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WOW!! Qigong magic..jeEEez, if this is real..Whew!!Must Watch Very Interesting!!

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posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by newyorkee
You know, I never said I didnt think there were people in mma that could defeat bruce lee,

^^someone else did then..someone said something along the lines of bruce being the toughest fighter to ever walk the planet...i will debate that all day

I will ask this, in terms of contribution to the arts, can you name a SINGLE person who has provoked more interest, or thought to the advancement of the arts. The gracie legend is dieing out, and as far as their contribututions, they have a long lineage

^^they do have a long family history but the single most important person as far as contributing to martial arts is in my opinion, royce gracie...now, royce is not the shizz like he used to and matter of fact, i wish he would retire and just train his kids...that said, the martial arts WORLD was forever changed after ufc when royce showed the world that there is more to fighting than one punch knockouts and such...martial arts will NEVER be the same...
before royce, there was very little in the way of popular grappling school(save for the other gracie academies)...
before royce, there was no training camps..people trained at a dojo..now, it is like an international community..for example, hayato sakurai lives in japan but he also comes to train in seattle..catch wrestling with josh barnett.
american top TEAM. brazilian top TEAM. TEAM punishment. TEAM gracie...it is forever changed and royce did that...

. In the martial ars community, people that go around trying to "prove" them selves are just jerks that need to meet someone who is a bigger jerk.

^^that is where you are wrong...it is all about testing yourself. it is very respectable(save for these new kimbo fights)...nobody getting beat to death. it's people wanting to test their skill. that has been going on for years and rorion started the ufc...it has nothing to do with being a jerk...you're way off on that man...sorry but you are...

I cant see why if someone succesfully avoids fighting his whole life why he would be seen as illegitamte even though he dedicated his life to the advancement of the arts.

^^^for about the millionth time, i can not call him a legit fighter if he has never fought....it is very simple..how many times do i have to say his fitness and his philosophy was amazing??
when people say that he is th best fighter to ever walk the planet, i have to debate that...can't be a legit fighter if you don't fight.

He was great man, not the best, GREAT. thats all. He was not sloppy. He was not a fraud. He did fight since if he hadnt I doubt any of the major figures of the time would have acknowledged him as being nothing short of great.

^^i agree, he was a great man..i do think he was sloppy though. i don't think he was a fraud either. i don't recall him talking like he was the best fighter ever, only the fanboys say that...thats not his fault..
as far as him fighting, yeah, i saw your post but that really shows nothing..


He is the elvis of martial arts, the king.

[edit on 9-8-2007 by newyorkee]

i also disagree with the last part




posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by Metalmind

I agree with you Boondock the whole Bruce Lee mythos is blown way out of proportion. The man was an actor. That takes nothing away from his physical prowess but it proves little of his combat abililty.

^^glad someone here is past the bruce lee roxors phase..i actually think he was too uptight about his physique and all that..using e-stem on his abs and stuff in the quest for the perfect physique...i woulda rather seen him fight.

The best fighters are MMA


^^at least two of us know

edit* i still say a huge part of the bruce myth was how he died and the fact that he died young..just as he was STARTING to become this MOVIE superstar, he died....he left behind a little bit of original material and people pour over it and then along with movies about him, they form these grand conjectures...

i mean, the one dude a few pages back tried to argue how bad ass he was by showing me footage of enter the dragon fight scenes.
i showed him a cro cop kick where he knocked a guy out with one high kick in 6 seconds, but according to him, that pales in comparison to bruce.

hahahhaah

[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 01:08 PM
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now, we have succsesfully goten that out of our system. Can we move on to the subject this thread was about. I have seen a few vids about qigong, after spending a whole night looking at them, I have to say I'm pretty convinced. I have always beed a proponent of the fact that the human ability to manipulate matter is rather limited in terms of understanding its potential. I think that there is something to this "energy" known as chi having a part in it, though I think there is more we are missing. Qigong is divided into so many types, that said ,it is almost impossible to fuse them all into a single dicipline. I look at them as being totaly different , though related due to common roots. I would like to see what forms of comparable excersizes in the western world compare in effect. I heard of the greeks having such practices revolving aroung the olympics, as body enhacement. I wonder if they borrowed from these asian cultures , or if in fact humanity has developed these practices independantly from eachother. I also read of turkish and middle eastern fighting diciplines sharing this common "iron man" training. Again, common roots, or new fusion?



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 01:34 PM
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I Dont see how this will improve humanity if you want to hear some truly amazing stories of what Qigong can do go to www.springforestqigong.com... and read the testimonials of the people cured of "incurable diseases" there are literally thousands of people he has healed and i have personally met the man and people he has helped heal and have also been helped get over west nile and lymes disease I believe he is geniune and he also works with Mayo clinic in Minnesota and has his own clinic around that area. He gives you the tools to help yourself heal and tune into some pretty amazing and hope inspiring spiritual vibes.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 01:41 PM
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just thought i would post this page as it shows testimonials to what qigong and spiritual practice can do for disease.

www.springforestqigong.com...



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 01:51 PM
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I dont think that medical qigong was the first. It seems like an offshoot of a more complex dicipline. It seems that fighting arts are always accompanied by healing arts with similar roots, or practitioners. I wonder which usually comes first. like the chicken and the egg, the destructive form or the corrective form????not that qigong originated as a fighting art, but I wonder if it originated from a healing art?


I have nothing but questions.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:17 PM
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I think our ability to manipulate matter is stunted by our bodies ability to handle energy and moral growth at least I hope so for our collective sake.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:43 PM
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ok, onto qigong/chi and all that.

i believe in it to a degree. i don't try to put it into a class. be it chi, quigong, reiki, chakras, energy force, etc....i don't doubt that 'something' is swirling around.
the human brain is so complex and can do so much #...
i have no doubt that via medetation and things like that, you can make your body accomplish amazing feats...things like slowing your heartbeat...controlling your breathing...energy conservation...

as far as things like this old man leaning against the wall using only his finger tip....i don't think it is so much 'chi' as it is concentration.
also, he probably practiced fo years and years, hardening his fingertips...it would help if he is double jointed so he can ge that little bend in there.
traditional stylists used to dig their fingers into drums of rice, sand, pebbles etc to strengthen their finger tips.

was that an amazing thing he did? hell yeah....i think it was more concentration/parlor trick though....
very light guy, the right angle, legs crossed, double jointed finger=maybe that is possible....know what i mean?

there are lots of people out there that can do crazy stuff and that don't mean they have crazy chi.

ever see that black chick from guiness that can pop her eyeballs way out of her socket? thats just something 'amazing' that she can do.

i liken chi to more of a sense of enlightenment through heavy medidation...i liken chi as helping one to absorb punches to the belly. they learn to control breathing and such. when to let the air out after accepting the hit.

unfortunately, this is one of those things that can not be measured..
i do not believe in people lighting stuff on fire with only their hands and things like that though....i think that is 100% scam.

all in all, i think all people would be suprised what we could do if we took the time to devote some serious concentration to it ya know



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:52 PM
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Have you ever ran your feet over a carpet and shocked someo one? What if instead of a carpet you could muster enough of an electric charge from within the body, and instead of a person you could light, lets say, gasoline. It has been proved that the residual static electric charge in the body is enough to light gasoline vapors on fire, definatly pure gasoline. If this is conceivable, how far off is a dry peice of paper. The question should be"where does that extra charge of electricity come form", though it was said before that it isnt electricity in the videos. What if it was something similar that produces a static charge?



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 02:59 PM
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I think it is all natural whatever it is much like an eel or something and i dont think the powers will be of much good i think the spiritual and healing aspects will be the things that our species needs to look into for survival and advancement



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by newyorkee
If this is conceivable, how far off is a dry peice of paper. The question should be"where does that extra charge of electricity come form", though it was said before that it isnt electricity in the videos. What if it was something similar that produces a static charge?


i think a dray piece of paper is very, very far off. gas is a whole different thing all together.

also, i am sure in PERFECT conditions, gas can be lit via static charge...

part of the reason i am very skeptical about all this is there does not seem to be any credible, scientific research into what is this?
i am not talking philosophical papers....i am talking about doctors and what not doing experiments or whatever, just like they do with everything else.

IF there was a guy that could really light something with only his hands, the scientific community would be ALL over it...i mean, the uses for that number in the thousands...
why do they seem to not pay attention to it?


i would believe that dude lighting that on fire a whole lot more if it was not 2 pieces of paper crumbled up and he did it on live(no delay) tv and did it back to back...then i would start digging some more...
till then, i think that far out stuff is a fraud.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:05 PM
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What about the "shocking" people part? Do you think that was just some sort of parlor trick? If it was nothing more than a trick than how would so many people go to him to experiance it. He cant have a wire runing from a battery in his banana hammock all the time?

[edit on 9-8-2007 by newyorkee]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by newyorkee
What about the "shocking" people part? Do you think that was just some sort of parlor trick? If it was nothing more than a trick than how would so many people go to him to experiance it. He cant have a wire runing from a battery in his banana hammock all the time?

[edit on 9-8-2007 by newyorkee]


yes, i think that was a trick too...i don't doubt that you could possibly send a small 'charge' through your body but not to the level that guy did..
he mentioned several times that it is NOT electricity, yet we are told the people needed to be grounded...well, grounded from what?
i don't think he could pass it enough so the people holding the person getting shocked could feel it too.
and still, like when they did the wand over him, i would have been more convinced if he was shirtless. only reason i see for him to wear a shirt is to hide something



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 03:53 PM
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Hi squiz,


Originally posted by squiz
Hey Paul, I'm with you, I consider Bruce to have been possibly the best fighter to have walked the planet.

I guess it takes an experienced martial artist to be able to realize just how good Lee was.

Most believe that one has to be noticeably muscular or BIG in order to be powerful. This is true in MOST CASES but not in ALL CASES. If one is an exceptional martial artist in having a high level of proficiency in speed and toning, as well as penetrating power, one does not have to be BIG in order to really floor an opponent.

With his shirt on, Lee did not look very formidable at all - a point I remember Billy Blanks of Tae-Bo fame making in an article.

I remember seeing a clip of Lee in I think a Longstreet episode. ???

He did a slowed-down extended backfist with his right hand. The muscles in his right arm as he executed the action were nothing short of superb. It is hard to explain. The muscles weren't large but they were so perfectly toned for the seemingly effortlessness of his technique - in harmonious conjunction with the rest of his body - that it was nothing short of a work of art just watching him.

Most of us just do a technique and it looks like we are doing a technique. Lee's body was so perfectly trained that he did the techniques like his body was originally designed to do them.


They say that someone who is good at anything makes it look easy.

Lee definitely had that.


Originally posted by squiz
I've also trained with James Demille one of Bruce's original students, he has some stories to tell. He was a golden gloves champion boxer in the air force, undefeated in over 50 matches, when they first met they had a bit of a run in and Bruce only 17 or 18 years of age played with him like he was a five year old. (his own words).

That is quite a story and one that speaks volumes about Bruce Lee.



Originally posted by squiz
I am currently training in James Demiles system based on Bruce's original teachings pre dating Jeet Kune Do.

Very interesting.

Feel free to recommend any DVDs you feel are noteworthy. As I stated previously, the one by Joe Lewis called Practical Jeet Kune Do is excellent. He even has a clip from his first full contact match that he won, in part from the techniques he honed (in having been already a champion) from Lee. For example, he used a double hook punch to knock down his opponent - something that Lee taught him and a technique that I have incorporated very effectively.

Oh...and that wonderful slide-side kick that Lee used


Which I also have incorporated over the years.

It has the power of a jump side kick - as in Tae Kwon Do - but you don't have to jump in the air in order for it to be powerful. I wish they taught me the hook punch and slide side kick when I took TKD as a teenager.

The above techniques have not made it into MMA matches yet. At least not the ones I have seen. They are awkward at first but unusually effective if you develop proficiency with them.


Originally posted by squiz
Bruce was a martial artist first movie star second.

You are absolutely right.





posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard
I guess it takes an experienced martial artist to be able to realize just how good Lee was.

^^^i think it takes an experienced martial artist to realize movie fight scenes are not the most accurate way to show off ones ability...
on that note though, i explained to some people on the sherdog mma board about how i was debating bruce lee(that debate happens once a day there) and how one guy(you) tried to show his ability via movie scenes....about 2,000 lol'd at that one...
thanks for that

Most believe that one has to be noticeably muscular or BIG in order to be powerful.

^^^agreed. this is another myth that royce gracie put to rest years ago...some of the greatest mma fighters active right now don't even weight train. it's plyometrics and anabolic workouts, etc.....6 days a week.


He did a slowed-down extended backfist with his right hand. The muscles in his right arm as he executed the action were nothing short of superb. It is hard to explain. The muscles weren't large but they were so perfectly toned

^^yes...believe it or not, many. many fighters have that type of physique....imagine that. he was very physically fit. he had an amazing physique....just how high of a pedestal do you put him on btw? you talk of his muscles as if its poetry...what gives


Most of us just do a technique and it looks like we are doing a technique. Lee's body was so perfectly trained that he did the techniques like his body was originally designed to do them.


^^is this frustrating for anyone else? 99.9% of the footage you have seen of bruce is from choreographed scenes that had multiple takes....now take that scene from enter the dragon and compare to his backyard workout....the technique is a lot different....
you are basing most of this on movie/tv footage cause that is about all there is. what esle? a few clips of him at ed parkers, a clip of the one inch punch, a clip of his screen test for green hornet, a clip of him doing fast low kicks to a shin and not even hittin a guy.....you put all this stock into lee based on that......ok buddy


Lee definitely had that.

^^yeah, in the movies...that clip i showed of him working out in his yard was mediocre at best. that was the stuff that was not choreographed and tken 100 times till the perfect one though, so, what do you expect?
it's not like the 'perfectly' executed high kicks in real fights that i linked eh?


That is quite a story and one that speaks volumes about Bruce Lee.


^^but can it be verified?

The above techniques have not made it into MMA matches yet. At least not the ones I have seen. They are awkward at first but unusually effective if you develop proficiency with them.

^^^there is a reason for that...in a real fight, they are not effective techniques...every now and then you will see a back kick but nobody does the jumping spoin kicks and all that jaz. it does NOT work and in a real fight it leaves you vulnerable.


you know, i don't know you or your 'persona' on here but i almost think you are doing nothing but trolling this thread with all this bruce lee crap, spewing stuff you know nothing about.

those kicks have not made their way into mma YET...dude, those kicks don't work in real fights......
i think you watch too much walker texas ranger.

for fun though, where/when have you encorporated these techniques effectively, or at all.
sanctioned fights? backyard brawls? demo's? what


edit* for effect, jumping side kicks, lol



this one is FUNNY

this guy had to do this 'feat' for his blackbelt test



bwuahahahah

why do people even pay for this type of instruction....
too bad he didn't land it. guess you don't need to land it to get your belt


[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]

edit* here you can watch all kinds of ineffective techniques that people pay long money to learn
www.youtube.com...

this jkd guy is fast as lightning, but he don't hit anything



more JKD trickery



i am enjoying this thread(not sarcastic)..

[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Most believe that one has to be noticeably muscular or BIG in order to be powerful.



Originally posted by Boondock78
agreed.

It's nice that we can find agreement on something.


Originally posted by Boondock78
this is another myth that royce gracie put to rest years ago...some of the greatest mma fighters active right now don't even weight train. it's plyometrics and anabolic workouts, etc.....6 days a week.

How do you define plyometrics and anabolic?


Originally posted by Paul_Richard
He did a slowed-down extended backfist with his right hand. The muscles in his right arm as he executed the action were nothing short of superb. It is hard to explain. The muscles weren't large but they were so perfectly toned.



Originally posted by Boondock78
yes...believe it or not, many. many fighters have that type of physique....imagine that.

I imagine that you are clueless.


Tony Jaa doesn't have it.

Any other candidates?

Show me someone that can duplicate the opening punching routine Lee did in E.T.D. when Bob Wall opened the door and ordered him to attend the morning ritual. I want to see the power behind that from a very well defined physique.

That would be a good start.



Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Most of us just do a technique and it looks like we are doing a technique. Lee's body was so perfectly trained that he did the techniques like his body was originally designed to do them.



Originally posted by Boondock78
is this frustrating for anyone else? 99.9% of the footage you have seen of bruce is from choreographed scenes that had multiple takes....now take that scene from enter the dragon and compare to his backyard workout....the technique is a lot different....

You mean like the multiple takes of Tony Jaa hitting the bag with a turning kick? You mean the example comparison I mentioned yesterday?



Originally posted by Paul_Richard
That is quite a story and one that speaks volumes about Bruce Lee.



Originally posted by Boondock78
but can it be verified?

Can YOU be verified as knowing what you are talking about?



Originally posted by Paul_Richard
The above techniques have not made it into MMA matches yet. At least not the ones I have seen. They are awkward at first but unusually effective if you develop proficiency with them.



Originally posted by Boondock78
there is a reason for that...in a real fight, they are not effective techniques...every now and then you will see a back kick but nobody does the jumping spoin kicks and all that jaz. it does NOT work and in a real fight it leaves you vulnerable.

You are showing your ignorance...again...of Jeet Kune Do techniques.

For openers, there are no jumping kicks in JKD.



Originally posted by Boondock78
i am enjoying this thread(not sarcastic)..

However long and arduous, some lessons can be fun.

Many are learning from this.



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard

Show me someone that can duplicate the opening punching routine Lee did in E.T.D. when Bob Wall opened the door and ordered him to attend the morning ritual. I want to see the power behind that from a very well defined physique.



no dude..i am not going to dig up clips of real fighters throwing these strikes in real fights for you to compare it to your ildol in a fight clip from a movie...
you keep talking about power and accuracy and all that and you can't tell how accurate or powerful he is from his movie strikes.
i'm not going to play that game.....

also, i never said there were jump kicks in jkd and i may very well be very ignorant on the topic of jkd. i read the tao of jkd but i do not study it. IMO, it is an ineffective art and i dismissed it long ago...
i will make another statement that you will find ignorant i am sure but i don't too much care.

these days, there are literally thousands of styles out there and they cover all types of disciplines...
me though, i am a fighter....when i was a kid, i went through the phase of being in awe of kung fu and all the cool techniques they had. i liked white eyebrow a lot...

these days though, unless that style has been proven by someone, at least once in some sort of legit mma competition, i really have no use for it...
i like styles that are proven effective and the best place to prove that is in an mma org. IF it is a grappling style, i will be content with seeing it put to the test in a sport jui jitsu competition, sambo, or abu dhabi.

if it is not anywhere near pride, ufc, shooto, k1 hero's, zst, abu dahbi, or various vale tudo spots in brazil, then i will immediately dismiss it as an effective 'fighting' style.
it might be aesthetically pretty, but untill proven, it is not effective.
jkd has yet to be proven...the only jkd guy i saw that had the stones to get in the cage had his arm broken...
let me get the stats on how long he lasted real fast. he had 17 pounds on royce too.


1:07 of round one, royce broke is arm with an armbar from the bottom..thus far, jkd= nope...least for me.

that said, i am not into martial arts for the spiritual side of it or for how aesthetic some of the techniques are....i want to see the most effective style. THAT is why i watch mma.
from there, i like to see my favorite fighters that cover all styles.

these days though, it is basically all 'hybrid' mma. thse guys all have a base in one discipline or another but they all cross train..nobody gets into that ring with only a singular discipline...

the jkd guy is the one with the hyper extended arm



royce rolled him, then he poped it



edit* pretty good physique for a guy that trains with ZERO weights



^^i know, bruce is better. i was posting this for others. no need to comment on bruce any longer





carlos newton does not use weights either...i know, i know, bruce is better. i got it






[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]


Wig

posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by SevenThunders

No, not if it was done through witchcraft or occult means. All occultic miracles are performed by the power of the devil and his minions. Most of the so called catholic miracles of the modern era are occultic and demonic as well.

However there are genuine movements of God wherein miracles are performed by the power of the Holy Spirit. I know people who have been healed this way, including someone who was instantly healed of chronic fatigue syndrome and another who was instantly healed of a broken arm.

The trick is learning how to discern the fake miracles from the real ones. The real ones come from believers who worship in spirit and truth, ie they have the correct doctrine and the right motives.


I'm only going to say this once, and will not post (reply) on this subject on this thread again, because this is not the subject of the thread IMO.

Your argument above sounds like the old "all religions are wrong except mine" arguement..... "All healings are satanic except the ones from my church".



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:18 PM
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I am presently looking for the clip of Bruce Lee on a Hong Kong television show when he breaks one or more boards with a kick. Perhaps someone else has this.

He doesn't just break the wood...he shatters it


Here is a good overview of clips.

Note the comments posted in youtube: that UFC President Dana White considers Bruce Lee "the father of Mixed Martial Arts" and the UFC even said that Bruce was the best martial artist of all time in the Ultimate Fight 5 Finale.

Now I'll take a look at your pics.

EDIT: Sorry...it isn't just being muscular, it is being able to deliver penetrating power to the degree (or at least in the ballpark) that Lee did.

A good example is Joe Lewis, the international karate champion back in the 1960s and 70s. I remember seeing him years ago on the cover of Black Belt Magazine. His physique looked better than any of those you pictured - and he successfully used JKD techniques in the ring




[edit on 9-8-2007 by Paul_Richard]



posted on Aug, 9 2007 @ 05:22 PM
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard
He doesn't just break the wood...he shatters it


^^you're not getting it..woo does not hit back. i had to break boards for all my tkd tests...that shows me NOTHING...
i would like to see his precision accuracy and power up against something NOT stationary AND human...you know, a human that is moving around, not providing a stationary target....you're showing me nothing but how much love you have for bruce.....good for you


that UFC President Dana White considers Bruce Lee "the father of Mixed Martial Arts" and the UFC even said that Bruce was the best martial artist of all time in the Ultimate Fight 5 Finale.



yes, dana white did say that. dana white is also condidered to be a giant, know nothing about fighting turd in the ma community. he is a buisnessman and an ex tai bo instructor....
when you say the ufc said bruce was the best martial artist of all time, what do you mean?
was that dana again?
have a clip cause i am curious.

the boards have been rife with laughter for a bit now over danas comments...

edit* hahahah, more movie/tv footage to demo his mad skills


[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]

edit*
here is some RARE footage of bruce lee using his technique to absorb the slap whilst not even moving




[edit on 9-8-2007 by Boondock78]



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