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Micah says, in chapter 4, verse 5:
"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the LORD our God for ever and ever"....
It does not say EVERYONE. It says WE. ....If it makes a contradiction in your understanding, then there is an explanation in scripture. You can't throw one verse out because it doesn't fit in with what you believe....I know you know this.
"Babylon, bable/confusion, is being void of the knowledge of God."...NO. Babel simply means 'confusion.' What dictionary do you use?
NO WHERE in the bible does it say that OR insinuate that.
In fact, Nebuchadnezzar ended up anything but void about the knowledge of God:
Those are teachings of men. Satan means 'accuser.' He is NOT a serpent or a particular being or anything like that. Simply an adversary. I am being your 'satan' in this discussion, technically speaking....God NEVER says that the King of Babylon is Satan; in fact, He calls the King of Babylon (Nebuchadnezzar, specifically) his servant. More than once!
According to Jeremiah 27:7-8, ALL NATIONS were to serve King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon; until the time of 'his land come' and then still nations and kings will serve him...nothing is said at all about excluding Christianity (which of course DID NOT EXIST and was not EVEN foretold of the prophets).
There is one assembly that is God's elect - Israel (not the UN-sanctioned country but God's elect). If God tells us to do something, then I guess we better do what He says, right? WHATEVER it is... If we are to be over-comers (prevail with God), that is.
Until you understand who/what the 'beast' is, your theology is going to be confused. The beast is man -the sons of men. Ecclesiastes 3:18
Worshiping the man Jesus is worshiping the beast. We are to worship God only. Who is pure spirit. Jesus said so, himself.
The strong delusion. It is the division that religions cause. The ONLY way to peace is to cease division. God is going to give us an expected end:
"The daughter of Zion, will go to Babylon and be delivered from her enemies. How will that happen? God's elect will speak God's truth in Jerusalem (the Holy Spirit will speak through them) and "even the gainsayers cannot resist" Luke 21:15."........EXACTLY. Right now. These present days. The very days in which we wake and sleep day after day.
G-d puts enimity between its seed and humanity. Not metaphorical seed remember this is a living creature and so is Adam.
Leviathan is most assuredly not the Ha Satan of Job. Leviathan is not an angel, not in heaven, and mentioned in Job with no connection even with Satan.
What do you expect to happen when Jesus returns?
Originally posted by whirlwind
What are many of our churches teaching now? That we will be raptured away and that teaching goes against everything Jesus told us. There is no rapture.
We will be here and most will not be ready for it and will fall for the deceit of Satan.
That is the strong delusion God sends to see if we have read His letter, to see if the teachers have taught us.
Originally posted by jakyll
reply to post by MikeboydUS
Taking things out of context in the bible is one problem,the bigger one is mistranslation.I think too many people forget or don't realise that the books in the bible have been translated form different languages.they also don't realise that certain words or phrases in one language can not translate into another,as happens in this day and age.plus,when spending hours copying from one book to another, ts easy to misspell words and not have the correct punctuation.
Originally posted by whirlwind
I do know that but I also know that God does not contradict Himself.
Another scripture that throws up that same flag is Luke 14:26
The puzzle is solved when we go to the same scripture as Luke 14:26, as told in Matthew 10:37
So...to me, rather than that time being when everyone can following whatever god they choose, it means all will walk the path of our Lord and there will be saints, judges, elect (gods) there to instruct them.
Originally posted by whirlwind
Everything associated with it is pure confusion. The Tower of Babel, Baal, Bel - Evil confusion, much, if not all of it Satanic.
PURE, a. [L. purus.]
1. Separate from all heterogeneous or extraneous matter; clear; free from mixture; as pure water; pure clay; pure sand; pure air; pure silver of gold.
Pure wine is very scare.
2. Free from moral defilement; without spot; not sullied or tarnished; uncorrupted; not debased by moral turpitude; holy.
Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil. Hab 1. Prov 20.
3. Genuine; real; true; uncorrupted; unadulterated; as pure religion. James 1.
4. Unmixed; separate from any other subject or from every thing foreign; as pure mathematics.
5. Free from guilt; guiltless; innocent.
No hand of strife is pure, but that which wins.
6. Not vitiated with improper or corrupt words or phrases; as a pure style of discourse or composition.
7. Disinterested; as pure benevolence.
8. Chaste; as a pure virgin.
9. Free from vice or moral turpitude. Titus 1.
10. Ceremonially clean; unpolluted. Ezra 6.
11. Free from any thing improper; as, his motives are pure.
12. Mere; absolute; that and that only; unconnected with any thing else; as a pure villain.
He did that from pure compassion, or pure good nature.
PURE, v.t. To purify; to cleanse. [Not in use.]
(same as Babylon)
Babel, Tower of
The name given to the tower which the primitive fathers of our race built in the land of Shinar after the Deluge (Gen 11:1-9). Their object in building this tower was probably that it might be seen as a rallying-point in the extensive plain of Shinar, to which they had emigrated from the uplands of Armenia, and so prevent their being scattered abroad. But God interposed and defeated their design by confounding their language, and hence the name Babel, meaning “confusion.” In the Babylonian tablets there is an account of this event, and also of the creation and the deluge. (See CHALDEA.)
The Temple of Belus, which is supposed to occupy its site, is described by the Greek historian Herodotus as a temple of great extent and magnificence, erected by the Babylonians for their god Belus. The treasures Nebuchadnezzar brought from Jerusalem were laid up in this temple (2Ch 36:7).
The Birs Nimrud, at ancient Borsippa, about 7 miles south-west of Hillah, the modern town which occupies a part of the site of ancient Babylon, and 6 miles from the Euphrates, is an immense mass of broken and fire-blasted fragments, of about 2,300 feet in circumference, rising suddenly to the height of 235 feet above the desert-plain, and is with probability regarded as the ruins of the tower of Babel. This is “one of the most imposing ruins in the country.” Others think it to be the ruins of the Temple of Belus.
A city in the plain of Shinar.
Tower built, and tongues confused at Gen 11:1-9
Ba'bel. (confusion). Bab'ylon, (Greek form of Babel), is properly the capital city of the country, which is called in Genesis, Shinar, and in the later books, Chaldea, or the land of the Chaldeans. The first rise of the Chaldean power was in the region close upon the Persian Gulf; thence, the nation spread northward up the course of the rivers, and the seat of government moved in the same direction, being finally fixed at Babylon, perhaps not earlier than B.C, 1700.
BA'BEL, n. [Heb.] Confusion; disorder.
From H1101; confusion; Babel (that is, Babylon), including Babylonia and the Babylonian empire: - Babel, Babylon.
Babel or Babylon = “confusion (by mixing)”
1) Babel or Babylon, the ancient site and/or capital of Babylonia (modern Hillah) situated on the Euphrates
Part of Speech: noun proper locative
A Related Word by BDB/Strong’s Number: from H1101
Same Word by TWOT Number: 197
Originally posted by whirlwind
Those that don't teach rapture also don't teach what to expect in the end of days.
Originally posted by jakyll
reply to post by whirlwind
Only a few lines explain what you think will happen,lol.thats what i wanted,a personal reply,not quotes.sorry for not making myself clear.
I can tell you, in a personal way, what I believe will happen but then why should you believe me? Everything you are taught should be substantiated in the Word of God - everything. He is the one you should listen to, not me or anyone else.
I'm just curious y'see.i always think,well someone who has lived a good life,doesn't have a bad bone in their body,but their an atheist.will they suffer?
God tells us that we shouldn't judge - "Judge not that ye be not judged'" (Mt.7:1), so I don't know what will happen to that person. He also tells us that the only way to the Father is through the Son, belief in the Son. It is that person's choice, just as it is yours or mine.
"Whosoever therefore shall confess Me before men, him will I
confess also before My Father which is in heaven.
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not
to send peace but a sword.
And if Jesus is going to battle Satan,why does it have to happen on earth,why not in heaven? More importantly,will he really succeed.coz if you look at Jesus' last visit,he failed miserably at converting man into a loving and peaceful creature.instead he left scriptures,some so unclear,that man perverted them for then own ends.the bible says he will,but the bible says a lot of things....also,what will happen to those tribes & peoples of south america,indonesia,mongolia etc,who in this day and age still haven't heard of god almighty and Jesus?
Jesus battles here because this is where He will be. He will rule here, on earth. The battle is because of us, for us, God's children. There are also battles in heaven. "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels."(Rev.12:7)
Of course He will really succeed and many of us will help. It is our destiny as a Christian, the reason we were born into this world when we were.
Jesus DID NOT FAIL miserably. He didn't come here to bring peace but to defeat death - He did. Because He died for our sins we can, with repentance, be forgiven and have eternal life with Him. He did teach that we should be loving and peaceful but you must realize we aren't in heaven yet. Before there can be a heaven on earth full of peace and love those that will not accept God or God's ways will be weeded out. Again - their choice.
Those that have not heard of Christ will be judged on the type of life they did live. Nature itself tells one what is right or wrong.
Rom.4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
and if Jesus is meant to be a figure of peace and non-violence,doesn't it seem strange for him to come back and pass judgement on people in a forceful and violent way? does that not contradict who he is and what he symbolizes?
I've shown where He isn't supposed to be a figure of peace and non-violence. That is the goal but it can't happen yet. Every chance is given to those He "passes judgement on in a forceful and violent way" and is not at all contradictory. He first came in the form of a babe. He next comes on a white horse with eyes as a flame of fire, with a sword, clothed with vesture dipped in blood with armies. "He shall rule with a rod of iron and He treadeth the winepress of the fiereceness and wrath of Almighty God." (Rev.19:11-15)
It's not a game.
You do realize Lucifer is a Roman deity. I'll repeat a Roman deity. We might as well start translating everything as the name of Roman gods if we go along with that rediculous idea. Its Helel and only Helel. Helel is not a Roman god
. Helel is not even a god. Helel is a man who wants to be a god, thus by calling him Lucifer youve fulfilled his desire by making him into a Roman god.
Helel - In Canaanitish mythology, a fallen angel, son of Sahar or Sharer, a winged deity. Helel sought to usurp the throne of the chief god and, as punishment, was cast down into the abyss. Cf. the Lucifer legend. The 1st star to fall from Heaven (Enoch I, 86:1) was Satan-Helel. This is an interpretation offered by Morgenstern, "The Mythological Background of Psalm 82" (Hebrew Union College-Jewish Institute of Religion Annual XIV, pp. 29-126). However, in his Fallen Angels, Bamberger argues: "The more natural explanation is that the 1st star [that fell] was Azazel." Helel was head or leader of the nephilim (q.v.). Generally speaking, angels can have no offspring, since they are pure spirits; but when angels sin, when they "put on the corruptibility of the flesh" and cohabit with mortal women, they are capable of producing progeny. A case in point is the incident in Genesis 6. In the cabala and rabbinic lore there are numerous instances of such heteroclitish productivity. [Rf. Graves and Patai, Hebrew Myths.] (a)
I'll have to agree to disgree over the Helel is Satan assertion which I have already shown why I do not agree, but Please stop calling a figure from the a Bible by the name of a Roman divinity.
ASIDE from the rapture theology, they teach, essentially, the VERY SAME superstitious ideas that you are promoting as spiritual fact, on this thread. I hope I do not offend you but that is how I see it, just based on the fact that all of it is the same old blah blah blah that, when really scrutinized, is inconsistent with the bible and in and of itself!
"We will be here and most will not be ready for it and will fall for the deceit of Satan".....But if you already have, how would you know? There is no way to truly understand deception until the truth is EXPERIENCED. But those that are convinced that they KNOW, know NOTHING. Those that understand realize that they know very little, if anything at all, and even if that isn't literally true, it speaks more about the attitude of open-mindedness than anything else.
"That is the strong delusion God sends to see if we have read His letter, to see if the teachers have taught us.".....What teachers? There is but ONE teacher.
Do you KNOW anyone that understands things in exactly the same way that you do? NOT believes but understands?
At-one-ment is evidenced by unity in the spirit which is manifested as understanding in concordance without divisions and the strife of trying to prove one's point. And there is a difference between that and the effort of attempting to demonstrate the way....Psalms 118:8
Originally posted by whirlwind...I do know that but I also know that God does not contradict Himself.
Well, then, what is the difficulty with just accepting what those verses in Micah say?
I am NOT saying that we are not to follow our G.O.D. (the G.O.D. of Is Real - the LIVING G.O.D.)....What I am saying is that G.O.D. obviously has far more tolerance for things (and no doubt because HE SEES ALL THINGS in the heart of men) than we do!!!
I don't find any 'red flags' in the scriptures, these days. G.O.D. works them out for me and there is nothing I see in there as contradictory, muddy, or debatable as far as consistency. Anymore, that is.
Then COMPARE 1 Chronicles 21:1 with 2 Samuel 24:1.
"So...to me, rather than that time being when everyone can following whatever god they choose, it means all will walk the path of our Lord and there will be saints, judges, elect (gods) there to instruct them."....YET that is not what it SAYS nor what it implies. That is what it seems to YOU. It may be true but so far all you seem to be going on is what your own reasoning has formed in order to force understanding (or the idea of understanding.)
It takes time...a LONG time, of intense studying, to get to the underlying unquestionable unity of the biblical message. And it doesn't come by way of human reasoning
Originally posted by jakyll
reply to post by pepsi78
Welcome to the debate.
I'm guessing you haven't read the whole thread,or there are things mentioned you've just totally ignored?
Lucifer is actually a name for Jesus,he even calls himself that.
""""I am the root and offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.""""" (Revelation 22:16)