Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by omnicron

Wow, talking about kicking the guy while he's down. Well as much as I don't agree with John Lear's so called 'facts', I feel bad about you guys putting him down the way that you guys did.

Even if the stuff that he say in here is considered ridiculous, you don't have the right of putting him down like that.

You guys are cruel. Leave the old man alone.

Thanks omnicron, its OK. The more they kick and scream and screw themselves up into ceiling the more I know I am on the right track. Its always the same guys, nothing ever changes. yfxxx huddles with his fellow dropouts at the hauptbahnhoff beer parlor anxiously waiting for Oktoberfest.

If you knew those people like I know them you would understand they just can't help themselves. They're just like that and nobody is going to tell them anything.

Thanks again for the kind words omnicrom.

Time and time again i have read posts by john lear and time and time again i watch him spew forth nonsense and people eat it up,now ATS people are just the best and brightest people i have seen on any board in sometime people who want the truth and approach subjects with skeptical optimism and those who oppose lears views are met with contempt by his followers and sycophantic praise by lear and those who oppose lears words and theories are met by half baked lear reponses for instance he picks and chooses the reponses he makes ignoring or deflecting well thought politely posed questions then offering condescending words. and another said he was a unwillingly or inccidental disinfo agennt but i disagree he is very willingly because he posts vague threads with often little or no credible sources to back them up.

So someone allegedly knows where a world changing piece of material is, yet wont say where it is for fear of upsetting a friend eh?

Wait please, whilst I wipe up my vomit.

Originally posted by johnlear

MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet)

(excerpts)

Product Identification: Thorium Oxide

IV. REACTVITY DATA

Hazardous Decomposition Products: Thorium oxide dust, thoron daughters, alpha, beta and gamma radiation.

Ah, I see, thanks. What isotope, 232? This matters for the decay chain. If it is, I see where the gamma and beta emissions are coming from - elements/isotopes further down in the chain (which exist concurrently). Only thing is that Thorium-232's half-life is about 14,050,000,000 years, meaning I don't think there would be a significant amount of decay products to give off that much radiation.

I could be wrong, of course, and it might not be that isotope.

Originally posted by Access Denied
That wasn’t censorship… Simon Gray accidentally deleted all my posts and threads while he was fixing a problem with my account. Why he wasn’t fired for that I’m not sure.

Thanks for the clarification. I just wondered ...

Thanks for noticing though… I did however get a chance to refine my explanation more recently in another 115 thread (I could look it up for if you like?) to show that the theoretical models have been proven to be correct empirically with data obtained from the recent synthesis of two different isotopes of 115… no isotope of 115 will last longer than 4 minutes or so anywhere in the Universe.

Interesting. Anyway, a half-life of 4 minutes is still long for a Z=115 nucleus (I assume, this isotope needs much more neutrons than those which were synthesized so far). I'm not sure, but I think I read about even longer theoretical halflifes for some even-Z (116, 118) nuclei.

[Translation: Bob Lazar never had any 115… period.]

I know !

Regards
yf

I rarely post in any other sense than a comical fashion to lighten the tension of a thread ^_^, but for once im going to be serious. For a moment and I will play devil's advocate for both sides. On John's side, to prove himself would be to betray a friendship and his own reliability there of, not to mention he would probably be killed by any number of business or government bodies who wish to keep the oil money flowing for themselves and/or constituents. Now on ITF and others side, if he doesnt materialize proof there is no way of them having any way of furthering the research into the topic of the thread or its believability.

Now that i have been serious, I will end on a lighter note.

ALWAYS LOOK ON THE BRIGHT SIDE OF LIFE..... (MONTY PYTHON)

Originally posted by Access Denied
Thanks for noticing though… I did however get a chance to refine my explanation more recently in another 115 thread (I could look it up for if you like?) to show that the theoretical models have been proven to be correct empirically with data obtained from the recent synthesis of two different isotopes of 115… no isotope of 115 will last longer than 4 minutes or so anywhere in the Universe.

Looked up your post, and followed the link. According to this theoretically calculated table, the longest living Z=115 (Uup) isotope is Uup-310 with a halflife of 4 days. Impressive, but still way too short for any chunk of Uup to live very long .

Regards
yf

Originally posted by RedEyes
Surely this would be one of the things in life worth dying for ?

Without a doubt. If given the chance to write my own legacy as a person directly responsible for the end of billions of people's suffering.....In a New York minute...

In my opinion, the alternative would be cowardice. Of course, this presumes the stuff exists and I'm simply not blowing smoke up the Internet's butt.

Originally posted by yfxxx

Looked up your post, and followed the link. According to this theoretically calculated table, the longest living Z=115 (Uup) isotope is Uup-310 with a halflife of 4 days. Impressive, but still way too short for any chunk of Uup to live very long .

Oops! 4 days, 4 minutes, what's the difference?

Thanks for looking that up and for the correction.

I concur, picking an odd numbered Z should have been a big red flag,

Regards,

AD

Off topic posts are being deleted.

If you don't like the way we attempt to enforce civility then I suggest you try another board. If you think enforcing civility is "supporting Lear's theories" well, I don't know what to tell you other than the ONLY thing ATS supports is Lear's ability to share his experiences with those who want to read them and those who want to question him POLITELY.

BACK ON TOPIC please...

Springer...

But this quote from John is civil and okay then:

"The more they kick and scream and screw themselves up into ceiling the more I know I am on the right track. Its always the same guys, nothing ever changes. yfxxx huddles with his fellow dropouts at the hauptbahnhoff beer parlor anxiously waiting for Oktoberfest."

Gotcha...

]Originally posted by Springer

John DON'T call people "drop outs", it's not acceptable and it won't be tolerated. We expect a HIGHER level of decorum from our CMs no matter how many angry pixels they must endure.

You know that resorting to childish name calling is the sign of a weak mind that has run out of data or a mind that hasn't matured enough to engage in civil debate.

You are correct. Please accept my apologies. Yes, a Conspiracy Master should present a higher level of decorum no matter the provocation.

And yfxxx, please accept my apologies for the inaccurate post.

Originally posted by johnlear
And yfxxx, please accept my apologies for the inaccurate post.

Accepted.

So I'll try it one last time:
John, how do you explain the obvious contradiction between your (and Lazar's) story, that Bob Lazar stole and betrayed one of the government's biggest secrets, and the indisputable fact, that Bob's United Nuclear company still does classified government work?

No viable conspiracy theory should have such blatant holes without offering at least some kind of explanation. A verifiable explanation would be even better.

So far, you didn't even try to answer this question, let alone offer a plausible theory.

Regards
yf

Originally posted by yfxxx

John, how do you explain the obvious contradiction between your (and Lazar's) story, that Bob Lazar stole and betrayed one of the government's biggest secrets, and the indisputable fact, that Bob's United Nuclear company still does classified government work?

I would respectfully suggest that Bob is extremely talented and that whoever hired him back was willing to let bygones be bygones just for the privilege of getting Bob back.

-OR-

Bob is working for a completely different division of the government that doesn't have the slightest idea that S-4 or Element 115 really exist. Therefore it would not even enter into their decision to hire Bob for whatever work he is doing.

-OR-

Bob is an alien that can make the government do whatever he wants. If he wants a job repairing alpha probes then he just puts that thought into their minds and he gets the job. We know he is repairing alpha probes because we saw them in the PBS special. And I helped him repair enough of them that I know what he is doing.

-OR-

Bob is an alien and he is putting the thought in our minds that he not only has his own Scientific Supply Company but that we also works with the government on secret projects. In reality Bob boards and raises horses in Sandia Park, New Mexico.

-OR-

Bobs original job with the government was to make John Lear believe that Bob worked on flying saucers and that he had Element 115. When John was fully convinced Bob moved to New Mexico claiming, "Lear is an idiot to have believed all that." Meanwhile in return for the disinformation work on John Lear, the government gave Bob a scientific supply company in Sandia Park and a few little contracts to keep him busy.

-OR-

Bob and John made up the whole story of S-4, the flying saucers and Element 115. Over the years they made a bundle. Lear retired from aviation and bought a gold mine. Bob moved to Sandia Park and set himself up in a scientific supply company which his wife Joy really runs while Bob shovels horse droppings out of the stables.

Take you pick, yfxxx. These are my best guesses.

Originally posted by johnlear
Take you pick, yfxxx. These are my best guesses.

Ok ...

I would respectfully suggest that Bob is extremely talented and that whoever hired him back was willing to let bygones be bygones just for the privilege of getting Bob back.

-OR-

Bob is working for a completely different division of the government that doesn't have the slightest idea that S-4 or Element 115 really exist. Therefore it would not even enter into their decision to hire Bob for whatever work he is doing.

No, these two are unfalsifiable "conspiracy-type" theories, which don't sound plausible at all. No matter how "talented" he is or what any government agency knows (or doesn't know), at least one government agency would know he's a traitor and would put him in jail (or worse!) and not in business.

Bob is an alien [...]

-OR-

Bob is an alien [...]

Nice jokes, but nothing more .

Bobs original job with the government was to make John Lear believe that Bob worked on flying saucers and that he had Element 115. When John was fully convinced Bob moved to New Mexico claiming, "Lear is an idiot to have believed all that." Meanwhile in return for the disinformation work on John Lear, the government gave Bob a scientific supply company in Sandia Park and a few little contracts to keep him busy.

I think I'd buy that one . Seems to fit all provable facts nicely.

On the other hand, the last idea ...

Bob and John made up the whole story of S-4, the flying saucers and Element 115. Over the years they made a bundle. Lear retired from aviation and bought a gold mine. Bob moved to Sandia Park and set himself up in a scientific supply company which his wife Joy really runs while Bob shovels horse droppings out of the stables.

... sounds equally plausible - except for the last half sentence (wife running business, Bob shovelling manure) .

So, I admit that the last two options you offered are good explanations. Unfortunately, of course, they are the ones in which the whole "115" story is bunk. John, what do you honestly believe is the true explanation? Or do you admit that you have no real idea (which you really believe) how to reconcile Bob's alleged past with his current business?

Regards
yf

Originally posted by zeroeffect

it seems that a few of my posts have been deleted because springer deems them off topic and when i politely asked how they were off topic they were met with deletion isnt that a definition of cover up? to come to the aide of john lear then delete posts that are not only on topic but put lear in a questionable light. i wonder how long this post will last untill its deleted

Thanks for the post zeroeffect. If you have a question for me that is off topic for the thread please ask it on Questions For John Lear. I will answer it there.

Thanks again for the post.