Thanks for the positive remarks, Mr. Lear. Many good coments here. Howard Marks was indeed a character but dealt primarily in cannabis and derivatives like hash and so was not part of a more vast government business. If he had been a threat, he would have been gone. Marijuana, as the demonizers called it way back when, is far too bulky to provide the ratio of risk to profit.

You can smuggle a ton of grass in a small plane and a ton of coke in a couple of drums. The big money is now in heroin, as the coke market has steadied now that the crack phase has run itself out. The CIA made a bunch of money on that deal and now the massive harvests in Afghanistan have insured a bonus year for all concerned. The streets of Europe, and to a degree America, will fill with heroin, which will fall in price as it becomes more available.

It is all a game and the guys who go to jail were thrown to the wolves to keep the system cranking and all those naive DEA agents busy..when they are not busting Grannies with a pot brownie in states where it is legal. Imagine fields full of poppies waving in the sun and big strapping armed thugs with no mercy obey the masters of the game and bust medical users. Sick world for sure.

Originally posted by eyewitness86

It is all a game and the guys who go to jail were thrown to the wolves to keep the system cranking and all those naive DEA agents busy..when they are not busting Grannies with a pot brownie in states where it is legal. Imagine fields full of poppies waving in the sun and big strapping armed thugs with no mercy obey the masters of the game and bust medical users. Sick world for sure.

Don't sugar-coat it eyewitness86. We are on abovetopsecret.com. You can say just about anything you want.

I suppose Al CIAda have to get there extra cash from somewhere.
I'll bet someone has statistics showing increases in drug production in countries from other wars where the U.S. was involved.

Things like this get me bent out of shape and it's not the post so hopefully no offense is taken from this.What it is, is the lies and deceit.
On one hand a person gets thrown in jail for drugs yet it's perfectly fine for those in power to spread it around.
My faith in humanity slips everyday and i hope there is a time when the people have the balls to say enough is enough.
That's my rant for the day.

Thanks for the info John.

Michael C. Ruppert had quit a bit to say in "Crossing the Rubicon, The Decline of The American Empire and the Endo of The Age of OIl" about the black ops drug trait.

One story sticks in my mind from back in the cold war days, the CIA was shipping wite powder hidden in sugar sacks on rail cars and shipped from the east through Russia to Europe. Apperently one time the train broke down in a rural vilage somewhere in Russia...the short of the story is that the people stole what they thought was sugar off of the rail cars, and soon there after there were massive reports of heart failures and other health related problems among the people...apperently the people were putting narcotics into their coffee, thinking it was sugar...

Mr. Ruppert, worked in drug inforcement and found out a little too much apperntly, and had to leave the country...he now is lucky to have his life.

I'm not really sure about the peak oil thing, but any informed person has to be insane to think that money isn't being made on drugs for black ops projects.

John Lear said:
(The Nugan Hand Bank scam is how the U.S. financed the purchase of Australia from the Australian government).

Could you run this past me again John, this bit about how the US owns Australia?

And also, I note your concern about the drugs in Afghanistan but also note that your friends in Continental Air Services were involved with Opium in Laos. If they were indeed involved how closely were you involved?

Originally posted by Chorlton

John Lear said:
(The Nugan Hand Bank scam is how the U.S. financed the purchase of Australia from the Australian government).

Could you run this past me again John, this bit about how the US owns Australia?

Thanks for the post Chorlton, your inputs are always greatly appreciated. Sometime in the next few days I will posting a 30 page document which outlines the history of the U.S.'s purchase of Australia which began with the Nugan-Hand merchant bank (Australian Frank Nugan and American Michael Hand, former green Beret) trafficking arms and drugs and laundering drug money which financed the CIA operations in Australia and Asia.

The 'purchase' went into full swing with the CIA instigated demise of the Whitlam Goverment in 1975 and John Freidrich (CIA code name "IAGO') joining the NSCA (National Safety Council of Australia) as a safety officer at the State Electricity Commission power station.

I am working with Zorgon on the secret space station today but I will get this posted as soon as I can.

And also, I note your concern about the drugs in Afghanistan but also note that your friends in Continental Air Services were involved with Opium in Laos. If they were indeed involved how closely were you involved?

I flew 590 missions for the CIA in Laos between 1972 and 1973 as a pilot for Continental Air Services, Inc.. How closely do you think I was involved?

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by Chorlton

John Lear said:
(The Nugan Hand Bank scam is how the U.S. financed the purchase of Australia from the Australian government).

Could you run this past me again John, this bit about how the US owns Australia?

Thanks for the post Chorlton, your inputs are always greatly appreciated. Sometime in the next few days I will posting a 30 page document which outlines the history of the U.S.'s purchase of Australia

Well John. Ill look forward to that with much interest. I actually knew Gough Whitlam and find your assertion about his demise totally hilarious.
You firm belief in the power of your CIA defies belief

And also, I note your concern about the drugs in Afghanistan but also note that your friends in Continental Air Services were involved with Opium in Laos. If they were indeed involved how closely were you involved?

I flew 590 missions for the CIA in Laos between 1972 and 1973 as a pilot for Continental Air Services, Inc.. How closely do you think I was involved?


You tell me John, you were there. How closely were you involved.
Because if you were, it was despicable, nearly as despicable as Gun Running.

Originally posted by johnlear
I flew 590 missions for the CIA in Laos between 1972 and 1973 as a pilot for Continental Air Services, Inc.. How closely do you think I was involved?

Not to pile on, but as I was reading this thread I was wondering the exact same thing...

I read an awesome analysis (and I should say now that I don't remember the title or the author, just that it was a woman's name and that she had a some kind of economics back ground) of the illegal drug trade. It showed numbers and maths and pretty much summed up if it were legalized, it would destroy the US economy (this was all based on numbers for cocaine). It also mentioned (as did someone else in this thread) that the pot was just icing on the cake, not a real money maker, but along for the ride.

I really can't imagine that the opium numbers are all that much different.

Cocaine Cowboys is an awesome documentary on the 80's that shows the rise to power of various Florida suppliers. The monies involved are out of control!

I know this thread is about opium, but the analogy is clear. Different product, same operations.

Originally posted by Chorlton

You tell me John, you were there. How closely were you involved.
Because if you were, it was despicable, nearly as despicable as Gun Running.

Thanks for the post Chorlton, your input is genuinely appreciated.

Tell me, in those many years as a musician traveling all over the world were you chewing celery stalks for entertainment?

Thanks again for the post.

Originally posted by Chorlton

You tell me John, you were there. How closely were you involved.
Because if you were, it was despicable, nearly as despicable as Gun Running.

hey chorlton, here is something you never heard of, but think about it:

Dont hate the player, hate the game.

John Lear is a good man and we are lucky he is here with us at ATS.



[edit on 11-10-2007 by moderndayHanSolo]

[edit on 11-10-2007 by moderndayHanSolo]

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by Chorlton

You tell me John, you were there. How closely were you involved.
Because if you were, it was despicable, nearly as despicable as Gun Running.

Thanks for the post Chorlton, your input is genuinely appreciated.
Tell me, in those many years as a musician traveling all over the world were you chewing celery stalks for entertainment?

No John I was out looking at the local sights, at history, at any anomalies that might be local to the area, whilst my fellow musician were normally fast asleep, because I knew the bandwagon wasnt going to roll for ever and wanted to make the most of my opportunities.
.
Now could you answer the question please?

[edit on 11/10/07 by Chorlton]

Originally posted by moderndayHanSolo

Originally posted by Chorlton

You tell me John, you were there. How closely were you involved.
Because if you were, it was despicable, nearly as despicable as Gun Running.

hey chorlton, here is something you never heard of, but think about it:
Dont hate the player, hate the game.
John Lear is a good man and we are lucky he is here with us at ATS.

I dont hate anyone, other than drug pushers and certain other classifications of people
However, John started this thread and it IS about Opium and the US involvement in it so my question was on topic.

John has openly stated he was a gun runner and openly stated that many of his associates in the airline were involved in drug running also. I would just like to know whether John was also involved in this drug running, and if he was then would you still consider a drug runner to be a 'good man'?,
knowing the death and suffering Opium and its derivates brings to individuals, families and entire societies?.
I realise this is a contentious issue with possible legal ramifications so John has the option of keeping quiet or simply saying 'No' to that specific question, instead of posting totally unrelated matter.

John,

I have a question in regard to this old thread.

First off I must tell you it is great to read your replies and your articles. Your podcast on Nam was the reason I sighned up. It was the first podcast I downloaded....

How is Vegas? I used to go their on biz every year but now I am out of country!

Anyhow, what have you heard, or saw concerning LSD labs in decomed missle silos..here in the US?

Why the continued interest in this drug?
Where and how..if at all is it being used now?

[edit on 22-2-2008 by whiteraven]

Well this is my bit of personal experience... When I was in the army I went to Afghanistan twice, and our mission was burning down Opium farms, maybe offing some farm security and the farm boss if he openly resisted...

But after a while it started to make me sick, maybe a few of the guilty were dead, but we just ran through and burned the livelihood of about 400-500 people who were now out of work.

It was counterproductive on the 'War on Terrorism,' as they like to call it, and it pisses me off that my life was in constant danger for the sake of a cover-up.

We were performing a real duty as a front, to fuel the front that there is actually is a 'War on Terror.'

What do I know though guys, I'm still an infant at 21, trying to make sense of this weak excuse of a soup sandwich that we call our world.

Hello John
Thanks m8. I always knew this, and I'm sure our UK "government" is in on this as well dare I say a few more "Legitimate organizations/operations", absolutely no doubt about it, the USA/UK politicians have dirt, corruption and blood money on their hands, what great magicians they really are..NOT

It's so heart wrenching that so many of the masses are blind to these so obvious "slap in the face" dirt their own leaders are up to..

Oh well John lets hope more do wake up

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzgruntzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...!!!

Peace
The Captn