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If I were an Atheist, I would..

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posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 10:58 AM
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If I were an Atheist, even if a former Theist, I'd be content and happy that I indeed have the superior knowledge, that there is no God. I would feel .. elite, I would feel special in terms .. not like super-special, but a step a. of the general thinkers who do believe in such a thing.

The absolute last thing I'd do is debate it for months on end, month after month, maybe years, on 'Theism' forums or Religious forums, attending to the threads and replying, creating argument and counter argument. I'd leave all that crap alone, I mean.. what an enormous waste of time and liberties. Think of all the other things you could actually be doing, like .. online or even offline, the possibilities are endless.

I'm just saying, I face a world everyday where people disagree with my ideas and beliefs. I keep those to myself most of the time in public, knowing these people dont agree, I dont start argument for the heck of it, to occupy my time, or to create a sense of enjoyment. I go home quietly with my beliefs. And I have never, in all my days, understood Atheists in that regard. It's like they attach to the mother Theist, like a parasite, kinda like those Sharks and Whales, they have that fish that stays directly underneath at all times, yeah. It's like that. Why dont you go swim for yourself, instead of letting someone elses swimming occupy your time to put down or talk against? Isn't that .. counterproductive in its very design of action?

And yes, God told me to post this, for the better of the forum, lol ..


[edit on 8/19/2007 by runetang]




posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 11:24 AM
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If I were an Atheist, I would ask you why sharks and whales get capital letters and fish do not. Does your God not deem fish to be equal with other marine dwelling creatures?

Are you Fishist?

MonKey




posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 12:05 PM
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Originally posted by runetang
The absolute last thing I'd do is debate it for months on end, month after month, maybe years, on 'Theism' forums or Religious forums, attending to the threads and replying, creating argument and counter argument.
[edit on 8/19/2007 by runetang]


So you're saying Athiests have no right to reply to threads and that other religious members on here do not argue in threads, only Athiests do? Wow, it's kinda like the pot calling the kettle black. Instead of making this thread, think of the other "crap" you could've been doing. *insert rolling eyes here*



posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 12:09 PM
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Originally posted by ChiKeyMonKey
If I were an Atheist, I would ask you why sharks and whales get capital letters and fish do not. Does your God not deem fish to be equal with other marine dwelling creatures?

Are you Fishist?


Bwahahaha Chi!!!! You made my morning!



posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 12:36 PM
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Ah, an attempt at censorship, wrapped up in a package of left-handed compliments.

Perhaps you should try being an atheist, then you will understand why we feel we have the right to discuss whatever we like, whenever we like, especially the hypocrisy and contradictions inherent in religion.

It seems to me from my "elite special" perspective that the religious types who complain about our skepticism have been frightened by an outside viewpoint that is rational and calls into doubt their own superstitious belief in the unprovable.

Unless this thread is an attempt to garner points, which it may be. Or to stir up the hornet's nest.

It is definitely one more attempt to censor people who have a right to speak, just not as overtly hostile as "Atheism is the Worst Sin" or any of the other clearly hateful threads started on this board.

Here's a great idea: if you don't like what atheists have to say about your religion, then don't read what they write. I tune out posts I find to be drivel, and I am not above Ignoring people who get on my nerves, at least for a few days, by which time I've usually calmed down enough to un-Ignore them.

Here's a thought and some advice for the theist censors on this board:

We non-believers aren't going away, we aren't posting in threads clearly designed for Christians to pat each other on the back and do mutual cheerleading, we only post in threads that are open to debate by the nature of the question posed, and we don't tell any of you to butt out of our threads.

Once again, the hypocrisy and childishness of the religious mindset is demonstrated loudly and clearly. I couldn't have done it better myself. Thanks, Runetang.


Edn

posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 01:06 PM
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This was brought up not to long ago (month or two ago). Quite simply, everyone regardless of there religious beliefs of lack there of are welcome to post in this forum. Look at the title, it doesn't say "the religious believers only forum" its called Faith, Spirituality & Theology.

If you like ill try and find the topic but basically none of those three words require any belief in a god or following of a religion to be discussed.

Faith can refer to any faith though here it referring to the belief in something (god(s)) without proof, it doesn't mean you have to have faith to post here it means you should post here if you want to discuss the forms of faith.

Spirituality also doesn't require any religious belief, though it tends to come with it, you can be spiritual without the belief in god (Buddhism as an example) you you can be spiritual without following any particular religion, you can even be spiritual as well as basing all your beliefs (forgot the correct word) on scientific fact.

Theology is simply the study of religion and you definitely don't have to believe in anything to do that.

So, there you go, simplified but correct as far as im aware. There is no requirement as to who can and can not post in this forum.

Also don't go putting all the blame on atheists for any arguments that happen here, is not like atheists are arguing with atheists is it.


[edit on 19-8-2007 by Edn]



posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by runetang
If I were an Atheist, even if a former Theist, I'd be content and happy that I indeed have the superior knowledge, that there is no God. I would feel .. elite, I would feel special in terms .. not like super-special, but a step a. of the general thinkers who do believe in such a thing.


really? because atheist don't have the knowledge that there is no god, that is a sheer assumption on your part. we simply have the knowledge that there is no proof for a deity, we don't absolutely know whether or not a deity exists, but we see no compelling case for the existence of it.



The absolute last thing I'd do is debate it for months on end, month after month, maybe years, on 'Theism' forums or Religious forums, attending to the threads and replying, creating argument and counter argument. I'd leave all that crap alone, I mean.. what an enormous waste of time and liberties. Think of all the other things you could actually be doing, like .. online or even offline, the possibilities are endless.


oh, now i see. you're trying to politely say "get the f out"



I'm just saying, I face a world everyday where people disagree with my ideas and beliefs. I keep those to myself most of the time in public, knowing these people dont agree, I dont start argument for the heck of it, to occupy my time, or to create a sense of enjoyment. I go home quietly with my beliefs. And I have never, in all my days, understood Atheists in that regard. It's like they attach to the mother Theist, like a parasite, kinda like those Sharks and Whales, they have that fish that stays directly underneath at all times, yeah. It's like that. Why dont you go swim for yourself, instead of letting someone elses swimming occupy your time to put down or talk against? Isn't that .. counterproductive in its very design of action?


raising of conciousness isn't a parasitic act. we do swim for ourselves, we live our lives like everyone else, we just argue against the dangerous concept of faith.



posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 10:14 PM
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Case in point, Runetang. It doesn't matter whether you're an atheist or not. What matters is whether or not you're secure with your belief system. In all walks of life, it seems to me that the people who are secure with who they are and what they represent are the same people you never hear from when the topic comes up. All of the people who seem to understand are off doing those more important things you mentioned, and the debates are left like table scraps for the uncertain masses to try and convince everyone else that their way is the right way so they can feel better about it, and not so alone in their beliefs.

I'm very secure with my beliefs, be they religious or otherwise. I guess that's why i'm not wasting my energy responding with the same contempt you did. Maybe you're just not enlightened yet!



posted on Aug, 19 2007 @ 11:28 PM
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Originally posted by The Cyfre
Case in point, Runetang. It doesn't matter whether you're an atheist or not. What matters is whether or not you're secure with your belief system. In all walks of life, it seems to me that the people who are secure with who they are and what they represent are the same people you never hear from when the topic comes up. All of the people who seem to understand are off doing those more important things you mentioned, and the debates are left like table scraps for the uncertain masses to try and convince everyone else that their way is the right way so they can feel better about it, and not so alone in their beliefs.


I quote this because, its how I feel about the subject, despite the poster misunderstanding me to begin with by claiming I had any amount of contempt.


Before I understood God and thus worship(religion) and realized that for me it was truth, I found it to be an idea or practice that was "old" and outdated, something from the past that needed to be done away with. A product of the times, mere folktale applied to real life with violent adherence.

Great, the gangs all here. It's like the thread maker becomes a punching bag! The funny thing is, I didn't say what you all act like I said, if you really look at the words. Thats what you want me to say, or anyone else for that matter, so you can get all up in arms about being denied anything that anyone else gets. We are all that way as humans, and we all exhibit that behavior sometimes, i guess.

But yes I am saying you all totally jumped the gun. I want to censor no one. I have no ill against Atheists. Yes I used to be one, for the majority of my life. When I was one, yes I had the internet. No I wasnt on belowtopsecret's faith & spirituality forum. No im not implying anything by this. Yes, its only the truth and what actually had occurred, and nothing else added. So I consider my own perspective enormous, only to the true extent that it is, even if you hate me, you'd really have to be me to understand, and the people who may say the same to me, I'd really just have to be them to understand what they claim to have.

But to the point, I want Atheists here. With no counter opinion theres absolutely nothing to talk about. It's just that you guys are so flagrant, since your belief is that you're against all the beliefs of this forum because they all end up in a "God" or "Gods", naturally you are going to be negative most of the time, if not all. And its okay to be the negative person, when you do it appropriately like .. butting in ever so often to allow everyone to know the downfalls to their plans and such, but to be in every single thread, ardently arguing with the poster or repliers, who may not even want a serious debate, probably just came to read and talk about something they like, and they get that taken away from them in the name of.. frikkin freedom i guess.

I used to be an Atheist and none of this stuff interested me. I saw all the Bible-thumpers for what I still see them as, a bunch of morons. Half of the Christians on the planet are extremely incorrect in their practices and ways, and they attach very, very many culturally-created taboos to the religion when they shouldnt even be there. Like the 'Conservative Right' when it comes to Movies, Music, and Media. That is not Christian, that is culture. But attacking me is not attacking that, attacking me is attacking someone who stands with you, beside you, despite your faithlessness, in agreement with you on that. And if you hate me just on sheer account of me being a Christian or having faith, then why is it not okay to hate a person on account of their lack of it? I don't hate anyone except murderers and crooks really, I certainly don't hate someone simply because of their belief, I dont even "hate" polytheists. According to my religion I should, but im not a mindless follower, I take what I know is good and not take what is obvious bad. Simple enough, I dont see why others cannot do that, my fellow Christians. But to the Atheists, you're blowing the horn for all the wrong reasons, I'm not calling for you to leave, I'm simply saying if I were you I would not be here and therefore find the fact that you are here abnormal. Abnormal being defined in this case as trying to discover something, figure something out, or to take it on the negative side, fill an empty place in your life or mind by shooting people down when they sing praise, doing so by questioning them insistently and always. I mean, I dont do that to you.. I have no reason to nor do I want to. And that is my only main point from my original post, its not that i dont want you here, id just think if you truly didnt believe in a God, you'd find the other sections of above/belowtopsecret more interesting, that is, unless you come here to bash people/things/or their beliefs.

And I spell Shark and Whale w/uppercase because I type like I speak, its a bad habit, but when you're used to emphasizing certain things and not others, it will creep in without consciously trying to do it.

[edit on 8/19/2007 by runetang]



posted on Aug, 20 2007 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by Edn
Look at the title, it doesn't say "the religious believers only forum" its called Faith, Spirituality & Theology.

If you like ill try and find the topic but basically none of those three words require any belief in a god or following of a religion to be discussed.

Faith can refer to any faith though here it referring to the belief in something (god(s)) without proof, it doesn't mean you have to have faith to post here it means you should post here if you want to discuss the forms of faith.

Spirituality also doesn't require any religious belief, though it tends to come with it, you can be spiritual without the belief in god (Buddhism as an example) you you can be spiritual without following any particular religion, you can even be spiritual as well as basing all your beliefs (forgot the correct word) on scientific fact.

Theology is simply the study of religion and you definitely don't have to believe in anything to do that.

[edit on 19-8-2007 by Edn]


Runetang you obviously missed this post. It defines THIS forum. To narrow it down even more for you, this part of BTS isn't just about religion.



posted on Aug, 20 2007 @ 08:30 PM
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Ahh so threads with atheist in the title, written by theists, shouldnt be answered to by atheists. Thats good, sound logic.

Would you like me to go through the forum and pull out all the threads started by theists that expect reply's from atheists.

I can think of 3 straight of the top of my .. If theists aren't interested in debating religion in this forum, why then start threads in which you wish or expect to get responses from atheists.


sigh



posted on Aug, 21 2007 @ 10:04 PM
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I'm interested in DEFENDING what I feel is true Monotheism, sorry. I'm not trying to debate anything. I'm open to discussing everything about every religion. Atheism isn't a religion though, so there isn't a whole lot to discuss about Atheism other than the core tenets of it, which are simple, and thats it.

The difference mojo my friend, is that the threads started by a theist with atheist in the title such as this one is asking for atheists to reply, I just didn't expect all the negativity, and psuedo-disrespect. This thread was me trying to understand WHY. But its okay, I take all that in stride, thats what us Christians do, get 'beaten on' and continue to walk and talk. That is, until someone strings us up or cuts our domes off for being in the wrong place @ the wrong time. But i guess all westerners have that problem so I can't include that in my gripe. For the record I am not being verbally 'beaten on', not implying it, just making a statement in general terms about Christians of past & present. Others suffer too. I can list examples if you don't believe that I believe that they do indeed suffer also.

But the threads written by theists FOR theists talking about the positive aspects of theism to theists, looking for feedback from theists about the post, these are the threads that commonly get filled with atheist rhetoric which is unwanted. Even I wont engage an entire thread of atheists on a purely atheist subject -- its not my ground, and im not looking for confrontation and argument. Its my opinion, and many others as well, that such behavior IS looking for an argument, and looking for confrontation, and being unnecessarily negative. However this thread is not looking for argument, argument came to it because argument0rs felt butt-hurt and decided to "engage" someone who was just trying to point out that there is a group of people being unnecessarily negative and starting unnecessarily arguments in threads in which it is not asked for, intelligent trolling if you will. And this thread poster just seeks the knowledge of understanding as to why this behavior is exhibited.


[edit on 8/21/2007 by runetang]


Edn

posted on Aug, 21 2007 @ 10:47 PM
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Originally posted by runetang
However this thread is not looking for argument,


I beg to differ, it may not have been deliberate but the thread title was negatively provoking to atheists, it basically says "Atheists get the hell out of our forum", in which I pointed out that this forum is for anyone to discuss Faith, Spirituality & Theology regardless of there beliefs of lack of.



posted on Aug, 21 2007 @ 11:05 PM
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Originally posted by runetang
[...] was just trying to point out that there is a group of people being unnecessarily negative and starting unnecessarily arguments in threads in which it is not asked for, intelligent trolling if you will. And this thread poster just seeks the knowledge of understanding as to why this behavior is exhibited.


[edit on 8/21/2007 by runetang]



(IMO) Insecurity; Anger. You see it in believers on these discussion boards and blogs, too. But, some of our resident atheists seem to be here to taunt and/or ridicule theists (usually only Christians,... almost exclusively.) One trick pony...

:shrug: Whatchagonnado :shrug:


People in the real world, at least in mine, tend to show more class. Believers and non alike. I guess that's the difference between an atheist and an anti-theist. Most sound more like they're just mad at God rather than not believing in Him.



Blah... I usually just stay out of the mud; try and keep my pearls clean (



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 01:18 AM
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reply to post by runetang
 





And I spell Shark and Whale w/uppercase because I type like I speak, its a bad habit, but when you're used to emphasizing certain things and not others, it will creep in without consciously trying to do it.


Now that is far more interesting than the whole God/God bashing thing. I teach English, (to kids mostly it's more fun) but I have never come across that one before. I think we might need to start a course of electric shock treatment where we wire your shift keys to a car battery! That I believe will soon put a stop to your rampant capitilization.

MonKey (Yes I know I do it with my name, but it's a name and a bastard form of English anyhow!)



[edit on 22/8/07 by ChiKeyMonKey]



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 04:40 AM
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Originally posted by Rren
But, some of our resident atheists seem to be here to taunt and/or ridicule theists (usually only Christians,... almost exclusively.)


we don't taunt or ridicule theists, we ridicule THEISM. there is a difference between attacking an arguement and attacking the arguer
that's because the VAST majority of the religious population on ATS is.... christian. i would start a thread attacking islam... however, there is really no point to doing it because it would be a disproportionate arguement. one side would have far too many people arguing against maybe 3 people.



People in the real world, at least in mine, tend to show more class. Believers and non alike. I guess that's the difference between an atheist and an anti-theist. Most sound more like they're just mad at God rather than not believing in Him.


i don't think any of us are mad at a being we don't believe in, i think we're just driven mad by how the religions tend to inhibit human progress



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 10:18 AM
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I have to agree with MIMS. I've been doing a lot of research lately on religion and religious thought, and I'm coming to see it as a psychic poison.

Without going off into a diatribe here about why I think it's a poison in ten easy points, I feel that it is the responsibility of any rational person to speak out against what they perceive to be a great problem in the world, whether it be poverty, HIV, teen pregnancy, or religion.

Religion causes far more problems than it solves, it pervades everything, and it's all man-made and imaginary.

Until people stop talking publicly about religion, I'm going to keep speaking out against it, as I perceive it to be an evil.

You can always put me on Ignore. Or your Foes list. I'm gathering up an awful lot of foes these days. it's kind of my new hobby.



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 02:02 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

we don't taunt or ridicule theists, we ridicule THEISM. there is a difference between attacking an arguement and attacking the arguer



Riiight. How exactly do you do that, madness? Shall we go through some of you posts? Nope, never attacking theists, but theism, riiiight. With the hyperbole and ad hominems you guys employ.... C'mon!





that's because the VAST majority of the religious population on ATS is.... christian. i would start a thread attacking islam... however, there is really no point to doing it because it would be a disproportionate arguement. one side would have far too many people arguing against maybe 3 people.



Ok. I don't "attack" them either, but for different reasons. But, you guys are saving the world from itself. Y'all remember what happened when the secular atheistic powers ran things? How'd that work out? People are people, regardless or their religion or lack there-of. Being a bigot never solved anything. The ironic thing is how much your rhetoric looks like evangelical fundamentalism... y'all just occupy the other extreme of the spectrum. Always watch out for the guy or gal on a soapbox.





i don't think any of us are mad at a being we don't believe in, i think we're just driven mad by how the religions tend to inhibit human progress


What progress have we Christians (Oops, you don't attack us, sorry) um, what theistic religions have inhibited human progress as of late. As you're such a fair and decent guy, please just attack Christianity.... so as not to have any sort of "disproportionate argument."



Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
I have to agree with MIMS. I've been doing a lot of research lately on religion and religious thought, and I'm coming to see it as a psychic poison.



What sort of research, specifically, are you talking about here?




Without going off into a diatribe here about why I think it's a poison in ten easy points, I feel that it is the responsibility of any rational person to speak out against what they perceive to be a great problem in the world, whether it be poverty, HIV, teen pregnancy, or religion.


Disregarding the "religion" you tacked onto the end there; do you think that religious institutions have had nothing to say about any of these issues? Whom do you think is the largest philanthropic contributor wrt these issues... not on blogs and boards, but in the real world? Atheists... you sure you want to go there? Definitely interested in this research of yours and what it has shown.




Religion causes far more problems than it solves, it pervades everything, and it's all man-made and imaginary.


No offense, but someone so insecure in themselves as to devote their avatar, avatar line, and portion of their signature line, and just about every post they make, to mocking the beliefs of others is hardly someone any reasoned believer is going to take seriously. Of course it's all just imaginary, and we theists just deluded and are what's wrong with the world... not an attack on the believer, but the belief.

Riiight.





Until people stop talking publicly about religion, I'm going to keep speaking out against it, as I perceive it to be an evil.



:pinky to lip: eviiiiiiilllll

Well, good luck with that. Onward and upward. Everyone needs a cause, I guess. Amazing how you 'herd of kittens' all seem to march in the same direction. Just me?




You can always put me on Ignore. Or your Foes list. I'm gathering up an awful lot of foes these days. it's kind of my new hobby.


Your new hobby? Ok, whatever's clever, I guess. But, no, I've never put anyone on ignore, nor do I have any "foes."


I am not nearly as upset about this stuff as you are... In real life we'd probably get along famously. Heck, I even like madness, and I've never seen a guy with a bigger "theistic"-stick-up-his-butt.


See, I can be funny too. Note: Not an attack on ATHEISTS but an attack on ATHEISM. See how silly that sounds now?

[wonders: why did I click on this forum again. Ima gonna regret this tomorrow, for sure] Y'all be good.


Regards.

[edit on 22-8-2007 by Rren]



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by Rren
Riiight. How exactly do you do that, madness? Shall we go through some of you posts? Nope, never attacking theists, but theism, riiiight. With the hyperbole and ad hominems you guys employ.... C'mon!


could you point out an ad hom attack that i have used?
hyperbole? hyperbole can be used without attacking a person.





Ok. I don't "attack" them either, but for different reasons. But, you guys are saving the world from itself. Y'all remember what happened when the secular atheistic powers ran things? How'd that work out?


i don't know... let's see how the scandinavian nations, holland and japan are doing...
oh, you meant the archaic arguements of stalinist russia, etc....
easy counterpoint to that arguement: nazi germany was christian, in america slavery was defended to its very end by christians (and ended by a person who was quite possibly an atheist), as was segregation...

but i'll go with the intellectually sound arguements...
which are doing better now, the religious nations or the nations with growing and substantial nontheistic populations?

oh, and america. that's a secular state...



People are people, regardless or their religion or lack there-of. Being a bigot never solved anything.


i'm not being a bigot. to be a bigot i'd have to attack people, hate christians. i love christians, most of my closest friends are christians.



The ironic thing is how much your rhetoric looks like evangelical fundamentalism... y'all just occupy the other extreme of the spectrum. Always watch out for the guy or gal on a soapbox.


yes, because we're condeming individuals here... ok, maybe in individual cases we'll point out a ted haggard or a kent hovind, but we aren't on the other end of the spectrum. we're actually REASONABLE... that's actually what makes us atheists in the first place.





What progress have we Christians (Oops, you don't attack us, sorry) um, what theistic religions have inhibited human progress as of late. As you're such a fair and decent guy, please just attack Christianity.... so as not to have any sort of "disproportionate argument."


well, islam has inhibited the progression of secularism in the mideast, it's quite obvious from any bird's eye view of the region.
let's see... christianity ...
AIDS, pope says birthcontrol > AIDS as an evil
science is being threatened by christianity (no, ID isn't a science, no matter how you paint it, it looks for a supernatural answer which is inherently unscientific)
medical science is being undermined by new age superstition
actually, science is just being threatened by religion.
stem cell research is being stopped by people who say we shouldn't use embryos THAT WILL BE DISPOSED OF ANYWAY for medical research! potential cures for thousands of ailments, just chucked away because someone thinks a few dozen frozen cells = human being.
in most parts of the world religion is still a driving force behind sexism
religion scares children to the point of psychological trauma (see hellhouses that some christians run for halloween)

i could keep going with this....



posted on Aug, 22 2007 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

could you point out an ad hom attack that i have used?
hyperbole? hyperbole can be used without attacking a person.


If you'd really like, I'll go through some posts of yours and put 'em up sometime tomorrow...







i don't know... let's see how the scandinavian nations, holland and japan are doing...
oh, you meant the archaic arguements of stalinist russia, etc....


Archaic?



easy counterpoint to that arguement: nazi germany was christian,


Source wrt to the Nazi government being Christian, thanks. And you skipped over A LOT of others, bubba.




in america slavery was defended to its very end by christians (and ended by a person who was quite possibly an atheist), as was segregation...


Ended by an atheist, seriously? No, it was Christians who did that (MLK anyone.) Once again, cite your source.



but i'll go with the intellectually sound arguements...
which are doing better now, the religious nations or the nations with growing and substantial nontheistic populations?


Ok, but you forgot to mention those "intellectually sound arguements[sic]"



oh, and america. that's a secular state...


Sure; except for the majority of the gov and population... I never claimed it was a theocracy. Christians are against such things, hence the laws they wrote and adopted.



i'm not being a bigot. to be a bigot i'd have to attack people, hate christians. i love christians, most of my closest friends are christians.


Fair enough; withdrawn.





yes, because we're condeming individuals here... ok, maybe in individual cases we'll point out a ted haggard or a kent hovind, but we aren't on the other end of the spectrum. we're actually REASONABLE... that's actually what makes us atheists in the first place.


So you say... all atheists are reasonable, by definition. Nice.







well, islam has inhibited the progression of secularism in the mideast, it's quite obvious from any bird's eye view of the region.


Ok, but I though we weren't going after them. Bet if they had a Stalin or a Pol Pot things would be just peachy, right?




let's see... christianity ...
AIDS, pope says birthcontrol > AIDS as an evil


I'm sure you're aware that's no longer true. If AIDS aint evil, what is it, good? Did he say that people inflicted with it are evil, no I don't think so. Perhaps a cite is in order here too.



science is being threatened by christianity (no, ID isn't a science, no matter how you paint it, it looks for a supernatural answer which is inherently unscientific)


You've admitted to having never read a single book. Your 'examples of IC' thread is a perfect example of how little you understand the arguments.



medical science is being undermined by new age superstition


Stem cells? New age? All of us, or certain advocacy groups. Do they get funding, madness? Do taxpayers have to pay for it for it to happen, madness. Again, if you could supply something more substantial to respond to, I'll do my best. If it's off-topic, put it where it should go and give me a .s-up. Whom, in your learned opinion, is allowed a voice in these issues, madness.



actually, science is just being threatened by religion.
stem cell research is being stopped by people who say we shouldn't use embryos THAT WILL BE DISPOSED OF ANYWAY for medical research!


With taxpayer dollars, madness. This research is going on, lots of places, even here in the U.S., no?



potential cures for thousands of ailments, just chucked away because someone thinks a few dozen frozen cells = human being.


Could you be less ambiguous, please. This research goes on without gubmint backing, no? How did you determine what is and is not a human being and what are these alleged "potential cures" that these new agey superstitionists have chucked away.



in most parts of the world religion is still a driving force behind sexism
religion scares children to the point of psychological trauma (see hellhouses that some christians run for halloween)


Yes, typical naive atheistic utopianism, if only there was no religion everyone would get along. Rational; reasonable,... really?



i could keep going with this....


I'm sure you could, this aint my first day here.

Regards.


PS,
Start school yet; how's Malta treatin' you?




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