.

Thanks for the post jfj123. I think there may be a misunderstanding here. Holographs can't blow up a building. Holographs are projected images. They have no substance per se.

Sorry, my bad. That was a bit of sarcasm. I should have been more clear about that.

The buildings were blown up with a combination of controlled demolition to coincide with the projected image of a holograph crashing into the building

I guess the problem I have with this is that, I would be interested to see evidence that this technology exists.

and then an hour or so later with a beam of directed energy that produced or caused molecular disassociation characterized by ‘rolling clouds’, 'drifting clouds', 'toasted vehicles' and 'fuming'.

I assume you are describing a laser hitting the building to weaken the steel structure to cause collapse?

reply to post by johnlear

man John lear your so full of it.you dont offer any explanation you just say this and that happened with out explaining how it happened. how do you expect anyone to believe you. how about you leave everything to the experts, you know the people that actually do know what theyre saying. every theory youve ever created is bs an can be disproved easly. every story you tell is a bunch of bs and nothing can be proven through them except the fact that theyre made up and stupid. take every theory to a scientist and they will laff in your face, thats how dumb they are. hologram theory is bs, the moon and venus theory pure crap, and wat ever other theory im sure 98% of educated people will dimiss it as bs created by a crazy guy.

your part of the 2% that believe bs and creat bs. the ignorant ones that have no knowledge or understanding on what they talk about.