Anti-Atheist Conspiracy?

Originally posted by Gorman91
Is it just me, or do Europeans simply follow anyone who calls themselves their leader? This seems purely a European thing, and once in a while another group will do it.

Hardly. Three words for you: George Walker Bush.

Originally posted by Gorman91

Originally posted by jfj123


Why would religious people not want facts taught in school today ?
Why would religious people torture and kill people because they thought they were witches?
Why did the inquisition happen?
ETC...

"Sadly in a nut shell, Christians. My fellow faithful have many times been led astray. Is it just me, or do Europeans simply follow anyone who calls themselves their leader? This seems purely a European thing, and once in a while another group will do it."

what about things like salem and various cults around the world like heavens gate and jonestown neither of which were in europe, you give humanity too much credit we are not that diverse and you will find in countries where the rich/poor divide line is so huge more people will follow a dodgy leader in the hope of something better, your fellow faithfulls have not been led astray they have always been lost and by searching for something with blind faith they always will be

[edit on 8-10-2007 by R-evolve]

I stand corrected on W Bush, MajorMalfunction. But we do not follow him. He only has 29% or so following him. SO it's not like he's Hitler where most people were happy to follow.

Salem r-evolve? That was early, when we were technically still Europeans. There is something about this Continent that males people smarter. When we do follow like sheep, it is at least to a good person. Like Regan, JFK, FDR, Teddy, Washington, etc.

Originally posted by jfj123
I actually read an article recently that stated

"Pope Benedict 'believes in evolution"

Thats a bit open minded and I appreciate the fact that he can come around even a bit to see there is more then just faith.

And indeed, it is once in a while you get good leaders in power who are open to thinking new ways. For the last 3 or 4 Popes, this has been true. All of them so far in the last 50 or so years have done their part in welcoming new ways of thinking.

[edit on 8-10-2007 by Gorman91]

[edit on 8-10-2007 by Gorman91]

"Salem r-evolve? That was early, when we were technically still Europeans. There is something about this Continent that males people smarter. When we do follow like sheep, it is at least to a good person. Like Regan, JFK, FDR, Teddy, Washington, etc."

jonestown and heavens gate, scientology, mormons the typical american tv evangelists, waco. All you are doing is naming presidents i could easily name prime ministers or presidents of european countries these are people we voted in as leaders and remove as leaders, As for there is something about that continent that makes people smarter thats a sweeping statement you have made up because of your pride in your country which is fair enough, funny how america uses a lot of european scientists why though they are obviously inferior due to where they were born and you didnt need those german scientists after the war. Be patriotic you should be america is a country full of many talented good people but there is no need to insult the rest of the world with your arrogance


[edit on 9-10-2007 by R-evolve]

reply to post by R-evolve


Everyone in America is either European or Some other country. We are Americans in our resolve to unite under justice and the Constitution etc. 3 generations ago my relatives were Italians. I'm American now though. Funny how all those scientists never returned to their nation of birth.

Onto other things, those TV evangelicals are perfectly fine and executing in freedom of speech. So to are so many others. Europeans on the other hand have actually had EVIL leaders. Last time I remembered, just about the only evil leader in the US was Hoover maybe, or perhaps Nixon, but he actually ended the Vietnam war. We reject or kill or evil leaders. Scientology is dieing, I've never even heard of johnstown and heavens gate, thus that shows ho much they are remembered, and Mormons are very nice people. Did you know that if you're lost in Utah, they will welcome you into their home for the night? Sure they've got their defects, but they're every nice people. I can't believe I've been reduced to quote from South Park, but :

" You know what... I love my family and they love me... so f**k you."

You generalize too much. You've fallen into the news' trap. you've been conditioned to automatically think Mormons are bad.

I may have pride in my nation, along with many others, but we do something different then others, we reject that pride in times like now. I am by all means NOT proud to be an American with the ass leading us now. Hitler, on the other hand, had no problem in getting people to follow him brainlessly. Also Nero, the Kaiser, Benito, Louis XVI, the Roman senate, Who ever was king of Turkey during their massacres, etc. America has never actually had an evil leader (maybe Bush is an exception) and likewise, we've often killed the fools who tried to be an evil leader.

i haven't fell into any trap i didnt mention right or wrong i dont believe mormons are evil or any of the above, you said is it just me or do europeans follow anyone who calls themselves leader, when its clearly a case of all humans fall into that trap and the examples i gave are of groups or religions that have been created by a leader and followed by americans. Europe is a hell of a lot older than the USA with many many different countries speaking different languages with many different religions and wars between them happen its human nature (or political greed) look at how many wars america has been involved in recently and evil is decided by the winners not by the most moral but whoever won, you honestly believe yourself to be morally superior, you say we do something different we reject our pride in our country at times like now, well guess what across europe millions protested against these wars and felt shame for their countries action, not so different after all infact i'd go as far to say we are all pretty much the same, accident and circumstance dictate our perception of the world, i could easily of been born somewhere else and through dogma my attitude and beliefs could be vastly different, alas they are not and I dont wish to have a war of words with you i admire your'e pride im also patriotic but i dont let it define who i am and i dont use it as a stick to beat someone with.

reply to post by jfj123


I understand what you mean, but atheists follow a set of morals and ethics, religious people do the same. Atheists, or religious people are both one and the same. For example, a religious person can get the flu, and so can an atheist.
What I'm getting at is, a person who believes in a higher power can be manipulated, and so can a person who has lack in belief. We feel the same emotions, and we all feel the same way. Corruption can manipulate anyone, and I will say this, it effected everyone in the past and so we must learn to benefit our future.

reply to post by R-evolve


You mis understood my original meaning. Not to be offensive, but I wanted to make the point that Americans are better educated. Something that has been like this since Indian days.

And I've been trying to make that point since square one, Equinox99, thanks for putting it in layman's terms. I often go into loooong pointless words.

[edit on 9-10-2007 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91


americans are better educated?
laughable. look at the general populace, a sad percentage of which still believes in creationism.
look at how horrid the americans are with geography

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


Yep agree, especially the geography part. Some of the things they say is so stupid.

there's people all over the world who are uneducated about geography not just America, but America is highlighted more and under more scrutiny because its a super power and due to its vast and uneven distribution of wealth its education levels are dramatic either really low or incredibly high which is no different to most other countries, no country creates a better or worse person, superior or inferior.

How are Americans better educated? Most Europeans learn to converse in at least one other language than the native one, for starters. How many bi-lingual Americans does anyone know?

We're isolated by geography and by our own government/media complex and the practically inbred attitudes we have towards the rest of the world. We're the world's hillbillies and we have this attitude that we're somehow superior. We have this image that we're the greatest and the best, while people overseas are often afraid to come here because they're thinking they'll be plopped down in the middle of Deliverance or Boyz in da Hood.

Our thinking is insular. It's exclusionist. Our nation can't even accept difference among our own people -- meaning tolerance of atheism (to keep the thread on track) and of other types of beliefs -- is it any wonder we can't accept difference in other peoples from around the world?

America seems to have this attitude that we're "better-than." And it's the same sort of attitude that comes across from fundamentalist and some other types of Christian. Smug, sanctimonious, self-righteous and self-aggrandizing. Also boring and disgusting.

We are in no way "better-than" any other people on earth. The sooner we get that through our collective American heads, the better off we all will be.

MM....

I don't think there is an Anti-Atheist conspiracy.

What I think, is that there are many opinionated people in this world.

(I apologize for any mis-spellings)

I think that there are a helluvalot of people that have staunch opinions and others that just stroll on by and give us what we think we should hear or troll on by and 'give us a thought'.

One day, I hope to be able to be amongst the 'worthy', those who can bring a point across to people elequently.

Alas...my simple words are all I have.

I was talking all education unrelated to God. Granted, we don't know geography at all, we still do damn fine. I'd rank us third. With Indians at the top,. anc Chinese at second. Just my opinion.

I guess I should be more specific. Anywho, We are more adapt, I should revive that to. In this I mean we make up every other race religion, and culture that ever existed, so we get the benefit of a wide thought, granted that most in the south just sit back and yell, I'm talking about the rest of us.

I just want to point out that after we get through this corruption period, or if the nation dies (wither way, the same following result will come) that then we will rebuild and be great. America has it's ups and lows, but mainly ups. The current low is due to several Presidential assholes. Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton. The lot of them are absolute asses.

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
How are Americans better educated? Most Europeans learn to converse in at least one other language than the native one, for starters. How many bi-lingual Americans does anyone know?

Well, I am an american and as part of my highschool requirements, I along with everyone at my school were required to take 2 years of a language. Most people I know are bi-lingual.

I wouldn’t have clue if atheists like me, have it just as bad in my home land, ‘Australia.’ Although John Howard and Kevin Rudd are both Christian so…………

reply to post by andre18


i'd kind of like to know how atheists are treated in australia as well.

i'd kind of like to know how atheists are treated in australia as well.

Actually......we got it pretty damn good.....there's no jobs that say piss off your not so and so religion....there's a #en lot of atheists in Australia as well. most of the people at my school (I’m actually just finishing my year 12 now) are atheist, a few Christian Catholics, Muslims, but they seem to really get along with each other......there’s no racial crap....i guess the multiculturalism, has influences us as a nation in a good way.... it’s completely different to America…..i listen to you atheists from America all the time complaining about atheist rights and all…..we don’t have that problem here…..that I know of…..

I really can't help feeling that the reason that our country is falling in the toilet, despite all our money and power, is because the religious right gets in the way by enforcing their version of biblical morality. The politicians are pandering to that mind set now, even the so called liberals.

It's been a while since this topic was active, so I'd like to ask any theists who are interested, the following:

In an election for any public office, from local government to president, if the most qualified and by far the best candidate was an atheist, would you vote for someone else?

If so, why?

If you're a theist and you WOULD vote for an atheist, I'd like to hear that, too.

Just curious to see if the population of ATS meshes with the various polls on the subject out IRL.

is anyone else not surprised that this thread is dead? nobody would like to acknowledge that atheists are discriminated against