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Mexican activist attempts to burn American Flag-key word "attempts"

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posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 09:03 AM
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Originally posted by Boondock78
i like all the patriots that talk about or imply physical harm......you guys are super....thats the way to protect what the flag means....beat people up for excercising rights 'the flag' is supposed to symbolize.


You know, I think what it boils down to is "fightin' words" versus meaningful debate/dialogue. The act was meant to be inflammatory (no pun intended) and at that point it doesn't matter if the guy had just hopped a fence 10 minutes before or had family that set their feet on Plymouth Rock.

If a Protestant had a beef with the Catholic Church and decided to exercise their religious freedom by buying a statue of the Virgin Mary and performing unspeakable acts upon it in a public setting, yes, he is engaging in "expression". But he had better be prepared to suffer the consequences at the hands of the offended party.

If a N.E. Patriots fan walked into Mcafee Coliseum and begins loudly orating on the sexual preferences of the home team, their mother's questionable lineage and the possibility that fans of said team may have an undue fondness for barnyard denizens, what do you think is going to happen? I think we all know the answer to that! I think the reaction would be much greater than that of the man who confiscated the American flag, there might be enough to put in a shoe-box, but not by much.


So, was it his "right" to engage in this form of expression? Apparently so. Was it smart? No. In my eyes, did he get off easy? Yes.

All I'm saying is that just because you may have a right to do something, doesn't mean that it is right and proper to do so. I think that all of the above protesters, both hypothetical and actual, should realize that their protest could result in a disturbing the peace or inciting to riot charge, and shouldn't even complain about the physical consequences of such an act.




posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
Bullcrap. I can give you dozens of instances where it is proper for John Q. Public to step in and take action against some unsafe deed.


please...i am curious as to the dozens of instances....

you know you're all using that as a cop out....nobody is really concerned with the burning of 'something' in public....only cause it is the flag are people uptight.

if he would have lit his guns n roses shirt on fire, i seriously doubt people would care that he was burning something in public....

either way, it's not your place to stop it unless you're a cop...still would like to see your list though....

also, would this be a list that is just stuff you put together from your opinion?



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 09:16 AM
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Originally posted by Sky Eyes
You know, I think what it boils down to is "fightin' words" versus meaningful debate/dialogue. The act was meant to be inflammatory (no pun intended)

If a Protestant had a beef with the Catholic Church and decided to exercise their religious freedom by buying a statue of the Virgin Mary and performing unspeakable acts upon it in a public setting, yes, he is engaging in "expression". But he had better be prepared to suffer the consequences at the hands of the offended party.


So, was it his "right" to engage in this form of expression? Apparently so. Was it smart? No. In my eyes, did he get off easy? Yes.

All I'm saying is that just because you may have a right to do something, doesn't mean that it is right and proper to do so.


maybe it was meant to be inflammatory...so what? again, it is his right

about the whole church thing....yeah, you better be prepared to suffer the consequences of the religious folk getting their feelings hurt....have your feelings hurt or being offended by something someone says or does, does not give you the right to take their property and/or lay your hands on them...not by a long shot.

as far as it being smart to do...apparently it is not cause we have a lot of patriots that get their feelings hurt pretty bad so even though we have the right to 'speak' in that way in this country, apparently we face physical harm while doing it...

define proper for me please

personally, i don't care about proper...it was legal. he was within his rights.
imo, people need to get their feelings in check,

if someone burning a flag bothers you that much, then i think the problem lay with you(not you personally..i mean whoever gets uptight over it)...

it's not about good taste or bad taste. it's not about being proper..

it is about the right to 'speak' like that....

is that not what the country is about? is that not one of the things the flag 'stands for'" the right to free speech...?

goes back to what i said earlier.....

freedom of speech as long as we don't say anything...
a lot of this patriotic crap realy gets on my nerves.
especially the e-tough guys here that 'better not see someone burning a flag', or else!!!!!!!

total load.....


i mean, when someone i saying something you don't like, we can always fall back on physical harm right?
ha



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 11:42 AM
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Ya know, if he really hates America that much, let him go back home to Mexico.

Simple, problem solved.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 11:47 AM
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Just because someone does something that you don't like, it doesn't mean that they should be disciplined or kicked out of the country. We have the right to say and do pretty much any dumb thing we can think of here.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:14 PM
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You know, I see alot of comments about rights and american's side and mexican's side...but in all reality lets look at this country in retrospect.

American continent = originally populated by native americans.
SouthAmerican continent= originally populated by native americans.
Mexicans = native americans.

Where dont they have a right to be here. You think a group people forget what was for thousands of years because for a couple hundred some one says different. Accept them. This is their home.

Flag burning is really an irrelevant issue. Protest is a crucial part of a democratic society. If you dont understand...dont care, or dont agree then walk away.

People may disagree with you but If you like democracy then you'd better hold the oppinoin that that is ok. Whats more you should be ready to defend their right to do so.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:20 PM
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posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:23 PM
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Also, it should be mentioned that it was another hispanic man that took the flag away from the creature that was trying to burn it. So, kudos to him for standing up for what he believed in and for what is right.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:25 PM
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Also, for those that don't understand, burning a flag is NOT a form of speech; it is an ACT... Big difference there.

[edit on 30-7-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Well maybe yopu liberals should give up the whole political correctness garbage that you all seem to think so highly of. After all, it's all based on not hurting someone's FEELINGS... Get my drift??


Interesting statement. He disagrees with you so he's a liberal? I don't know that he is. Dontcha just love labels.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:30 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Also, for those that don't understand, burning a flag is NOT a form of speech; it is an ACT... Big difference there.
[edit on 30-7-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]


It may be an ACT as you stated, but the Supreme Court says is covered under freedom of SPEECH. I thought you weren't going to participate in this thread anymore anyways? You praise the guy who took away the flag for "standing up for his beliefs," completely ignoring that the guy who was going to burn the flag was standing up for HIS beliefs. I guess one can only legitametely stand up for beliefs if they agree with you??

edit:typo

[edit on 30-7-2007 by ninthaxis]



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:32 PM
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Intrepid, well.... If you argue from a liberal standpoint, and believe me, the whole "we have a right to burn the flag" is a very liberal standpoint of view, then you are likely to get labeled as such. It really doesn't matter to me if he's liberal or not, I am just making the statement that going by his whole "feelings" argument, it can be applied to a whole host of politically correct garbage that the liberals have instituted into the United States. They have made it to where you can't say anything anymore without someone being "offended."


[edit on 30-7-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Intrepid, well.... If you argue from a liberal standpoint, and believe me, the whole "we have a right to burn the flag" is a very liberal standpoint of view, then you are likely to get labeled as such. It really doesn't matter to me if he's liberal or not, I am just making the statement that going by his whole "feelings" argument, it can be applied to a whole host of poluitically correct garbage that the liberals have instituted into the United States.


Seems like the Supreme Court doesn't agree:


The first federal Flag Protection Act was passed by Congress in 1968 in response to protest burnings of the flag at demonstrations against the Vietnam War.[3] Over time, 48 of the 50 U.S. states also enacted similar flag protection laws as well. All of these statutes were overturned by the Supreme Court of the United States by a 5-4 vote in the case Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989) as unconstitutional restrictions of public expression.

After the Johnson decision, Congress quickly passed a new Flag Protection Act, which was also struck down by the Supreme Court the following year by the same 5-4 majority in the case United States v. Eichman, 496 U.S. 310 (1990). The Court decided that expression through flag burning was constitutionally protected.


en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by ninthaxis
You praise the guy who took away the flag for "standing up for his beliefs," completely ignoring that the guy who was going to burn the flag was standing up for HIS beliefs. I guess one can only legitametely stand up for beliefs if they agree with you??

edit:typo

[edit on 30-7-2007 by ninthaxis]


And you conveniently left out the second part of my statement, didn't cha'? "He stood up for his beliefs and did the RIGHT thing."



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Well maybe yopu liberals should give up the whole political correctness garbage that you all seem to think so highly of. After all, it's all based on not hurting someone's FEELINGS... Get my drift??


dude, don't label me with the pc crowd...you obviously don't know me that well. i am about as fed up with PC crap as anyone could be...
i am simply arguing this cause i think it is asinine that the patriots want to kick some butt or take some property cause someone is using their right to speak.....

i am not pc..political correctness has gone crazy, but that is for another thread...just wanted you to now you're way, way off base with me on that one.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

And you conveniently left out the second part of my statement, didn't cha'? "He stood up for his beliefs and did the RIGHT thing."


I left out the subjective part of your quotation because I fail to see your justification for it not being right? Exercising one's rights isn't wrong because it hurts joe-schmoe's feelings, sorry.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
And you conveniently left out the second part of my statement, didn't cha'? "He stood up for his beliefs and did the RIGHT thing."


No, he didn't do the right thing. He was the only one here that could be charged. Petty theft.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:40 PM
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posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Also, it should be mentioned that it was another hispanic man that took the flag away from the creature that was trying to burn it. So, kudos to him for standing up for what he believed in and for what is right.


you're a real piece of work you know that..?
now we can't even refer to the man as a person/man/human....you're so hurt about it you have to resort to calling him a creature....i'm lumped with the liberal and pc crowd cause i don't agree with you and frankly, think pretty low of you now after some of the stuff you have put in here.

how someone gets THAT hurt over a guy trying to burn a flag is beyond me...clearly you have stronger opinions towards this cotton that you do towards peoples rights and them actually excercising them...

as i said, friggin warped.



posted on Jul, 30 2007 @ 12:41 PM
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To be a liberal or not to be, Do you think that anyone with real political power would identify with either side of the spectrum. They may hold beliefs that leen more to one side than the other...depending on how you interpret the situation, but in reality our leaders understand that it is all relative. Both are needed so as to keep us on opposite sides of the fence. to chose one or the other is to accept that we are not a single country but rather a conglomerate of 2 sides. That is no form of unity, we are then divided. Stop identifying with one side over the other. This is one country. Its not the liberals who are messing it up...not the conservatives...its your leaders.



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