John Titor's Time Machine Identified?, page 2
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reply posted on 16-1-2004 @ 02:20 PM by Satyr
Originally posted by iamlucas
ScienceGuy I'm with you. Reading through his posts, I do not believe there is any credidible debunking information.

Technically John seemed to know what he was talking about. As much as I wanted to believe, I still think a time travelling Corvette is rather amusing


000033548311*^.0

First it was actually a Camaro, not a Corvette. Second, the only reason his theory sounds logical, is because you're not a physicist. Did you read what Dr. Brown said? A real quantum physicist, having spare time, could debunk almost every aspect of his story. We discussed this in depth. Dr. Brown pointed out how unlikely his scenario would be. In his first appearance, the IBM model was also a different number. (I think it was a 5110, or something. I don't remember now)
This is another one of those things some people just want to believe....like religion. If you do believe it, no one is going to convince you otherwise, apparently. There are still idiots out there ignoring every single fact we picked to pieces, as if they were never mentioned. Our research spanned across 3 or 4 different message boards, which covered the story, or had original JT posts. I'll give you a clue, though. If you can find anyone else on the web claiming to be a time traveler who misspells the word "reveal" every time he uses it, you may have found your John Titor.

Anyway, if anyone has some space, I still have all the research info. I'll up it to your ftp or web space. 7.54M of original info, copies, and research.

[Edited on 1-16-2004 by Satyr]


reply posted on 17-1-2004 @ 12:57 AM by Satyr
He said it was a Camaro the first time. It was a while back now, but there was definitely two versions from him, as to what kind of car it was. The same with the IBM. You'd think that, if your only mission was to get a specific model computer, you sure as hell wouldn't forget what model number it was, would you? Do you need the 7.5MB of info I have? It's in there somewhere. It might've been on his Art Bell forum session. Somewhere, he specifically stated that it was a Camaro. It was in his first chat session that he claimed he was here to get a 5110, and not a 5100. There's a huge difference between both the cars, and the computers.

While I'm not sure if time travel is possible or not, I looked up every "prediction" JT made. For each that seem to have already "come to pass", articles can be found that were written before his "predictions". Here's the biggest ones that most people were crowing about.

----------------------------
CJD:

Mad cow disease was discovered in Britain in 1986, triggering a slump in beef consumption across Europe and the subsequent slaughter of millions of cows to try to restore consumers' faith in eating beef. Britain has recorded over 110 cases of vCJD since 1996, linked to beef infected with mad cow disease, and at least 100 people have died.

-------------------------------
CERN:

It was widely known as early as Aug. 1999 that CERN was in a "race to create a black hole".

www.kressworks.com...

www.gyre.org...

www.astronomy.net...

------------------------------
Unix bug:

This was known long before JT posted. Not sure exactly when, but 1997 was the earliest I could find. Many older articles have probably disappeared from the web, but I'm sure you can find older ones if you look. Actually, I'm quite sure this was known when they created they wrote Unix.

32-bit systems can only store a maximum of 231 non-negative seconds (2,147,483,648 seconds or about 68 years). Which means that 32-bit UNIX systems won't be able to process time beyond 19 Jan 2038 at 3:14:07 AM GMT.

One of the common solutions will be to switch to 64-bit architecture systems that can store a maximium of 263 non-negative seconds (9,223,372,036,854,775,808 [9.2 Quintillion] seconds or about 292.27 Billion years), which is about 22 times the estimated age of our universe!

Let's put it this way:
1. A 32-bit counter will expire in little over a year.
2. A 64-bit counter will expire in little over 2^32 years, or roughly the time the sun (not the Sun) is expected to expire.
3. The odds of your computer hardware surviving the forementioned event without reboot are very slim.
Any questions?
www.deepsky.com...

Any engineer who could do math (and what engineer can't?) knew that 32bit Unix would expire on January 19th 2038 at 03:14:07 2038.


------------------------------
IBM 5100:

The APL/Basic thing has been known for years. It wasn't originally released in 1975, but was widely publicized later. This is pretty easy to find also. IBM was absolutely anal about documentation, so you can bet your ass this was indeed documented.

Both BASIC and APL were available, the desired language being selected by a toggle switch. The modification he was referring to was probably something as simple as jumping the toggle switch.

www.cs.ualberta.ca...

www.ornitron.com...

www.brouhaha.com...

www.obsoletecomputermuseum.org...

www-1.ibm.com...

One of the most unusual features of the 5100s is that they could run BASIC or APL or both.

www.thocp.net...

www.old-computers.com...

You want more? I'm not wasting anymore time on this hoax. I spent a few weeks doing in depth research, and I came to my conclusion.

[Edited on 1-17-2004 by Satyr]


reply posted on 17-1-2004 @ 02:37 AM by hmmm
the portion below here is a conversation i had through email with the owner i guess of a website about the 5100. the website is www.brouhaha.com...

it was posted by satyr up there as a credible link. check it out.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> does it have the ability to read all of the code before then?

It can read IBM 3740 format floppy disks. These were not normally
used to store code for IBM's earlier computers. The floppy disk wasn't
even *invented* until the 1970s. Most of the code for earlier computers
was stored on 1/2 inch magnetic tape, and there wasn't any way to read
that on the 5100.

> is there some
> kind of modifcation that can be done to it?
>
> and do you think this statement is true?
>
> it was discovered (or at least known after testing) that the 5100 computer
> was capable of reading and changing all of the legacy code written by IBM
> before the release of that system and still be able to create new code in
> APL and basic.

I'm not really sure I understand what that is claiming. Certainly the
5100 can be used to read and change programs stored on floppy disk, but
it can't run those programs unless they are written in APL or BASIC.

There wasn't ANY system available in the mid-to-late 1970s that could
handle ALL of the legacy code that existed by that time. IBM had made
far too many different, incompatible systems. Even the IBM 370/168 and
370/195, the two most powerful computers they made at that time, couldn't
handle "all of the legacy code". They clearly had enough processing
power, but much of the legacy code was incompatible and would have needed
simulators.

Ask the person making this claim whether he really believes the 5100 would
run legacy code for these families of computers:

IBM SSEC
IBM 701, 704, 709, 7090, 7094, 7094 II, 7040, 7044
IBM 702, 705, 7080
IBM 7030
IBM 650
IBM 1401, 1410, 7010, 7070
IBM 1620, 1710
IBM 305
IBM 1130, 1800
------------------------------------------------------------------------
well draw your own conclusions from that.



reply posted on 14-4-2004 @ 12:34 AM by s.o.r.r.y.
Taken from dialog between JT and Ernie.

Posted by Ernie Vega on 02-08-2001 09:39 PM

Hi John:

I've read all the postings here and I sense that what we have here is a failure to communicate. It's been my experience that the majority of posters on this board are genuinely open minded, and ready to believe. Actually I'm intrigued by the escalating level of frustration being experienced here, and wonder where it's going.
...
10. If any what is the predominant religion?
11. Did Jesus come back?
12. Did we send manned missions to Mars?
13. What did we find on Mars?
14. Did we colonize the Moon?
15. Are we currently being bombarded by mind control devices?

And JT's reply:

12. No mission to Mars but we are working on it. There is a group working on the idea of gravity displacement to get into space but the calculations and error rate are very large obstacles to overcome.

13. We don't know what is on Mars yet.

14. We're not on the moon yet either. A great deal of technical effort is going into cleaning the planet up.

Now sure...this was set in the framework of questions regarding the future. But given the extraordinary info we already have now from the rover missions about WHAT IS on Mars...

What IS on Mars

...the response just doesn't make sense. What...everyone with any knowlege of the rover missions has been "destroyed" along with every piece of literature about this only 32 years after the FACT? Heck...it's past that many years from the 1st Moon landing yet I recall reading about it as well as what happened and the info derived from said trip. While this JT might be somewhat believable to a weak and gullible mind that does not take a good, close look at ALL the info, no wool is being pulled over this "sheep"! We'll see for sure when the all out civil war of 2K5-2K8 fails to materialize. That is unless of course, JT and "his sheep" go on a loon rage.

Anyone remember the prediction of the experiment, supposedly to happen within a year or so of his 2001 post, at the new (LHC) facility CERN's building that will lead the way to creating a microsingularity. The problem here is LHC, which has a schedule of completion for 2005, will still have to undergo a 2-4 year line of systems analysis before even attempting a collision!

Large Hadron Collider (LHC) to begin operation in 2007! (if all goes according to schedule that is...never does!)

You do the math! I guess JT won't be firing up that "time machine" after all with it's "security requiring a need for understanding addition and subtraction and his limited knowledge of such!

And here is his original prediction post:

The source of power for the C204 that allows it to distort and manipulate gravity comes from two microsingularities that were created, captured and cleaned at a much larger and ģcircularī facility. The dual event horizons of each one and their mass is manipulated by injecting electrons onto the surface of their respective ergospheres. The electricity comes from batteries. The breakthrough that will allow for this technology will occur within a year or so when CERN brings their larger facility online.

What's 6-8 years to a time traveler with a bad "memory" hmm?

Point is...I could go on and on about the hundreds of gaping holes which many choose not to see but what's the use? Fact is...this guy is on par with Dime Store Palm Readers with a Crossing Over with John "whatever his name is" following. A Charlatan and a Snake Oil Salesman feeding off the weak with a penchant for sensationalism and a "need to believe". This is a very entertaining story but it should reside on the fiction shelf under Urban Legends. For those that missed that, get a grip on reality, or soon, you will be out of a job and living in a trailer park wondering "What the hell happened to my life?".

That's my prediction!

CAUTION: JT "worldline" is a bit more than 2.5% off!

[Edited on 14-4-2004 by s.o.r.r.y.]


reply posted on 14-4-2004 @ 10:21 AM by ZeddicusZulZorander
Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
How did he keep track of the exact location, of a singular spot on the earth as time passed?

I don't recall his mention of this aspect at all... the most important aspect of "time travel".


Actually SO, he did discuss this very thing regarding holding a position.

Pamela: 14. what happens if the device messes up? Do you end up in space? if it goes offline and shifts ? does a hole open elsewhere?

Timetravel_0: Good question!!! That one almost never comes up. The hard part of traveling through time is not the bending of gravity but the plotting of your course and holding to the basic "position" in your environment. This is done through a system called VGL (variable gravity lock). Basically, the unit takes a reading of the local gravity and samples it during the "trip" in pulses. If the gravity is too far off, the unit stops or reverses itself to the last sample period where the readings were correct. If there is some sort of failure, the unit shuts down and drops out to where ever you may be.

Also:
The hard part of traveling to other world lines is just that. There is a system of clocks and gravity sensors that sample the environment before dropping out. Its called VGL, (variable gravity lock). If a cement block were there, the machine would “backtrack” until it sensed relative congruity to the original gravity sample. A great deal of time and effort goes into picking just the right spot since you can not physically move during a displacement.
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