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Starting from the Beginning

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posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 01:38 PM
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That's more than understandable. I was actually hoping for something in the way of an authoritative exhaustive collection of hardcopy public records that could be researched.

Certainly the various agencies that may have been responsible for any permitting, licensing, etc during the various stages of the centers existence must have records, and at least in some cases must be subject to some level of transparency standards.

I'm nobody important and would be more than happy to make a few phone calls and sound like a kook if need be. I'm not exactly in a position to just drop by New York to view hardcopy records, but if I could be pointed in the right direction I could probably come up with some way of reviewing them- perhaps coordinating with another conspiracy theorist in that area, or making a phone call to find out why a given resource, such as the one you found, might be incomplete and if there is any way to verify it.




posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 01:43 PM
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Originally posted by The Vagabond
I'm sure we've got somewhere around here somebody who knows a thing or two about the paper trails and red tape that would be associated with any work done on the trade center...

So how would we look into that further for confirmation and explanation (or lack thereof?).

Excellent question, but remember, you will still need to hunt down some of the more prominent demolitions experts. Those experienced in skyscraper demos and anyone who performs Optopyrotechnic Demolition, as per gottago's theory.

If the controlled demo theory is correct, some of these experts might have ties to unexpected people, and support the theory. I personally do not subscribe to the CD theory, but I certainly encourage thorough and meticulous investigations into it.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 01:57 PM
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I suspect that being able to identify who has done work in the trade centers would help with that.

I have a hard time believing that they could have gotten away with expunging ALL records. With any luck at all, the case would be that the records are just kept offline since the stereotypical model of a conspiracy theorist is a non-academic type who would be a lot less likely to track something down if he had to actually make a trip somewhere and navigate a record system that wasn't available on a computer database.

So perhaps then we get lucky- this is far out there but this is the kind of lead that you'd dream about when following an angle like this- perhaps we find out that fiberoptics were installed in the trade center at some point not to far before 9/11. So perhaps then we research that contractor and by some incredible stroke of luck find out that they had previous contracts that would pertain to optopyrotechnic demolition.

It's thin I admit, but perhaps easier than working backwards from a list of everybody who is qualified.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by The Vagabond
I'm nobody important


Nor am I. I didn't mean to sound like I was.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:17 PM
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I hope my comment wasn't taken to imply that you sounded arrogant, because you did not. It's quite understandable. I'm just saying that a college student from California can afford to seem as crazy as he wants in just about any agency in New York and never have to worry about being viewed differently in his trade or any other respect. In fact I think thre is a suspicion in much of the country that college students from California are supposed to be a little off.

[edit on 8-8-2007 by The Vagabond]



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by The Vagabond
I hope my comment wasn't taken to imply that you sounded arrogant,


No, not at all. I just wanted to say that I don't think of myself as more than the average bear or whatever.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:50 PM
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Originally posted by The Vagabond
The actions of Al Qaida since then have been inconsistent with a true enemy


Why, because another major terrorist attack on U.S. soil hasn't happened since then? What further proof does anyone need that Al Qaida is a true enemy...?

Over a dozen countries and organizations have officially labled them a terrorist organization, they've consistently spoken out against the West and encouraged a holy war against us. And despite multi-national efforts against them they've regrouped, rebuilt and regained their strength to a level not seen since pre 9-11. I doubt it's Osama's next birthday party they're spending all this time and effort preparing for...

Another major terrorist attack may not be immediately imminent according to reports but clearly their intent to inflict further damage on the west hasn't dissipated. Regardless of whether or not 9-11 was an inside job, I'm convinced that Al Qaida is most certainly a true enemy and will continue to provide evidence of the fact.



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 02:57 PM
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external source

..... I offer the following historical time-series analysis of the symbolism of the date chosen for the attacks, and you tell me if being familiar with our own History is necessary to identifying the root-cause of the critical events which shape all of our lives:

September 11th, 1922: The League of Nations signed a post-Balfour declaration regarding the Future creation of a Zionist state; noting that Zionism is a political movement derived out of the infamous Dreyfus Affair. The same group responsible for this declaration, eventually created the Council on Foreign Relations, thus one of the many connections to Dulles in relation to 9-11. To this day, the Council on Foreign Relations has influence over all of our political, media, and economic variables.

September 11th, 1941: Ground was broken on the Pentagon- noting that it was destroyed exactly 60 years to the day later.

September 11th, 1971: construction began on both the North and South Tower- that same day, Nikita Khrushchev died, and there was also the famous riot at Attica Prison, in New York. Noting that the Twin Towers were destroyed 30 years to the day after their birth.

September 11th, 1973: After Kissinger's Operation Condor set the scene, the CIA sponsored one of many coups, specifically wherein Augusto Pinochet used planes and missiles to overthrow democratically elected Salvadore Allende in Chile...

September 11th, 1991: The Infamous GHWB New World Order Speech, 11 years to the day before 9-11

September 11th, 1995: reports surface of a remote controlled plane that was crashed into the White House.

September 11th, 1998: Kenneth Starr, nephew of AIG founder C.V. Starr, sends his infamous report on Bill Clinton to Congress... and I would also note that both Hilary and Bill Clinton were involved the Mena, Arkansas drug smuggling operation, for over a decade prior to their Presidency, but Starr didn't report on that, did he?

September 11th, 2005: the State of Israel declares an end to their occupation of the Gaza Strip, also relating back to the September 11th 1922 root cause event.

All of these events are Council on Foreign Relations activities... so who runs the CFR?



First and foremost, I think the WTC fireballs were merely a diversion. I am undoubtedly one of the VERY few people who were tuned in to FOX, CNN, and MSNBC at 8:47AM that Tuesday morning, 9/11. I had the day off from work and watched the whole production. I say this because virtually everything that was reported between 8:47 and 9:00 has been either completely stricken from the record, or severely altered.

There was obvious deception on the part of the news networks during this crucial time period. When they broke what was to be the biggest story of the decade, the reports were sketchy at best. The concensus was that a Cessna had hit the WTC North Tower in an area that was devoid of humans. The damage was limited and the resulting small fire had been contained.

There was no reason to doubt the story, but this was certainly an unusual development. So I was curiously drinking my coffee as the out of focus TV cameras were coined on the WTC, with just a faint wisp of smoke visible.

They never panned down to the carnage at street level - and both news channels showed the exact same angle from a stationary camera with no accompanying audio. After later seeing video footage shot by various eyewitnesses (which show that heavy smoke was billowing from the WTC), the images being broadcast live to the masses must have been from a looped recording of some sort.

There were not any field reporters dispatched to the WTC by CNN or FOX. No colorful eye witness accounts live at the scene that you would expect. Nope.. nothing like that. They must not have fielded any phone calls from good sources, looked out the window, or removed the ear muffs and their heads from their collective asses that morning. At this early juncture of 9/11, there was a clear and present danger.

What happened next was incomprehensible. The news anchors on both CNN HN and FOX News encouraged people who worked in and around the WTC that it was business as usual. They SPECIFICALLY and repeatedly advised that employees of Merrill Lynch and Morgan Stanley that it was going to be a BIG TRADING DAY and they were going to miss out on massive commissions if they didn't come in to work. This struck me as extremely odd. Why did the NYSE even open that day?

Had I not seen this deception play out first hand, I would never have considered such an industry-wide curtain of propaganda to be a remote possibility. Instead of warning of the inherent dangers and urging people to stay clear of the WTC, they were actually giving the "all clear". Something was important enough to put more lives at risk while losing a little thing called CREDIBILITY. Who is responsible for the muzzle of secrecy that apparently was imposed on the media the morning of 9/11?

I guess we we're supposed to believe that - in this, the age of breaking news stories from highly competitive networks who thrive on being the first on the scene; a jet could roar into NYC striking a national landmark during rush hour without drawing attention. Bad news travels fast. Maybe it headed out across the Atlantic Ocean and had to circumnavigate the globe on 9/11, along with the scrambled F-15 fighters.

Amazingly, it wasn't until the second tower exploded that the ugly reality was revealed to the viewing public in a sick example of shock TV. Amazingly, NOBODY was on commercial break at 9:03 when the fireworks started. The shock value was so great that the media's earlier lack of news gathering skills went virtually unnoticed. Then, and only then, the news networks finally started their coverage of 9/11 while acting just as unsuspecting as the general public.

The NYSE didn't close until 9:32AM. Imagine how many people in the news industry ditched all their stocks! While 99.9% of the stockholders and taxpayers in America and abroad went about their daily lives, their holdings became practically worthless and a bunch of gold went missing. In another amazing turn of events, there is no recorded footage of the alleged jet that struck a section of the Pentagon housing financial records for the DOD. Not to mention [ENRON] WTC 7.


Mod note: please us [.ex] tags instead of [.quote] tags for quoting non-ATS sources.

[edit on 9-8-2007 by The Vagabond]



posted on Aug, 8 2007 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by The Vagabond
It's thin I admit, but perhaps easier than working backwards from a list of everybody who is qualified.

Not to be contentious here, but I'd think that working backwards might be the easiest place to start.

Optopyrotechnic demolition is new. There have probably only been a few applications of this technology since its patent in 2001, and thats only the patent. Since then the technology would need to be developed to the point of practical application. I would suspect that there are only a few places, maybe companies or universities, developing it at this point, with only a very, very few demolition contractors using it.

This list might be small enough, and accessible enough, that working backwards might give you the names to look out for. You also might be able to spot some key names, project managers, etc, who might pop up in lists like Griff posted. Otherwise, the names on lists like the ones Griff posted mean nothing.

1 Identify key players & developers
2 Attempt to secure more information about contracting in the WTC
3 Check all lists for names of key players & developers



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:12 AM
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Taking the lessons learned from 9-11, I have worked out a startup company business plan that is interesting.

The going rate for imploding buildings for demolition starts in the low millions of dollars.
Following this outline, you could lower your demolition costs, and charge high rates at the same time.

1. Dont use explosives.
2. Buy 50,000 gallons of jet fuel, ignite near the top, and the building will fall down neatly into its own footprint.
3. If there are 3 buildings to implode, just light fires in the 3rd building, and walk away.


Presto, time for cleanup, with all the steel in a neat pile for shipment, and all of the concrete and contents pulverized to dust.
Should work everytime. "Sarcasm"

[edit on 9-8-2007 by weatherguru]



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