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posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 05:21 PM
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reply to post by HDFACTORYCERTIF
 


Well, there's certain questions and expected answers within the Craft Lodge and I should think that the same applies to York and Scottish Rite. Not being acquainted with them personally, I'd suggest U2Uing with either of the two board members I mentioned. An ATS Board of Trial as it were.

Since you haven't posted any information that isn't freely available on the Web and are talking about a situation that would reflect extremely poorly on the Grand Lodge of said Lodge not to mention the Lodge itself (not to mention posting on a board like ATS which seems an unlikely outlet for verifiable information such as you're putting forth), surely you can appreciate that a degree of skepticism is in order here absent validation.




posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 06:23 PM
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I find it interesting of the request to contact other members of this board for some kind of verification, when indeed these other members may not be Masons just because they say they are. Strange how that is.
In the same vein, saying that ATS is not the proper forum to discuss a hopefully isolated incident such as this, when Mason subjects come up here often.
On the other hand, this discussion would not be allowed on the all Mason forums, as far as I can tell anyway.
It should not be a surprise that stupidity can happen in any fraternity,with so many lodges and members.
May I point out again, the actions of this lodge has already spread to the community, resulting in a very bad reputation for all the Masonic bodies involved. The Grand Lodge just does not get it, or does not care.
When I took the obligations, and swore to God over them, I took that along with RacerX very seriously, obviously more serious than the Monkey lodge, Grand Lodge and possibly Masons that post here.


[edit on 18-11-2007 by HDFACTORYCERTIF]



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
I find it interesting of the request to contact other members of this board for some kind of verification, when indeed these other members may not be Masons just because they say they are. Strange how that is.


Just a suggestion as your choice of venue for 'outing' 'your' Lodge seems a tad questionable. You also choose not to identify the Lodge (fair enough), District (maybe less so) or State (Now we're getting silly) and in your posts, basically equate the State's Grand Lodge (whichever state it might be) with your "monkey lodge" suggesting that the Craft Lodge Grand Lodge is in thrall to the Grand Lodge of the York Rite. As has been pointed out, this seems just a tad unlikely.


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
In the same vein, saying that ATS is not the proper forum to discuss a hopefully isolated incident such as this, when Mason subjects come up here often.


I didn't say improper; just a questionable first choice for a real Mason.


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
On the other hand, this discussion would not be allowed on the all Mason forums, as far as I can tell anyway.


Forums such as????


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
It should not be a surprise that stupidity can happen in any fraternity,with so many lodges and members.


In one Lodge, anything could happen. Pigs might fly out of the IPM's butt. We then get into a question of how likely something is to happen. You're suggesting the Grand Lodge would tolerate the behaviour. I think that's rather questionable.


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
May I point out again, the actions of this lodge has already spread to the community, resulting in a very bad reputation for all the Masonic bodies involved.


Care to elaborate on how this got into the community? And if it actually did, I'd take that as something that would have already forced the Grand Lodge's hand. This is adding up even less as things go along.


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
The Grand Lodge just does not get it, or does not care.


You'll pardon me if I think that just a bit of a stretch. Grand Lodge's are nothing if not protective.


Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
When I took the obligations, and swore to God over them, I took that along with RacerX very seriously, obviously more serious than the Monkey lodge, Grand Lodge and possibly Masons that post here.


I somehow doubt that you're a more serious Mason than the Masons on this board, certainly not likely moreso than any Grand Lodge and of the "Monkey lodge" (if it does, in fact, exist), maybe so. But without knowing even the State it's supposed to be in and no attempt on your part at proving your bona fides, why would you expect Masons on the board to take your posts at face value?



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 06:54 PM
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Again, how would I know if anyone on this board is a Mason? Nice try anyway.
Now, anyone care to address if the Obligations are Meaningless Words?
Come on you can do it!



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 07:02 PM
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Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
Again, how would I know if anyone on this board is a Mason? Nice try anyway.
Now, anyone care to address if the Obligations are Meaningless Words?
Come on you can do it!


You don't seem to get it. How does anyone know YOU are? Info that's freely available online doesn't a Mason make. I gave you some suggestions; is there any particular reason you're reluctant to follow-through?

Shenanigans



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 07:04 PM
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Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
Again, how would I know if anyone on this board is a Mason?

Obviously you don't. What's that got to do with anything? Now you're really stalling. My masonic status has no bearing on your refusal to give specifics. If you are so concerned about non-masons finding out details of this matter why are you posting it all here in the first place?


Now, anyone care to address if the Obligations are Meaningless Words?
Come on you can do it!

As no-one on this board can prove they are a mason, no-one can answer this question to your satisfaction. You have just totally destroyed the legitimacy of your own question.

FYI I am a moderator on a well-known masonic board and can get to the truth of the matter very easily. And no, that doesn't prove I'm a mason either



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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Trin, your point really is? Lets say other then attempt to discredit RacerX and I.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 07:23 PM
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Originally posted by HDFACTORYCERTIF
Trin, your point really is? Lets say other then attempt to discredit RacerX and I.


Well, I'm not a Mason, believe me or don't, and I think you're doing a fine job of this on your own. If you've got a point would you mind making it?



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 07:32 PM
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Back to the question, are the Obligations only Meaningless Words? Just try for little further light.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 08:21 PM
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reply to post by HDFACTORYCERTIF
 


Obviously not though to your magical, mystical "Monkey lodge" in your imagination, I'm sure they must be. Absent some sort of evidence of your being a Mason, you're going into my killfile as a wannabe pretender.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 08:26 PM
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reply to post by HDFACTORYCERTIF
 


Fine. I will aquiese to what in my opinion is is blatant trolling and attempted ATS point garnering.....

The answer is no the obligations to me are not just words. They are a creedo to help mold my life by and I take them very seriously.

I am a member of Clifton Lodge #203 of Free and Accepted Masons in the State of New Jersey. Now my cards are on the table, how about you?


[edit on 18-11-2007 by AugustusMasonicus]



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 08:30 PM
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Mississauga Lodge #524, G.R.C.

Next



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 08:36 PM
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I am absolutely speechless! As I read the opening statement of this thread I thought surely I had somehow gained entry into a discussion I had no business being in. (I'm sorry, but I was compelled to continue reading!)

I honestly can not believe that a 3rd generation Master Mason would not know who or how to properly report such outrageous conduct to, rather than airing it publicly on an open forum discussion!!

I have enormous respect for this organization, but am well aware of the mass number of anti-Mason fanatics that would just have a field day with all of this!

If nothing else, I'm really surprised there aren't Member Only Forums where such matters could be discussed not only in private, but in such a manner that, if true, then immediate appropriate steps could and would no doubt be taken by this esteemed fraternity to put an immediate end to such behavior.

I really am inclined to believe this is just some crazy hoax!

All due respect, but I would be relieved to see this entire thread removed.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by lajansann
If nothing else, I'm really surprised there aren't Member Only Forums where such matters could be discussed not only in private, but in such a manner that, if true, then immediate appropriate steps could and would no doubt be taken by this esteemed fraternity to put an immediate end to such behavior.

Quite apart from the regular masonic channels, which I agree are the best way to deal with such alleged problems, there are a whole host of masonic forums out there on the web which a quick google would find quite easily.

This individual has simply chosen to use ATS instead to air his 'grievances'. This speaks volumes for his intentions.

Personally I hope the thread stays. I think most people can see through this nonsense.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 09:49 PM
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God bless you Augustus! That is exactly what I am looking for! RacerX and I do feel the same.
There are many reasons that I can not expose this lodge and or Grand Lodge. 2 are legal and the final charge that is given at the end of every meeting.
The assumption by some that I am gathering ATS points is wacky, what happens if I gather 10000? Do I get a bottle of Stag bourbon?
Like I said before, this does not happen everywhere. It did and is going on in this situation, causing conflict between those that believe in the obligations and those that do not. At least here, Augustus does, and I believe him to be a brother. Others may continue to act like Monkeys in lodge and their personal lives.
As far as being directed to the 3 pillars forum, it clearly states in its rules of engagement that no negatives toward any Grand Lodge is allowed. This particular Grand Lodge is negative.



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 10:05 PM
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reply to post by HDFACTORYCERTIF
 


You seem not to have noticed Trinityman's suggestion of the Lodgeroom
back on the first page of this thread.

Why's that, I wonder?



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 10:37 PM
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OK, if Trin wants to get it going, let me know and we can hash it out there.
Found a Mason that lives the obligations here! How about that!



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 10:37 PM
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reply to post by HDFACTORYCERTIF
 


Ooook...

I know I have said this before, I think your a liar. A bad liar at that...

But I like where Masonicus and Fitz are going.

Give us the Lodge # and state, be it u2u if you like, unlessss............. Your as I think, a bad liar.

And so no hard feelings about being the only one asked to disclose information:

Solar Lodge #730 F&AM Ohio.

And your self?


But I can be sure no Mason would bring something like this to ATS if it where true.. there are many Masonic communities on the net you know, I think your best chance is to go there. Unless you have and got chased off for being a troll.

Your not a troll are you??



posted on Nov, 18 2007 @ 10:53 PM
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Wow Guinness or rockpuck! whats with the nasty stuff? Problems with the obligations?
By the way, whats with the square and compass on this forum? Why are Masons posting here anyway?

[edit on 18-11-2007 by HDFACTORYCERTIF]

[edit on 18-11-2007 by HDFACTORYCERTIF]



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 12:13 AM
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Monkey business...

In a Lodge?

Who'd of thunk it?

I'm extremely skeptical... But I'm too consumed with consuming this fantastic bottle of Leonetti Cabernet and reading some Whitman... Maybe later.




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