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If I were an Atheist, I would..

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posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 05:12 PM
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Runetang,


Hey, looks like I may have hi-jacked your thread here, sorry 'bout that. Me and madness (and whomever else) could probably take our discussion into another thread... you were looking for atheists to explain their motivations for their posting/style. Sorry to take 'er to left field.

I'll be hitting the road for a day or so later this evening.... so she's all yours.



Again, sorry for the off topic banter... seems I took the bait then threw some of my own... typical stupid human tricks and all that. Anywho, good luck and God Bless. Unless of course you don't mind the segway, I'll check in when I return to see where she's goin'.

Regards.




posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by Rren


in america slavery was defended to its very end by christians (and ended by a person who was quite possibly an atheist), as was segregation...


Ended by an atheist, seriously? No, it was Christians who did that (MLK anyone.) Once again, cite your source.


Slavery is what MIMS was referring to, with Abraham Lincoln either a strong agnostic or an actual atheist.

Abraham Lincoln quotes on religion.



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 11:54 AM
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Originally posted by Rren
If you'd really like, I'll go through some posts of yours and put 'em up sometime tomorrow...


ok, i'll wait to see for personal attacks (this shouldn't count attacking public figures for the sake of comedy, because that isn't an attempt at anything more than getting a laugh)




Archaic?


yes, there are modern secular nations that you can look to



Source wrt to the Nazi government being Christian, thanks. And you skipped over A LOT of others, bubba.


and again, let's look at MODERN nations as a real arguement....
i love how you overlook the northern european countries that i presented..



Originally posted by Rren


in america slavery was defended to its very end by christians (and ended by a person who was quite possibly an atheist), as was segregation...


Ended by an atheist, seriously? No, it was Christians who did that (MLK anyone.) Once again, cite your source.


well, segregation was ended by a coalition of the secularists, the muslims, and the christians... i think that's what you're talking about




Ok, but you forgot to mention those "intellectually sound arguements[sic]"


diversion. address the arguement. secular nations: better or worse than religious ones?



Sure; except for the majority of the gov and population... I never claimed it was a theocracy. Christians are against such things, hence the laws they wrote and adopted.


the law of america is in no way founded on the christian religion....
it's in a treaty....
it's national law that our country is in no way founded upon the christian religion....



Fair enough; withdrawn.


thank you



So you say... all atheists are reasonable, by definition. Nice.


no, i said the foundation of becoming an atheist is being reasonable. i never said that all atheists are currently reasonable.




Ok, but I though we weren't going after them. Bet if they had a Stalin or a Pol Pot things would be just peachy, right?


no, but if they had the secular government of... let's say sweden.... they'd probably be a lot better off




I'm sure you're aware that's no longer true. If AIDS aint evil, what is it, good? Did he say that people inflicted with it are evil, no I don't think so. Perhaps a cite is in order here too.


no, he said that birth control is a GREATER evil than AIDS... i'll get the source later



You've admitted to having never read a single book. Your 'examples of IC' thread is a perfect example of how little you understand the arguments.


i understand the arguements, they all rest on logical fallacies.



Stem cells? New age? All of us, or certain advocacy groups. Do they get funding, madness? Do taxpayers have to pay for it for it to happen, madness.


...no, i was actually considering new age "healers" and how they're threatening to undermine the reputation of legitimate science when all they're providing is a touchy-feely placebo effect....

and tax payers are funding holistic medicine in britain...



Again, if you could supply something more substantial to respond to, I'll do my best. If it's off-topic, put it where it should go and give me a heads-up. Whom, in your learned opinion, is allowed a voice in these issues, madness.


the people allowed a voice are those that can support their arguements with reason.



With taxpayer dollars, madness. This research is going on, lots of places, even here in the U.S., no?


yes, and i'm happy it is. but there are those that threaten the possible cures.



Could you be less ambiguous, please. This research goes on without gubmint backing, no? How did you determine what is and is not a human being and what are these alleged "potential cures" that these new agey superstitionists have chucked away.


can it suffer?



Yes, typical naive atheistic utopianism, if only there was no religion everyone would get along. Rational; reasonable,... really?


i never said that... i just pointed out that religion is a driving force behind issues. sexism would still be a cultural issue.... but much of the cultural sexism is also aided by the religious sexism




PS,
Start school yet; how's Malta treatin' you?


nay, i start oct 1st
and malta is just fine



posted on Aug, 23 2007 @ 11:38 PM
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reply to post by runetang
 



Runetang, like I say about atheists and "debunkers" alike, they certainly do spend an awful large amount of time trying to disprove things that are "abberations of the mind."



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 03:48 AM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by runetang
 



Runetang, like I say about atheists and "debunkers" alike, they certainly do spend an awful large amount of time trying to disprove things that are "abberations of the mind."


clearly it's because we feel the need to rid the world of something that is quite obviously one of the most corosive forces on the planet.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 10:26 AM
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First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

-- Pastor Martin Niemöller


Even though this was written by a pastor, about the Nazis, it applies now, to atheists and agnostics and secular people in a world where religion is trying to overturn rationality.

THIS is why I speak out, because if I don't, the voices of the deluded tend to be the only ones speaking.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 10:32 AM
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Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
Even though this was written by a pastor, about the Nazis, it applies now, to atheists and agnostics and secular people in a world where religion is trying to overturn rationality.



Oh, so they are the "victims," eh? Interesting. :shk: Sounds like you have a persecution complex to me.

[edit on 24-8-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 10:38 AM
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We have reason to be paranoid. Rationality is under attack by the religious. The entire ID movement is an attempt to undermine science and bring religious teachings to people who have no interest in them.

I have a question for you, Speaker, if these subjects bother you so badly, and you get so sick of reading the atheist point of view, why do you continue to come to these threads?

Is it a compulsion on your part perhaps? Just can't look away? Or are you a part of the problem as well? You decry people posting what they think in every thread, but I notice you still post instead of ignoring us. What's up with that?



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 10:47 AM
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Originally posted by MajorMalfunction

Is it a compulsion on your part perhaps? Just can't look away? Or are you a part of the problem as well? You decry people posting what they think in every thread, but I notice you still post instead of ignoring us. What's up with that?


I decry ignorance,yes.. I was on a thread not too long ago that you participated in and you have a tendency of turning every thread into a pissing match. I wound up telling both you and the other person to shut up. Remember,? I am sure you do.

You like to personally attack people. Like you are attempting to do here with me. It won't work with me though because I will call your bluff.

You have a tendency to get completely off topic because you'd rather attack a person individually, rather than attack their stance. I find it rather amusing,really. Keep on, keeping on though..



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 11:43 AM
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SpeakerofTruth, MM hasn't put a single ad hom attack in her posts, i'd actually u2u her to cool down if she did.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 11:46 AM
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Madness, just about every thread she posts on tends to turn into a pissing match, and she has the audacity to say that I "attack" other posters... Nah, that's not going to fly.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 12:12 PM
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Anyway, back to the TOPIC!!!

Look, atheists have every right to voice whatever they wish. However, how is it that they think they can come onto a FAITH and SPIRITUALITY forum and not be scathed with criticism. Common sense would dictate that they are going to be criticised.

For example, as a theist, imagine me going to an atheist discussion board and spew my theistic beliefs. Would it be rational for me to expect to be unscathed by criticism? Of course not!!:shk:

[edit on 24-8-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 02:05 PM
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Speaker, I know the thread you're speaking of, it was one of AngelOfLight's false prophecies. If there was a problem, I'm sure the mods would have said something.

And, IMO, it seems to me that you are the one making personal attacks here, so I perceive this last bit from you to be a simple case of projection, which is more than common when an atheist makes a rational statement to a theist regarding what they regard to be superstitious nonsense. The rational post makes the theist angry so they say the atheist is the angry one when that's not the case at all.

Thanks for clearing that up. Now I understand the situation and can go on about my day.

And, BTW, this anti-atheist thread is in the faith forum. So it's OK for theists to post anti-atheist statements but we aren't allowed to come on and make our own case against the slander? I see how it works in your reality.

It has been said in many places on this forum that it is to discuss faith, theology and spirituality. It does not say that people who don't believe are not allowed to discuss them as well -- that, again, is censorship. You and a few other members are constantly trying to censor me, which leads me to believe that my posts are touching nerves right left and center.

Deflection and blame are common tactics people use when they don't want to answer the question directly, especially when it is a personal one.

Like the UFO forum, people who DON'T believe are also welcome to post in this forum. And I for one would appreciate it if you and some of the other sensitive theists would stop trying to censor me and telling me to go away.

If you don't like what I write -- don't read it. The Ignore button is your friend.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Madness, just about every thread she posts on tends to turn into a pissing match, and she has the audacity to say that I "attack" other posters... Nah, that's not going to fly.


then show me where she's used an ad hom attack, i'll readily admit that i was wrong about MM



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by MajorMalfunction

And, BTW, this anti-atheist thread is in the faith forum. So it's OK for theists to post anti-atheist statements but we aren't allowed to come on and make our own case against the slander? I see how it works in your reality.


Ahem,ahem, as I stated before, which you so conveniently forgot to mention:


For example, as a theist, imagine me going to an atheist discussion board and spew my theistic beliefs. Would it be rational for me to expect to be unscathed by criticism? Of course not!!



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
Speaker, I know the thread you're speaking of, it was one of AngelOfLight's false prophecies. If there was a problem, I'm sure the mods would have said something.

And, IMO, it seems to me that you are the one making personal attacks here, so I perceive this last bit from you to be a simple case of projection, which is more than common when an atheist makes a rational statement to a theist regarding what they regard to be superstitious nonsense. The rational post makes the theist angry so they say the atheist is the angry one when that's not the case at all.



You don't just do it here, MM... It is is almost invariably any thread you post on. You start telling people they are ignorant or superstitious and then expect them not to respond. You do it constantly. I have not seen very many threads where you posted that it hasn't turned into some personal pissing match, very few.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 05:06 PM
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Anyway, now that I have that off of my chest, I'll move on...



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 05:30 PM
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Originally posted by runetang

The difference mojo my friend, is that the threads started by a theist with atheist in the title such as this one is asking for atheists to reply, I just didn't expect all the negativity, and psuedo-disrespect.


No disrespect intended, i'll usually only reply in this forum to threads that have either asked for atheist input, or take a swipe at my beliefs (or lack of
).


Originally posted by runetang
But its okay, I take all that in stride, thats what us Christians do, get 'beaten on' and continue to walk and talk.


And that can sometimes be the problem, when Christians walk up to my door and then talk about their beliefs on my doorstep without an invitation by me, the homeowner to do so. A bit like your problem with Atheists appearing in your threads uninvited isn't it.



Originally posted by runetang
But the threads written by theists FOR theists talking about the positive aspects of theism to theists, looking for feedback from theists about the post, these are the threads that commonly get filled with atheist rhetoric which is unwanted.


As above, i cant stop Christians from wandering up to my door on a saturday morning and annoying me (without doing something illegal). Nor, it seems can you stop atheists from commenting in threads on a public forum and annoying you. Life's like that.




Originally posted by runetang
And this thread poster just seeks the knowledge of understanding as to why this behavior is exhibited.


The finger can be pointed in both directions.
I wouldnt be claiming the high moral ground on behalf of all theists on this board if i were you, some of those theists exhibit the same characteristics you are complaining about.

cheers mojo.



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by ChiKeyMonKey
If I were an Atheist, I would ask you why sharks and whales get capital letters and fish do not. Does your God not deem fish to be equal with other marine dwelling creatures?

Are you Fishist?

MonKey



Chikey!

You forgot my friend, Atheists never have to question whether the fish get capital!



Fish swim in the flow of things, and don't question their existance.

'Capital' is a human term to denote: "How much monies we can make on things."



posted on Aug, 24 2007 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i would start a thread attacking islam... however, there is really no point to doing it because it would be a disproportionate arguement.


Yeah, that and they'd call for your head, and who needs that nonsense?

Ha, see what I did there. I took one of these theist v. athiest threads and made it much more gooder with a stereotype.

And dude, for Logic's sake get an avatar. Do it for me, so I can better ID your posts at a quick glance.



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