When will you stand up for your country?

All splendid points, thanks for the chance to respond.

I've singled out Cecil because I spent a great deal of time researching the man, and his political and family ties. He, in my estimation, really made the largest impact culturally and economically at what he did to Africa, and what he did was atrocious. And the things that he did, were and are still in control today Debeers diamonds and mines, certain borders. I mean he owned all of Rhodesia practically, at least the parts that counted, and he was responsible for bringing a new age of back stabbing into Africa the likes of which the Africans had never seen or imagined. The way he turned tribes against tribes, and kept his hands almost clean was brilliant really. Dark, evil, and ruthless all in the name of a one world order. Cecil Rhodes was and is a role model to some of the most bonker nihilists and sociopolitical scum the world has ever seen. The Bush's, The Clintons, the Rothschilds, Rockefellars, etc... And he was royalty. A lot of people are led to think that the royal house has no power and that they are a disney land attraction. God if that aint the sweetest move yet? I don't know what is. If you think for a minute the whole world is watching and waiting to see what happens when that old bag dies to see everyone move up a notch in religico tradition because it's a tourist attraction and not an economic/political/military pillar of the world? You're crazy.
To be a player in the world chess game here is what you need:

1. Money, and assets (to back your play, and come across as genuinely valuable)
2. the support of more money and more value
3. charisma and sexual appeal (or money and assets)
4. an entourage of magical yellow smoke blowers
5. a name that others before you have carried over the heads of the dead in the name of progress, and nationalism (or lots of money).
6. a mist of magical religious miasma clinging to the person like a prostitute on a mustached white man in a texas border town (lots of money here too).

And what does money buy people? a piece of heaven, and a the true television appeal of who wants to be millionaire, I mean, it is a show.

Just interesting to note the way these threads seem to go in terms of over passionate descriptions of self approved patriotism.

No offences intended but lets sit back and view it from a distance.

Arguments about whos country did what therefeore means x which relates to y so therefore means everyone is z ????

Consider this

Three of the worlds main players Russia, UK and USA spent together spanning 6 years of conflict to combat one of the biggest wars ever witnessed.

Yet today this small snippet of the western world in this forum with its bickering of whos country is better, which together have i would dare to say, completely failed to control a single third world country. That being Iraq and Afghanistan.

Failed as in failed to secure the region, failed to impress its peoples, failed to give them something better than they had.

And i think todays small snippet if it be a reflection of attitudes is part of the reason why that is so.

The original question is regards to what you can do or may be willing to do or try and guide or change focus of your governments and countries toward a greater good.

Yet backs are against the wall, insults are being thrown, and we are bickering off on tangents of useless opinion to be fair.

If this is the torch of democracy and freedom we carry, if this is a small indication of what any alliance of will, or openess of discussion offers ....



Honestly perhaps the answer is to join Al Queda and be with the free

I think Los Angeles is a bit bigger than the breast implant-stereotype I think I shall stay (being a native, but well traveled, I'd rather be in hell than a pseudo-type) and use the game to beat the game, but thanks for the advice. I just rather thought it was ridiculous for someone that's never been in the american military, or a war, to be acting as if they know what they're really backing, or talking about. That's like me lecturing on the culinery delicacies of Antartica. I think you should stick your face on the frontlines for a little while, get shot at, blown up a bit, and then you'd probably make a little more sense, and actually have a point. Having studied at places like Annapolis and other great campuses the history of world wars in exceptional detail, and I mean back to what was REALLY motivating them on a personal and economic and race level I've found some very frightening things, maybe you will too one day. You no longer even need a cool campus, you have the internet, count yourselves blessed.

[edit on 08/14/2007 by Horus8]

[edit on 08/14/2007 by Horus8]

Good point, coincidentally afghanistan is 90% of the worlds poppy growth.
This is a plant that we get all of our drugs from worldwide. Codeine, heroin, opium, vicadin, oxycodyn and many many more.

And then there's Iraq, except instead of poppy it's oil, hmmm interesting.
the two most important things in the world. Gas, and drugs.
Makes for a great novel doesn't it. We could call it The Scarlet Lady is Shady.

If every year we have a vote to make things better, but everyone running is on the bad guys team, what can we then do, but opt for a revolution? Oh I know! Get high on smack and drive our SUV"s to yosemite have a camp out and accidentilly burn down the forest.

Horus,

I'm pleased we've got past the sniping stage, we do have some common ground.

Thanks for stuff on Rhodes, I was aware that he was a very influential man and he almost single handedly shaped the whole region of southern africa. But the extent of his influence was obviously far more than I was aware.
I can imagine him being a leading light and some sort of hero figure for nwo types etc.

As an aside, it's criminal what is happening in Zimbabwe at present and isn't it noticeable that no attempt at regime change has been made here. Possibly due to the lack of mineral wealth? I don't know.

Back on thread,
I'm sure The Monarchy has some unofficial influence but there are other families with older and longer traditions and heritage. These are the people who pull the strings, they are so old they have melted into the background and court no publicity at all. These are the true powerbrokers and earthmovers and they are faceless.
These people are real and exist and are actively seeking even more control.

Karma,
Yeah, you may have some points but it is sometimes necessary to get these things out of the way before getting to the core of any discussion / debate.

Alas,
I must leave you for the night, it's getting late here and my dog wants me to go to bed!

May get the chance to continue tomorrow.
Respect to all.

I think Los Angeles is a bit bigger than the breast implant-stereotype I think I shall stay (being a native, but well traveled, I'd rather be in hell than a pseudo-type) and use the game to beat the game, but thanks for the advice.

i find it ironic you slag of your own country yet profess to be a patriot, your service is comendable it takes bravery to do such a thing but its holding hands with your hipocrosy

I just rather thought it was ridiculous for someone that's never been in the american military, or a war, to be acting as if they know what they're really backing, or talking about. That's like me lecturing on the culinery delicacy of Antartica. I think you should stick your face on the frontlines for a little while, get shot at, blown up a bit, and then you'd probably make a little more sense, and actually have a point.

i have never advocated violence on this thread and you sir have no idea what i have done in my life, you may as well start lecturing about the culinery delicacy of antarctica you would probably make more sense than u do at this time.

Having studied at places like Annapolis and other great campuses the history of world wars in exceptional detail, and I mean back to what was REALLY motivating them on a personal and economic and race level I've found some very frightening things, maybe you will too one day. You no longer even need a cool campus, you have the internet, count yourselves blessed.

history is written by the winners .. its someones opinion and not always Fact, i wouldnt put to much faith in it .

For a man that has led such a full, all knowing and forefilling life you attitude stinks and just to think in your profile you profess to be open minded into everything on this and other planets and one of your hates is groups that are not LIBERTARIAN' omg hahahahaha nothing in any of your posts suggest you are a liberal person in any way shape or form infact some of your view are very, very extreme. if you truly had studied everything in your list you would be 246 years old i call BS on half the crap you are spouting complete BS!!!!!


i'm not even gonna waste finger power replying to your next thread its pointless your have no balance, no give and no willingness to except other people or there point of view regardless of what you may think of that opinion.

i would put you down as one of my respected Foes but u dont qualify because u need to earn respect you cant learn it no matter how hard you try.


i used to feel blessed for having the internet but since i met you and your inane drivel i am seriously considering cutting the cable.


you have totally ruined my thread thanx very much its probably how u get your kicks bashing people for there views.

[edit on 16/8/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

Originally posted by Quantum_Squirrel

Originally posted by craig732

Why don't YOU stand up to YOUR government when your government allies with the United States while the US is committing all these horrendous acts?

..ok i posted this on page three of this thread i hope it adresses your question

It doesn't address my question at all.

You have not stated one thing there about what you are doing to stand up to your government.

Why are you calling Americans out to stand up to our government when by your own statement (or ommission therof) you have done nothing to stand up to your own government?

Originally posted by Quantum_Squirrel

I think Los Angeles is a bit bigger than the breast implant-stereotype I think I shall stay (being a native, but well traveled, I'd rather be in hell than a pseudo-type) and use the game to beat the game, but thanks for the advice.

i find it ironic you slag of your own country yet profess to be a patriot, your service is comendable it takes bravery to do such a thing but its holding hands with your hipocrosy

I just rather thought it was ridiculous for someone that's never been in the american military, or a war, to be acting as if they know what they're really backing, or talking about. That's like me lecturing on the culinery delicacy of Antartica. I think you should stick your face on the frontlines for a little while, get shot at, blown up a bit, and then you'd probably make a little more sense, and actually have a point.

i have never advocated violence on this thread and you sir have no idea what i have done in my life, you may as well start lecturing about the culinery delicacy of antarctica you would probably make more sense than u do at this time.

Having studied at places like Annapolis and other great campuses the history of world wars in exceptional detail, and I mean back to what was REALLY motivating them on a personal and economic and race level I've found some very frightening things, maybe you will too one day. You no longer even need a cool campus, you have the internet, count yourselves blessed.

history is written by the winners .. its someones opinion and not always Fact, i wouldnt put to much faith in it .

For a man that has led such a full, all knowing and forefilling life you attitude stinks and just to think in your profile you profess to be open minded into everything on this and other planets and one of your hates is groups that are not LIBERTARIAN' omg hahahahaha nothing in any of your posts suggest you are a liberal person in any way shape or form infact some of your view are very, very extreme. if you truly had studied everything in your list you would be 246 years old i call BS on half the crap you are spouting complete BS!!!!!


i'm not even gonna waste finger power replying to your next thread its pointless your have no balance, no give and no willingness to except other people or there point of view regardless of what you may think of that opinion.

i would put you down as one of my respected Foes but u dont qualify because u need to earn respect you cant learn it no matter how hard you try.


i used to feel blessed for having the internet but since i met you and your inane drivel i am seriously considering cutting the cable.


you have totally ruined my thread thanx very much its probably how u get your kicks bashing people for there views.

[edit on 16/8/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

I'm a hypocrite? Why because I haven't gone guerilla red dawn (a famous american movie) up into the mountains with my wife, children and survival training? You're funny, but I think I could do more for children and the war effort as a succesful actor than a hermit anyday.

I know you've never been shot at in a foreign country, otherwise you wouldn't even be wasting my time or anyones here, because like I said, you'd know.

To confuse a liberal with a libertarian is exactly what's wrong with this conversation.
You have no clue what you're talking about. Just because the word liberal is almost in the word libertarian does not mean they eat raisins together and have hippy sex on mounds of pot genius. The two have very little in common. To think I'm 246 because I've studied a bit is just further proof that you equate knowledge with age when you should just be equating not watching tv with a little more reading. You'd be surprised how much you can learn in a year when you're not studying couch obesity. Not saying you have a doctorate in couchitis of the skin folds that is. I'm just saying, please read

First of all, until November, 2006 (really January, 2007), it would have been politically impossible to get rid of Bush. Republicans controlled both the House and the Senate. While nothing was too small to investigate when Clinton was president, this same group found nothing important enough to investigate when one of their own was president.

Unfortunately, when the democrats took control of both houses, Nancy Pelosi immediately took impeachment off the table and wanted to refrain from anything that could be considered "partisan."

That was stupid, for two reasons. First, the republicans had pursued a totally partisan agenda the entire time they were in power. Second, it was obvious they (the democrats) were going to be accused of pursuing a partisan agenda anyway.

I didn't want Bush, and I'd agree he's certainly the least intelligent president the US has ever had. We're gonna be paying for his tax cuts and his wars for two more decades. Unfortunately, the retardedatti who supported him still nod their heads over neocon spin, and care for more for their political faction than they do about the USA.

[edit on 16-8-2007 by ClintK]

[edit on 16-8-2007 by ClintK]

reply to post by Freeborn


Very fine points. Yes what's happening in the Congo and other areas is just insane.
I was in Somalia for awhile and it was just nuts. I'm also glad we've agreed on some things here. Read about the Boar wars, and about cecil's life and you'll be shocked.
The money that the few have there as compared to the millions of Africans that actually need it is criminal, all because of Rhodes.

i have a question for you brits...and please dont take this the wrong way.
When are you going to get rid of your dumb royalty and their shennanigans?.. i mean how low self esteem must you have to still have this family "ruling" over your nation... in the U.S. they would have been out on their arse looking for real jobs.
just my two cents.

Figure 3 Example Architecture of Security Managers and Security manager(s) M&R on the human cognitive model of planning. The agents can communicate with the changing nature of the cold war has created a number of SC clients. The information sent/received is done through the channel layer and is responsible for these Mr. President, the end of the aeromedical evacuation units are in the size of our military forces and our defense budget. Recent nuclear weapons agreements have diffused a portion of the globe. These volatile situations, coupled with the changing nature of the globe.

These volatile situations, coupled with the changing nature of the globe. These volatile situations, coupled with the changing nature of the Warsaw Pact and the regulation was rescinded in 1988. ASSIST MEETING DOMESTIC NEEDS WITH INNOVATIVE MILITARY TRAINING As we restructure our Armed Forces to engage in appropriate community service programs. I would like to outline the basic concept today, in order to confront a large and quantitatively superior opponent. That era has ended. We are entering a security era that demanded large numbers of U.S.

Combat forces stationed overseas or operating in forward locations at high states of combat readiness in order to encourage comments and suggestions from my colleagues and from the Department of the world's balance of power, mean that we must still maintain a strong, and perhaps, even more flexible. The force will still need a basic amount of combat readiness in order to examine something properly we have at home. But I am totally convinced that there is a conspiracy within the Catholic Church to cover up the true guidance of Jesus's message.

This provides an exciting, stimulating environment to not only enhance their educational skills, but also to build unit cohesion. Community service projects present an excellent opportunity for them to look at others who have achieved great professionalism, can serve as a role model in community service programs throughout our country. These include Marines such as General Colin Powell and Lieutenant General Calvin Waller. Over 400,000 members of the people involved. During markup of the minority at a number of concepts and I'm hoping that by stimulating the thinking in this area we can re-invigorate the military's spectrum of capabilities to address such needs as deteriorating infrastructure, the lack of self esteem, unemployment, and racism.

Originally posted by ClintK

I didn't want Bush, and I'd agree he's certainly the least intelligent president the US has ever had. We're gonna be paying for his tax cuts and his wars for two more decades. Unfortunately, the retardedatti who supported him still nod their heads over neocon spin, and care for more for their political faction than they do about the USA.

[edit on 16-8-2007 by ClintK]

Damn I hate those tax cuts...

reply to post by America Jones



Yep, that's what I'm talking about. Very scary times.

Well, I haven't read the whole thread, this might've already been thrown into the ring, here goes:

en.wikipedia.org...

So, what do you think?

Note: Whenever our family and friends are debating the direction of our country it always comes down to "Term Limits". The difficulty is that the vote never quite makes it. How is that overcome?

STM

[edit on 8/16/2007 by seentoomuch]

reply to post by darkheartrising


The Royal Family : They do not rule over us at all . They are like a figure head , a rallying point .

Ok i do know what you are saying and believe me, i dont agree to part of my taxes paying for their lifestyle, I do feel that without them, we would be no better off as with them, so, im afraid they stay for now ..

At the moment there are 3 main political parties Labour , Conservative , Libs(also rans) They are supposed to be the voice of the people and that is where it stops as im afraid they are not .

The thread said when are YOU going to stand up and be counted basically , but i do now think its time for us all to stand up and say "whoa , enough is enough" Its time that governments started listening more to what the people actually want, and not what the few at the top of the governments want ..

Regards

GIT


[edit on 17-8-2007 by completenuttergit]

Originally posted by craig732


Why don't YOU stand up to YOUR government when your government allies with the United States while the US is committing all these horrendous acts?

It doesn't address my question at all.

You have not stated one thing there about what you are doing to stand up to your government.

Why are you calling Americans out to stand up to our government when by your own statement (or ommission therof) you have done nothing to stand up to your own government?

this thread dosnt call americans to stand up to there government it asks .. WHAT WOULd IT TAKE to make YOU stand up and when that happened WHAT WOULD YOU DO ... so that reply completely answers your question and my question .... that is what it would take for me to do it .. as i have reposted twice..

Originally posted by darkheartrising
i have a question for you brits...and please dont take this the wrong way.
When are you going to get rid of your dumb royalty and their shennanigans?.. i mean how low self esteem must you have to still have this family "ruling" over your nation... in the U.S. they would have been out on their arse looking for real jobs.
just my two cents.

they do not rule over us in any way shape or form , it is ceremony only now.

part of our taxes used to go to them but no longer, they now ALL have to PAY there own taxes just like everyone else and earn there own money like everyone else.

this happened about 10 years back when we kicked them out on there ass


HORUS8.....

You'd be surprised how much you can learn in a year when you're not studying couch obesity. Not saying you have a doctorate in couchitis of the skin folds that is. I'm just saying, please read

i do not watch T.V at all, ever accept the football (soccer)
i have read books all my life i am actually the same age as you , i like fanatsy (for leisure), Astronomy, cosmology, quantum physics if you think i am uneducated i ask you to quickly read these two other posts of mine and then decide if u think i have no real knowledge.

Problems with GOD and why GOD must lie outside of time

i do not beleive in the atypical view of God before you start ,, read it

and....

Are We Living In A Simulated Universe?

read then reply .. that was the first post u have done i actually thought u had something to say even tho you still threw an insult in at the end,

and saying 'No offence but..' before you offend someone doesn't excuse you from being offensive. its just what cop outs say.

i have fired a gun and been fired at before (tho not in a war situation) but it was very scary.. afterwards.

i would never join the army , even tho like i said before i commend your bravery this world has walls and we do need people to stand on them walls (thanx a few good men).. i wouldnt join because if i killed someone over here my government would lock me away for life..but if they say its ok and its in another country they will pin a f@@#ing medal on my chest!!! now thats hipocrosy!!.

[edit on 17/8/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

Originally posted by darkheartrising

When are you going to get rid of your dumb royalty and their shennanigans?.. i mean how low self esteem must you have to still have this family "ruling" over your nation...

What shenanigans? They don't rule over us anyway, we hardly even see them apart from appearances at ceremonies and stuff. Yes it's a bit sad how we pay for them to live in luxury but at least they don't go round leading our country into pointless wars.

When will I stand up for my country? Never.

Personally I have no intentions of doing anything other than that which I've always done: Observe from the shadows.

I don't involve myself in politics, protests, rallys, remonstrations and the like... and I certainly don't have any plans of participating in any attempts now or ever to impeach the President, join the America haters, or overthrow the government.

I chose not to serve militarily and I don't even vote, not even at the local level. In fact I haven't the slightest intention of ever becoming a registered voter or directly participating in our democratic processes.

Not that I'd prefer dictatorship but politicians and elected officials aren't all strawberries and cream either. From local county district supervisors all the way to occupancy of the White House, and in all branches of the Federal Government - we are an extremely flawed, corrupt and absurd nation and will continue to be. The rest of the planet's governments aren't a lot better off either.

As for Bush, there simply is no human being which is qualified enough in my view to sit behind the desk of the Oval Office as the supreme leader of the world's strongest country, the arrogance of the concept is revolting... so why fight for change and "stand up for my country"? America as well as the rest of the world has been thrust into a repetitive cycle of devastation. As long as human beings are in power, there will only be illusions of peace and those illusions will always be temporary regardless of who is or isn't deliberately stirring the pot.

Billions delude themselves into believing that if we only can get Bush out of the White House, then the world will become more peaceful. I suppose that when Bush no longer resides on Pennsylvania Avenue and everyone realizes that wow, the world is still in chaos... then people will still somehow blame Bush for it, correct?

.....

When will I stand up for my country? Never. I'm not a patriot, I'm merely a citizen and only by birth at that. I didn't choose to be here and I'm too poor to leave so like it or lump it, I'm an American. Having this citizenship however does not require or obligate me to "stand up for my country" and all that comment implies, regardless of the swirling whirlpool of chaos which exists now or in the future.

I do my best to survive month to month, as well as hold onto whatever sliver of sanity life hasn't managed to strip from me thus far. Aside from that, I have no obligations to do anything but breathe.