Student Arrested, Tasered at Kerry Event

reply to post by scientist


you are in tears? i hope your weeping for your countries loss of freedom speech i really do ...

is it ok for me to come into your home and shout my freedom of speech views into your face? or as a citizen of a planet with many diverse people and many more diverse views.. do u not agree that there has to be at least some form of structure to facilitate the smooth running of life in general for all people?

like i said before his question .. his views.. his freedom of speech became vastly irrelevant once 6 police offers sat on him and tazered him that is my primary concern when dealing with this thread, not debating your views on what you think freedom of speech is.

Yeah, the "kitty playing guitar" part was just inappropriate.

Just kidding Majic, don't kill me! *covers head, runs and hides*

Peace

[edit on 18-9-2007 by Dr Love]

Originally posted by arktkchr

...this is sickening, "hello police state" is right, anyone ever been tasered? it hurts, a lot. i was reading about the military issued ones, they're like 80,000 volts?! cops get power to their head and held the thing to my neck, it bruised and felt like death////

i. Thank God people are finally realizing myself and esdad's argument. The reaction towards this student was entirely justified, from what we are able to see, and moreso, from what we most likely don't.

ii. For the last time, tazers don't hurt. They are incapable of 'hurting'. It's a shock, a fear, a paralyzation. Quite frankly, I doubt your 'bruise' claim, if it was a close-range touch-sensor tazer, as nothing touches your skin, and bruising could only extremely rarely result from what occurs.

Time to throw my 2 cents in where it matters least. The police force used in this recorded tasering was excessive. Not only was the man walking out on his own when the police approached him, but he had his hands raised away from his body in a show of mercy. He told them not to touch him and that he would walk out on his own and the police got rough with him. He was on his way out anyway. Kerry also offered to answer what he called "a very important question", and the police continued to use force to bring the man down. Now, answer me this, why is it necessary for all of those officers (who already have the man pinned to the ground) to then taser the man. He was subdued already. If I were this man, I would take the officers to court and have the video played in front of a jury. Let them decide who was being excessive.

On another note, I am a huge fan of police officers and have many as friends. I believe in using force when force is necessary. The degree of force used in this instance was excessive and abusive. The man made no threats, he simply asked questions. He did not curse or use foul language in asking the questions. Abuse of power, abuse of power.

Originally posted by freight tomsen
Hey idiot with the kitty playing guitar. You don't need to start spreading information about this guys background. This issue has nothing whatsoever to do with whether this guy likes taping practical jokes or thinks he's god. He did nothing wrong. In fact he did something right. He made his voice heard regarding relevant issues intentionally avoided by Kerry... he did the job our journalists aren't doing, and for that he gets taken down, tazered and arrested. This is terrible, and guitar kitty guy spreads cynical apathy like some MTV poster idiot. Get angry kitty man! Don't trivialize the death of our country! Feel the utter disgust that instinctively surfaces when you watch this! What's wrong with you people?

Kitty man? lol He's no kitty he's a giant. Compared to me that is.

Whoa take it easy I know Esdad can be a pain in the tail sometimes but he's entitled to his views..(Just kidding Esdad)

But you still have to be curtious to the other members. Name calling is frowned upon here.

I see your view too your angry and thats ok. The world isn't what it used to be. Thats for sure.

The cops have rules to follow too. And this was clearly excessive force against a unarmed man. Sure he threw a fit and the cops had no call to bum rush him with 8 to 10 cops.

Tazors don't hurt? Majic, can I tell this guy to take a flying leap? Over 100 people have DIED from tazors in America alone. You guys will say anything to justify this police state won't you? It's OK because tazors don't hurt anyway!? People... my faith in humanity... slipping away...

Originally posted by Quantum_Squirrel
is it ok for me to come into your home and shout my freedom of speech views into your face? or as a citizen of a planet with many diverse people and many more diverse views.. do u not agree that there has to be at least some form of structure to facilitate the smooth running of life in general for all people?

your analogies are inaccurate, and not even close to valid in the current context.

did this kid come into someones home, or was he at a public place paid for by tax dollars? Also, he was not shouting in anyones face, which could be considered harassment.

like i said before his question .. his views.. his freedom of speech became vastly irrelevant once 6 police offers sat on him and tazered him that is my primary concern when dealing with this thread, not debating your views on what you think freedom of speech is.

well sorry if you had an intended thread of discussion for this post. perhaps you should make it clear next time by saying "we will only talk about X in this thread, because that's all I care about."

reply to post by scientist

your analogies are inaccurate, and not even close to valid in the current context.

i was attempting to show you that even tho you have freedmom of speech certain situations call for certain rules to be in place .. my above post is a metaphor not a statement of fact!!


again you twist and you turn .. did i say i had an agenda for this thread and all should bow to it? NO

i said MY primary concern was not the same as the concerns that you are eluding to openly.. there is nothing wrong with this we are ALL entitled to our opinions but you seem reluctant to allow me my freedom of speech now don't you? if i differ from your view you have to call me wrong and/or illogical. why don't you do what i do and take all posts as they are .. i have gleamed usefull insight out of all the posts here .. and yes my fellow ATS'er even yours!!!!!!!!

This board is here for the very purpose of allowing a massive amount of people to express a greatly differing amount of views on any given subject. and i love it!!!!!

the question is do you ? or do you just like shouting people down ? wanna tazer me? that would shut me up no? :p

god i love this site!!! it gets the blood pumping and if u keep it in a positive way we will all gain as human beings!!!

[edit on 18/9/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

The Price Of Free Speech

Originally posted by freight tomsen
Tazors don't hurt? Majic, can I tell this guy to take a flying leap?

Well, if you're nice about it...

I hope I'm not coming across as overbearing. I just want to make sure a subject this important doesn't get buried beneath a flame-fest, as happens all too often.

Remember that the most important concept of free speech is that of protecting speech you may not agree with.

And indeed, as long as we're not breaking the rules, we can disagree as strenuously as we want.




[edit on 9/18/2007 by Majic]

O.k. here's a twist... 630 WMAL in D.C. is reporting that this guy was linked to Alex Jones.... Anyone hear anything close to this..Cause if this isn't true then we may have the spin police already on the subject here in D.C. now if this news being reported here isn't true then this scary story just went to down right time to GTFOD some of you might understand what I just typed to others it has the "F" bomb in it.

[edit on 18-9-2007 by tsloan]

I have noticed over the past few years that the police (or should i say some police) have become taser happy and will use it on just about anyone, from a pregnant woman to an elementary school aged kid, for just about any reason.

They either need to be held accountable, and the respective police departments; aren't about to do it, or they should have their toys taken away.

What really annoys me is Kerry didn't say anything about it and just let it happen.

Originally posted by Nola213
reply to post by merryxmas

 

Poor analogy in my opinion. Your talking about your own property, and doing nothing worng and the police just coming in without a warrant.

Apples and oranges. The scenario you described has 0% to do with the issue being discussed here.

This event took place in public where there were innocent bystanders within close proximity to this person who became violence and beligerent when he was just ask to leave the premisses quitely.

The police have all those other peoples safety to be concerned with as well. Again for all they know this guy coulda been a psycho and pulled a knife or a gun. I think they did their job perfectly, but again that's just my opinion.

Which the bulk of it comes from the fact I believe this guy had an agenda, and wanted to cause a scene. Again he's lucky they have non lethal human ways of subdueing out of control people who want to fight the police.

Poor comparison huh? So your own person is not your property then? So you should not defend yourself or excersise your rights when you are fully in accordance with the law?

You also missed out on the fact that my analogy is larger than the scope of what you saw. It's a string of events that lead to those types of scenarios when you don't stand up and protect your rights every step of the way. Every time you don't your freedoms are slowly eroded. The scenario of property seizure seems outlandish to you because you cannot see the bigger picture or you are unable to see a little further down the road.

The idea behind free speech is you may not like what the guy was saying but ALL speech is to be protected because there will come a time when there are other people who don't like what you are saying and that's when it matters to you, personally. That's why a staunch stance against such behavior is needed. If you cannot see a timeline then you are missing the point in it's entirety.

The guy was already on the ground with several officers on top of him. At that point is when the tazed him. You think that sort of action by officers of the law is acceptable. That is the result of slow conditioning or a just a perverse train of thought.

It's funny because your first sentences:

Poor analogy in my opinion. Your talking about your own property, and doing nothing worng and the police just coming in without a warrant.

What was he doing that was wrong? Perhaps you think his line of questioning is wrong? Or perhaps you think the volume of his voice was wrong? Or perhaps you just don't agree with his opinions.

The malarkey about him being a threat is just that, malarkey. Worked up != threat. Now the police coming into your home without a warrant and seizing your valuables when you did nothing wrong is a matter of opinion to you. You can scream that until your blue in the face and what good will it do when you don't stand up for freedoms while you may not agree with them? Someone may see a clip of you being dragged out of your house screaming "I did nothing wrong!" and they will come to the conclusion "oh he must of deserved it" just because it made the news. Or just because that is the slow conditioning and that is what you are supposed to think.

You see different freedoms as separate issues. See the bigger picture and realize when one freedom is trampled on it's just a matter of time before another one of yours is too.

I can't believe there are people on this forum defending this!

"Breaking the Q&A" rules is not grounds for assault and arrest.

Talking is not grounds for assault and arrest.

Being "annoying" and asking too many "stupid" questions is not grounds for assault and arrest.

There is no need to taser a person who has four people sitting on top of him. That is absolutely wrong. IMO, there had no right to put their hands on him at all. If they would have handled the situation more politely there would not have been an issue.

Little silver badges does not make anyone above the law, or more important than the rest of us.

reply to post by tsloan


This is the first I've heard of a possible Alex Jones connection, but like I said before, this guy could be working for the other side, and now that Alex Jones has been mentioned, it could be aimed at discrediting him and his followers/listeners.

This guy walked around with a billboard telling poor kids how the Harry Potter book ended before it came out. It's a classic discrediting set-up.

Maybe Jones was tied to this guy, I don't know, but if he was I bet he's regretting it big time right now. A guy in his position has to be very careful who he deals with.

Edit to add: And yes, I started a Harry Potter thread on suicides if Harry died, but it was purely speculation.

Peace

[edit on 18-9-2007 by Dr Love]

reply to post by Shane Void


I for one do not support the officers who tazed the student. It was excessive force.

He asked about Skull and bones- thats a no no.

[edit on 9/18/2007 by Leyla]

Handle With Kerry

Originally posted by grover
What really annoys me is Kerry didn't say anything about it and just let it happen.

In fairness, Senator Kerry was trying to calm things down with his comments over the PA.

What else could he have reasonably done? Told the cops to back off? Say "Don't make me come down there!"? Actually gone down and gotten into the scuffle?

Be annoyed if you must, but I think he was as surprised as anyone else there.

I have a hypothetical question. Suppose the student simply asked 1 simple question e.g. the skull and bones question or the election challenge question, calmly, without shouting Kerry down and behaving politely and then politely sat down waiting for an answer. What do you suppose would have happened to him?

My answer is nothing. Kerry would have dodged the question in some way and the poor fool would not have been tasered. The reason he was removed is because he was disrupting the event by not following a very simple protocol. That's the problem with the left sometimes, they let their emotions dictate their behavior. A little more left brain activity would have allowed the event to proceed.

Originally posted by Quantum_Squirrel
i was attempting to show you that even tho you have freedmom of speech certain situations call for certain rules to be in place .. my above post is a metaphor not a statement of fact!!

first of all, that was not a metaphor. I'm not sure why you would think it is, but that's off topic, so I'll dismiss it.

you seem reluctant to allow me my freedom of speech now don't you? if i differ from your view you have to call me wrong and/or illogical. why don't you do what i do and take all posts as they are .. i have gleamed usefull insight out of all the posts here .. and yes my fellow ATS'er even yours!!!!!!!!

so what part of that has anything to do with your freedom of speech? Because I disagree, I am denying you your freedom? You seem to be on the defensive, but I am not attacking you.

the question is do you ? or do you just like shouting people down ? wanna tazer me? that would shut me up no? :p

god i love this site!!! it gets the blood pumping and if u keep it in a positive way we will all gain as human beings!!!

again, I think you are misdirecting your frustration. please check my original response to you, and try to figure out where exactly you became so agitated

im cool as a cucumber.

Originally posted by tsloan
O.k. here's a twist... 630 WMAL in D.C. is reporting that this guy was linked to Alex Jones.... Anyone hear anything close to this..Cause if this isn't true then we may have the spin police already on the subject here in D.C. now if this news being reported here isn't true then this scary story just went to down right time to GTFOD some of you might understand what I just typed to others it has the "F" bomb in it.

[edit on 18-9-2007 by tsloan]

linked how? as in a fan? a news contributor? a sponsor?

I am linked to ATS... does that mean anything I do discredits SkeptikOverlord?

Everyone jumped on the Virginia Tech administrators for not getting help for the VT killer.

This is a great chance for the University system to institutionalize this kid to make sure he gets the help he needs. He is obviously mentally deranged, and the last thing we need is another potential mass killer.

What gives this mentally challenged kid the right to barge to the front of the auditorium, grab a mic and spew out his questions, without waiting for an answer.

Could I go the Emmy awards, jump on stage and grab a mic and start asking questions?

Could I go to a football game, run to the 50 yd line with a bullhorn and start asking questions?

Could I barge into a Mosque, grab a mic, and start asking Muslims why they consider a child molestor to be their prophet?

Why not? Free speech right? WRONG it's called disturbing the peace!

The ironic thing is that this happened at a Democrat forum!