Originally posted by gavind5uk
as far as im concerned cctv is a great thing in this country, they can film me every day of the week if they like because im not out in the public
committing crimes, which after is what cctv is for, and if civil liberties group honestly think that it has no effect on crime rates then they
obviously run by very stupid people, it stops criminals committing a crime if they have half the sense to realise that they are going to get caught on
camera and for the ones that do commit the crimes anyway cctv gives the whole public a positive id on the people doing it, true it might not always
stop crime but when you sit at home watching a tv programs showing how pedophiles attempting to run off with small children are caught on cctv
and then we able to be arrested by the police because of the footage, i am definatly of the opinion that when it helps stop people like that then
being filmed every day of the week is certainly a price im willing to pay.
I'd love to know what you base that on, and I'm also amazed that you're not looking at the bigger picture here. Ignorance is bliss.
You are however really overlooking 3 key factors. Does CCTV really prevent crime at all? Who actually has control of the usage of CCTV? Who has
control over what information is obtained from CCTV and what rights
do you have?
First off there is absolutely NO evidence that CCTV prevents crime. It's only effective on small petty crimes or not effective at all. That's
hardly worth the tax spent on it is it? Studies have shown that more would be done to deter crimes if streets were better lit and more police were
walking the beat.
"The National Association for the Care and Resettlement of Offenders (Nacro) revealed that Home Office statistics show crime fell in 13 of the 24
cases studied after CCTV cameras were installed but crime rates rose significantly in four others.
BBCNews CCTV: Does it deter crime?
"The organization said lower-tech crime-busting strategies such as improved street lighting are significantly better at reducing criminal
Areas need to be appropriately policed, not remotely policed," she said. "Given the choice between walking down a dark alley monitored by CCTV or
having that alley adequately lit, which would you prefer? CCTV is not a panacea.
The study found that cameras had no effect on violent crime and were most effective when used to curb thefts from cars.
'Big Brother' Cameras Have Little
Effect On Crime
the report also says that the cameras "make people feel safe." which is something I will call on later.
Did you know that alot of the companies in control of CCTV are private security companies, and that there is absolutely no higher group to check how
they operate them or what they do with the information?
Here are some good articles you might want to take a look at, see how much you have nothing to fear if you don't commit a crime.
Who's watching the watchers?
Big Brother Britain, 2004
As for what rights we have and who owns the content of what is found on the footage, well, the laws are a joke. There are also no regulations as to
who operates these cameras which in the future could be a serious problem with the digital revolution from people who could zoom in and see you keying
pin numbers, security codes e.t.c.
"The use of cameras to film people in the street is banned in Germany, Canada and several other countries. But it is accepted practice in Britain,
which is alone in not having a privacy law that protects people against constant surveillance. The Data Protection Act states that the public has to
be informed that CCTV systems are in operation, and be told how they can exercise their legal right to see their own footage. But civil rights groups
said many councils, shops and businesses were failing to provide this information, and they estimated that up to 70 per of CCTVcamera operators were
breaking the rules.
"Some shopping-centre security guards use the cameras to track "socially undesirable" people, such as groups of teenage boys or rough sleepers,
around stores, and then eject them even if they have done nothing wrong.
Now regardless of what you think about the yobs it is actually against the law
. These private companies are taking the law into their own
hands and throwing your rights out the window. They are now being selective of who they want there, will everyone eventually have to conform? Do you
support this? I hope not.
Did you know that there are no laws to protect your image rights on these cameras? They can very well just go out and sell the footage to anyone they
like. They can show it anywhere. Employers can take the footage home and do lewd things with footage of YOU.
If they caught you falling over in the street they could sell it to You've Been Framed
and there's not a damn thing you can do about it.
Did you know there are no known regulations for how people are employed to operate CCTV? There could be peadophiles, burglars e.t.c. casing you and
your kids and you wouldn't have a clue.
Because of it not being public property did you know you can't go and view the footage yourself if needed? You have no rights to the footage,
shouldn't it be public property? These guys can do anything with it.
Oh, and then there's the things they can do under the guise of "suspicion of terrorism".
"What has happened to the faces of all the thousands of innocent travelers who were no doubt videoed and possibly run through face recognition
systems ? Is it still on file ? Will it remain on file and get transferred into some HOLMES type statistical weighting system to plague innocent
people with "suspicion of terrorist association" points ?
Take a look at the links which go much more into depth about the confusion over all of this. There doesn't appear to be any laws and no one knows
where this information is being stored. They could make a routine check and you, an innocent man, could be stuck in their logs as a potential
terrorist. Constantly watched through no fault of your own and as a result of lax or no laws.
Now, why do they need so much surveillance? One word, money (isn't it always). Big security firms and the armed industry can make a bucketful out
of their little gadgets and in return the government gets all the information it wants on people. You think that's far fetched? I'm sorry to hear
So why are people in the UK so accepting of CCTV? Simple, they've been scared into it and have falsely been led to believe that it is a deterent.
This is of a result of media hype mainly concerning peadophiles. The way the media goes on you'd believe there are peadophiles on every street
corner, licking their lips waiting to snatch your child when it's unlikely there are anymore now than there has ever been. The media has got parents
scared senseless and wondering what they can do to prevent it.
Then right on que the government steps in and offers CCTV. What? Not more police walking the beat? Not better street lighting? No, CCTV. If you
think this hasn't all been orchestrated you'd better think again. This is kids stuff, the government working with the media that is.
So now they have to convince the public that CCTV is effective. Well, the two biggest cases of CCTV involvment especially in the media are
The James Bulger Murder
and The Holly
Wells and Jessica Chapman Murders
These are the two that are arguabley the most famous uses of CCTV in the media, and what is not surprising is that they both involve kids.
What is very important to remember here is that in both cases CCTV did absolutely nothing
to prevent the crimes, although they remotely helped
in bringing convictions to the murderers. It's important to remember however that these crimes would've been solved without of CCTV.
Why were people convinced that CCTV was useful from all this? Because both times it was responsible for showing the childrens final moments. Such
strong and powerful images never leave anyone's brains of who have seen them, and subconciously this rates to the families, public e.t.c. that it has
somehow served a purpose in crime prevention when in fact it has done no such thing. The power of them final moments seen through CCTV is what made
people get used to it.
Today now we have more conditioning to the idea of surveillance through the media in the form of "Reality TV Shows" such as "I'm a Celebrity, Get
Me Out of Here" and of course the biggest of all "Big Brother". These shows condition us to believe that spying on people is normal and ok. Well
for all our sakes I hope you fight this conditioning, otherwise Big Brother will most certainly be here, and it wont be as entertainment.