Originally posted by forestlady
Marg: Excellent post and thanks for the quote.

Thanks forestlady as usua you keep everything on a even level also, I also agree with many issues Js pointed out but I will always be skeptical of the intentions of our present government.

Originally posted by Melbourne_Militia
another "911" incident is almost a guaranteed and before the next US election.

I will go in that prediction a littler farther, as a slap to all the American people that think and conspiracies on the inside job, they will do it right no the same month as the first 9/11.

Occurs this just an opinion.

Originally posted by grover
BTW Josbecky... you seem like an intelligent person; (articles like this one aside) why is it so difficult for you to see that bush minor and dick cheney's assertions of power bode ill for this country and will ultimately have to be checked? We both love our country that is obvious; there must be some common ground to address these issues as Americans, not Republicans or democrats.

[edit on 20-7-2007 by grover]

First of all, you are correct, this isn't a R vs D thing. I register as an independent. An indy can have liberal or conservative leanings. Mine tend toward the conservative in fiscal and military matters, liberal in social issues. Much like many, if not the majority, of Americans, I would say.

When I see these cries for impeachment, I remember that impeachment is an indictment of criminal behavior. And what I see from your side is not a statement of specific crimes, but simply a difference in philosophy between you and Bush. You're mad because he has the power.

So in your frustration, you resort to alarmism and blaming Bush and Cheney for everything under the sun. You never step back and realize just how silly some of these accusations you make really are. They just aren't grounded in common sense at all. But what they do do is to get people stirred up. People who think the same way that you do. And you take that as validation that what you say is true.

Now, you have every right to believe what you want. But there is no police state, no concentration camps, no master plan to enslave us through fear. Our country is going thorough some very trying times right now, and the people we have elected to represent us have failed us time and time again, but that doesn't equate to imminent martial law. We've been through much worse in my lifetime, and martial law was never invoked. Our country is much stronger than that. We won't collapse because some people are saying that the sky is falling.

yeah i remember when he took power riot police lined the street and busted heads there was no fan cheering from sidelines. next day he announced a national day of thanksgiving for such a peaceful transfer of power. within a a week all the orders for server racks that my company made were terminatedand our warehouse filled with product and i lost my job because all the big companies that bought from us said they wanted to wait and see what bush had planned.

Maybe we should organise a "Police State Awareness Day"? As cheesy as that sounds, on a single day, if everybody on ATS (and others ofcourse) who knows about this, stands somewhere with signs or goes out to inform people in the public, it will hit the mainstream media. The key is the gravity of the demonstration, if 5 people in New York and 10 people in California do it, of course its not.

But as you guys have probably heard me say before, the problem with talking to people about 9/11 conspiracy theories (trust me, I have, in school, out of school, family members, I gave a 20 minute improvised speech on 9/11 conspiracy theories to a large group of people...) is that the mainstream media has brainwashed the people into making us look like anti-patriotic uneducated insane terrorist supporters. (Youtube Bill O'reilly :@@

That results in us being flogged in public, on any alternative subject, whether it's 9/11, government exeutive orders (yes, people don't believe me when I tell them about certain executive orders even though i have it in print), and even proven history...

But overtime with a large "grassroots" support, we could either highly slow down or stop this police state. Or atleast end up in a cool sci-fi situation...where we're like the "rebellion" or something. Paticularly when those RFID chips come out...anyway...

I'm sure if we organise to DO SOMETHING rather than just TALK ABOUT IT then something might actually HAPPEN.

Originally posted by proteus33
within a a week all the orders for server racks that my company made were terminatedand our warehouse filled with product and i lost my job because all the big companies that bought from us said they wanted to wait and see what bush had planned.

Really? Is that what your boss told you when he gave you your walking papers?

"Sorry proteus, but we gotta let you go. All the big companies that bought from us said they wanted to wait and see what bush had planned."

That's a real bummer.

Vinci that is very true.
I am from Iraq, but my aunts husband is American.
One day we were watching CNN, they were saying how great
Bush is and he was totally rooting for Bush.
Couple years pass by I went to USA to visit again,
we were watching CNN. They were speaking about
how Bush has failed the people. So then his mind state
changed in a 180 degree turn. He was telling me how Bush
really was evil.
Over the time these American people believe everything they are
told by the mainstream media. Just because they have nowhere
else to turn to.

Okay, here's what I don't understand.

What exactly is the point? What is the point of Bush invoking a police state and taking over like that?

Money? Power?

He's the president of the United States. He's the most powerful man on Earth and has no need for money and never will.

He's old. He'll be dead in 20-odd years. Why go through all the trouble? What's the point?

Originally posted by DazedDave
Okay, here's what I don't understand.

What exactly is the point? What is the point of Bush invoking a police state and taking over like that?

Money? Power?

He's the president of the United States. He's the most powerful man on Earth and has no need for money and never will.

He's old. He'll be dead in 20-odd years. Why go through all the trouble? What's the point?

Maybe it's just not for him. . .
Maybe Bush just speaks on "facts" but who is the person that gives Bush
all the information?

Originally posted by Equinox99

Maybe it's just not for him. . .
Maybe Bush just speaks on "facts" but who is the person that gives Bush
all the information?

But even then...If he's working for someone, that means they have the President in their back pocket. Doesn't get better than that!

"So in your frustration, you resort to alarmism and blaming Bush and Cheney for everything under the sun. You never step back and realize just how silly some of these accusations you make really are."

Okay, what about all the executive privileges he has used, what about commuting Mr. Libby, what about signing a law that gives him ultimate power over our government if something bad were to happen. I just don't trust a man who lives by the philosophy "Do as I say, not as I do". Little Bush is one of the biggest Hippocrates I have ever came across. He says he is for upholding our constitution but has only eroded it. He says he is for peace, but has caused nothing but fear and death. And the whole reason we went to war was a lie. That is not just talk but fact. How many people have died in the Iraq war? Not just Americans but Iraqis as well. How many people have died due to a war that was based on lies? Isn't that criminal? I just don't see how one could say that these things are just accusations. The truth is out there. You just have to search for it. You won't find it on T.V. I will admit that I was a Bush supporter when he first ran. I will admit that I thought that going over to Iraq and helping them oust Saddam was a good idea because it would allow them to live a better life. I will admit I WAS WRONG. It didn't take long to see what was happening. And when I had a question about something the Internet was the answer, not the T.V. There are just too many dots connecting for any of this to be just speculation. If this were a court of law and Bush was on trial, he would have been convicted a long time ago. The evidence is just too much when you actually look for it. And for people who say that this is all speculation and conspiracy theories, I say go do just five minutes of research. When a liar is caught in a lie, what does he do? He shuts up. So when our government refuses to turn over documents or testimonies, what does that say? It says they are hiding something. When our own president says time after time that he is claiming executive privilege, something is not right. Our president shouldn't need to hide things from us. As a nation I think we need to be told exactly what is going on so we can all voice our opinions on what to do. When someone holds the truth to themselves it leave the rest in the dark. So when our government continually hides things from the public, that just shows us that they are not acting on our behalf but only their own.

Isn't it like 600,000 Iraqi's that have died becuase of this war?

Now a seasoned credible Republican is acknowledging what us "wacko conspiracy nuts" have been saying is in the works all along?

I don't know what else people need to hear to understand just how serious this is. I wont repeat again what I've said before but I am just more than happy to see that we have some official out there that has the guts to say what's about to come....

...and it is coming very shortly.

You can also ask yourself this question. Who can
vouch for this Republican? Maybe he just wants to see
Bush fail, and maybe he wants someone else to rule.

You can never know what these politicians are thinking.

Maybe Cheney takes over permanently Saturday???

From CNN:

Cheney to be in charge during Bush colonoscopy

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Vice President Dick Cheney will serve as acting president briefly Saturday while President Bush is anesthetized for a routine colonoscopy, White House spokesman Tony Snow said Friday.

President Bush will transfer power to Vice President Dick Cheney for a few hours Saturday, a spokesman says.

Bush is scheduled to have the medical procedure, expected to take about 2 ½ hours, at the presidential retreat at Camp David, Maryland, Snow said.

Bush's last colonoscopy was in June 2002, and no abnormalities were found, Snow said.

The president's doctor had recommended a repeat procedure in about five years.

The procedure will be supervised by Dr. Richard Tubb and conducted by a multidisciplinary team from the National Naval Medical Center in Bethesda, Maryland, Snow said.

Originally posted by Equinox99
Just because they have nowhere else to turn to.

More like because if they turn anywhere else they wont be "cool" or "sane" or anything else that people think makes life great.

As for the colonoscopy...

Haha, that must be embarrasing, having the entire world know when you get a camera shoved up your ass . I would doubt Cheney could do anything but ever since those new exec orders I'm not sure...

The fact the president can wage war or claim power of the entire executive branch and declare an emergency state without approval of congress is scary, Cheney having those powers is scarier.

This SOB, Paul Craig Roberts?, he's on drugs! Don't listen to this delusioned individual.

Nothing more than a trouble-maker.

People that listen to him are what you would call, let's spell it: P-A-R-A-N-O-I-D!

Say that Bush and Cheney wanted to use WMD against an American city to further a "terrorist agenda" - how would they accomplish this? Wouldn't they need the cooperation of the CIA, FBI, and Military (or atleast segments within them) in order to acquire the materials and logistics need to do it? What if they had another nuclear power do it for them (Russia or China)?

Or am I making it more complex than it really would be?