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Chávez deal to aid low-income Londoners

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posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:16 PM
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Perhaps this shall clear up something - from CIA World Factbook:


Cuba
  • Oil - production: 72,000 bbl/day (2005 est.)

  • Oil - consumption: 204,000 bbl/day (2004 est.)

  • Oil - exports:NA bbl/day

  • Oil - imports:NA bbl/day

  • Oil - proved reserves: 259 million bbl (2006 est.)

As you can see, the oil consumption exceeds the oil production in Cuba - so the help that Cuba receives from Venezuela is more then welcome and even if all the people living in Cuba do not have cars, I am sure that there are many public transport vehicles and ships and other vehicles which need oil in order to keep the transportation of Cuba in move. And let us not forget that Venezuela produces around 3,081,000 bbl/day and Cuba does not. So what is your problem dude? Why you fighting so hard to paint this gesture of Chavez as an action of pure Evil?




posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:16 PM
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Here is some more in this deal.


In exchange for up to $32m-worth of diesel oil, intended to subsidise bus travel in London for the poor (defined as those on income support), the Greater London Authority will provide its expertise to the Venezuelan government on a wide range of projects, from transport to housing, and from cleaning up rivers to the promotion of tourism.

balafria.wordpress.com...

Appart from that Chavez is spreading an image of him "giving out to poor people in the world"....Communists tend to do that, and since Chavez has as a mentor another Communist dictator and Chavez himself has stated he is a Communist, this is nothing more than propaganda from a "Communist" as shots was so kind to remind us.

I am glad at least one or two people don't fall in for these lies in these forums....



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:19 PM
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reply to post by shots
 

So if YOU needed oil to survive and to drive your car and to warm your house and it was offered to you by a socialist leader of a socialist nation (like Venezuela) you would say NO? Well then my Friend, you shall freeze to death because of pride. And let us not forget, that pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins.



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:19 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
..................
So what is your problem dude? Why you fighting so hard to paint this gesture of Chavez as an action of pure Evil?


What is my problem? my problem is that some people are fighting hard to represent Communist dictators as good people around here, and since I have experienced some of the horrors of Communism i will fight against anyone trying to claim "Communist dictators are good people"...



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by Muaddib
 

Dude - I also lived in a Communist Dictatorship and I still think that it was far better then any rotten form of capitalism that is controlling this planet of ours today. The very ideology of people coming together for the common cause of ALL of them living in a better country, a better world is a complete opposition of the ideology, which teaches us, that an individual is more powerful then entire communities of people. So please, do not patronize me - you can fool people on this board, which have never ever even visited a socialist country - but you can not fool me with your commieparanoia. Get over it already.

And if you think that Democracy is a form of government, where people choose their leaders, then you are very wrong. Democracy is also a Dictatorship - only with elections. And if you think, that you can make a change by voting for your candidate, then you are wrong also. It is just the another head of the same dragon.

[edit on 23/8/07 by Souljah]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
And if you think that Democracy is a form of government, where people choose their leaders, then you are very wrong. Democracy is also a Dictatorship - only with elections. And if you think, that you can make a change by voting for your candidate, then you are wrong also. It is just the another head of the same dragon.


Oh i know you are a Communist, even though in the past you have claimed you are not in these same forums....and you have been working very hard to claim that even the atrrocities committed by Communist regimes were done by the U.S....

The form of government in U.S. is better than any Communist country has ever been, and the fact is that people in Communist countries have been dying by the hundreds of thousands to leave such Communist regimes and trying to reach places like the United States...so your claims are easily debunked by the facts....

[edit on 23-8-2007 by Muaddib]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:39 PM
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reply to post by Muaddib
 

Wrong my Friend. I am not a communist. I was once, when I was accepted into the Socialist Youth of Yugoslavia - but that time has passed here also. I am just an un-curable nostalgic and I have to admit, I do miss my former republic, where nations and nationalities of seven different republics lived together in almost perfect harmony. Sadly that time has passed and the brothers and sisters slaughtered each other in a brutal civil war. And I already know what you are going to say - socialism does not work; it works only when a dictator is in control, right? In any case, we are beyond the topic here, so I think we should get back to mister Chavez and his deals to the poor people of the west.

What form of government REALLY works only time will tell...

But the one, that teaches how an individual is more powerful then entire countries is just responsible for over 27,000 children who died around the world today. That is 1 child dying every 3 seconds. 20 children dying every minute. And over 50 million children dying between 2000 and 2005. Did the commies do that?

[edit on 23/8/07 by Souljah]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by Muaddib
my problem is that some people are fighting hard to represent Communist dictators as good people around here,


You know What Muaddib I understand your point of view more than you think, because I know that you were one of the Lucky one that was able to get out of Cuba when Castro took over, and nobody can deny what Castro has done to Cuba.

But remember that Chavez has been portrayed and bashed for socialist and dictator so any good that he may have will never be taken into consideration.

Now When you said that people around here fight hard to represent Communist dictators as good people around here let me remind you that our own government does that quite often as long as it serve corporate American and our government agendas.

Remember our nation sleeps with communist countries, feudal monarchy and support dictatorships, everyday, we borrow their money, we sell them weapons and we even trust their goods to feed and serve the population of our nation.

[edit on 23-8-2007 by marg6043]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:15 PM
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reply to post by Souljah
 


Yes I sure would refuse it. You seem to forget Chavez is not the only country that sells Oil and I am proud to say I am a member in good standing of boycotting CITGO

www.citgoboycott.org...



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by shots
 

What if a natural disaster would strike and Chavez sent you food, supplies and general medical help? Would you refuse that too? Out of pride? Other man's help? Forget that he is a stinky commie - think of his, as a friend in need. You know - sometimes your worst enemy turns out to be a good friend, and your best friend turns out to be the worst enemy...



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:24 PM
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Riiight, and those 27,000 children dying everyday will be solved once there is Global Communism...the same economic system that has killed more people than all mayor wars put together...and that's without mentioning the people who were imprisoned....

I guess some people do miss a system that forced 7 different nations together, otherwise they would be imprisoned or killed....

I don't know why you keep trying to deny it... Between what you have written in your avatar, and constantly defending Communism and claiming the U.S./CIA did what Communists regimes did, everyone by now should know that you are a Communist...

Oh, i get it now, Communists are claiming they have a new system that is better than the old one. It is the same as Chavez "Socialism/Communism of the 21st Century"....

Then you have to read the fine print where he mentions Marx, and Lenin.... Although i don't know why he at times mentions Lenin since he is more in tune with "Trosky's Permanet Revolution"... He recommends Venezuelans and all people to read Trotsky permanent revolution...

The difference between Trotsky and Lenin was that Lenin wanted only to nationalize Communism, Trotsky wanted to export it to the world....make it a Global revolution....

Chavez constant ditriabe about exporting the revolution around the world and making it permanent etc sure goes along with Trotsky's writings....

I guess some people do miss the old days when only a few, those who worked for the Communist regimes" had everything they wanted or needed while the rest of the population were opressed and had almost nothing.... "The good old days" huh souljah?



[edit on 23-8-2007 by Muaddib]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:28 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
reply to post by shots
 


I think Shots have the right to boycott any country that he feels deserve it, I have not problem with that.

But should we boycott China goods for been communist after all our markets are full of their goods, we borrow their money to support our wars and economy.

How about Saudi's oil after all they are a feudal monarchy.

And how can we sell weapon to countries like Pakistan when the leader that our government trust and support ran a brutal coup to establish a dictatorship.

I guess when it comes to supporting communist countries and dictatorship as long as they do not get in the bad side of corporate American like Chavez they are just fine.



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:35 PM
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reply to post by Muaddib
 

You just do not get it, do you? You created me. And I created you. I am the other side of the same coin, we both are using. You always bring up the bad light of communism - and I do the opposite. This is an endless tango dance and we can this on an each and every subject possible. Which is still just our opinion - which apparently could not differ more. And my point is, that as it looks no system is better and capitalism and communism is the same crap, only eaten from a different bowl. Capitalism kills people on daily basis and so did Communism. But one claiming, that one is purely better then the other, is just as blind as he want to be. There are many different levels of comparison of these two political systems and I think that in the end they both turn out to be equally good and evil. You know why? Because the people are greedy and evil and corrupt and proud and allow some pure idea to become rotten. There is always something good in bad and there is always something bad in good. You can not think in absolutes. That makes you very narrow minded. I tend to keep an open mind regarding almost anything. Including Yourself. But then again, I do not know you, neither do you know me - so we can do this endless tango dance forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and nothing shall change or move a foot to the left or to the right.

But until then - here are some latest news regarding Chavez and his aid, which just can not be ever accepted as it is - AID:

Venezuela disowns 'provocative' earthquake aid



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:46 PM
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Yeah souljah, i guess Chavez sending cans of food with print in it saying "Chavez is better than the Peruvian authorities" have nothing to do with the fact that Chavez is in fact trying to export his revolution around the world...and using any means to do it...even if it means taking advantage of catastrophes in poor countries......

You just proved my point...thanks....


[edit on 23-8-2007 by Muaddib]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 01:54 PM
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I suggest you watch this link that I'm providing. It's a excellent documentary and very interesting indeed.

THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT BE TELEVISED DIRECTED AND PHOTOGRAPHED BY KIM BARTLEY AND DONNACHA O'BRIAIN IRELAND, 2003 74 MINUTES

HUGO CHAVEZ ELECTED PRESIDENT OF VENEZUELA IN 1998, IS A COLORFUL, UNPREDICTABLE FOLK HERO, beloved by his nation's working class and a tough-as-nails, quixotic opponent to the power structure that would see him deposed. Two independent filmmakers were inside the presidential palace on April 11, 2002, when he was forcibly removed from office. They were also present 48 hours later when, remarkably, he returned to power amid cheering aides. Their film records what was probably history's shortest-lived coup d'état. It's a unique document about political muscle and an extraordinary portrait of the man The Wall Street Journal credits with making Venezuela "Washington‚s biggest Latin American headache after the old standby, Cuba

video.google.co.uk...

After viewing this movie, I came to the conclusion the Western media is unfairly targeting VENEZUELA, compare it to how the media is portraying Iran at the moment, It's all to do with the rich elite and the oil. You won't be disappointed by this film, I give it 9/10.




[edit on 23uThursday07/27/20 by paul76]



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 02:02 PM
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reply to post by paul76
 

Thank You so much for this documentary!


I shall go and watch it as soon as possible!

Kind of a movie, which our dearest member Muaddib would just love to see.

Thanks again!




posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 02:07 PM
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Originally posted by paul76
.......
After viewing this movie, I came to the conclusion the Western media is unfairly targeting VENEZUELA, compare it to how the media is portraying Iran at the moment, It's all to do with the rich elite and the oil. You won't be disappointed by this film, I give it 9/10.


Oh riiight...after watching a film that was edited by westerners who do not show the speeches of Chavez, you should actually hear what Chavez himself has to say and then make your own conclusion instead of relying in a "rigged film by certain westerners"....



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by Muaddib

Originally posted by paul76
.......
After viewing this movie, I came to the conclusion the Western media is unfairly targeting VENEZUELA, compare it to how the media is portraying Iran at the moment, It's all to do with the rich elite and the oil. You won't be disappointed by this film, I give it 9/10.


Oh riiight...after watching a film that was edited by westerners who do not show the speeches of Chavez, you should actually hear what Chavez himself has to say and then make your own conclusion instead of relying in a "rigged film by certain westerners"....


I've listened to what Chavez has to say, and disregard what the Western media has to say, I would believe what comes out of Chavez mouth to be more reliable than the media.



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 02:13 PM
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reply to post by Muaddib
 

One Question:

DID YOU SEE THE DOCUMENTARY?

Or is it just like before - in the case of Michael Moore's SICKO, where you shed a light upon all of us, what kind of lies and deceptions Michael Moore did spread in his pro-commie documentary, which spreads socialistic-propaganda among the free west world?



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
But I really do not understand the Eskimos. Aren't they cold and would like some free oil, to warm their igloos up? Weird...



I know this is off topic but...........

You do realize how insensitive and potentially racist this remark is? Right? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. I don't think you thought before you spoke.

Even though I'm not a Native Alaskan they have my utmost respect for what they have accomplished in Alaska. Native Corporations here are highly successful and motivated enterprises. Native Alaskans have no need of handouts. The welfare mentality is not part of their culture. That is one of the reasons I love living here. I'd had my fill of the give me, give me, give me crowd. Chavez offering them an unneeded handout was a slap in the face. People like Chavez do not understand people who's freedom is not for sale. I'm sure their are plenty of people he can buy elsewhere.

FYI -
We get a thing called the "Permanent Fund Dividend" annually. It can range from a few hundred to a couple of thousand. We are litterally Stock Holders in the State of Alaska. It costs more to live here so that is not a reason to move here. We can read and write and have evolved beyond cave drawings and hunting with spears
We hope to someday have indoor plumbing. We are getting a little tired of heating our "Igloo's" with Moose Droppings though. I'm actually thinking of bathing twice a month from now on.



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