I don't think Bush "lied" in so much as he "overstated." :tryingtokeepastraightface:

After all, he knew his Dad and Reagen gave Iraq the components for WMD's, so who could have known that Saddam actually got rid of them... I mean it's not like we had him contained and inspected for a decade before Bush's war... oh wait. WE DID! And Saddam was telling the TRUTH the whole time!!!!

So Clinton apparently did a great job!!! If the hunt for WMD was a one minded effort for vindication of Bush, it most certainly did NOT do that, but it's futile efforts did one thing well... vindicate Clinton.

Here's a joke: Kay and O'Neill are waiting at a bar to be met shortly by Powell...B-O-O-M!!!

Get it? The bar had a "gas leak."

Does anyone else think that Bush and Co. should be impeached and face prosecution for his intentional misleading of the American people in order to involve us in a unjustified, and illegal war?

Does anyone think they ever will be?

I think Bush should be impeached as soon as all the other countries agree to impeach their corrupt leaders too. Why should the US be the only country in the world to do the right thing?

Originally posted by THENEO
I think Bush should be impeached as soon as all the other countries agree to impeach their corrupt leaders too. Why should the US be the only country in the world to do the right thing?

WTF kind of statement is that??? That is the same kind of thinking that allows people to get mugged or raped in public view while a crowd of people just stare and do nothing. "Why should I help if no body else is going to?"

Here are some other reasons:
1.) It's the Duty of Every American to keep watch over the Freedoms of this Country and it's People. Including the re-organization and/or reconstruction of it's Government if it should become corrupt and act against the it's people.
2.) Since when is it a good idea to take action depending upon what all other countries may or may not be doing? Our responsibility is to keep control over what is happening here, not somewhere else. To do otherwise is Hypocritical.
3.) If one currupt leader in the world is bad, 2 is worse. 3, 4, 5, etc. worse still. Getting rid of any of them is a benefit, why not start here, be a good example, show the world what is possible, maybe we'd earn some respect back.

Shall I continue?? Honestly, think about what you're saying. I don't mean to sound rude or flame you THENEO, but that statement is unbelievably illogical.

It is a valid point. It is easy to criticize your own but let everyone else run wild, this will not create justice or peace or security.

Furthermore the more others cheat and lie and swindle the more difficult it is for the few remaining honest people to do so.

Besides you and many other people have a problem with the idea of the war period and it doesn't matter if they found weapons tomorrow because you would find annother fault. I just know you would, so accept that WMD are not the issue here but just a topic for discussion because even if they appeared tomorrow most of the people crying about them today would forget about it and make annother problem to beef about.

Like I said before at ATS and nobody has disputed yet is this: Saddam claimed to have WMD correct? It does not matter whether he did or not, he wanted people to believe that he had them and that was enough reason to go in and verify yes or no. Besides they may still be there or they may have went into Syria as I have suspected all along.

People are free to complain about WMD if they want but it won't change my mind at all nor most people that found Saddam to be a threat to Western civilization which he was.

Originally posted by THENEO
It is a valid point. It is easy to criticize your own but let everyone else run wild, this will not create justice or peace or security.
If "Your Own" is corrupt then that is where you start! You don't ignore it and/or justify it because everyone else is doing something similar.

If your neighborhood is infested with Rats do you wait until everyone else clears out thier house before you deal with cleaning up yours?

If you're hanging out with a group of people and they all decide beat and rob some frail old man or attack an innocent woman, do you join in simply cause they do it?

Furthermore the more others cheat and lie and swindle the more difficult it is for the few remaining honest people to do so.

All countries should deal with their Corrupt Governments individually. However, we cannot force other countries to see things our way. We are supposed to deal with our own Country and it's problems regardless of what the rest of the world is doing with theirs however.

Besides you and many other people have a problem with the idea of the war period and it doesn't matter if they found weapons tomorrow because you would find annother fault. I just know you would, so accept that WMD are not the issue here but just a topic for discussion because even if they appeared tomorrow most of the people crying about them today would forget about it and make annother problem to beef about.


Like I said before at ATS and nobody has disputed yet is this: Saddam claimed to have WMD correct? It does not matter whether he did or not, he wanted people to believe that he had them and that was enough reason to go in and verify yes or no. Besides they may still be there or they may have went into Syria as I have suspected all along.

I'm not saying anything about the War or Saddam or WMD's. Saying or having the attitude of "Why should we do the right thing when nobody else is?" is the point I'm talking about. I'm not saying Bush is only problem either. Nor am I saying it's the Right wing Cons. either. I'm talking about the Corrupt Actions of Our Government and fixing the problems. I am looking at the actions of each official without party representation or political classification.


People are free to complain about WMD if they want but it won't change my mind at all nor most people that found Saddam to be a threat to Western civilization which he was.

Originally posted by jezebel
Does anyone else think that Bush and Co. should be impeached and face prosecution for his intentional misleading of the American people in order to involve us in a unjustified, and illegal war?

Does anyone think they ever will be?

Of course.

Worse still than leading Congress and the American public astray with false and fabricated intelligence, the US has dragged in certain countries into the supposed "Coalition Of the Willing" on the same basis, and owes them big time for this deception. Not to mention the people of Iraq.

Originally posted by THENEO
It is a valid point. It is easy to criticize your own but let everyone else run wild, this will not create justice or peace or security.

Since when did it become right for us to police the actions of other countrys, instead of our own. If we cannot hold our own government accountable for it's lies and deception, how can we say anything about another country for doing the same. We are the United States of America, not the United States of the World. We have no business telling other countries how they should do things. The best thing for us to do, would be to serve as an example of strength and integrity so that others, who don't think it's possible, can see that it is.

Furthermore the more others cheat and lie and swindle the more difficult it is for the few remaining honest people to do so.

Honest people don't cheat, lie, and swindle. Hence the word honest.

Besides you and many other people have a problem with the idea of the war period and it doesn't matter if they found weapons tomorrow because you would find annother fault. I just know you would, so accept that WMD are not the issue here but just a topic for discussion because even if they appeared tomorrow most of the people crying about them today would forget about it and make annother problem to beef about.

You need to focus on one problem at a time. You have no idea how anyone else would react, if WMD's were found because they haven't been. To blow off that fact with such an unfounded assumption about someone else's character, shows your unfortunate determination to believe whatever lies they tell you, so your pride is not hurt. What you don't realize is that, in refusing to admit that you might possibly be mistaken, you are allowing others to define your values.

Like I said before at ATS and nobody has disputed yet is this: Saddam claimed to have WMD correct?

He claimed to have HAD them, but also to have destroyed them. He did not claim to have them still.

It does not matter whether he did or not, he wanted people to believe that he had them and that was enough reason to go in and verify yes or no. Besides they may still be there or they may have went into Syria as I have suspected all along.

What matters is whether or not he was a threat to the United States. He had never threatened us, nor had he made any moves that indicated he would attack us. Was he was a tyrant? Yes. Was he was a tyrant put into place by our government and armed by our government? Also yes. Was our government honest when it told us that he posed an immediate threat to our lives and safety? No. Did they use our fear to start a war that we otherwise would not have supported? Yes. Should that be considered an act of treason by the American population? Yes

Anyone who feels a need to rebut your logic, jezebel, might benefit from a full read of the definition of treason. It is an emotive word, but it also has specific connotations at law which need detailed examination in this case. And obviously there is going to be a long-winded and drawn out case.

Originally posted by THENEO
It is a valid point. It is easy to criticize your own but let everyone else run wild, this will not create justice or peace or security.

Furthermore the more others cheat and lie and swindle the more difficult it is for the few remaining honest people to do so.

Besides you and many other people have a problem with the idea of the war period and it doesn't matter if they found weapons tomorrow because you would find annother fault. I just know you would, so accept that WMD are not the issue here but just a topic for discussion because even if they appeared tomorrow most of the people crying about them today would forget about it and make annother problem to beef about.

Like I said before at ATS and nobody has disputed yet is this: Saddam claimed to have WMD correct? It does not matter whether he did or not, he wanted people to believe that he had them and that was enough reason to go in and verify yes or no. Besides they may still be there or they may have went into Syria as I have suspected all along.

People are free to complain about WMD if they want but it won't change my mind at all nor most people that found Saddam to be a threat to Western civilization which he was.

Wow!!! They're at it again, trying to use the power of the spin to wash over this. Is that what there say on some "I love Bush" site THENEO. Read the Elvis quote in my signature and realise that no matter how much these scumbags try to spin this, it ain't going away.

Will all these same members cry at the wrongs of Democratic leaders if and when they actually elect one again. I wish they would but I doubt it.

Originally posted by THENEO
Will all these same members cry at the wrongs of Democratic leaders if and when they actually elect one again. I wish they would but I doubt it.

What has that got to do with anything? You're talking about something that isn't even happening, meanwhile what is happening is that Bush is a liar and you are doing your best to paste over the cracks in his lies.

Nothing would be any different if Democrat is in office, and I'm sure with the exception of a few everyone else feels that way. I wont be happy until I see a new form of government all together.

Stop trying to make it into something that it isn't.

....& question, more specifically. At what point does the justification for a war that has killed 10's of thousand Iraqis ( most of them non-combatants ) & hundreds of Americans some how become exonerated by the most circumstantial of conjecture?

- All proof has been concrete that the Bush administration marshalled the US to war on very speculative evidence. A quarter level below that on the concrete scale is that they lied in doing so.

- If high treason is defined as a willful act to the severe detriment of your home country, they're guilty.

And most importantly, so that it's removed as an item in the Right Wing grab bag of justification: wars are set about on based on clear & present dangers.........till a proof to that definition some how falls from the heavens in the Iraqi illegal invasion saga, stop trying to cling to the use of a 'maybe-could-have-they-said-might-be-over-there' subterfuge on Iraqi WMD.......everyone from the UN inspector/US inspector/CIA/Sec. of State/UK Ministers have recanted those spurrious claims.

[Edited on 26-1-2004 by Bout Time]