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What was on Hitler's Ipod?: Hitler's HQ featured Jewish music

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posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 01:32 PM
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You really have to wonder sometimes. It also featured Russian music as well. This latest revelation comes from a daughter of a Russian intel officer who looted about 100 phonographs from the Reich chancellery in 1945.

news.yahoo.com...;_ylt=AgE_6GmmTI.Srj0MQscJuyRvaA8F

[edit on 8/8/07 by FredT]

[edit on 8/8/07 by FredT]




posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:46 PM
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Very interesting. Having studied the influence Jazz and Classical had under the Nazi regime in-depth back in college, this is an area extremely interesting to me. Hitler and his Gestapo knew that music had the power of influence over people, and since both Classical and Jazz were huge parts of mainstream popularity he never outright banned either form of music. In fact, Nazi propaganda minster Josef Goebbels used music to influence the masses just as much as any other means, and never actually put a ban on Jazz or music from other cultures, but established a means to control it. He would ban certain songs (primarily anything American or of non-European liking), but musicians would find ways around this. In particular, there are numerous incidences of French and American musicians simply re-naming American songs with French names, thus fooling the Nazi propaganda machine. Hitler and Goebbels knew that most of their troops were fans of either Jazz or Classical, so it appears that they instituted a policy of heavy handedness when it came to the music, but realized it's influence that they could garner for support by manipulating it.

It is very interesting to see that Hitler himself owned records produced by Jewish and Russian composers and musicians. This can shed a whole new light on the amount of hypocrisy that flourished in the Nazi party as well. As the article states it is intriguing to see Hitler in possession of such works by Artur Schnabel or Tchaikovsky, however it is the mention of Artur Schnabel which has most of my interest. Although Schnabel's works primarily centered around classical compositions by Beethoven, Brahams, and Mozart the general scope of his recordings lend them self to the Atonal side of music. Atonal music in Nazi Germany was derogatorily referred to as "Bolshevik and degnerate music" by the Nazi regime; so not only was Schnabel Jewish, but he was creating music heavily leaden with African and American roots. I find this facinating.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 03:03 PM
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Well, considering our source on this is a dead Russian spy who may have been a Jew himself, I think we can't simply take this at face value.

I don't support Hitler's racist philosophy but there may very well be some disinformation going on here.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 03:29 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Well, considering our source on this is a dead Russian spy who may have been a Jew himself...

...but there may very well be some disinformation going on here.


While all assumptions can have validity I dont think the above statement is true in this case. In fact, Richard Strauss, one of the the approved musicians during the Nazi regime was appointed as President of the Reich Music Chamber Orchestra. Strauss would regularly hire and play with Jewish musicians (sometimes against Goebbels consternation) in much the same way Benny Goodman would hire and play with African American musicians in the United States. Seeing as the Nazi party would knowingly manipulate music to serve the efforts of their propaganda campaign, it would not be a stretch to believe that they would do the same with Jewish, Gypsy, Russian, or American music. In fact, Jazz musicians such as Gus Viseur, Django Reinhardt (a gypsy himself), Jean Sablon, and others were regularly allowed to both entertain the German troops and even requested to play their music within the German borders. I have even heard reports and seen pictures of Jewish bands in the Concentration Camps who were allowed to preform music for the Nazi soldiers who watched over them such as the following bands:

Weiss Quartet
Erich Vogel's Dixieland Orchestra
Ghetto Swingers
Louis Markovitsch
etc.

Not only did Hilter allow it to happen, but he wanted it to happen as a means to control a bigger faction of people than he already had. It would not be all that suspicious to believe the works of classical composers such as Tchaikovsky or Bronislaw Huberman would work there way into the personal musical library of Hitler himself.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 03:38 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Well, considering our source on this is a dead Russian spy who may have been a Jew himself, I think we can't simply take this at face value.

I don't support Hitler's racist philosophy but there may very well be some disinformation going on here.


Yep, its highly suspicious. Why would they bring such a thing out know.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 04:57 PM
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According to Roger Manvell and Heinrich Fraenkel in Doctor Goebbels His Life and Death (1960), there was a party held upstairs from the bunker in the Chancellery Canteen on the last night of Hitler's life.

"..a message was received that Hitler would want some time during the night to meet the women who were left...to say his formal farewell...there was a dance in progress, but even this sad news of the furhrer's wishes could not stop the hilarious noise made by the men and women who did not know whether they would be alive or dead in twenty-four hours...The dance went on even after the silent members of Hitler's staff stood ranked in the Bunker at half-past two in the morning while the Furhrer solemnly moved along...stopped before each women and shook her hand. The noise of the dance outside went on long after the ceremony, and the messages which had been sent to get it silenced were disregarded."

The article says that the records were found somewhere in the Chancellery, not necessarily in the Bunker - either way the above passage, confirms that there were records in the chancellery so there is a good chance that this lady has got the Nazi Party's record collection.

(As the Fuhrer wasn't enjoying the music and asking for it to be turned down, I could surmise that on the last night of their lives these people decided to break out the good stuff and raided the cupboard marked 'banned' in Goebbels' office! If you were trying to live it up and forget your troubles, you wouldn't want to listen to Wagner would you??? Not too great for dancing either
)

Good find Fred T.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 05:10 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Well, considering our source on this is a dead Russian spy who may have been a Jew himself, I think we can't simply take this at face value.


Could be but to waht end? Cleary not an attempt to rehab Hitler's image. Its more of an interesting look at the psychology of psychos as it were.

I may be blind but I fail to see the motive of any sort of active disinfo campaign for this



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 05:11 PM
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Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by uberarcanist
Well, considering our source on this is a dead Russian spy who may have been a Jew himself, I think we can't simply take this at face value.


Could be but to waht end? Cleary not an attempt to rehab Hitler's image. Its more of an interesting look at the psychology of psychos as it were.

I may be blind but I fail to see the motive of any sort of active disinfo campaign for this


Alright, Fred...here's a potential motive: make Hitler look like a hypocrite.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 05:56 PM
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That's Not What I Heard

I read a item yesterday (Tuesday the 7th of Aug) which said
that Hitler was enthralled with the super-aryan stuff by Wagner!

but it was allowable/tolerated for Jewish or other 'inferior' people
to perform Wagners' heroic (for german master-race ears) music...

which is a slight more different than Hitlers' 'Perferring' or 'demanding'
that Jews or Gypsies play the music of Wagner.


if i'm wrong i will eat crow...

thanks

[edit on 8-8-2007 by St Udio]



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Alright, Fred...here's a potential motive: make Hitler look like a hypocrite.


Sixty plus years after his suicide? I'm not sure that there really is any motive here... I don't think Hitler's deserved reputation as the slime of the earth needs any more tarnishing.

By the way, very interesting thread. Thanks FredT and Jazzerman!

[edit on 8-8-2007 by ArbitraryGuy]



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 06:53 PM
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St. Udio, you are correct in that Hitler was a big fan of Classical German composers such as Bach and Brahams, and Wagner was no exception to this. In fact it could be argued that the writings of Wagner, who lived and died decades before Hitler, had a part to play in the rise of anti-semitism in Germany during the 1930's and 1940's. However, Hitler's own Gestapo and S.S. Officers were actually fans of music produced by Jews, Gypsies, Russians and others. The mere fact that this music was never directly banned by the Nazi's speaks volumes for the role Jazz and Classical music played into the collective conscious of the people. Had Hitler banned this music I believe he would have caused a type of revolt within his own nation, so instead he simply used it as propaganda for the regime. One way to get around this problem was to take popular Jazz pieces of the day and play them in a very rigid and conformed "Classical" way, whereas syncopation is kept at a minimal and rhythm and melody are influenced by this rigidness. By doing this, both German officers and the German public could enjoy the music of the day without believing this music came from what Hitler described as "the music of degenerates".

I can't say if Hitler actually loved this music himself, or even understood the roots of music in general (much in the same way today's neo-Nazi's prefer Rock music that has roots in the Blues...irony), but the mere fact that it was allowed under Nazi control does speak volumes itself.

Uberarcanist, I don't believe there was a motivation to make Hitler "look" like a Hypocrite...he did that quite well by himself. The fact that this music was never directly banned says quite a bit about the man behind the beast.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Alright, Fred...here's a potential motive: make Hitler look like a hypocrite.


Okay Ill give you that, but I mean its not like he had a reputation to tarnish eh? I mean What can you say about the likes of Hitle, or Stalin, or Mao, or Pol Pot. They all read like a sheet of used toilet paper. Little more on the sheet is not going to make them worse or any lower than they are.

For worse he is a major historical figure that changed the shape of the world. Any bit of info on him is interesting no matter how trivial IMHO



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 08:45 PM
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Because, sure, it's not like anyone idolizes Hitler...



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 08:51 PM
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Originally posted by uberarcanist
Because, sure, it's not like anyone idolizes Hitler...


yes, but for that crowd, you could get a picture of Hitler with J. Edgar Hoover having a dress up session and that wont change thier mind at all
.... man thats one youtube I don't want to see


But deep down I suspect the motivation or agenda is the usual one in stuff like this: How much money can I get for this stuff?

[edit on 8/9/07 by FredT]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:04 PM
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You cant hate a race without hearing its music first.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:45 PM
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Originally posted by FredT
Could be but to waht end? Cleary not an attempt to rehab Hitler's image. Its more of an interesting look at the psychology of psychos as it were.


I've read rumours before that Hitler had partly Jewish ancestry via his paternal grandmother. She lived and worked for a Jewish family and got a child with one of them. The most extreme version of this rumour is that the Jewish family was a Rothschild, and so Hitler is supposed to be descended from the Rothschild. Dunno what of all this is true or not though.

I'll try to find the info.

Edit: I hope it's not from some David Icke article that I read that.


[edit on 9-8-2007 by TheBandit795]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:32 PM
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The Bandit795,

I am aware of this rumor as well. It appears that Adolph's father Alois Hitler was the illegitimate child of a woman named Maria Schickelgruber, who was a cook for a prominent Jewish family named either "Rothschild" or "Frankenberger"; I have heard both names mentioned before. The idea was that Maria (Adolph's grandmother) had a child with one of the members of the Jewish household. However, to fulfill this piece of speculation, Adolph's father Alois would have to be born to one of the people in the Jewish family, and for this I can find no evidence. It appears that there is little evidence for this claim other than a brief mention of it by Hans Frank at the Nuremberg trials, but I have yet to find evidence of this either. Should I find anything I will post it.

Here are a few brief pieces of information I could find about Adolph Hilter's family on the internet (not the best resources, but sources appear to be scant on this topic):

Origins of Hitler

Holocaust History: Answer to Hitler being Jewish

It appears that there is little evidence either way, and the fact that Adolph Hitler had his hometown destroyed offers very little further information for historians investigating the matter. If it were not for the lack of evidence, it might be worth investigating whether or not Alois was conceived while Maria was working for the Jewish family, or if he was conceived prior to her employment with them. I'm going to do some research of my own to see if I can find anything.

[edit on 9-8-2007 by Jazzerman]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 04:32 PM
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Interesting read, according to sources the man who impregnated Hitler's grandmother still remains an unknown. It's not proven that hes Jewish, but then again its not disproved either.

Source: www.abelard.org...



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by TheBandit795
I've read rumours before that Hitler had partly Jewish ancestry via his paternal grandmother. She lived and worked for a Jewish family and got a child with one of them. The most extreme version of this rumour is that the Jewish family was a Rothschild, and so Hitler is supposed to be descended from the Rothschild.


I had heard about the jewish ancestry but not the Rothschild rumors. That would put quite an interesting spin on world events as it were. Perhaps an attempt at a NOW before the term was coined?


If the NWO was to take controll it would be far easier to so if you had the whole world under the Nazi flag with a puppet as thier leader.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:44 PM
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Hitler's parentage has been repeatedly investigated and most conclude that the stories of Maria getting pregnant by her employer are erroneous. Maria at the time of her son's birth was a 42 year old farmer's daughter. She may have been a fine figure of a woman but I doubt she was to a rich man's taste. I could be wrong. Five years later she married Johann Georg Heidler.

It is considered likely that it was either Johann Georg or his brother Johann Nepomuk Hutler that fathered the child. At various points in Alois' life it is recorded as one or the other. When Heifler run off and left his wife destitute, Hutler took the boy in.

Alois', third wife (I think), Klara, was his first cousin. They therefore as Catholics had to have permission from the Church to marry, which was refused. It was only when they said Klara was pregnant did the Church relent.

Hitler was their fourth child, three had died in early infancy from dyptheria. After Hitler they also had a daughter Paula who was mentally under-developed and suffered from learning difficulties. This could suggest that they may have been a little too closely related.

The rumours about his possibly Jewish ancestery arose through the son of his half-brother who was at that time living in the US and were reported in the British Newspapers. It was basically propaganda to undermine Hitler in the eyes of his people. His half-nephew was regularly paraded before the press in the US wearing his US Navy uniform.

en.wikipedia.org...

Klara did work for a Jew called Frankenburger in Graz, so it is possible that he was the father, but she was not some young german wench but a middle-aged woman...my opinion is that it is unlikely.

Hitler though is said to have taken the enquiries seriously enough to ask Frank to investigate them. Frank claimed that the family did pay Maria an allowance to raise her son and that there were letters that implied an affair between Frankenburger's son and Maria. The son was 19. Not buying it personally.



[edit on 9-8-2007 by KilgoreTrout]




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