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The Fifth of November?

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posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 08:44 PM
Could ATSmix go in the yellow one on the right? It has to part of the "feeding". And the purple one above it could be user-content

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 08:49 PM
Ok, I've been staring at this for awhile now and here is what I have. ( I even took off my "coke-bottle" glasses and looked at it cross-eyed as was suggested early on in this thread.) I'm going to designate them according to direction ( N, S, E, W)

N: radio
NW: books
these first two I can clearly see after enhancing the image and standing on my head for awhile.

I agree with many others that the W is television, and NE is probably web casting.

I'll continue to mess around with the image and see what I can come up with, it seems that when I do something to make the top clearer the bottom gets worse.

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 08:55 PM



posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 08:56 PM
More E-context for Dollnean... GNU radio project... ETel. E E E E E-Tail
O'Reilly Radar Can I interest you in Ruby? Kitchen table Alienware?


Remember what it is ALL based on. What's your IP? Tim Berners-who? Pipes and channels feed from the platforms to? Using what?

[edit on 30-10-2007 by Mira_of_lurk0more]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 09:02 PM
reply to post by Mira_of_lurk0more

Software Radio

GNU Radio

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 09:15 PM
It might not be called that... but that might fit an Atom Stream. It's all pretty much clear as Mud. The nomenclature doesn't seem to important to me... try and think of the spheres in generic terms, but tailored to the TAN. Like Video Channels eh? Ruby is the new Python.


ATS ufovid is up

Sometimes the future comes a bit early. New buttons! The colors are starting to make sense? I had a thought... had.

[edit on 30-10-2007 by Mira_of_lurk0more]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 09:32 PM
OK, one more try. Someone please tell me if I have anything right. Please......

Change Lime green (6:00) to Audio Channel

Change yellow (3:00) to radio

[edit on 30-10-2007 by IrishLass]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 09:33 PM
If one has a video channel? What other channels might there be? Blue, Brown, Green, and Lime, spectra. Audio channel?


Go IrishLass!

Holy Toledo... Dad's gonna flip-out. The vids are primo-selectamundo! Extra sticky mallow! I gotta watch some.

[edit on 30-10-2007 by Mira_of_lurk0more]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 09:59 PM
I'm sitting on the sidelines (much needed PDSD R&R)
, but so far haven't heard many responding to Springer's hint(s) in his last post.

I mean, either I'm all wet or he let us know every which way he could that the "middle is a region of limitless power, has "NO LIMIT", is "Not Limited", etc.

Y'all may want to try something with "x-UNLIMITED-x" in the center sphere or some version of same...

Good luck...

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 10:07 PM
Last try of the night, I have to work in the morning and 5:00 comes early....

if not close, maybe someone can take some of the ideas and run with them, ie Mira.

If not solved when get home from work, I will work on it some more.

[edit on 30-10-2007 by IrishLass]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 10:36 PM
I'd just be guessing IrishLass. Did enough deductive reasoning based on bad "crack" data last night which got me - nowhere (kinda). I like the web the this "matrix" represents.

I like your choices too. Short story? I like the whole deal... whatever names are hung on the diagram. The addition of the various video channels is very, very, cool. High value. One less reason to leave the portal.

The center? Either the some spun-permutation of the WWW relating to TAN and the community or perhaps the ethos. The center will be more abstract than say the "concreteness" of the outer spheres.

These are guys so I'd bet structural as opposed to epistemology of the community body of wisdom/knolwedge. I am often wrong. I call that learning. Caveat lector.

A wack of long term plans coming to fruitition to be followed by some fairly "first among best" announcements at the Rev party. I really hope some honkin' code/tools is comin' down the pipe... I was reading on another very good site, "Give the user something they can use." BINGO!

The Spivak stuff looks wack. I'm sure there are others.

I like surprises that are fun. I want a new laptop... not a 5 five figure laptop but a mid-4 figure ATS endorsed and all badged out UFO or NWO would be cool. Pink please. Mom might even get one for Dad (Blue). Dad really only likes one computer in the home. That seemed reasonable and prudent for a long, long time. Times change. Things evolve until they out-grow their paradigm - Revolution happens. The V component is interesting. I like the color stuff - I associate stuff that way anyway.


[edit on 30-10-2007 by Mira_of_lurk0more]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 10:44 PM
reply to post by Mira_of_lurk0more

Im not getting feedback from moderators....dont know if anything I have put in this sphere is correct. Im like a blind squirrel chasing a nut. I really would love to solve it. I got to get the center and work out. I know the center has to do with the CROWD, MASS PEOPLE, TAN. Dont know how to put in words to make flow. That is where my brain is at now. I know all spheres come from the middle. The middle being the MASSES (PEOPLE). DOLLNEAN, I know I'm missing something but cannot put my fingers on the keys to type

Guess I will go back to drawing board.

[edit on 30-10-2007 by IrishLass]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 10:51 PM
I haven't been involved in this thread for a while, but I want to help solve this image.

I don't think the middle is text. I think it's a picture of something. It looks completely off from the others, which are text. It has completely different characteristics to it.

I don't think it's the Above Network logo either. There's not enough black in it.

If it is indeed a picture of something, it's in a pentagon type shape, or a distorted circle.

That's all I got for now

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 11:16 PM
Here I go again. Mod's please let me know if I need to remove other sphere pics. Not sure if taking up to much space, Im new to this.

[edit on 30-10-2007 by IrishLass]

posted on Oct, 30 2007 @ 11:30 PM

That's my best guess. I gave multiple choices for three of them because it could be either of the choices.

For some reason, I'm fairly confident the green and pink at the top are two of the three choices of Radio, Audio, and/or Video.

I'm also fairly confident about the Pod/Web Casting.

The E Books seems right too. Other people's pictures looked right so I put it on mine. I'm almost certain there's a separation between the two things in that "E Books" one. There appears to be a single letter to start it, then a space. So, logically, since this is the internet, it's probably "E". E Books seems like it'd fit in with the theme.

I'm probably totally off though. Hopefully this will spark an idea in someone else's head.

EDIT TO ADD: I have no idea what the middle is. I still say it's an image and not text, but I could be completely wrong.

EDIT TO ADD 2: Tin Wiki may be one of them. Somebody probably already said that though.

[edit on 10/30/07 by NovusOrdoMundi]

posted on Oct, 31 2007 @ 01:11 AM
I would be surprised if there wasn't some sort of mobile telephony component. Perhaps with a bandwidth optimized feed. Optimizing for dial up and BBand would seem very, very important for a good user experience.

That "channel" of communication is ripe - awash in tech and bucks. Lotsa bucks in the hanset/mobile market - all of it has the IP components - globally switched over the net. Text alerts, HTTP GET and PUT. All kinds of new ways and means wireless. The ecosystem is perfect for for NEXT. Nov5th "IT" starts or is born. The social side of "how things will be" should be perhap the most significant part. Maybe. Could be what the net has been lacking. That whole rich data transform like a social switchboard.

IrishLass made a post that floated the DELL NANO so I Goog-it. Funny Dell has a wireless laptop mouse called a Dell Nano VX, the dollnean screamed meme deja vu. The SWF on Dell's site is cool. There is some hub-bub elsewhere on the net about the site entry being decodable. The characters are apparently a one for character swap. Dollnean. I really don't care too much about the monetization as long as it keeps the culture sustainable and growing in a controlled manner. Monetization is very important to the systems heath. I suspect something very NEXT. I guess that's really been the hassle all along. The monetization "thing" was all front-to-back in previous models from what I've been reading. Crowd sourcing can blow that barrier away, no them and us anymore because were all together. Revoultion 4 sure. The "V" thing bugs me in a good way.

The puzzle, it really depends on how the creator viewed the metaparadigm or worldview (philosopy) in relation to the conceptual model or paradigm (the graphic puzzle) and the component "theoretical constructs within" in this case various methods of communication. It could be almost anything the designer wants. What to say? Good.

"A continually evolving self-feeding content ideation, creation, and publishing ecosystem."

You train "it" by providing preference behavior and it decides from empirically history what you want or may want which could be many aspects inside TAN. Might even be able to share or fetch "just what you want" and have what you want while you aren't always connected. It really is a paradigm shift. Convergence continues... ATS on your fridge or coffee pot or your alarm clock. In your car. Mark Up Languages. Java. I stayed up too late eating toffees but I loved the UFO vids. I didn't have to leave site.

The new normal is coming to the real world which has converged with the next world. Just watch and participate it should be a an absolute blast - digital dynamite. The Revoluton should occur in 5 Days 21 hours 52 minutes. Somebody thinks this stuff up.


Access Denied is Access Granted!!!! Awesome! APPLAUSE to JacKatMtn, Access Denied and all involved! Good things can and do happen. HOPE!

[edit on 31-10-2007 by Mira_of_lurk0more]

posted on Oct, 31 2007 @ 04:18 AM

Originally posted by Springer
What is the venue, in a NON limited/ing sense, that creates/allows/gives voice to this new "Crowd is the Source" paradigm?

Could the middle not be the WWW as this is the "Venue" where all these sources of information are coming together from all corners of the world and from all types of media. The problem I am having with this is that the middle does seem to contain two words. or is it simply W.W.W which may give that kind of picture quality that NovusOrdoMundi is referring to..

posted on Oct, 31 2007 @ 04:29 AM

Originally posted by Springer
What is the venue, in a NON limited/ing sense, that creates/allows/gives voice to this new "Crowd is the Source" paradigm?

Figure that out and you may have a middle from which to create/attach/involve and source the external(s).

Think BIG, think in the non-limited, we do, everyday because we've seen what WE can do.

Include, but never LIMIT, no brand or genre or topical collection is sacrosanct.


[edit on 10-30-2007 by Springer]

Hi there to everyone!

Some superb stuff suggested... WTG!

Now to Springer's post....

What creates/allows/gives voice to the new "Crowd is the Source" paradigm?

Tricky question. Not a trick question, just tricky... I don't have the answer, but I do have a thought.

Lots of thoughts. Like we all do.

What's they key to us as people? Two arms and two legs etc? No.

Our thoughts. Our minds. The stuff we use to produce, communicate, create content, and ideate.

Could this be close? I don't even have a clue, but it's possible...

Já aní netuším, ale je to možný...

(For those whose computers don't have Czech fonts loaded -- Ja ani netusim, ale je to mozny... )

That's just Czech for "I don't even have a clue, but it's possible..."

Why am I writing cute little statements in Czech? To impress you? No.
I expect that many here know two, three or more languages. Just happens that due to geographic relocation I picked up one of the rarer ones.

There was a guy years ago named Berlo who created a model of communication. He said that communication requires four things, which he labelled "S-M-C-R" > "Sender -- Message -- Channel -- Receiver".

His model is pretty clear. No need to explain it. But there's another point that this model doesn't really cover so well. For communication to be completely effective the sender and receiver should obtain the same mental result from the message.

The dollnean phrase is a good example of incomplete communication. It wasn't in a form that allowed us to obtain the same mental result as the one who created and sent it -- until we deciphered it. Took us ages and sent some of us nuts. Well...some of us pretended to be gaga, anyway -- for certain reasons

Has anyone else wondered why we were given that key statement in such a form? Just to make us spend weeks trying to work it out? Maybe...but maybe there was a message within the message.

Our minds are so finely tuned in the sense of language usage that we can often find it very difficult to deal with communications that deviate even slightly from what we are used to:

"I have gone to shop." So said a note that my wife left for me, knowing I'd wonder where she was when I got home from work. She's Czech and English is a pain for people whose own language base is very different.

So I had this note. "I have gone to shop." Now, trouble was, I didn't know if she meant it literally, namely like "I have gone shopping" or "I have gone to the shop" -- meaning the one down the road where we buy our bread and other basics -- or "I have gone to a shop". That's a worry, almost as much as "gone shopping", as she could be gone for hours.

She knew exactly what she meant, of course, and when she got home half an hour later she explained that of course it was "the" shop. Wasn't it clear to me?

No... It wasn't!

Gee I hope I'm making a point here.

Methods of communication, such as those embodied in the "continually evolving self-feeding content creation, ideation, and publishing ecosystem" are only going to be effective if and when all parties are getting the same message.

The spheres diagram was constructed with the assumptions that (a) we can see it (or have someone who can describe it to us), (b) we all see and understand the value of the arrows in the same way (DO we??), and (c) that the diagram itself, when considered as a simplified representation of the dollnean statement, can be configured in such a way that all who look at it with due consideration will obtain the same mental picture of what it truly depicts.

Otherwise, it would be a dud diagram.

Backing up a ways, the things we have in common for working on this diagram are our language (more-or-less, for there are regional and cultural variants here), our understanding that the diagram is a message as well and one we wish to know, and most importantly...our minds.

It's our minds working together and ideating that are getting us closer to the answer.

I'll leave it there as I've taken enough of your time already. (Yes time is also a factor... Just btw...)

Regards and thank you
for your tremendous patience with this pedantic character,


Interesting how common the use of smilies has truly become. My Czech students use them a lot in messages to friends abroad -- even in text messages on their phones. These little symbols are now effectively part of our language -- by which I don't mean English, I mean human language. Like in the old days people put signs on their houses because a large part of the population couldn't read numbers or words but still needed a way to find places. There are still houses in the Old Town sections in Prague that have their original signs. The Three Violins, The Ostrich, The Bear...

Now, in the sense of businesses and business, we call it "branding"...

Don't forget where that word comes from.

[edit on 31-10-2007 by JustMike]

[edit on 31-10-2007 by JustMike]

posted on Oct, 31 2007 @ 05:37 AM
Doing a new post because re-editing the previous one again is painful. Also it's long enough already.

Just wondering...remember how we were being given "imagine" over and over again in respect of our dollnean work (and also the spheres)?

So...if the essence of humans is our minds, what's the essence of our minds?

Thought? Yes. But I can think "I must make another coffee," or think about work I must get done.

What's real, creative, ideative and evolving thought? What's at the core of the "vision", and provides the force that will make it possible?

Imagination... I think.

Shouldn't that belong somewhere? Imagination?

Just a thought...

I agree with Mira about the centre being more "abstract". Also with IrishLass in her suggestions. I think these are in the right direction. My rantings of yestereve about "The Crowd" were seemingly inebriated/stressed-out/frantic, but as I said (and confirmed in more detail to some members via U2U's), it's not a matter of me being right.

What matters is finding what is right.

Further to that image... What is the point of providing the image at all? We have the "vision statement", so why not just give us another statement that includes all of the components and describes their interactions? Why use an image?

Because while words are one form of communication, one that we often call language, images are another -- one that strangely, we don't all immediately think of when someone says the word "language".

While the first spoken languages developed from commonly-understood sounds and facial/bodily expressions within a particular group, the first written languages were derived from images. The whole concept was to be able to pass on a message to others who were not there at the time when the message was "written". This was the next level of language. With time, the images became more and more stylized, then as people understood that our minds can take this much further and they used imagination and applied it to evolve communication, we developed alphabets to build levels of consistency and more-accurate understanding into the intended communications.

Music is also a language, which these days has various levels of commonality, so a Chinese musician can play a piece composed centuries earlier by a German named Mozart -- who never spoke a word of Chinese. They get the same mental picture and emotional drift, because they interpret the symbols the same way.

I mentioned smilies. Visual language. And it's also an emotional language.

What is the next level of language? How, in future, will a language be derived so that almost anyone, living in almost any culture, will get the same mental and emotional image and be able to respond?

I think that's part of the evolution. Yes, it may not be there yet, not literally in the spheres as they are now, but we need to imagine the future in order to make it happen. So I'd say that one of the spheres needs to express this concept of future communication development.

How about a language -- an alphabet, if you will --comprised entirely of smilies, or the next level above basic smilies? Smilies with sounds that express tones and levels of feeling and mood?

Imagine being able to send an entire message to someone in what are basically virtual pictographs or pictograms, knowing that s/he will "get"exactly what you mean. We are almost doing this now, but with a little inventiveness we can work together to create a real, functioning and evolving language... "Smilies" that will depict tense (past/present/future), singularity and plurality, conditional functions (like would/could/should), questions but with no "question mark", poetic functions like rhyme, adjectival and adverbial concepts -- the list goes on.

This can be done. It would be wonderful to be the first to develop a truly international, functioning, virtual language based entirely upon active and multi-layered images of light, sound and movement -- perhaps one that for the sight-impaired, could be interfaced with a reader program that will present the message audibly, using the language of the recipient.

Yes, there are movies and cartoons that do present messages in this way so that almost all who watch them will get the same concepts. But those do not allow the recipient to respond in kind, without spending many hours drawing a similarly-based cartoon or making a movie that functions at the same level. I'm talking about the possibility of real-time communication, with almost anyone in the world.

Have your "dictionary" set up, with all its "multi-layer-smilies" placed within according to your formal symbolic conceptual framework (ie language), click on the ones you want and send...

Goodbye language barrier...Goodbye to so many prejudices... Understand people and laugh with them and you will never want to go to war with them...

Does a "smilie dictionary" already exist? One where you can -- within the limits of the smilies that exist now -- just click-and-create complete messages? If so, where is it? If not, why not?

I kind of like the idea of a fully working, multi level, tense-and-action-targeted smiley lexicon. I like the idea of being able to link two or more smilies with hyphen characters to generate a new one that expresses the concepts contained in the originals and present it as a single multi-layer functioning graphic...

Does anyone follow what I mean by this or am I going nuts again?

I the moment, there are thousands of these smiley things. But we can communicate a massive amount with rearrangements of just 26 characters and a few items of punctuation. So smilies, while cool, are not answer unless they are evolved to the next level. Think beyond the cave men drawings, in other words, because right now, that's effectively what they are...

Am i making any sense??

Somehow I have gone right off-topic from my original intent in this post. It just "happened". Sometimes does when I think out loud. People, I'm very sorry and I apologise for this awfully long rave...I seriously considered just deleting it all but maybe something in it is useful for the task to hand in this thread so I'll let it stand and bear the consequences.

To the moderators: sorry about all this.

[edit on 31-10-2007 by JustMike]

posted on Oct, 31 2007 @ 07:19 AM
Someone help me catch up please

what words do we have that are 100% accurate ?


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