Disclosure, Aliens, and a new president.

I've been doing alot of thinking, based on what I’ve read on here, and I had a fairly interesting theory, which is probably shot full of holes, but maybe worth a read?

Part A. Everyone on here wants disclosure, right? (While except for the "plants", but lets ignore them for now). So, would the obvious idea not be to groom and prepare someone on the side of the (lets call ourselves "theorists") and have them attain a position of high and credible power? The best one would of course be a President or Prime Minister, but given my knowledge it takes a lifetime of politics to get into those positions, so that is out of the question. But a lower, yet still powerful one, if a "theorist" was to get into one of those positions purely for the ability to spill, a few years after holding it, the beans on a great many subjects. Interesting idea, no? And I am not talking about alien contact, even. More along the lines of concealed technology (which the government obviously has, its a well-known fact that publicly available technology has been used in secret for at least 5 years before it is released), and archaeological discoveries that are covered up (the disinformation concerning Bosnia, anyone? the lack of info concerning the city in India, and the ruins off Cuba?). Anyways...

Part B. While I am on the fence, completely, about the subject of UFO's (because quite honestly, most of what I have seen is a ridiculous farce), I did have an interesting idea. Lets assume that the "Galactic Federation" theorists are correct, or even that the "another group is watching us" ones are correct, and a species that has attained a higher level of technology than us is watching us. Now then, given the escalating state of world affairs since the 50's, would you REALLY want to let us know, even in the slightest, that you were watching us? Consider: The world has been under a near constant threat of complete destruction since WWII. We haven't had a decade go by where the world superpowers were not A. conducting war and espionage in a foreign country, or B. Threatening us with nukes.
Now, if you were an alien species, with more technology, the obvious thing to do would be to sit there and do NOTHING but watch, correct? If we are "worthy" of continuing as a species, and reaching out into the galaxy, then we will get over this slump of warfare and apathy we are currently in. If we don't, and revert into some barbaric species, then we were obviously not something worth being contacted, and they were wise to stay away.

Why would an external something watching us not intervenes, you say? Because if we Cannot pull ourselves out of it on our own, then we would do it again in the future. It's the theory of "you made your mess, now you clean it up". Helping humans fix this would only forestall the inevitable, and the next time it happened, we would have something worse than nukes. Thus, an external species, if they thought in logical terms, would see the global climate as humanities test of "worthiness", so to speak. If we can pull out of it, then who knows? If something is out there, they may come down and extend a hand of friendship. If not, then we fell because we were somehow flawed.

Sorry if it’s a bit of a wall of text, I wrote it rather hurriedly at work

Originally posted by D.E.M.

I've been doing alot of thinking

I love that, in a person.

Part A. Everyone on here wants disclosure, right? (While except for the "plants", but lets ignore them for now).

I'm not a "plant". Though, some think so.

So, would the obvious idea not be to groom and prepare someone on the side of the (lets call ourselves "theorists") and have them attain a position of high and credible power?

Assuming a person started when they entered college (age 19),
then the person would (at best) be around 45 when they were in
position to be elected to a position that you suggest.

Is it really worth 25 years to try this ?

IMO, no.

But a lower, yet still powerful one, if a "theorist" was to get into one of those positions purely for the ability to spill, a few years after holding it, the beans on a great many subjects.

See above. And, after attaining such a position, after years in
the "game", WOULD the person spill the beans ?
I'm guessing, no.

Interesting idea, no?

Yes, it is.

And I am not talking about alien contact, even.

Thank God !

More along the lines of concealed technology (which the government obviously has, its a well-known fact that publicly available technology has been used in secret for at least 5 years before it is released),

Sorry to break your paragraph, but it's needed.
Military tech (govt) is around 15 years ahead of civilians,
not 5.

and archaeological discoveries that are covered up (the disinformation concerning Bosnia, anyone? the lack of info concerning the city in India, and the ruins off Cuba?).

My interest is peaked !
Please provide some info on these digs !

Part B. While I am on the fence, completely, about the subject of UFO's (because quite honestly, most of what I have seen is a ridiculous farce),

My friend, UFO's are real.
It's all too common these days for the term UFO to become
synonymous with "aliens".
It ain't so.

I did have an interesting idea. Lets assume that the "Galactic Federation" theorists are correct, or even that the "another group is watching us" ones are correct, and a species that has attained a higher level of technology than us is watching us.

Assumptions can lead places I don't want to go.

Now, if you were an alien species, with more technology, the obvious thing to do would be to sit there and do NOTHING but watch, correct?

If "they" were sadists, sure.
Sadly, our society today is adopting this attitude.
People see a mugging or car theft and just look away.
IF there were "aliens" watching, I'd hope they would
intervene.

If we can pull out of it, then who knows? If something is out there, they may come down and extend a hand of friendship. If not, then we fell because we were somehow flawed.

We are Human, my friend.

We ARE flawed.

Problem is, too few admit this and attempt to change.

Great post. Thank you.

Regards,
Lex

Every hear that Nazi developed saucers came to New Mexico
under operation paper clip ?

That would be a National Security Secret.

It can not be disclosed.

Thank you for your kind words, Lexion. I know I may have been a bit rambly and off on a few facts (i knew the technology date was a multiple of 5, but didn't want to be taken for an idiot and went for a safer number), it was 7 am here and I had just woken up

The city off Cuba is under approximately 1000 meters of water, sadly, but the evidence that it is man-made (such as the structures being made of granite, which does not occur there naturally) makes a strong case. I found the link to its official site, but I have since lost it. Here is a link to an article on it, from (sadly) 2001: www.freerepublic.com...

The pyramids in Bosnia are an ongoing investigation, and have been since their discovery in 2004/5. They recently received the full support of the Bosnian government, despite outcry from the Archaeological community that they are fake and be shut down, since their approximate age of construction is around 10,000 years ago. They have just this year started pulling real, obvious artifacts from the tunnels beneath the pyramids, and are gaining ground. A link to their website is here: www.piramidasunca.ba...

And of course, the city in India is the hottest topic in the ancient civilizations board right now

TeslaandLyne, I haven’t heard of that one specifically, no. I had heard that the US smuggled quite a few top Nazi researchers out from under the fall of Germany, (Mengele didn't die at 70 in south America by luck, in my opinion), and I have heard of the Bell, and of the Uranium refining facilities that Hitler was building, but no that one, no.
Have you ever read, "The hunt for zero point" by nick cook? It is quite far-fetched at some points, but alot of what is contained could theoretically be plausible.


[edit on 4-8-2007 by D.E.M.]

[edit on 4-8-2007 by D.E.M.]

TeslaandLyne, I haven’t heard of that one specifically, no. I had heard that the US smuggled quite a few top Nazi researchers out from under the fall of Germany, (Mengele didn't die at 70 in south America by luck, in my opinion), and I have heard of the Bell, and of the Uranium refining facilities that Hitler was building, but no that one, no.
Have you ever read, "The hunt for zero point" by nick cook? It is quite far-fetched at some points, but alot of what is contained could theoretically be plausible.

My last signature link is a big hit with conspiratists that upgraded the thought that the US government administration was acting like Nazis to evidence that
they are Nazis. Picture of Mengele included.
www.proliberty.com...

Tesla discovered ZP and don't think we need to go to any one else.
Too bad researcher Lyne had to spill the beans but don't think anyone
will pick them up correctly. Tesla is being locked by our government
in essence by not disclosing his works. Its a National Security issue
now and experimental work is secret. Don't think any thing past Lyne
of any substance will be known.

What Hitler and his German scientists did before, during and after WWII
is a big no tell zone by the CIA. Researcher Lyne did find some puzzling
ideas its true but at least he does not join in the CIA Nazi or what ever
cover. Lets say he does it his way. Have doubts of Hitler's demise, well
then assume alive and see what results. a story in itself. Sort of the
OPPOSITE story line.

Well as Lyne was living in New Mexico, the hot belt of saucers in America,
I take his word that the Roswell Aliens were dead left over rocket sled
monkeys.
And that saucers flu regularly in the New Mexico skies.
All after WWII.

See on cook

Thats the Tesla oscillator talked about by Lyne in a video interview
posted in nine parts on YouTube. Thats the joke the reviewer of cook's
ZP talks about. It's been identified by Lyne who met with the builder's
son.

Atomic gases and magnetics provide direct a/c, even picks up earth's pole to pole electrical energy vibrations.

No nuclear hot pile making steam, that's nuclear not atomic.
Atomic is ZP. Nazi subs had them, well as the only story goes,
according to Lyne. Even if Germany's subs are mentioned in WWII
media productions, it won't mention correctly how much range they
achieved or how they did it. The new air snorkel was all she wrote
to the not telling all media release.

Indeed. That would explain why they decided to sink the entire Nazi U-boat fleet in deep destructive water off of Ireland, rather than scrap them and melt them down, too. Interesting info, thanks!

D.E.M. a very good friend of mine (best man at my wedding) is currently running for his second term as a low level elected official in the county he resides in in New York State. He has a goal of attaining higher levels of office? Presidency is not his goal but you never know. He is a Democrat and has shmoozed with Billary on several campaign swings thru the state, including a hell of a nice bash last summer that he invited me to. She is going to be hitting him up once he wins his re-election and his involvement might be a nice stepping stone to the next levels, especially if a dem can manage to get into the white house.

If he moves up, he has already stated that I will be given important positions whenever possible because I have so much dirt on him I could be called a landfill. I promise to push him for this information. Hell, I tried to ask Bill about it last summer but those pesky Secret Service agents wouldn't let him talk to me for more than 2 seconds before they whisked him off to talk to a group young, good looking women.


Odds are, I'll have the opportunity again in the next year and I will be more persistent this time around. Perhaps I'll get some ladies to do the asking for me.

I'm afraid that even the most powerful people don't know exactly what's going on with classified information.

The Vice President didn't even know about the Manhattan Project until it was nearly completed. It's called compartmentalization and it's done to keep secrets from getting out. One person might forward an encrypted document to another person, but I doubt that he knew that document said to drop bombs on Iran. I doubt the President has much knowledge at all of UFO phenomemon. I doubt the Commander of the Army has much knowledge of top secret Air Craft the Navy possesses.

The real people that have that sort of knowledge have no public entity. In fact they're the manipulators of the puppets we call politicians. Unless you're alread a billionaire or have a father that's already a member of thier Good 'Ole Boy's club, I doubt there's much hope of joining their elite ranks of world dominators.

Originally posted by D.E.M.
I've been doing alot of thinking, based on what I’ve read on here, and I had a fairly interesting theory, which is probably shot full of holes, but maybe worth a read?

Part A. Everyone on here wants disclosure, right? (While except for the "plants", but lets ignore them for now).

I don't know that there are any plants, but you can be sure that they won't be the vocal skeptics.

I don't want Disclosure (with a capital D), because I think it is a meaningless concept. The notion that there is a cabal that Knows All and is Keeping the Truth from the People, and so on, is completely unsupported by the evidence. If this is the same U.S> government that I know, their thinking is not that coherent or continuous or big picture.

Little d disclosure would be a change of policy and declassification of documents. However, I am not sure that anyone knows what documents there are or where, and that effort would cost a fair bit of money and probably take years.

Even some disclosure about WTH project jennifer was all about would be nice, in my mind. I mean, the cold war is over. The sub in question and probobly all of the technology therein is over 40 years obsolete. Everyone knows it happened. And yet they refuse to say anything about it and the records are kept secret even under a freedom of information act suit

So never underesitmate the value of the declassification of even a few documents...

[edit on 6-8-2007 by D.E.M.]

I personally think there is nothing to disclose. Other than thousands of pages locked away in files that lead to nowhere, blurry photos and fuzzy videos of some lights in the night sky. You people need to consider this.

If there was physical evidence of aliens visiting earth held by our (USA) government it would have been leaked by now, and not by a bunch of nutballs in some stupid UFO symposium or crap like that. I'm talking evening news leaked. I mean, come on, our government can't keep ANYTHING secret. The amount of people needed to keep alien visitation secret alone makes it impossible to keep.

There is nothing to disclose, if they were here we would never know it. No alien is coming from Alpha Centuari to buzz our skies at night to secretly observe us....but then accidentally leave thier parking lights on so some goofball can get a blurry video of them. Seriously.

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
If there was physical evidence of aliens visiting earth held by our (USA) government it would have been leaked by now, and not by a bunch of nutballs in some stupid UFO symposium or crap like that. I'm talking evening news leaked. I mean, come on, our government can't keep ANYTHING secret. The amount of people needed to keep alien visitation secret alone makes it impossible to keep.

The evidence would suggest the government can very well keep a secret. The Manhattan Project, for example, was a massive multi-billion dollar project--back when a billion dollars was real money. Not only did the military get the money from Congress without telling them what it was for, they also built several giant facilities (including, for example, Hanford) without letting on its purpose. They invented and built the atomic bombs under security so tight that almost no one knew what they were building. Truman did not know it existed until he became President.

With the theory of compartmentalized information on a need to know basis, and the level of security clearance required for access you bet the government can keep a secret. If someone does start getting traction, it's easy enough to deal with. NICAP, for example, was a serious organization that was getting close to a congressional investigation. The CIA stepped in, took over some board positions, booted out Keyhoe, and drove NICAP bankrupt, all right in front of everyone's noses.

Plus there is a fallback position. If something does get out, pepper it with disinformation so that no one can tell what is fact from fiction. Serpo, Cooper, Lazar. It's easy, a kind of security judo that uses the tin foil hat crowd's willingness to believe any conspiracy against them very effectively. That there are people who sneer derisively that the 'government can't do anything right' is just another point that makes them smile. Keep thinking that; they want you to.

A little plausible deniability mixed with some covert action and disinformation is all that is needed to keep the crazies at bay. It's worked for sixty years. read: UFOs and the National Security State by Richard Dolan to get an idea of what has happened.

Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
If there was physical evidence of aliens visiting earth held by our (USA) government it would have been leaked by now, and not by a bunch of nutballs in some stupid UFO symposium or crap like that. I'm talking evening news leaked. I mean, come on, our government can't keep ANYTHING secret. The amount of people needed to keep alien visitation secret alone makes it impossible to keep.

The evidence would suggest the government can very well keep a secret. The Manhattan Project, for example, was a massive multi-billion dollar project--back when a billion dollars was real money. Not only did the military get the money from Congress without telling them what it was for, they also built several giant facilities (including, for example, Hanford) without letting on its purpose. They invented and built the atomic bombs under security so tight that almost no one knew what they were building. Truman did not know it existed until he became President.

Lets use our heads here, that was a COMPLETELY different time period and the country had a completely different mentality about government, secrets, and war. You have to consider the here and now. Institutionalized distrust of the government, incapable politicians, the internet, bloggers, government leaks on SENSITIVE projects ending up on the front page of every newspaper within minutes...the Drudge report, lol.

In this day and age, you can't have a large group of people keep ANYTHING secret, trust me. To even consider that there is a small group of people holding the keys to some out of this world vehicle is crazy. Not even the highest military ranks, under the threat of court marshal even, would keep alien life secret. Once it would be out, it would be out and recrimination against an individual would be pointless so the threat of treason is meaningless against such world changing important information. But it's not out, because there is nothing to get out. Face it, if there was anything really substantial to disclose it would have already happened.

There is nothing to disclose, if they were here we would never know it. No alien is coming from Alpha Centuari to buzz our skies at night to secretly observe us....but then accidentally leave thier parking lights on so some goofball can get a blurry video of them. Seriously.

How can you possibly know they have nothing to disclose? I admit i'm a 'skeptical' believer but saying that you know for certain that there is noting to disclose is a bit bold is it not?

When I say they have nothing to disclose, I basicly mean they have nothing substantial, nothing of value, and no smoking gun to disclose.

Hey, I would be THRILLED to death to have any nation's government disclose something other than blurry photos and thousands of pages of meaningless reports. But I just don't think there is anything substantial to let loose. If so, I believe it would have happened by default. I mean, come on....some third world country with WAY more problems than covering up some ufo crash would have disclosed it by now (considering politically many that want to slam the USA would use anything they had at their disposal to sow dissent among our citizens...ie.."look at what your government is hiding from you")

For that matter, do ufos only crash in country's with secret agenda governments, lol? I mean, I would imagine that in some lesser nations we would have pictures of some poor kids using it as a jungle jim for months before the UN aid workers got there for their medicine delivery.....

Originally posted by D.E.M.
And I am not talking about alien contact, even. More along the lines of concealed technology (which the government obviously has, its a well-known fact that publicly available technology has been used in secret for at least 5 years before it is released), and archaeological discoveries that are covered up (the disinformation concerning Bosnia, anyone? the lack of info concerning the city in India, and the ruins off Cuba?)

Ignore the facts, as you can see above, i was not referring to that type of disclosure. I was referring to projects that have been kept, and are still kept, secret for a very very long time. Such as the Jennifer project, which is still completely denied despite everyone knowing about it. Or along the lines of the door that is in the side of the Sphynx.

Sorry, I'm lost now. There's a friggin' door in the Sphinx?!? Can't believe I have not heard that before, lol. I would imagined that the thousands of Egyptian scholars out there would have clamored over each other to publish on that. I'll have to google it to see (other than woo woo sites) which of the worlds best scholars have published a treatment on that.

I know nothing of "project jennifer" The first time I heard that referenced was in one of your earlier posts in this thread I think. I'll go google that too while I'm drunk and online....


O.K. just googled a couple different phrases about the door in the sphinx and was linked to nothing but "unexplained mysteries" type sites. Didn't dig enough to see any real reasearch papers from real Egyptian researchers, however I would imagine if it were true they would have turned up on within the first page of google results. Call me lazy. I must have missed the Discovery channel special about the door in the sphinx also.

Just Googled prject jennifer and read the wiki page on it. Pretty cool. Not the only sub we have salvaged for sure. I doubt the goverment cares to declassify anything about it out of institutionalized stupidity, not because they are trying to hide it. But salvaging a sub off the floor of the ocean is a far cry from finding an alien UFO and salvaging it. A bunch of sailors that work shipwrecks all the time just viewed it as another job, nothing special, so they could really care less, probable forgot all about it unless someone poured some beer into them. But salvaging and alien spaceship, studying it, (which would take hundreds of people to be "in the loop") that is not something easily shrugged off by your average worker bee and would have been "disclosed" beyond the shadow of a doubt by now if it happened ever.

Posts are getting incoherent now, probably should let off the booz and hit the sheets......

[edit on 6-8-2007 by D.E.M.]

Originally posted by D.E.M.
Indeed. That would explain why they decided to sink the entire Nazi U-boat fleet in deep destructive water off of Ireland, rather than scrap them and melt them down, too. Interesting info, thanks!

A good way to keep the secret and put the engine in the large football
field size aether ships.

I never thought of it that way, Lyne never says it outright.
It would be conjecture but he would not be against the idea.

Put the pure electric Dort generator used in the Nazi electric U-boats and
put them in the large Belgian Triangle type or larger air ships.