Ghosts are spirits serving Satan

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
Ahhhhh, but we're talking about something changing so radically that no definite shape can be discerned: disc to cylinder, etc.

A sideways disk appears cylindrical unless you're up-close and personal. Same for the F-14 at a distance. Is it a triangle? A fixed-wing craft or a cylinder? What's more fun to throw in the mix is fly-by-wire craft, which is something that only flies by computer. The computer fails, the craft is a brick, but man can those babies turn on dime! My gosh is the X-29 beautiful!

Behold the 'Black Triangle' of ufo lore! or is it a cigar-shaped ufo?

Hmmm...wait a second...are you suggesting US aircraft and their pilots are serving Satan?

[edit on 4-10-2007 by saint4God]

reply to post by runetang



I have heard all of what you posted, and more.

Jesus told the thief on the cross he would be with Him in Paradise "this day."

Whether Paradise and Heaven are the same I do not know.

Seventh-Day Adventists also believe that the soul "sleeps" until judgment day.

You've raised several sixty-four-thousand-dollar questions.

too bad we couldnt have that tattoo john constantine had and command those into the light to be seen

maybe an indigo can?

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
You're kidding me, right?

Mothman was just the name it got from a character on the Batman TV series of the sixties.

We're talking about a man-sized, bat-winged creature without a discernible head and two glowing red eyes on its "torso". It seemed to be able to hypnotize people.

I've seen 'pictures' that are never consistent, the idea of him being moth-relative as in nocturnally and wing morphology. I hadn't heard 'bat-winged' before...which is ironic because if it came from Batman, it should be called batman :-D. Maybe the critter fights crime. The hypnotism is a new one to me. Again, if someone can pin down (pun intented) what mothman is supposed to be, sure I'd be interested in hearing, however it sounds a bit different then both demons and their intensions.

www.prairieghosts.com...

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
I'd like to reply to the rest of your comments, but rather than do that I'll take the "cop-out" answer and invite you to study further. Books by Brad Steiger, Jerome Clark, Whitley Strieber, et al, don't present a complete picture, but if you put it all together it suggests a grand strategy by what Brad Steiger calls "The Cosmic Trickster."

Sorry, I don't care what these people have to say right now, they're just names to me. People I have never and will never meet. I am interested in what YOU have to say though, as I can ask you questions and you're more real to me then 'joe author who made lots of money on their books'.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
People who see UFO's often see Bigfoot or have poltergeist infestations as well.

So you're saying people have multiple and different paranormal accounts?

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
People who experience any of the phenomena we've discussed have often dabbled in the occult.

Whoa ho! Crikey, now this is getting interesting. A kind of 'brought it upon themselves'? I'm not going to take a side of the fence on this yet, but am SUPER curious about what you and others think of that.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
THE MAIN PROBLEM is that the UFO people don't follow what the ghost people consider phenomena, the Bigfoot people don't follow the UFO people or the witchcraft people, and so on.

Erm...welcome to ATS! I suppose this website is the cure for that ailment.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
A study of ALL phenomena leads one to seeing a bigger picture: it MAY, I say MAY, all be related.

I'd love to see the scematics of this big machine. I'm not expecting you to diagram it all out, but I believe two things: 1.) You're on to something and 2.) A very unique way of painting the picture (in my opinion)

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
My demon experience?

I was lying in bed one night with my face pointing away from the window. SOMETHING that I could not see because of the way I was facing came to the window and tried to communicate with my telepathically. At first, it tried to convince me it was an "alien". When I didn't believe that story, it became enraged. I KNEW it was an external entity: NOT sleep paralysis, not some kind of hallucination, etc. When you see a bear you know it's a bear and not a dog.

Good analogy in that last two sentences and I can verify that with my own experiences.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
This thing became so full of hate that I knew if I turned over and looked at it, that it would kill me. I began to pray to God to make it go away. It left finally, and I could "feel" its presence leave the area.

Question of motive please. I'm not sure you know the answer but if you do I'd be interested. Why would it want to kill you?

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
That thing inadvertently gave me some ammuntion with which to fight ALL of them: by lying about being an alien, it planted a seed in my mind that some, maybe not all, so-called "extraterrestrial" encounters are demonic.

I'll be the first to suggest that there may really be aliens and that not all "alien" encounters are demonic. But this one was.

I think that's very open-minded of you and can give props to that.

I am literally having fun on ATS again. Something that hasn't happened in a loooong while. Most of the time it feels like work. Valuable work, but work nonetheless.

[edit on 4-10-2007 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
Ahhhhh, but we're talking about something changing so radically that no definite shape can be discerned: disc to cylinder, etc.

A sideways disk appears cylindrical unless you're up-close and personal. Same for the F-14 at a distance. Is it a triangle? A fixed-wing craft or a cylinder? What's more fun to throw in the mix is fly-by-wire craft, which is something that only flies by computer. The computer fails, the craft is a brick, but man can those babies turn on dime! My gosh is the X-29 beautiful!

Behold the 'Black Triangle' of ufo lore! or is it a cigar-shaped ufo?

Hmmm...wait a second...are you suggesting US aircraft and their pilots are serving Satan?

[edit on 4-10-2007 by saint4God]

It's kind of a cop-out answer, but if you had seen the video of the object I'm talking about you wouldn't compare it to a fighter plane.

The video I saw shows a shape-shifting UFO that goes from a spacecraft shape to almost a living being shape and keeps changing as the camera films it.

There is a book out called "Sold Out: Warning" which suggests that our government has made a deal with demons masquerading as aliens. Even though that book MIGHT appear to agree with what I'm saying, the author presents a lot of wild theories but offers little to no evidence.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
www.prairieghosts.com...

Thanks for the link. Again, not exactly a clear picture of what this thing is according to the testimonies. Does it have gray or brown fur? Does that mean there's more than one? This is a physical thing, right? Can demons take on a physical form? Testimony says, "and his funny eyes were staring at me almost hypnotically" not "I was hypnotized". I saw the photo of the 'mothman' perched on the bridge before. Looks very similar to whatever was on the other post of the bridge except bent. Very little to go on here, I'm surprised they had more than a paragraph to write on it. Okay okay, let's say mothman is a demon. What is the endgame to this demon spooking people out? People typically don't have a love of evil when they get scared half to death.

reply to post by Zane Zackerly


While i respect your views on religion i will explain in a non offending way.

There is no "heaven" and there is no "hell".

When people die they enter the astral realm, ghosts are simply spirits who do not want to leave the closest realm to the physical realm, the spirits who have made peace with not being able to contact the physical realm will simply move up to higher astral realms.

So you can basically say that hell is the closest astral realm to the physical, and heaven is a higher astral realm theres a realm called the "summerland" which is what people can describe heaven as, plush plants, trees, oceans, colours are brighter and everything is more real than reality. And anything is possible in this realm ANYTHING. Now that sounds like heaven to me.

I could go into more detail about this but im busy at the moment.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
It's kind of a cop-out answer,

Nono, true skepticism requires we first rule out the natural and obvious possibilities first. If I did not know about B-2's and X-29's, both their shape and movements would be alien to me. It would be incorrect for me to assume then they're servants of Satan.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
but if you had seen the video of the object I'm talking about you wouldn't compare it to a fighter plane.

The video I saw shows a shape-shifting UFO that goes from a spacecraft shape to almost a living being shape and keeps changing as the camera films it.

Certainly possible. Just demonstrating the repercussions of jumping to conclusions. I'd like to see each careful step of that journey.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
There is a book out called "Sold Out: Warning" which suggests that our government has made a deal with demons masquerading as aliens.

Whoa hey! Somebody get George Clinton, it suddenly got funky in here.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
Even though that book MIGHT appear to agree with what I'm saying, the author presents a lot of wild theories but offers little to no evidence.

I can imagine!

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
I'd like to reply to the rest of your comments, but rather than do that I'll take the "cop-out" answer and invite you to study further. Books by Brad Steiger, Jerome Clark, Whitley Strieber, et al, don't present a complete picture, but if you put it all together it suggests a grand strategy by what Brad Steiger calls "The Cosmic Trickster."

1. Sorry, I don't care what these people have to say right now, they're just names to me. People I have never and will never meet. I am interested in what YOU have to say though, as I can ask you questions and you're more real to me then 'joe author who made lots of money on their books'.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
People who see UFO's often see Bigfoot or have poltergeist infestations as well.

2. So you're saying people have multiple and different paranormal accounts?

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
People who experience any of the phenomena we've discussed have often dabbled in the occult.

3. Whoa ho! Crikey, now this is getting interesting. A kind of 'brought it upon themselves'? I'm not going to take a side of the fence on this yet, but am SUPER curious about what you and others think of that.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
THE MAIN PROBLEM is that the UFO people don't follow what the ghost people consider phenomena, the Bigfoot people don't follow the UFO people or the witchcraft people, and so on.

4. Erm...welcome to ATS! I suppose this website is the cure for that ailment.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
A study of ALL phenomena leads one to seeing a bigger picture: it MAY, I say MAY, all be related.

5. I'd love to see the scematics of this big machine. I'm not expecting you to diagram it all out, but I believe two things: 1.) You're on to something and 2.) A very unique way of painting the picture (in my opinion)

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
My demon experience?

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
This thing became so full of hate that I knew if I turned over and looked at it, that it would kill me. I began to pray to God to make it go away. It left finally, and I could "feel" its presence leave the area.

6. Question of motive please. I'm not sure you know the answer but if you do I'd be interested. Why would it want to kill you?

Seat belt on?

1. This thread cannot go on long enough for me to explain everything. Sorry. I've studied this for thirty years. I can't condense it much more than I already have. Suffice it to say that it IS worth seeking out some of these authors. Get Brad Steiger if you can only stomach one.

2. Yes. In fact, it seems at least to me that if a person is prone to one type then others follow. Again, Brad Steiger is your "one-stop-shop" if you don't want to spend the next five years reading every book in the New Age section.

3. Yes. The demonic apparently has to be "invited in" for it to affect you. Once you play with Ouija boards, consult mediums, play with Tarot cards, perform Wiccan rites, etc., you've given permission to the demonic to throw phenomena your way. Read Ed and Lorraine Warren, Malachi Martin for evidence of this.

4. That's why I'm here.

5. No one can diagram it because no one knows the Evil One's "grand strategy". As my Dad says, "He may just want to muddy the waters."

6. Why would it want to kill me? Because it hates everything. It hates the fact that there is such a thing as "beauty". It hates the Creation. It hates the fact that it's damned and its time is short. I don't know. But that is definitely what it was telepathically conveying.

Whew.

reply to post by ahornsby



and no disrespect taken my friend

you said you have dreams of spirits that come to visit you.
strangley,
after my visit, my grandmother came to visit me (she had died a long time ago) in a dream. she was introducing me too somebody but the dream was very hazy and i dont remember who it was.
that is the only time i remember my grandmother visiting me in a dream, tho, i dont dream much (or remember them).

i worked at the V.A hospital on the Psych ward and i met a man i would testify was possessed by a demon. he was tied to a metal bed with railes. you know like a hospital bed. he had a crazed look in his eye and when i stepped in the room he went nuts. saying he did not want me there. and begged me to take off my cross. he was so strong he bent the bed railes and folded them down toward the ground against the normal way they are supposed to go.

yes i know these people exist, so i cant argue against them existing
but what is possessed and just plain madness
if he was truly possossed, would he not be able to do more than just bend the bars. or to put it another way, if he is possessed, he is easy to keep out of the way.

there is only a small portion of light frequency we as humans can see. then there is infared. and so on if we as humans could change the frequency we see on then i bet we would be totaly amazed by the spirit world that we can not see.

i fully agree
and i believe, that saturday morning something was out of line or something crossed the line and our frequenencies meet.
but i dont believe science has a true answer, sorry..

as for reading the bible
i was made to read it when i was young
but i had problems believing what i was reading, so i quit as soon as i was allowed
but i understand what you mean by the story
and when you put it that way, if i believe in spirits, just maybe demons do exist. just not a demon who can turn a good person bad.
now i am rambling

good luck my friend
and thx

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
www.prairieghosts.com...

Thanks for the link. Again, not exactly a clear picture of what this thing is according to the testimonies. Does it have gray or brown fur? Does that mean there's more than one? This is a physical thing, right? Can demons take on a physical form? Testimony says, "and his funny eyes were staring at me almost hypnotically" not "I was hypnotized". I saw the photo of the 'mothman' perched on the bridge before. Looks very similar to whatever was on the other post of the bridge except bent. Very little to go on here, I'm surprised they had more than a paragraph to write on it. Okay okay, let's say mothman is a demon. What is the endgame to this demon spooking people out? People typically don't have a love of evil when they get scared half to death.

Can demons take physical form? Apparently at least temporarily--or it is the ILLUSION of physical form.

What endgame to frightening people? Perhaps we are closer to the end of the world than we think and the Devil is desperate. He doesn't care anymore. That is an unanswerable question.

Here are some books which appear to show evidence that different types of paranormal phenomena (UFO's, poltergeists, ghosts, Bigfoot, orbs) can happen in conjunction with each other:

Hunt for the Skinwalker: Science Confronts the Unexplained at a Remote Ranch in Utah (Paperback)
by Colm A. Kelleher (Author), George Knapp (Author)

Mysteries of time and Space (Mass Market Paperback)
by Brad Steiger (Author)

SHADOW WORLD: True Encounters with Beings from the Darkside (Paperback)
by Brad Steiger (Author)

Zane, very interesting thread,Interesting responses too. I as well have been studying the subject of demons lately.
I have not had the chance to post here at ATS for awhile and hopefully this will not be another cameo.

I have to say one thing to you Zane, I agree with you 100%. How do I know this? It's a long story and not ready to give all the details but let me give you cliff notes:

I had a very close call car accident on April 28th of this year at 9 p.m. This accident happened out of the blue and took me TOTALLY by surprise.. Even though I don't remember anything from the accident save a brief memory of being strapped into a gurney, I know by the evidence left behind that I did not see it coming. Again, I was taken utterly by surprise. I almost died. I don't mean to leave everyone out in the cold but I'm not ready to get into the gory details but let's just say it was the most horrifying experience I've EVER had and let me tell you, unless you have experienced a close call with death and been seperated from God you DON'T know fear. People who are reading this need to take heed and harken to my words. Demons are REAL and they are EVERYWHERE around us. There are no souls from the 'dead' or our long lost relatives running around ever exept in the rare cases where God allows it and 'these' souls have to have been in Jesus's camp when they died. People who died without Jesus are judged immediately and gated up in Hell for eternity. (Once you go to hell you DON'T ever leave) Some people believe that, and the Bible speaks that souls 'sleep' until judgement and this is true but only to an extent. Souls only sleep in our time, God and eternity are not bound by time and time works differently on the other side. What might take a long time here happens in a blink when you cross over. This may not make sense now but think outside the box for awhile and hopefully it will make sense. (Praying for discernment in Jesus name will help as well) You can believe in the Bible or not but let me assure you from the bottom of my heart and with GREAT passion it is real. Don't believe for one second that the Bible is fallible just because it was written by man. If you understood how God is in control of things you would change your tune immediately. The reason why alot of you have not gotten the 'proof' you seek it's because you have blinders on due to unbelief/lack of faith in the Lord Jesus.

Getting back on track and summary:

Demons are REAL, they are all around us all the time and they are masters at deceiving. The Bible is clear about Demons.. they are angels that turned on God and were cast out of Heaven down to earth and our 'spatial' realm with 'not place in Heaven found for them again'. Many will come to you masquerading as a lost relative or 'friendly' being. They are LYING. The only reason they are doing this is because they are trying to shoehorn their way into your life and get a greater foothold.. these demons have lost everything for eternity and they HATE you because you still have a choice.. your soul which never dies is their prize.

Right now we are living in a dimension of 'choice'. God has cursed this fleshly season of our 'existence' by allowing demons to exist in our realm along with us with limited power but rest assured the day is coming when this 'barrier' will be taken down and the 'restrainer' taken away just like in death and without Jesus you will be in 'outer darkness'.. you don't have the mental killowatts to comprehend what this will be like...Only Jesus can protect you from demons. The silver lining to all this? we can still choose God and he is giving us a chance/waiting for us to do so. Once we 'leave here we will not be able to choose God so choose carefully and keep in mind he has a NAME and His name is Jesus Christ. Trust ME.. You do NOT want to leave earth without Jesus. Once the 'bowl is broken' and the 'silver cord' is loosed you will be in for quite an experience when you die and it will last for eternity. Have you ever really seriously wondered 'what' Jesus was saving you from?

While we are here on this earth we are ALL spiritually oppressed by demons around us on some level but we can do things to invoke greater influences by them, even to the point of demonic possession. What are these things that will open the 'doors' to these greater levels of visitations? It's a long list but here are a few.. Being told about Jesus and still rejecting him, lack of prayer, known sin in your life that you refuse to turn away from, playing with ouiji boards.. stuff like that. The Bible is perfectly clear about devination and it's spelled out clearly. DON'T do it.


I could go on and on but might post more later. What I will leave you with is a link to a video, this is one of the best ones I've seen. There are several 'sightings' in this video but the two that really got my attention were the ones involving the ouji board and the camera in front of the mirror.

www.youtube.com...

At the end of the second one involving the camera sitting in front of the mirror, you hear voices. Made me think of the Bible in Mark where Jesus cast demons out of a 'crazy' man.

Check out all of it but here is a snippet:

Mark 5:9 "And He (Jesus) asked him(Demon), What is thy name? And he(demon) answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many."

For we are many?

Revelation 12:7-12, "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."

"Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto YOU!

Zane, question...

One commonality that seems to bridge demonic experiences in general along with temperature changes (cooling) and strange electromagnetic disturbances are "popping" and "snapping" sounds often heard by people as well as cameras. Have you run across this? I have seen alot of material and these "flitting popping and snapping noises" are definitely 'on the charts' with demonic activity.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly
I am a Christian, and the Bible clearly forbids people to contact the dead.

Tell that to Christ. He was 'conversing' with 2 dead people - Moses and Elijah (or whoever) on top of a mountain while Peter, James and John looked on.

Jesus can tell the difference between an evil spirit and one that is good.

A human can't unless he has the gift of discernment.

That in itself is ignorant.. Do not place claim in the power of one being who by no means is proven to exist (anymore.. yes Jesus was alive but the rest is up to be examined)

Humans can be deceived.. powerful beings can be deceived.. deception is just an act, anyone can see through it and anyone can fall for it, be them all powerful and all knowing or not.. because no one or nothing is ever all knowing, that would mean that life is a script that they write, therefor taking away from the idea of free will that most religious figureheads try to point give at. Knowledge can only be gained after action takes place, skill and practice are what see through deception.

Then i'll cite another tv show named ghost hunters, where they have picked up on the ghosts of small girls who can't have possibly done anything wrong enough to go to hell.

Originally posted by Zane Zackerly

Jesus can tell the difference between an evil spirit and one that is good.

A human can't unless he has the gift of discernment.

You said earlier about the Bible forbidding contact with the dead... What if someone were to have this "gift of discernment"? Would that be okay? Somehow I doubt that you would think that it was.

I respectfully disagree with your opinion regarding all ghosts being controlled by Satan. As someone stated earlier, you have the burden of proof, so I am not going to go into why I believe you to be wrong.

Besides, you didn't provide any proof in your posts. Many of your sentences began with "I believe." Your beliefs are just that. Your beliefs and my beliefs might drive us to behave a certain way, but they do not constitute "facts."

reply to post by chickenfeet


I had the same experience (someone invisible spooning with me in bed) twice in my life, but it didn't feel good and I was totally freaked out. I also didn't have any dead lovers I could have attributed the experience to. Bottom line: You THOUGHT it was your dead girlfriend, but you don't really know what it was.

As for demons/demonic spirits: I've had (more than) my share of personal experiences with those and I can only say you're very lucky that you've never encountered any.

reply to post by Zane Zackerly

I believe what we call "damnation" is maybe more complicated than simply "going to Hell." I believe the actual mechanism involved is that the unsaved person dies, and is kidnapped and taken to Hell by demons that roam the earth looking for new victims. I believe that some "ghosts" may be the unsaved dead who have successfully hidden from demons (temporarily!) and will eventually be taken to Hell when they are "found."

I don't think so. Once on Coast to Coast AM, there was a paranormal investigator who was talking about ghosts, demons, and how ghosts -- what he defined as "earthbound spirits" -- sometimes can be "held hostage" by demons. One case was a group of nuns (= ghosts) that were stuck in one house and under the power of a demonic force.

Obviously those nuns would not have been "unsaved." Also, there are multiple examples of devout Christians who had to undergo exorcisms (i.e. the true story of the exorcism of Emily Rose and many other, less known examples of "saved" people being obsessed or even possessed by demons). I really don't think "saved" or "unsaved" is the criterium here; it has to be something else.

[edit on 5-12-2007 by sylvie]