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ATS closes all threads about pot?

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posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by Project_Silo
So as i understand it,on the biggest serious alternative talk website in the world we can't share our spiritual or truly lifechanging experiences with anyone else?


Huh? Sure you can, any and or ALL.

You just can't roll out onto the boards reflecting on the effects and or experiences from last night's blunt ... or other illegal substance abuse.

Perhaps you missed my previous post above. (?)


It really is That simple.
?

 

[edit: to add link]

[edit on 27-7-2007 by 12m8keall2c]




posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:40 PM
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What I see is a persecution of certain "illegal" activities. There's 1000's of posts on "how to break into Area 51" and the like, yet discussion of infiltrating a secure government facility is allowed. I bet if any one of the plans involved getting high, they'd be deleted, but instead the discussion mere infiltration, either by technology or brute hostile force is allowed.

That's just one example, there are many others, NWO "I'm not going to concentration camp" posts discussing evasion and even antipersonnel tactics. Last time i checked evading the law was illegal, as well as armed insurgency against the (however injust or wrong) government, yet this is allowed.

Okay, something else a little less let's-overthrow-the-government-y flavored threads and look at the survival forum. Lots of info there on using plants and animals. Hunting out of season, and by many "survival" methods are illegal in a lot of states. Harvesting anything in the parks, state or national, and on lots of other type of wilderness land is also illegal. How about the posts in the survival forum about "who to eat first" at the Donner Diner, discussing premeditated murder for the purpose of cannibalism. Yeah, that sounds like a perfectly legal activity.

How about that new 7/17 presidential order? Can posting anything that's not pro-iraq be considered illegal activity? That you'll probably only figure out it is while you're being dragged off to eastern europe on CI-Air though.



2e.) Illegal Activity: Discussion of any illegal activities such as drug use, drug paraphernalia, hacking, sexual relations with minors, etc. are strictly forbidden.


Is there an exemption for discussion of certain illegal activities and/or illegal activities performed by others? As the T&C reads, "any illegal activity", with such a broad statement, that would apply as far as discussing current events where a crime was committed. Discussing details of a murder or a "terrorist" act seems to fit very well within this discussion of illegal activity.

I'm not whining because i can't brag about how high i may get, but because there seems to be a fundamental flaw with the T&C in this aspect, or just hypocracy. As soon as any anecdotal is mentioned about the benefits, it's acted upon as if we're trying to sell state secrets. Without the ability for anyone to tell their side of the story, all that's left is propaganda. Denying ignorance, huh?

Also, as mentioned earlier, illegal where? If i came on and posted something like, say, walking through the middle of town with a couple shotguns slung over my shoulders, two .45's on my hips, a .38 shoved in my waistband and a .45 lever action in hand, which i've done, and which is HIGHLY illegal in places like NYC, but in my state i can freely open carry. Yeah, sometimes tourists see me walking back through town with the armory and freak out, but i've never been stopped by cops, unless they wanted to BS about guns. If i was in NY or Philly i'd probably catch more lead than Amadu Diallo before i could "freeze".

Same thing here with cannabis, our doctors' notes hold up in court, and with the recommendation, cops won't even confiscate a medical patient's stash if it's just a case of simple possession with a note because it'll never hold up in court. If you're a kid getting high the cops will bust you cause you probably don't have back pain, glaucoma, or alzheimers and no medical recommendations. Therefore (hypothetically speaking:@@
if i had a note, and i was sitting in the park minding my own, not making a scene, just sitting on a bench smoking cannabis by myself, and the cops drive by and see me, i wave, they wave back.

Or what about when I "hypothetically" visit Canada, and stop into the cafe in the middle of downtown Van. When one blazes a fatty in the "smoking area", that individual committed no crime, violated no law, and no illegal activity took place. Therefore if I post about how, let's say for fiction's sake, that i smoked out in the "smoking area" with businesspeople on their lunch break, old ladies hippies, rastas, punkrockers, the asian kids, and all manner of "normal everyday" people, in a lawful setting, then there should be no reason why i can't talk about my "fictional
" legal drug experience.

Let's say now that because the board is based in the US that US law applies, and if i talk about the violation of US law, then fine, but in the above "fictional" account i never violated a single US law if i went abroad and had my experience.

What i'm getting at is that half the posts on this board violate the T&C in this respect but that's okay, as long as we don't discuss the "devil weed". While we're busy denying ignorance, we shouldn't forget to deny hypocracy and double-standardism.

Now i'm off to NOT smoke pot!



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:44 PM
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yes i saw your post above....

Did you read the part in my post about poeple sharing life changing spiritual experiences?Certain drugs have been used throughout history to provoke visions and such.I feel this is a important issue that poeple should be able to share with poeple.

Anyway to make a topic forum for that specific thing?that way those who want to share spiritual experiences can,and those who dont want any part of it don't have to hear it...

For being number one you would think ats would be more open to these types of discussions.I hear them often on coast to coast and other outlets.Its just like any other subject.........

Hell if you guys dont want to break the law then you better stop allowing post about the Iraq war and 911.You could be thwarting the stabalization process of Iraq.

See my point??Your totally writing off a whole subject because it is illegal.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:53 PM
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Well, POO. There go all my interesting tales about how heroin and ketamine are secretly good for you.

I feel oppressed! Darn you, mods! Darn you to heck!




posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by Project_Silo


See my point??Your totally writing off a whole subject because it is illegal.


Yes, I see your point. Where do we stop though? Do we allow the discussion on what a pedophile did last night. That's illegal, but not everywhere in the world. Hell we could probably get NAMBLA to sponsor that.


As to the poster before you, most of those examples are hypothetical, ie: the Survival forum. Breaking into Area 51? Yeah, like someone is actually going to try that. Come on back to the real world. If you just want to bitch about ATS, please, just be open about it. We can take it. We, members and staff, are damn used to it.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:57 PM
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This decision to limit discussion of a few key "illegal" items was not made lightly, and they really are limited to a handful of topics...
1) drug use
2) sex with minors
3) computer hacking (in the strict sense)
4) racially motivated hate

If you really have an interest in these items, there are dozens of websites where advocacy of these topics are a primary focus.

However, ATS chooses to focus it's attention on mature and sober discussion of a number of "alternative" topics... just not these. In our 10-year history, we've discovered (the hard way) that enabling these types of topics does two things we'd rather avoid:
1) Attracts disruptive participants
2) Puts our domains on automated filtering lists

The issues many of our members discuss on ATS are very important to them, and to us (owners). There has been tremendously productive speculation on a broad range of conspiracy topics that attracts a significant number of new users and exposes our member's compelling contributions. Certainly, anyone who respects the topics and members of ATS would have no problem with understanding a few simple guidelines?

These rather simple rules have been in place for just over four years. In that time, we've grown from a barely noticeable website to the 4,163rd most popular site in the world (out of 20,255,768 sites tracked by QuantCast). It's not hard to realize that one of the factors of our rise to prominence is our limited but strict content guidelines.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Project_Silo


See my point??Your totally writing off a whole subject because it is illegal.


Yes, I see your point. Where do we stop though? Do we allow the discussion on what a pedophile did last night. That's illegal, but not everywhere in the world. Hell we could probably get NAMBLA to sponsor that.


As to the poster before you, most of those examples are hypothetical, ie: the Survival forum. Breaking into Area 51? Yeah, like someone is actually going to try that. Come on back to the real world. If you just want to bitch about ATS, please, just be open about it. We can take it. We, members and staff, are damn used to it.


Pedophiles?your completely blowing this off topic because i have a godo point.You guys are completely ruling out a whole genre of poeple because its against the law.well so is half the stuff on this website......

How can you claim number one and totally deny these poeple the right to express their life styles and ways.

And i already stated delete post in the new forum that are about a crazy weekend.I'm talking about poeple who use certain drugs for spiritual purposes.The poeple who fast and set everything up and do it once a month or whatever..These serious poeple deserve an outlet and i think ATS is the right place..

Please don't get absured with compairing this to pedophiles and such,thats blatently reaching way way to far..Stay on topic and answer the questions.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:01 PM
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See that was what i was looking for skeptic over lord..You answered my questions well and now i understand..

By infact allowing poeple to discuss these expierences the website would suffer through filterings and other matters.I now understand,i still think its a shame but i would not compromise my website either....

well thanks again.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:06 PM
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Nevermind, I see the Boss answered this.

[edit on 27-7-2007 by intrepid]



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:12 PM
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Originally posted by Project_Silo
yes i saw your post above....
...
See my point??Your totally writing off a whole subject because it is illegal.


BUT,
It would also seem that you missed, Entirely, my point regarding the effects that Content Filtering may or could have on the subjects that we discuss on ATS.

Want your thoughts and or opinions available to as Many as possible? Discuss the ISSUE(s), not personal use and or "I tripped" experiences.

Want your thoughts and or opinions Filtered down to a Much smaller audience?
Go elsewhere. Honestly.

Change happens in numbers, and those numbers are Not achieved by sources being filtered based on the overall content within.

Experiences? Have at it ... WE're all ears.

I toked some Ganja and had a dream? ... not gonna cut it.


What part of issues versus personal use is it that remains unclear?

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
As for the user above comparing "Let's break into A51" to this ...
Apples and oranges, my friend.

There IS a difference. Actuality versus Probability. The math required to ascertain such would seem quite shy of Intermediate ... in my opinion.

? thoughts ?

[edit: just noticed SO's comment]



[edit on 27-7-2007 by 12m8keall2c]



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:23 PM
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Out of curiosity, stating the approved

"Marijuana should be legalized"

vs the banned

"I smoke marijuana"

still has the primary word of marijuana. If the criminal content *marijuana* is the same in both instances, how does is a content filter able to differentiate between the two?



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:37 PM
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Its very clear im not talking strictly about pot here man,use your head.And i dont care about reaching a million poeple,i never once stated anything close to resembling that.I'm saying you are denying a group of poeple to discuss "alternative topics" wich this website was buildt on.....

Spiritual,and emotional developement is a very real issue to me.....I'm sorry they don't reach the point of real issues for you,but they do so for many many others out there..

And the poster above me brought up a good topic,how does the filter tell the difference,were still saying pot right now.........

Also please re read my post,i made it very clear i don't think posts about tripping at a party or smoking pot are valid.Im talking about poeple who take this seriously.I'm not even one of them but i have found it very odd that you guys do not permit any talk what so ever about this.

But i see a modirator would rather just tell me and everyone who does these things for spiritual and emotional purposes to go somewhere else.

[edit on 27-7-2007 by Project_Silo]



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:40 PM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
still has the primary word of marijuana. If the criminal content *marijuana* is the same in both instances, how does is a content filter able to differentiate between the two?


Context AND content, Raso ... with the sum total given further consideration.

While keywords DO play a part, the Context of such has since been incorporated into most Famly filters, if you will. They're not, nor have they ever been, perfect, but they have advanced as to relevancy ... much as the various engines.

At the very least, I see the goal as to keeping ATS at or near a G or PG-13 rating ... thereby ensuring that which we discuss the broadest audience.

Others' mileage may vary, but that's my thoughts.

??

 



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:44 PM
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Originally posted by Project_Silo
Spiritual,and emotional developement is a very real issue to me.....I'm sorry they don't reach the point of real issues for you,but they do so for many many others out there..


This is very simple then. Go to websites that adhere to those values for those topics. Would you deny EVERYTHING else that ATS has to offer someone because you wanted to discuss this here and thus ATS was blocked from them?



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:52 PM
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i would not deny everything ats does to anyone.

First of all let me just say.i find it amusing how my questions and points cannot be discussed or answered.Skeptic answered me pretty well but no one else at all.

Im simply saying,this website was buildt and is now number one on alternative topics yes or no?

Wellllll,this is a alternative topic and it simply wont be tolerated.Lol so far you have compaired the purely spiritual taking of a drug to pedophilia..
I'm very shocked to see you intrepid and the other mod making rash or mocking statements over and over..

The same kind of statements that my past posts and im sure many others have been edited for.Why is this such a sensative topic that you guys break your own rules?

The only person who stated clear reasons why not and addressed the issues directly without mocking me was Skeptic.I guess 1 out of 3 mods isnt to bad

[edit on 27-7-2007 by Project_Silo]



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:55 PM
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Project Silo,

I think you're still not Getting it ... with regards to the Seeming fine line.

Personal use of illegal substances, discussion of experiences while under the influence of said substances, What happened last night ... after downing a bottle of cough syrup ('___'). (?)

That plane doesn't fly from this airport.

I think "X" should be reconsidered for legalization, and here is why ...

There are 1000 uses for "X", and it would reduce our carbon footprint ...

Is "X" a means by which to discover a higher plane of mental awareness?


ALL of the above can be Discussed without references to individual usage. no?

? thoughts ?



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 06:56 PM
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I see the point about filtering, but we're talking about filtering the reality of about 50% (conservative estimate) of the population who have had an experience with cannabis. What weighs heavily though is that the issue of the legality is being stifled by this filtering.

So IE ATS is bowing to the censors, the same censors whose mission it is to ensure ignorance is prevalent, yet claiming to deny said ignorance by silencing the TRUTH?

Because that's what people are relating in these posts, the TRUTH, not the BS that the aforementioned censors pump through their fact filtration. We're not making false statements, that's big pharm and big corp on that end. Oh yeah, and we don't want to make too much noise because we might cut in on the CIA's south american racket to fund black ops. After all we can't have too many people realizing that the war on weed keeps us all imprisoned by the CIA's cartels and ensures the reign of terror. Weed kills and all this other "reefer madness" propaganda has virtually no counterpoint because anyone that stands up and says "i smoke weed because it keeps me healthy" is either silenced or ridiculed as a communist hippie "doper".

I can understand censoring when it comes to stuff like how to cook crack or freebase or pop H, or make meth, because all that is pharmaceutical, be it black market or otherwise, but as far as cannabis, check the history. It's been around as long as humans have been, and has co-evolved to help humans cope with environmental stresses. It's fast growing properties and many uses allowed the spread of civilization from "the cradle" (evidence of this can be found especially in the southward migrations through PNG and into N Aus. around 110,000BP as well as significant use by neanderthal man) and the plant's THC matches our THC receptors, lessening a group of symptoms collectively known as ENSR, or ExcitoNeuroendocrinal Stress Response. The UV-B radiation that is one of the leading factors contributing to ENSR is what stimulates production of THC in proportion to the amount of melanin produced in the presence of strong UV-B. Humans are well adapted to take advanatge of the benefits of this plant when taken internally, and all parts of the plant are useful.

Fast forward to about 80 years ago when a NWO reptilian shapeshifter Anslinger hit the scene and wanted to get rid of all the mexicans. He made a law based on nothing that was selectively enforced to "weed out" dissidents by having the ability to bust the mexicans and blacks because they all had weed back then, it was part of their culture. Whitey had weed too, fields of the dank, but those were the hemp plantations, and whitey ran that, so it's all good, but if you're brown, watch out!

Shortly after companies like Dupont and 3m decided the world needed more synthetic fiber, because we had all this oil, trillions of barrels, and cheap, and they'd also be able to work the oil markets and really make bank. Only problem was that there were fields pf hemp that offered an alternative that didn't have enough bid/ask margin on the exchange, so it also was phased out. By 1961 the UN joined the witch hunt and shortly thereafter OPEC sprang up, another NWO move on the board.

In the Nixon days it was reclassified and penalties made harsher, they got rid of the mexicans for a while (but they'll be back), and instead were left with a bunch of flower power hippie dopers whose perception of freedom didn't matter in the eyes of the NWO, and a movement that preached peace and unity was opposed by the government. Nixon was Anslinger and the hippies were the mexicans, history repeats itself again and again as a generation forgets, and is reminded by the "free" society that they can't legally do what our ancestors have been doing since time immemorial. Silencing the cannabis users is allowing us to keep the "mexicans", whatever demographic they may represent in whatever generation embraces herb and freedom, down.


So yeah, i guess i was wrong thinking that ATS is denying all the ignorance.

Maybe it should be ATS:Mostly denying ignorance.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 07:01 PM
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Here we go again


Originally posted by Project_Silo
i would not deny everything ats does to anyone.


But you WOULD if we allowed this. That seems a little selfish to me. I can't access BTS at work. I have NO idea why but that's the case. Say someone's only access to a computer IS at work. If we allow this topic and it gets blocked because of it, we would be denying someone of ALL the material at ATS.


First of all let me just say.i find it amusing how my questions and points cannot be discussed or answered.Skeptic answered me pretty well but no one else at all.


Personally I find it annoying that you won't get the point. Go elsewhere if you want to discuss this. No biggie.


Im simply saying,this website was buildt and is now number one on alternative topics yes or no?


Yes it is. And the reason for this is the T&C. Now you want this changed? Seems illogical to me.


The same kind of statements that my past posts and im sure many others have been edited for.Why is this such a sensative topic that you guys break your own rules?

odd


I've checked your posts, they were only edited by you. We aren't breaking our own rules, just enforcing them. S.O. has explained this to you. It seems to me that you just want to pick a fight. No sense there man, the rules aren't going to change for you. They've served us, ALL MEMBERS, well.

Like I've said, you want to discuss this, go to a site that encourages it.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 07:03 PM
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thanks for a non hostile response lol.

Yes i do completely understand where the line is.I don't hink you understand im talking about professionals(if there could be such a thing).I'm not talking about the average joe blow.

I'm saying the poeple who do it once a month or once a year or whenever they do it..They do it for a purely spiritual reason,maybe they fast before and after and do a ceremony or something.Like shamans or whatever.

All i know is like every ancient culture and some current cultures used these for purely spiritual purposes.You see what im saying?So the stories would not be oh yesterday i got tanked and saw green men jumping on my bed.

I'm talking about the poeple who are dead serious,they do not use substances anytime but for strict ceramonies. I have heard a couple of them on Coast to Coast but i can't remember the names right now.

The fact is i do understand what your saying,but your talking about the average joe user and im talking about the once a year for a ceramonie to talk to whatever god or look inside yourself person.



posted on Jul, 27 2007 @ 07:05 PM
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ATS denies ignorance. You can talk hypothetically about cannabis all you like. You can't personalize it, unless you have a doctor's recommendation for medical use, which is how I've been allowed to talk about certain things nobody else has gotten away with.

it's the 3 Amigos' board, they set the rules, arguing about it isn't going to change the rules.

i hear where you're coming from, but you need to hear the mods and everyone else -- hypothetical discussion, political discussion, medical discussion is OK, personal stories about personal (illegal) use is not allowed.

What's the issue?



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