Originally posted by newyorkee
world government anyone..??? That would be a simple enough solution....btw jk

Globalism in and of itself is probably not a bad idea.. However the way that the powers that be plan on instituting it certainly is.

One more thing, its seems to be a misconception the illegals are making only minimum wage in america. Actually were I live (s.florida) the farm workers who pick tomatoes and whatever make big bucks. And they follow the harvest up north thats why they are called migrants.

They make a lot more than minumum wage, they just look poor because they are sending all their money back to mexico. And thats the part I dont like, instead of helping our economy they hurt it.

[edit on 2-8-2007 by earth2]

Originally posted by earth2


They make a lot more than minumum wage, they just look poor because they are sending all their money back to mexico. And thats the part I dont like, instead of helping our economy they hurt it.

[edit on 2-8-2007 by earth2]

True. The whole idea that they are somehow helping the American economy is not entirely true. Much of the money they make gets sent back to Mexico.

Not that anyone sigled out mexico,not at all, I myself chose to use them as an example, but what of asian peoples comming to this country and simply selling their bussinesses and homes to extended family members then returning back to their home land all the while making minimal re-investments into the american economy. One could argue they are on more of a lend lease arrangement with the US than their southamerican counterparts that eventually stay here permanantly. Both have histories of being here illegally in varried waves but one does not adopt the culture offered to them while the other is more attune to Americanisms. Just a thought..

NewYorkee, as I stated in another thread, illegal immigrant is not a racial term. It applies to anyone who is here undocumented, in other words, BREAKING THE LAW...

Speaker, I know man..I just see that most arguments made about imigration only encompass relative neighbors while in reality the entire world contributes to the dilema...I know the differance.

I don't know if the OP was serious, but one of the biggest problems is the Mexican border as a conduit for illegal immigrants from everywhere, not just Mexico - I'd be interested in learning what percentage are actually Mexican nationals. The CIA says Mexico's per capita GDP is $10,700 - which is just over $5/hour for a 40 hour week, 2000 hour year. That agency says US per capita GDP is $44,000 (this may be a conservative estimate, though, because I've seen estimates as high as $60,000 for adult males working full time.)

Now, earlier this year it was announced the federal US minimum wage would be raised to $7.25/hour. I have no idea if states have their own minimum wages they can place above this, and prefer I never gain first-hand knowledge of it!

So, that's almost 50% more than the average (not minimum) wage in Mexico! And you also need to note the wealth concentration in Mexico is far different than it is in the US. If you thought the gap between super-rich and poverty was bad here, you ain't seen nothing.

I really don't think you can blame US corporations operating in Mexico for their problems. Plus, I'm sure jobs at places like McDonald's are already primo, highly sought after positions for young Mexicans because the vast majority of the country cannot afford to eat there. Remember all the folks you saw standing in line next to you? Either not Mexicans or wealthy Mexicans. You won't see places like McDonald's in the interior of the country or outside of the touristy places the further you go inland from the border.

One of my closest friend's father was a newscaster in Mexico City (interior, and only reason I'd dare go there was because we had a free place to stay, hah, and was of the adventuring age) and we once flew into the city and took a car to Puerto Vallarta (west coast.) Let's just say it was the only time in my life where I would have killed to see a McDonald's or a Wal-Mart. I know Wal-Mart has a specific Central American division, but I can't remember what it's called and unless you knew about it you wouldn't have any idea they were related to the Wal-Mart down the street in Anytown, USA.

So, even if this was economically feasible, I doubt it would stem the tide of illegal immigrants, especially given the cost of living in someplace like Cancun or Acapulco compared to, say, Pachuca (interior) It's like comparing the cost of living in Palm Beach or Manhattan to someplace nobody's ever heard of in South Dakota. It's not like every Mexican works for a US corporation. I imagine places like McDonald's and Pizza Hut have absolutely no problems filling their staff paying them as they currently do, because I imagine the jobs are highly sought after and pay well relative to most others.

Just curious, any idea how much they do get paid? I don't even know how much they get paid here - $7.25?

Originally posted by newyorkee
Speaker, I know man..I just see that most arguments made about imigration only encompass relative neighbors while in reality the entire world contributes to the dilema...I know the differance.

Well, NewYorkee, that's because there are an estimated 7-8 million from Mexico out of the 12 million illegals in this country. I personally think it's closer to 20 million than 12, but will go with the conservative figure.

Let's say that there are 20 million illegals here in the states, at that ratio, the number from Mexico and Latin America would probably at least number 13-14 million.

This sounds like a great idea to me...at first. But then I had to wonder, what makes these US companies send business south in the first place? To save money. And what would happen if those companies couldn't save money by sending work to Mexico? They would pull out and return the jobs to the US, thereby setting more Mexicans out of work, increasing the need to go North to look for work.

But this may only apply to manufacturing jobs, economics aren't my strong point. I do agree that service based industry should up the pay scale to US standards, at least then it wouldn't be such a slap in the face to everyone involved.

Good thinking OP!!

That's a good idea, perhaps (I don't know much about economics), but an improbable one. A bill unfavorable to the business dealings of multinational corporations would likely get shot down in Congress very quickly. It also wouldn't take much funding on the part of these businesses to start "grass-roots" opposition campaigns to government meddling in the market and so forth.

Not to be an arrogant ass but I think have a simpler idea: just remove the barriers to the free flow of labor. Barriers to the flow of trade, capital, services, etc. have been deconstructed to different degrees, as far as I know. The barriers to the flow labor remain, though, and are even being strengthened it seems (i.e. Mexican-American border wall, the Minutemen). I think the problem is that Big Macs, pizzas, and Home Depot kitchen sinks don't have any national loyalties, while laborers do.

You have absolutely no idea how money works whatsoever. I recommend Richard Maybury's "What Happened to Penny Candy". But seriously, one of the biggest flaws of our education system is that people grow up not having a clue how money and economies work.

so trauma, speak so as to enlighten,

[edit on 14-8-2007 by newyorkee]

I think you saw those there because you were a tourist in a tourist area. If they make five dollars a day I doubt the mainland and mexico city has too many KFCs. Who would pay a day's wage for a sandwich?

Originally posted by ThaDewd
Well i think just on a moral standpoint, we should not be allowed to import anything into America that was made by people making a wage( or workinging conditions ) that would be illegal here. Non of this moving out the country for cheaper labor. I guess it would suck pretty bad though cause then we'd have to pay more for everything. But this would probably make more companies stay here , creating more job, which I here was good for the economy.

How about adding quality in their country by insisting on the quality in yours. What would the requirement of the proper finances to survive(so's ya don't pay welfare for them)do to inhance the quality of their work. Perhaps if they had money this would also contain another requirement which could be a college education, ya think?

I'm just tired of "tired, wretched and poor, yearning to be free", doing too much wrong and costing way too much. Illegal immigrants aren't coming here to support the country if they illegally enter. I doubt that someone who rows a shore in a rubber life raft is a wall street broker. More like stole along wall street, and the next spy. These persons should make a credible entrance before expecting acceptance. Illegal is illegal and despite that fish's size, weight, race, capability, or need, it ought to be thrown back.


[edit on 1-8-2008 by rightwingnut]