It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

NWO and Secret societies and the British connection

page: 1
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 18 2007 @ 11:06 AM
link   
O.k I've watched a few documentaries relating to the Illuminati and the New World Order and how the secret societies and freemasons are linked to to the NWO. I must admit I came away from watching the documentaries with a very bad feeling indeed and that the documentaries contained alot of substance. For example the the architecture in London, Washington, and the Vatican, plus lots of other insignia relating to company logos and the Dollar bills. I'm not sure if the NWO does exist, but the one thing I do know is that these secret societies do exist and some involve the most powerful people in the world. Some of the members like Bush and Kerry have openly admitted it and used strange signs to one an other. They say the societies are so secret, they can't talk about anything relating to the subject. I find this very unnerving and can't believe that some of the most powerful people in the world could be running our financial institutions and political parties. What I also find alarming is Britain's involvement in the secret societies, In the documentaries I have viewed in the past the Royal family seem to keep rearing there ugly heads and I've also read various statements from Americans saying that Britain's Freemasons and secret societies are alot more sinister than there own counterparts. So what am i asking here? Well I'm quite new this site and this is only my second thread to date. I'm always seeing reference to the NWO when viewing various threads and it seems like most members believe in the NWO, so I'm betting there is a wealth of knowledge out there and I'm hoping some of you more knowledgeable people would be good enough to give your views on the NWO and the secret societies and especially the British connection.

[edit on 18uTuesday07/27/20 by paul76]




posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 03:35 AM
link   
There's just too much info and multiple degrees of separation to talk about when discussing the NWO. Britain is definetly one major part.

From what I've seen and read, I believe that there is indeed an international group of loosely connected individuals who are working toward several goals, none of which are good for the United States or world as a whole. Anywhere with a non government run central bank is being manipulated by these people. This goes without saying as far as I'm concerned because you would need a corrupt government to allow such a bank to exist in the first place. All of the U.S. presidents that have moved against the banks have been assasinated or have had an attempt made on their lives. The two who printed actual American currency were shot in the head.

Most of the people in control are members of a few family blood lines. They are put into power by their relatives or family friends. Various networks exist to recruit, brainwash and promote like minded individuals who will eagerly help the NWO for temporary success. Those individuals who might help their cause are given a leg up for a future return of favors. Rhodes Scholars like Clinton are one example. Sometimes a family friend helps out, like Armand Hammer and the Gore family. (Arm-and-Hammer, get it?) Or Bush who was sold a million dollars in stocks for a fraction of the price by a family friend in order to get him started out.

These people continue the slow boiling of the water to finish their ancestor's goals. A frog tossed into boiling water will of course jump out. They will gladly spend a whole lifetime making a small amount of progress. Family dynasties have longer memories than normal people. History repeats and no one is alive to remember. Besides, the power elite already live like kings without all of their goals accomplished. Imagine what it will be like for their great grand children who rule over the 500 million remaining people of eath.

The effort is so huge and well, smart; that it is hard to concieve of a way to stop it without a massive history altering natural disaster. They have numerous think-tanks of very smart people who spend all day every day figuring out how to trick people into accepting, or even begging for, a one world government, population reduction and tracking and monitoring of all people and objects in the world.

The only way to fight these people is with knowledge used to reveal their hidden plans. We have to continue breaking the codes, deciphering the symbols and connecting the dots and revealing it to people. Unfortunatly the media brain washed zombies wont accept the truth; much like the Matrix. In the Matrix movie, Morpheus says that they usually dont "wake up" adults, because they are so connected to the Matrix that they can't accept the truth.

"The individual is handicapped by coming face-to-face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists." - J. Edgar Hoover, FBI Director (1924-1933)



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 11:17 AM
link   
reply to post by ViolatoR
 



Thanks for your input, very interesting indeed. Would I be right in saying that the USA is the template for the NWO? It seems to me that the USA is the Guinea pig. Also from what I've been reading it seems the Bank of England has a large part to play in all of this.



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 04:04 PM
link   
If the secret societies are so powerful, why does it take them for ever and ever to implement the NWO? Does NWO mean we are all united under a dictator or united in peace?

I think those who control the military forces of the world could bring us all in line in a few months. Uniting us in peace under self governance, now that would take a long time indeed.

I believe there are little known powerful groups who hold huge sway over world affairs. They use money and power to get more money and power but why assume there are only evil secret societies? If there are true secret societies, then we haven't ever heard of them. And if they were all evil, we would all be brain-chipped slaves by now.

I suspect there are some good people working behind the scenes to keep us free while we vote away our rights and give up freedom through apathy.

Here is something to consider: What if the good secret societies devise their own symbols with virtuous meanings to convey complex ideas and the bad secret societies, to mock the good ones, confuse the masses, pervert virtue and hide themselves, use the same symbols as the good societies?
Just like what Hitler did, he took a perfectly good symbol and wiped his arse with it.


[edit on 19-9-2007 by RedPill]



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 04:53 PM
link   
reply to post by RedPill
 


I am glad there is someone here at ATS who understands the possibility of positive conspiracies and good secret societies. Thats a possibility that is missed by so many researches and authors. Also, great point about "why does it take so long?" etc.



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 05:35 PM
link   

Originally posted by Skyfloating
I am glad there is someone here at ATS who understands the possibility of positive conspiracies and good secret societies. Thats a possibility that is missed by so many researches and authors. Also, great point about "why does it take so long?" etc.


Exactly. There have been much better chances in history to take over the world and they weren't seized upon.

Trying to do so now seems like a much harder task than ever before. If they ever had a plan to do it, then they fudged it up big time.

Personally, I believe that all these NWO theories are American-centric. In that they are always, without fail, promoted by Americans and centre on America as the key in the plan. not once does any of these theories even consider the possibility of other nations and interest groups who may not see eye to eye with any secret plan the White man has.



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 07:51 PM
link   
Yes You've hit the nail on the head in my books. That's the one thing I haven't been able to put my finger on, why have the so called NWO taken so long to bring there grand schemes into fruition? With all there power and money they could pretty much steam roller any obstacles in there way. Why all this cloak and dagger business? According to the information I've read they have most of there goals achieved, EG...control of political and financial institutions, control of government agencies. With these foundations in place their isn't anything to oppose the alleged NWO, unless you count in states such as China or Russia or Iran. If indeed the NWO does exist they will have to conquer rogue states before there grand plan is finalized. Another point is I think somewhere in our future that it's inevitable that there will be a legitimate One World Government . Surely there would be benefits to a world Government, no war, one religion, one currency or am I being naive? Thanks for you posts...Much appreciated.



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 08:59 PM
link   

Originally posted by paul76
So what am i asking here? Well I'm quite new this site and this is only my second thread to date. I'm always seeing reference to the NWO when viewing various threads and it seems like most members believe in the NWO, so I'm betting there is a wealth of knowledge out there and I'm hoping some of you more knowledgeable people would be good enough to give your views on the NWO and the secret societies and especially the British connection.

Well I'd be happy to answer any questions you have about freemasonry in Britain, as it's a subject I know quite a lot about.


And while there may or may not be freemasons involved in the so-called NWO, it is quite clear to me that British freemasonry as an organization most certainly is not, and indeed cannot by definition have any involvement in anything political. I challenge absolutely anyone to demonstrate otherwise.


BTW welcome to ATS



posted on Sep, 19 2007 @ 09:06 PM
link   

Originally posted by stumason
Personally, I believe that all these NWO theories are American-centric. In that they are always, without fail, promoted by Americans and centre on America as the key in the plan. not once does any of these theories even consider the possibility of other nations and interest groups who may not see eye to eye with any secret plan the White man has.

Freemasonry is one of the pleasant exceptions to this rule. Because it was founded in Britain, and the British Grand Lodges are the oldest in the world, it necessarily follows that if there is a masonic conspiracy it must obviously start in Britain. Much speculation follows on from this premise, almost all of which is sadly lacking in any kind of a factual base. Not that that ever stops anyone, of course



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 03:31 AM
link   
In my opinion there have been several attempts to impose a NWO and some have been more successful than others.

I find it surprising that the Freemasons can embrace the fact that they were instrumental in instilling democratic thoughts and that many mason were revolutionaries and yet fail to acknowledge that rule by the people, for the people was a New World Order.

How NEW do the ideas and intentions have to be, to be considered a New World Order?

In Britain our revolutions took place centuries before the others and ended in a constitutional monarchy that maintains an elitist model but does allow meritocracy - a compromise. Britain is the Middle-way, in Church and World Orders.

Why does it take so long to impose a New World Order?

Because not only do we damn blighters keep resisting, but there is more than one New World Order ideology, they are still vying for supremacy or splitting the booty. It can only get a lot worse and many more people are going to die. (In my opinion).



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 08:49 AM
link   

Originally posted by paul76
I'm always seeing reference to the NWO when viewing various threads and it seems like most members believe in the NWO, so I'm betting there is a wealth of knowledge out there and I'm hoping some of you more knowledgeable people would be good enough to give your views on the NWO and the secret societies and especially the British connection.


Oh, the British connection is very interesting and more secret than the American counterparts.

After all, the British spreaded influence throughout the world for centuries under the empire. The Anglosphere of influence is very large till this day.

Now, to secret societies. Lets take Freemasonry. The Grand lodge of England is the mother lodge of international Freemasonry. Some members of the British Royal Family are masons, members of parliament and even some in the Church of England. So, one could argue (if you believe the conspiracies) that Freemasonry has infiltrated all parts of the UK constitutional make up.

The aristocracy in this country is very large, powerful and has influence. So, if there is a global conspiracy, logic dictates that Britain would have a very large and significant role.



[edit on 20-9-2007 by infinite]



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 09:41 AM
link   
Whilst I suspect that there may currently be a group of individuals / families / societies who are trying to manipulate world events and affairs to further their own agenda's, I still remain to be convinced how far back this stretches and exactly who and why they are doing this.
Is this NWO or Illuminati? Again i'm not sure but there certainly does seem to be quite a bit of circumstantual evidence to support at least their existence. I think it's also fair to suggest that there is supportive evidence for the existence of some other Secret Societies.

Thanks to other threads here on ATS, I have recently been reading into the connections between the banking institutions in Europe and the USA.
Initially I was very sceptical of any such connection. I think I have been proven to have been quite naive and have indeed been quite shocked at the level of complicity operating between these institutes and families.
The Swiss Banking operations during WW2 can be described as at worst prostitution and at best sheer profiteering. That UK, US, German etc banking institutions also profited, (often by continually dealing with each other whilst at war!), is nothing less than treasonous.

Freemasonry has it's roots in Britain but I personally have found any study of Freemasonry difficult to understand. There appears to be some lodges which are Catholic, some strictly Protestant, some outright Pagan like, some Satanical but most profess some deep mystical understanding of ancient gnostic or esoteric teachings.
On top of that, each higher degree reveals more of this secret knowledge and depending on what lodge and what degree you are determines how much is revealed to you.
Sorry, I find it highly confusing.
Is it a deliberate ploy to camouflage the true beliefs and purposes, possibly, it's just so confusing.
I could really do with someone posting an idiots guide to Freemasonry, the history, the beliefs, the aims etc. Bit like a rock family tree

One things certain, imo, they are involved somewhere.

Also, I think that it's probably reasonable to assume that some of these secret societies are well intentioned. Who they are? Again, I haven't got a scooby.


In essence, I think it's all smoke in mirrors, with circles in circles and conspiracies upon conspiracies, all designed at keeping us from the truth.
I also think that i've spent a whole lot of time writing this post which will add nothing new or positive to it. But i'm still going to post it!
I'm confused, bet you are now as well.


[edit on 20-9-2007 by Freeborn]



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 06:53 PM
link   

Originally posted by infinite
The Grand lodge of England is the mother lodge of international Freemasonry. Some members of the British Royal Family are masons, members of parliament and even some in the Church of England. So, one could argue (if you believe the conspiracies) that Freemasonry has infiltrated all parts of the UK constitutional make up.

I think the above connections are overblown. There are two (minor) members of the Royal family who are freemasons, The Duke of Kent and Prince Michael. I have heard it said that Prince Philip was once initiated in his youth - if this is true he is certainly inactive now and has been for many years.

I know of one member of the House of Commons who is a freemason. Just one. I think there are several in the House of Lords but as that's hardly the hub of British power broking I wouldn't worry overly about their influence. If I had to guess, I would say there were no more that 20 freemasons in the Lords.

Many, many Anglicans are freemasons, but I can't testify as to how many of these are in a position of influence within the Church of England. Since membership of freemasonry is now pretty much the kiss of death to any public career I don't imagine there can be many.

Conspiracy theorist or not, there is just no evidence to suggest that freemasonry is to blame for corruption within the Halls of Power, as opposed to other more obvious connections, like the Old School Network for instance. Of all the possible networks, freemasonry is the only one that I know of to explicitly request its members not to use their membership for personal gain.

Freemasonry, as usual, is the easy target. The true culprits are laughing their heads off.

[edit on 9/20/07 by Trinityman]



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 07:04 PM
link   

Originally posted by Freeborn
Freemasonry has it's roots in Britain but I personally have found any study of Freemasonry difficult to understand. There appears to be some lodges which are Catholic, some strictly Protestant, some outright Pagan like, some Satanical but most profess some deep mystical understanding of ancient gnostic or esoteric teachings.

I would be very interested in this research of yours, as regular freemasonry is not demarcated along religious lines, and certainly none are Satanic. You may have come across irregular masonic grand lodges, or quasi-masonic organizations who exhibit these characteristics, but none of these are Freemasonry.


On top of that, each higher degree reveals more of this secret knowledge and depending on what lodge and what degree you are determines how much is revealed to you.

This I am most confused about and I am wondering what you mean by this?


Sorry, I find it highly confusing.

If you have been researching freemasonry on the internet I am not surprised at all. The is so much contradictory tosh and nonsense published about freemasonry that I would hardly know where to start myself.


Is it a deliberate ploy to camouflage the true beliefs and purposes, possibly, it's just so confusing.

I really do think it is a deliberate ploy, but not by freemasonry


I could really do with someone posting an idiots guide to Freemasonry, the history, the beliefs, the aims etc. Bit like a rock family tree

Check out "Freemasonry for Dummies" by Christopher Hodapp. It's US-centric but still covers a lot of good information. It's on Amazon for $13.59.


One things certain, imo, they are involved somewhere.

Hmm. Not so sure about that



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 07:31 PM
link   
reply to post by Trinityman
 


I have read several texts recommended and linked to in other threads and have only succeeded in confusing myself.
I have never tried to pass myself as an expert, i'm sure that's pretty apparent.

I am aware that there are Protestant lodges, evident yearly during the Orange Lodge marches in Northern Ireland.
I am also aware of supposed Catholic and Vatican links to Masonic Lodges, Roberto Calvi etc.

Some people have expressed the opinion that some Masons use The Brotherhood, (maybe the wrong name for it), as a cover for Satanical worship, I find that unlikely, and others that Masons know the true (?) nature of Jesus etc, others that they are the guardians of ancient gnostic and esoteric knowledge that is gradually revealed as a member progresses through the ranks.

These are not my opinions, just what has been expressed both here and in numerous other sources.

To put it as simple as I can, I personally am as confused as hell about it all and quite frankly don't understand any of it and seek clarity and understanding.

I am far from being a stupid person but this makes me feel like one


Now where does all this fit in with NWO, Secret Societies and the British connection. As stated before, I haven't got a scooby, but if, and I grant you it's a big if, there's some truth in any of the supposed origins and ultimate aims of the upper echelons of British Freemasonry, then I wouldn't be suprised if there is some sort of connection.

Me, I'm still confused as hell but I hope you understand where my confusion comes from.
I will try to read the book you have recommended. Thanks. I just hope it doesn't add to my confusion.

I personally suspect that there is a greater link between the banking institutions and any possible NWO etc.
Again, just an opinion.



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 08:04 PM
link   

Originally posted by Freeborn
I am aware that there are Protestant lodges, evident yearly during the Orange Lodge marches in Northern Ireland.
I am also aware of supposed Catholic and Vatican links to Masonic Lodges, Roberto Calvi etc.


Any lodge you find that associates itself with one particular religion is not real Freemasonry. Catholics have an order called the Knight of Columbus and the Protestants they have something called The Orange Order these are not related to Freemasonry. Over the centuries many orinizations have sought to emulate Freemasonry so there are a number of irregular masonic lodges that make whatever religious claim they want. Real mainstream Freemasonry does not promote one religion over another. If some sick satanic teenagers want to go out and see who can be the most evil then call it masonry, that is unfortunate but its not Freemasonry.



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 08:29 PM
link   

Originally posted by Freeborn
I am aware that there are Protestant lodges, evident yearly during the Orange Lodge marches in Northern Ireland.

Indeed, but the Orange Lodges are nothing to do with freemasonry. You can visit the official website of the Grand Lodge of Ireland here and the website of the Orange Lodge movement here. The Orange movement, like others, copied freemasonry in many respects, but that in itself does not make them masonic. In fact they fail one of the basic determinates of regularity, that of political and/or religious neutrality. I can see how the similarity, though, between Freemasonry and the Orange lodge is confusing, but that is not the fault of Freemasonry.


I am also aware of supposed Catholic and Vatican links to Masonic Lodges, Roberto Calvi etc.

I too am aware of nefarious activities in so-called masonic lodges in Italy. None of them are regular, in fact the only regular Grand Lodge operating in Italy is the Regular Grand Lodge of Italy, who's website can be found here. Again, many GLs in Italy are too politically opinionated to be regarded as Regular.

Incidentally, no link has been proven between the death of Roberto Calvi and freemasonry, regular or otherwise. More urban myth I'm afraid, based around Calvi's membership in P2, a completely irregular "masonic" lodge in Italy.


Some people have expressed the opinion that some Masons use The Brotherhood, (maybe the wrong name for it), as a cover for Satanical worship, I find that unlikely, and others that Masons know the true (?) nature of Jesus etc, others that they are the guardians of ancient gnostic and esoteric knowledge that is gradually revealed as a member progresses through the ranks.

Most freemasons are Christians, and find the accusations of Satanic worship both ridiculous and hilarious. Still these rumors persist, fueled mostly by disingenuous or misguided fools and their websites. It all seems to be based upon one sentence written by one freemason 150 years ago taken out of context.


To put it as simple as I can, I personally am as confused as hell about it all and quite frankly don't understand any of it and seek clarity and understanding.

I wish you the very best of luck with that. Your first step is to decide who to believe.


I am far from being a stupid person but this makes me feel like one

I'm quite sure you are far from stupid. You are asking questions rather than taking what people say for granted. That is a good start.



posted on Sep, 20 2007 @ 10:13 PM
link   
The only thing that gives the NWO power is us. As long as we accept it or ignore it they can do whatever they want. And beacuse this is so, the main stumbling blocks to the NWO are large populations and civillian gun ownership (and an informed public). China, Russia, Germany and Cambodia all passed gun bans shortly before killing millions of their own people. They all wanted to shape a new order. The Nazi especially wanted a new world order. Several attempts have been made to kick off the NWO including WWI and the League of Nations, WWII and the United Nations, Persian Gulf Crisis, 9/11 and now a possible nuclear scenario to be blamed on Iran.

An attempt to establish the NWO when they wanted to pre-WWI would have been impossible. The technology to efficiently monitor everyone was not yet developed. There were many "conflicts" to be fought in order to put U.S. military bases and illigal central banks in almost every country in the world. There now exists several methods for mass depopulation and the ability to monitor everyone on the face of the planet.

"The Technocratic Age is slowly designing an every day more controlled society. The society will be dominated by an elite of persons free from traditional values who will have no doubt in fulfilling their objectives by means of purged techniques with which they will influence the behavior of people and will control and watch the society in all details". "... it will become possible to exert a practically permanent watch on each citizen of the world".
- Zbigniew Brzezinski - (co-founder of Trilateral Commission) (and more recently Barak Obama's "foreign policy guru")

Freemasonry is not the secret arm of the NWO. Although as an already existing international network, it can be used to spread influence and recruit people. Of course almost no one "working for the NWO" is working for the NWO. They might support a plan to depopulate africa through forced sterility or other means, but not know that this is also the plan of the NWO. After all, according to Al Gore we should be promoting ZERO additions of carbon emmiters into the world; which means no more cars, factories, and more importantly- people.

"The governments of the present day have to deal not merely with other governments, with emperors, kings and ministers, but also with the secret societies which have everywhere their unscrupulous agents, and can at the last moment upset all the governments' plans. "
- British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli, 1876

"The drive of the Rockefellers and their allies is to create a one-world government combining supercapitalism and Communism under the same tent, all under their control.... Do I mean conspiracy? Yes I do. I am convinced there is such a plot, international in scope, generations old in planning, and incredibly evil in intent."
Congressman Larry P. McDonald, 1976, killed in the Korean Airlines 747 that was shot down by the Soviets

"The Trilateral Commission is intended to be the vehicle for multinational consolidation of the commercial and banking interests by seizing control of the political government of the United States. The Trilateral Commission represents a skillful, coordinated effort to seize control and consolidate the four centers of power political, monetary, intellectual and ecclesiastical. What the Trilateral Commission intends is to create a worldwide economic power superior to the political governments of the nationstates involved. As managers and creators of the system, they will rule the future."
- U.S. Senator Barry Goldwater in his l964 book: "With No Apologies".

The secret to when the NWO will be established is that when we are finally told that we have a New World Order, it will be years after their goals were basically finished. We will stop and think: "...national ID cards, interstate checkpoints, union of world unions, a single currency (computer units, no real change in currency necessary), a massive drop in new births, 24hour monitoring of every person in the world, less wars but more riots... oh yeah, we do have the NWO!" There isn't going to be a massive world war after which a single country claims ownership of the world.

"It is to the sacred principles enshrined in the UN Charter to which we will henceforth pledge our allegiance."
- G.H.W.Bush, speech to the UN, Feb. 1, 1992

On January 20, 1993, William Jefferson Clinton took the oath of the presidency and gave his address:
"Let us resolve to make our government a place for what Franklin Roosevelt called 'bold, persistent experimentation'. There is NO longer a clear division between what is FOREIGN and what is DOMESTIC, the world economy, the world environment, the world AIDS crisis, the world arms race, they effect us all. Today, as an Old Order PASSES, the New World is more free but less stable. When the will and conscience of the international community is defied, we will ACT with FORCE when necessary."

"If there are those who think we are to jump immediately into a new world order, actuated by complete understanding and brotherly love, they are doomed to disappointment. If we are ever to approach that time, it will be after patient and persistent effort of long duration. The present international situation of mistrust and fear can only be corrected by a formula of equal status, continuously applied, to every phase of international contacts, until the cobwebs of the old order are brushed out of the minds of the people of all lands."
Dr. Augustus O. Thomas, president of the World Federation of Education Associations (August 1927), quoted in the book International Understanding: Agencies Educating for a New World (1931)



posted on Sep, 21 2007 @ 04:17 AM
link   

Originally posted by Trinityman
I know of one member of the House of Commons who is a freemason. Just one. I think there are several in the House of Lords but as that's hardly the hub of British power broking I wouldn't worry overly about their influence. If I had to guess, I would say there were no more that 20 freemasons in the Lords.

Many, many Anglicans are freemasons, but I can't testify as to how many of these are in a position of influence within the Church of England. Since membership of freemasonry is now pretty much the kiss of death to any public career I don't imagine there can be many.


Hello Trinityman

I am wondering if, in the UK at least, we should worry at their LACK of influence.

I have studied Freemasonry reasonably closely and found it to be on the whole a positive influence on world affairs - not perfect and there are inevitably exceptions - but I can find no really reason to fear it. I

I am poor though and relatively powerless, why would I fear an organisation that promotes a democratic and morality based ethos? If indeed it is these ideals that influenced the endeavours of Camille Desmoulins and the Founding fathers - then the only people who should fear Freemasonry are those without merit that acheive power through inheritance, tyranny and priviledge.

Why then is membership of Freemasonry considered the kiss of death in the pursuit of a public career?

I am also interested that there are "many, many" Anglican members of Freemasonry - I vaguely recall reading somewhere (may have been here) that Rowan Williams was considering whether Freemasonry was compatible with the Anglian Clergy - I cannot help but feel that the two are linked in the origins of speculative Feemasonry? Can you perhaps shed some light on this for me - Are Anglicans well represented in UGLE locally and internationally? What about other lodges, are there any trends there?

Very best wishes



posted on Sep, 21 2007 @ 08:12 PM
link   

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout
I am wondering if, in the UK at least, we should worry at their LACK of influence.

I tend to agree, although I would say that wouldn't I?


In a country which does not require its citizens to take any form of oath of allegience, it is in fact only the freemasons who voluntarily, several times a year, pledge on their honor to uphold the law of the land to the best of their ability. This pledge supercedes any obligation to a fellow freemason. On this basis I would have though freemasons would actually make better public servants!


Why then is membership of Freemasonry considered the kiss of death in the pursuit of a public career?

Because of the public perception, fed by the sensationalist media, that freemasons are corrupt, networking, back-scratching middle-class snobs who's sole purpose is to feather their own nests at the expense of non-masons. This opens the door to any Unfortunate who is unable to take any form of personal responsibility to lay his or her misfortune at the door of the Lodge. "The Freemasons Did It!" "If it wasn't for them I'd be successful etc etc".
This perception simply will not go away because many people want to believe it rather than accept the alternative.


I am also interested that there are "many, many" Anglican members of Freemasonry - I vaguely recall reading somewhere (may have been here) that Rowan Williams was considering whether Freemasonry was compatible with the Anglian Clergy - I cannot help but feel that the two are linked in the origins of speculative Feemasonry? Can you perhaps shed some light on this for me - Are Anglicans well represented in UGLE locally and internationally? What about other lodges, are there any trends there?

I merely meant that there are many Anglican freemasons, because there are many Christian freemasons. There are also many Methodist freemasons too. Rowan Williams father was a freemason, and he has subsequently backtracked on his unfortunate and ill-considered comments at the start of his term as Archbishop. Read the Telegraph's article about it here.


Very best wishes

Always a pleasure, KT.



new topics

top topics



 
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join