1984 Is Here Again!!

Britain is one of the most watched countries in the world! the Government has been kind enough to put camera's up just about everywhere....Its is also telling us what we should eat,what we should watch,that we should recycle,(but be charged for it.)how much alcohol we should drink,where we can and can't smoke,that we all should have electronic id's,that we should even use a lower setting on our washing machines!! the list is endless.....

But now something new has been revealed to the public.The Police,with the backing of the Government,want to bring in a new oppression.If you commit an extremely minor crime,such as dropping litter,they want to be able to take,not only fingerprints,but a DNA sample as well!! Is it just me who finds that crazy??
Should two of the most corrupt orginizations in Britain be able to get away with such measures?? There are many things up with the laws in this country,but this is not the answer.Here are a few examples...

A life sentence is only 15yrs.why?

You can spend more time in prison for not paying your t.v.licence than you can for downloading child pornography.why?

A woman who is raped is told by the Police that it will just be her word against her rapist.on the rare occassion that these cases get to court,the prosecutor asks the victim how she was dressed,if she was flirting,had she been drinking! why? if she said yes to all these things does that mean she should've expected to be raped!??!

If your home is broken into and you in defending yourself injure the burglar it is you who will be arrested.why?

If a burglar injures himself while breaking into your property say,cutting himself on broken glass,it is you who will be prosecuted.why?

A loophole in the law allows known child abusers/pedophiles to become private tutors.why?

Anyways,before i ramble too much,I don't see how taking fingerprints and DNA will help in anyway.To me its just all about control,but control against the wrong ppl.(meaning,not habitual criminals.)If you drop litter,dodge paying train/bus fare,walk on the grass etc u should not have such measures forced upon u.Especially when you know that if someone rich or someone famous breaks the law,it will be a different rule for them!!

Should our human rights be violated in this way??

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[edit on 4/8/2007 by Mirthful Me]

Originally posted by jakyll
Britain is one of the most watched countries in the world! the Government has been kind enough to put camera's up just about everywhere....

The majority of cameras are actually privately owned.

Its is also telling us what we should eat

Sorry but the Government has never come a'knockin on my door telling me what to eat and as far as I know the 'fat-tax' hasn't been implemented yet.

what we should watch

Eh?

that we should recycle,(but be charged for it.)

I haven't heard this one either. In my area all recycling door to door is free. Many supermarkets offer free facilities as well. The Government also imposed a 'WEE' bit of legislation to ensure all electronic appliances are disposed of correctly- most are taken away for free by the bigger companies.

how much alcohol we should drink

Yes they may be concerned with the binge drinking culture but them being concerned can't stop me from going to the pub now and attempting to finish a bottle of whisky. They aren't exactly enforcing this.

where we can and can't smoke

I'm a smoker but even I agree with this rule.

But now something new has been revealed to the public.The Police,with the backing of the Government,want to bring in a new oppression.If you commit an extremely minor crime,such as dropping litter,they want to be able to take,not only fingerprints,but a DNA sample as well!! Is it just me who finds that crazy??

It's still on the drawing board. An idea as it were. This is all it is, there is nothing to say it will or won't be implemented.

If your home is broken into and you in defending yourself injure the burglar it is you who will be arrested.why?

If a burglar injures himself while breaking into your property say,cutting himself on broken glass,it is you who will be prosecuted.why?

I think the first point you make isn't entirely true (and i emphasise 'think') but didn't a law come into place where a reasonable amount of force can be used to expel invaders? Stabbing/ shooting would get you into trouble but hitting them with an objwect won't.

As for the second point the person wouldn't get prosecuted- instead the chances are the burglar could take them to civil court. The court system is more of a sham here in my eyes.

To be honest, recycling has been universal and effective in n. america for over 20 years now....Britain is very far behind in this area. So they need to get their act together - and shipping it off to China is NOT the way to deal with it either...that's a joke: they need to be building their own recycling plants by the dozen. Do you know that here, you can't even buy non-recycled paper, it's pretty well unheard of. And most inks used are made from plant extracts.

Speeding, I've noticed on visiting the UK, goes pretty well unpunished: you could never get away with the insane driving that goes on there over here. All those cameras, yet people can do 120mph down a highway and change three lanes without signalling either. Crazy stuff. Oh, by the way it's official: the UK IS the most watched society on the planet.

Littering? Well, the UK is covered in litter & garbage - I've never seen anything like it. You need serious littering laws there - laws that are enforced! And yeah - you SHOULD be trying to conserve energy. Why not? Every time you use energy in the UK, you either create tons of CO2 (coal power plants) or nuclear waste.

DNA profiling? I agree - is crazy. Unless you are CONVICTED of a serious criminal offence, why should they be allowed to have your DNA?

But overall, I think the UK is still living in the previous centuy in many important areas...



[edit on 4-8-2007 by jimbo999]

[edit on 4-8-2007 by jimbo999]

[edit on 4-8-2007 by jimbo999]

Originally posted by Knights

Originally posted by jakyll
Britain is one of the most watched countries in the world! the Government has been kind enough to put camera's up just about everywhere....

The majority of cameras are actually privately owned.

Its is also telling us what we should eat

Sorry but the Government has never come a'knockin on my door telling me what to eat and as far as I know the 'fat-tax' hasn't been implemented yet.

what we should watch

Eh?

that we should recycle,(but be charged for it.)

I haven't heard this one either. In my area all recycling door to door is free. Many supermarkets offer free facilities as well. The Government also imposed a 'WEE' bit of legislation to ensure all electronic appliances are disposed of correctly- most are taken away for free by the bigger companies.

how much alcohol we should drink

Yes they may be concerned with the binge drinking culture but them being concerned can't stop me from going to the pub now and attempting to finish a bottle of whisky. They aren't exactly enforcing this.

where we can and can't smoke

I'm a smoker but even I agree with this rule.

But now something new has been revealed to the public.The Police,with the backing of the Government,want to bring in a new oppression.If you commit an extremely minor crime,such as dropping litter,they want to be able to take,not only fingerprints,but a DNA sample as well!! Is it just me who finds that crazy??

It's still on the drawing board. An idea as it were. This is all it is, there is nothing to say it will or won't be implemented.

If your home is broken into and you in defending yourself injure the burglar it is you who will be arrested.why?

If a burglar injures himself while breaking into your property say,cutting himself on broken glass,it is you who will be prosecuted.why?

I think the first point you make isn't entirely true (and i emphasise 'think') but didn't a law come into place where a reasonable amount of force can be used to expel invaders? Stabbing/ shooting would get you into trouble but hitting them with an objwect won't.

As for the second point the person wouldn't get prosecuted- instead the chances are the burglar could take them to civil court. The court system is more of a sham here in my eyes.

Actually, what he means is: the Government is cosidering implementing a tax on people who DON'T recycle, which I think is a great idea. Far too many brits don't recycle - and they are the people polluting your country and covering it with garbage. Get the bast*rds, I say.

Originally posted by jimbo999
Actually, what he means is: the Government is cosidering implementing a tax on people who DON'T recycle, which I think is a great idea. Far too many brits don't recycle - and they are the people polluting your country and covering it with garbage. Get the bast*rds, I say.

Actually, the title of the thread suggests the theory of 1984. Last time I looked the theory 1984 had NOTHING to do with recycling.

[edit on 4-8-2007 by Knights]

[edit on 4-8-2007 by Knights]

The first thing we need to do is get off our high horse, get rid of the Royal Family, and actually get ourselves into the 21st century.. because as far as i can tell, we are still 100 years behind everyone else..

I know alot of people take "pride" in being "British".. but we really need to stop praising ourselves when we are actually quite a backwards society. Its ok to praise the country, government, and our "way of life", but only when we they are in working order.

The binge drinking culture, and anti-social yobs, is merely a reflection of discontent within British society. People need to wake up and realise this, and then start looking at what is really causing these problems.. ie the way our country runs.

As for the police state.. yes we are already in one. We mite not fit the definition of it, but they way its being implemented is via 'stepping stones'.. and only once its too late will people be saying, "oh yeh, we are in a police state.. fancy that!"

Garh.. get me out of here.

Privatly owned cameras? don't think so mate.here's a good example of how watched we are.when tv presenter jill dando was murdered,the police trying to find evidence on cctv cameras followed her movements for over 4hrs! that means for 4hrs they knew what shops she went into and what roads she drove down!

Just because someone hasn't knocked on your door,or something hasn't been implemented yet does not mean you are not being told what to eat! although this comment was mainly aimed at them telling us what our children should eat.

The comment on what we should watch,i'm talking about the tv censors who think that adults can't make choices for themselves!


Yes,recycling is free now,but if its inforced they want to charge us for it.they also want to bring in a charge of how much waste we have.


I know its still on the drawing board.thats the point of this thread,to discuss if its a good idea!!

A neighbour of mine was prosecuted when a burglar got caught up in some barbed wire that was on his property!!

I agree that over here it does look like most places have a daily litter festival! and yes something should be done.but not fingerprinting and dna samples!!

Originally posted by shrunkensimon
I know alot of people take "pride" in being "British".. but we really need to stop praising ourselves when we are actually quite a backwards society. Its ok to praise the country, government, and our "way of life", but only when we they are in working order.

I am very proud to be British. In what context are we behind? Which countries are you comparing Britian to for being 'behind' as far as I can see every country has major failings.

The binge drinking culture, and anti-social yobs, is merely a reflection of discontent within British society. People need to wake up and realise this, and then start looking at what is really causing these problems.. ie the way our country runs.

As for the police state.. yes we are already in one. We mite not fit the definition of it, but they way its being implemented is via 'stepping stones'.. and only once its too late will people be saying, "oh yeh, we are in a police state.. fancy that!"

The binge drinking culture- although seen as bad by many reflects our personal freedoms. It is the individuals choice to go out and drink till they are blind. It is their choice, their freedom. Take this away and we will be stepping into the 'nanny state' police culture. You argue against the police state but unknowingly support it it seems.

Originally posted by Knights
I am very proud to be British. In what context are we behind? Which countries are you comparing Britian to for being 'behind' as far as I can see every country has major failings.

Its not about comparing Britain to other countries. There aren't really any countries that i would say are ahead of us, but then it depends on what terms your talking about (economically, technologically, spiritually..). What i mean by behind is that we as a country are still stuck in the Imperialistic mindstate. Its OK for us to taunt Americans for being blindly patriotic to their fascist government, but when it comes to the way our country works, we just turn a blind eye..

Britain is the bastard nation of the world. There really is nothing to be proud about.. we have possibly the darkest history of any nation on the planet, yet we still praise our monarchy and televise it for the world to see. We still wave flags as if they mean something..

Britishness is just the same as being patriotic towards the current US adminstration. Its blind unwavering support for those who don't deserve it. Our government, nor our Royal Family, deserive any support.

Originally posted by Knights
The binge drinking culture- although seen as bad by many reflects our personal freedoms. It is the individuals choice to go out and drink till they are blind. It is their choice, their freedom. Take this away and we will be stepping into the 'nanny state' police culture. You argue against the police state but unknowingly support it it seems.

Its not a choice when you have other options that are denied by law, such as smoking Cannabis for example. The sole reason why alcohol is legal is because it helps people forget that they are nothing but worthless slaves to the masters of our society. It helps them "escape" worklife by poisoning their body and mind so that they can forget their unhappiness. Then people get angry when they drink too much because their subconscious problems surface, and their ego retreats.

Despite alcohol being nothing more than a poison, its the one substance which we "brits" decide to take as our "culture". That just shows you how backwards we really are! Rather than deal with problems head on, the underlying causes of why we as a society are actually quite depressed, we just decide to "drown our sorrows".. Yet, alcohol advertising is still going on.. equating drinking with good times, sex and rock n roll

You don't find many 20yr old Brits like me who detest drinking. Im considered an outcast in that respect. I've lost many friends to the drinking culture already, no thanks to Universities helping glorify this binge culture. I have nothing against a pint or two now and then, but going out every weekend or even week days, just to get "lashed"... that is backwards thinking. You get nothing out of poisoning yourself. Thats how poisons work, they take away, on all levels.

We have the personal freedom to poison ourselves, and in some places now, 24hrs a day.. yet we can't enlighten ourselves using other substances.. what a free society we really are.

Im against the police state, but binge drinking is part of the police state. It keeps people dulled and unquestioning. They poison you with other things like fluoride and aspartame.. but alcohol is by far the worst. Yet its glorified and available in many retail outlets, all for your convienince.

"""Britain is the bastard nation of the world. There really is nothing to be proud about.. we have possibly the darkest history of any nation on the planet,"""

I'm surprised by this comment,but i shouldn't be.All we hear about when it comes to our past is the negative,never the positive.
Of course our past was brutal,empires are not made by being nice too ppl.there made by men who hunger after power and wealth!

Yet,this country laid the foundations of the modern world,with our discoveries in such areas as science and medicine and our inventions in technology and engineering.I believe that schools should teach the full history of this nation,all the good as well as all the bad.

If you knew the full history of Britain you would find many,many things to be proud of!!

Yes we have developed some fantastic things, but that doesn't change the fact that we are still ruled over by the same type of people and organisations that were in power throughour our history.

Materialistic things mean nothing when we are still living in a backwards imperialistic mentality, and they certainly don't detract away from the truth of the situation.

Israel, for example, has come up with many wonderful things.. but that doesn't excuse the fact that it continues to do things that would astound most people if they were made aware of it. Infact, i could argue that Israel is a perfect mirror image of Britain, except that our leaders are slightly more subtle about things than the Zionists.

Schools teaching the "good and bad" will automatically be biased, because ultimately they would be institutions funded and organized by the government, corporations etc, who want to keep the truth of the situation hidden from public eyes.

Do you see where im coming from?

I do.and when i say schools should teach british history in full,i mean without prejudice.without any kind of control from the government.a ppl should know their history,i think.the glorious and the gory!

British inventors,scientists etc did more then help create materialistic things.we have done such things as change the face of transport forever,improved ppl's way of life,changed how ppl communicate! discoveries in medicine have helped save millions of lives,i talk to you now because of british inventions and discoveries! when i say we should be proud,these are the kind of things i am talking about.and just because we are a nation of lions being led by an ass does not mean we should be negative about our past!

Not sure i agree with you saying britain and israel are a mirror image.britain evolved and developed over 100's of years.we are made up of many different ppl.women in britain have freedom.for example.modern israel exisits because of britain.it is made up of one kind of ppl.they oppress women.