God only likes people who like him

Im not saying that I dont like god and im not saying that i dont believe in god

but i dont know about you as for my after life i would very much enjoy absolute freedom without leaders and a handfull of people dictating everybody what to do.

i just want to be a free spirit when i die, not controlled by anyone or anything.

Shearder

Yes, i would have to agree that they would be in their own sort of hell. Not hell as said i.e. lake or sea of fire but in a hell of understanding! But again, they would "die" and be part of the second resurrection and then the second death! (see further below)

Originally posted by whirlwind
My question for you is, what do you believe the following scripture means?
Rev.20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Well if i think about it, it is a confusing verse to say the least, but I would have to say that when the Antichrist comes those that do not "convert" to evil will be killed. Those souls will be of the first resurrection and they will rule with Christ for a thousand years. Then Christ will rid the world of evil and then resurrect the "rest" of the "dead" to judge. Yes and i agree they will be spiritually dead i.e. their souls will be dead too. He won't resurrect corpses - it will be souls IMO.

I question if anyone will be killed by the anti-christ at all. He is coming in the guise of Christ so has to maintain that facade. Scripture does state:


And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.

But there shall not an hair of your head perish. (Luke 21:16,18)


So...even though they are delivered to death, which I believe just means being delivered to Satan as death is another of his names, not even one hair will perish. The elect are placed in front of him and that is when the Holy Spirit speaks through them.

There is another place where Christ assures His elect. He was speaking to His disciples but as He makes reference to Satan it was also for the elect of end times (as Satan doesn't fall from heaven until the end of days):


And He said unto them, "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:18-19)


However, whether or not the elect are killed at that time, shortly after they stand before Satan the true Christ will appear and Paul tells us what will happen:


Behold I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:51-52)


Paul was talking about flesh and blood in a previous verse so here he can't just be singling out the elect as those that will be changed...."All" has to mean all flesh and blood that is living at the time Christ appears again.


For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, "Death is swallowed up in victory." (1 Corinthians 15:53-54)


Here I think we see the difference in the souls that make the "first resurrection" and those that are spiritually dead. If all those living were changed into our spirit bodies then everyone has "put on incorruption" - their bodies won't age, die, etc., at least throughout the millennium but not all will also be immortal. Those that are also immortal are those that will reign with Christ through the millennium, which means they will teach. They won't have to be tested as the others will.....they are home free. They are immortal but the other incorruptible souls are still liable to die.


That is what I believe the scriptures are saying but my friend, who is very, very knowledgeable about the Bible reads it differently. He believes that those that didn't make the first resurrection continue on as they have before, in flesh bodies throughout the millennium but they live without the influence of Satan until he is released at the end of the 1,000 years.

I doubt at all that there will be "bodies" living for 1000 years. There will still be the usual dying of the body and souls will either go to heaven as normal OR they will die (souls) if they have the mark and be resurrected to be judged. And that's when he will pull out the book of life and that's when he will judge the "dead" - those souls that did not qualify for eternal life. That will be the second resurrection.

If they have "put on incorruption" they couldn't die physically as the flesh body is already gone. Of course, if they were still in flesh it is possible they could live through the millennium if things go back to how it was at the beginning.

I think from reading your paragraph that we see that millennium time in a different way. Are you saying that the "souls that did not qualify for eternal life" are in a sort of limbo during the millennium? If so, we differ in that I think everyone that didn't make it will be taught without Satan's influence....taught by those that did make it. It sounds like a "second chance" but really, as a teacher of mine stated, "they never really had a chance to begin with", what with the type of teaching going on today.

like verse 5:12 says "12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works"

To me, that is the last chance those that didn't make the first resurrection have. The final judgment. But, were those being judged in a spirit body or flesh body? Had they been held in limbo or were they taught. If they are judged on their works they had to be able to work. This brings me back to my original question (I think, it's been so long since I've been at my original question), which is.....After all of that, do you think scripture tells us that during the millennium some will be walking earth in their flesh bodies or spiritual bodies?


............Whirlwind

Originally posted by masterchief117
but i don't know about you as for my after life i would very much enjoy absolute freedom without leaders and a handful of people dictating everybody what to do.

I think you're in luck. Seriously. That seems to be the plan, as far as I know. Although no one believes it...and those that do claim that peace is 'evil' and a sign of the 'anti-christ.' How much sense does THAT make? How can peace be BAD?

i just want to be a free spirit when i die, not controlled by anyone or anything.

Of course you do - I do, too - more than anything, just FREE. And if there is a GOD - don't you think GOD is a free spirit? And if GOD is love, as is written, then it is beyond question that GOD would want us all to be just as FREE as GOD.

And if truly we are a piece of GOD, and all together within GOD, then wouldn't that mean that we are already free (from death's illusion)...we just have to fear not death~!

Huh?

Either GOD is good and merciful and eternally patient - because outside of time everything is 'eternal.'

Or else GOD is a crock of poo. I don't want a GOD I'd like to kill.

If GOD isn't love...in truth...then GOD is NOT.

i would really have to get to know god before i can speculate now wouldnt i?

oh wait a second! gods not available at the moment please leave a message...

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
reply to post by WorldShadow

 

This whole conversation reminds me of what goes on my daughter's kindergarten class, namely, "I'll be your best friend if you give me a cookie. But I won't like you if you don't."

"I'll let you come into Heaven if you follow all my rules, believe in and love me and do everything the Bible tells you to. If you don't, you're going to suffer for all eternity in the fires of Hell."

Scaring people into believing. Got to love it!

Parhessia

God doesnt want to force us into believing or suffer. He ants us to love him, then if we truly humble ourselves out he will show us true happiness.

(joy) is a gift of the holy ghost. God who made joy or a smile or laughter wants us to be happy, as long as we realize where we come from.

If my mother gave me rules when younger, am I supposed to rebell because she knows whats best for me?

I see today that the lack of understanding complete turns people off to God. They dont have a clue what kind of immense joy God wants to show people.


peaCce.

Originally posted by masterchief117
oh wait a second! gods not available at the moment please leave a message...

:shk:
Out cursing fig leaves, again?

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
They dont have a clue what kind of immense joy God wants to show people.

Hubris again -- you are assuming that those of us who reject your god haven't felt religious joy.

I have, and I recognize it for a function of my physiology, specifically, my neurology. I've also felt it under other circumstances, that were non-religious.

When people say things like this THAT is what turns people off from your message. Well, people who might otherwise have listened and accepted it. I turned off the "good news" a long time ago.

Your experience is not unique nor is it special. It's part of the human condition, and is not in any way supernatural.

Now, if god wants me to be his best friend, I need my heavenly cookie. Or should that be manna?

reply to post by JesusisTruth



ok

God doesnt want to force us into believing or suffer. He ants us to love him, then if we truly humble ourselves out he will show us true happiness.

why does god need us to love him
is a little paraniod of the life he created

i believe my parents created me
and i love them very much and i dont even have too humble myself in front of them, for them to accept me for who i am.

my happiness is my daughter
and me and her mother created her
she is everything to me.......

(joy) is a gift of the holy ghost. God who made joy or a smile or laughter wants us to be happy, as long as we realize where we come from.

ehhhh
same thing
i know where i came from
and same thing again
my daughter has given me all my joy in my life, not anybody or anything, just her.........

I see today that the lack of understanding complete turns people off to God. They dont have a clue what kind of immense joy God wants to show people.

just where do you go for this immense joy from god
or do i have to worship and obey him BEFORE i get this immense joy

dont tell me i have a lack of understanding or that i dont have a clue

us non-believers dont judge god or his messangers/believers
his believers should show the same respect, would you not agree.

have a nice day in church tomorrow

chickenfeet

reply to post by JesusisTruth


There are stories of parents who lost their children, only to discover that they have been raised or adpoted by another family.

Some of these children know some of their past and acknowledged their birth parents when they meet.

Others do not due to many reasons. Some of these birth parents continue to fight for the acknowledgement of their children, while others do not pursue this course as long as they know that their children are happy and well taken care of.

They continue to love them even when they know that these children may never ever acknowledge them as their birth parents.

I think some of these parents have amazing self-sacifice and love.

So far, I have never come across any case where the birth parents of these lost children, attack/kill or kidnap and torture the children who did/will not acknowledge their birth parents even when concrete proof was presented and confirmed.

I would like to think that I am able to see selfless, unconditional love of the many mortal parents then a love that comes with a price tag.

God has the same flaws as some mortal parents, love on condition or suffer damnation.

[edit on 7-10-2007 by ixiy]

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
When people say things like this THAT is what turns people off from your message. Well, people who might otherwise have listened and accepted it. I turned off the "good news" a long time ago.

Thank YOU for saying that! Listen up Christians! Your message has gone sour and ineffective! Giving GOD a bad name and spreading atheism like wildfire. Look up the word 'reconciliation' before you even think about the word 'GOSPEL.' ♥

MM~
an idle question - in your personal opinion, do you think that Christianity is the #1 cause of determined atheism?
(excluding anything agnostic)
- maybe call it 'conversion to atheism'

I think it is.

I am neither a Christian or an atheist - never have been either one. And that is my own opinion. Whaddya think?

Your experience is not unique nor is it special. It's part of the human condition, and is not in any way supernatural.

That's right - names are not anything more than capital-letter semantics (to the casual) and hidden codes (to a spiritual geek like me)...Christ is LOVE is self-truth and brotherhood and cooperation. Call it whatever you want to or need to - it is essentially the flame of sentient life we all share - call it Lucifer, the fire of Prometheus, fire from heaven, Kundalini, enlightenment, buddha-hood, the fiery chariot, the lake of fire...whatever!!

Life is life is life. We all are the same in that respect, no matter what!
Whether we came from stromatolites, ET's, blue cosmic eggs, or even *gasp* a GOD...regardless, we ALL came from that same place!

Now, if god wants me to be his best friend, I need my heavenly cookie. Or should that be manna?

GOD's in Queens this week; bring Pepsi and ring-dings.

Originally posted by queenannie38

MM~
an idle question - in your personal opinion, do you think that Christianity is the #1 cause of determined atheism?
(excluding anything agnostic)
- maybe call it 'conversion to atheism'

Actually, I don't. But I don't think the state of Christianity in general in the country helps any. I do think, however, that the attitude of many Christians (the evangelicals for instance) makes atheists like myself want to speak out more and state our piece to make elbow room for ourselves. So in a sense, I don't think Christianity CAUSES atheism, but it does cause atheism to be much more vocal.

A great many of the atheists I know also tried other things than Christianity and we found god in none of them.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction


Thank you for sharing your thoughts, MM! I always appreciate it!

The Mother Goddess loves all who are not evil.

Regardless of who believes in her or not.

That is all I have to say.

The Mother Goddess loves ALL.

ALL.

She is a mother - the epitome of unconditional love!

Originally posted by masterchief117
Im not saying that I dont like god and im not saying that i dont believe in god

but i dont know about you as for my after life i would very much enjoy absolute freedom without leaders and a handfull of people dictating everybody what to do.

i just want to be a free spirit when i die, not controlled by anyone or anything.

Would it be acceptable if you were under a dictatorship but were unaware of it? If you did NOT have the notion that your thoughts and actions are not your own, would that offend you? It seems you want to be a free spirit, but I would not want a spiritual entity that cannot promise freedom to others.

The spiritual realm dwells within the physical realm. For your soul to be truly free, you need to release the spirits of others who you see every day through others, if that makes any sense. You are entertaining the spirits within you so don't be a dictator yourself and you will free your own self.