A bit young for religion?

Originally posted by DenyAllKnowledge

I consider myself as having a understanding of what atheism stands for, just as I think i kind of understand what religion is about. I'm just sorry that this dicussion won't get anywhere.

You obviously do not or you wouldn't be insulting me by saying I'm religious.

Yes, I said it. Your saying that I am religious is insulting. I am in no way religious. In fact, you could say I'm anti-religious.

Atheism does not equal religion. It only is a religion in the minds of people who don't know any better.

i as an atheist have never behaved like this....



thats a lot of people there man....pretty nuts

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
I am in no way religious. In fact, you could say I'm anti-religious.

Atheism does not equal religion. It only is a religion in the minds of people who don't know any better.

one could say that about me..this is a gray area for me though...if you want to worship a picture of the man with the sandals and say grace before every meal, thats cool. have at it....
i'm against all this organized crap like in that vid i posted. i am against these evangelicals that try to push this stuff on the world. i am against the religious folk that try to interfere in others lives cause the book they hold stock in goes against what they are doing...
i am against all those things and i will say it again.

i think religion is plague on this planet and i wish it would go bye bye yesterday. lets give that a shot for a few thousand years and see where we are at

major, you watch that vid?

it's fantastic

I just got up from my nap, and watched it.

All I can say is WTF??? People really do that stuff? Why? What's the mechanism? Is it mass hysteria? Is it a need to act like a freak once in a while because society frowns on it so in every day life, so this is where some folks feel they can let their hair down?

It looked violent. Where is the "love" that is always preached?

I'm so glad I got past my need for religion. What it looks like to me is a bunch of people working themselves up into a frenzy like berserkers used to do, all so that the man yelling at them and pummeling them can get rich off them.

I am going to have to go do some research now in actual scientific papers about that phenomenon.

Thanks for the vid, BD. The metal soundtrack made it all the better.

Hey Boondock, what religion was that? I have never seen anything so crazy. Who the heck would act like that in their right mind? I am not judging but that did seem pretty violent and crazy. Some guy in a suit pushing people around.

I watched the video.

I'd say it was a combination of two things, mass hysteria (have a look at Kreskin - he was doing that stuff as entertainment on TV shows when I was a kid) and the more closer examples where he is touching people look like some kind of nerve pressure/hypnosis thing, he seems to grab people in roughly the same spot. I'm aware of a few techniques for this that can literally "stun" someone for a second or two.

I'd like to know where the vid came from, so I could look at it some more.

As far as religion goes...

If you took a child along to a meeting of the church of the flying spaghetti monster, you'd probably be accused of indocrinating it into a cult. Take one along to a church - which is essentially the same thing - and you wouldn't be. Theres a whole set of hypocrisy around things like that.

I

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
You obviously do not or you wouldn't be insulting me by saying I'm religious.

Yes, I said it. Your saying that I am religious is insulting. I am in no way religious. In fact, you could say I'm anti-religious.

Atheism does not equal religion. It only is a religion in the minds of people who don't know any better.

Oh, here we go with this old song and dance! Don't try and feed us that stuff when I know there are Atheists organizations. Organizations that share a common belief system. Sounds religious to me!

Of course I'm just a stupid abusive Christian, what do I know....

Wish I could hang around and see how this turns out but I am late, so flame away....

Originally posted by jbondo


Oh, here we go with this old song and dance! Don't try and feed us that stuff when I know there are Atheists organizations. Organizations that share a common belief system. Sounds religious to me!

Of course I'm just a stupid abusive Christian, what do I know....

You said it, not me.

Since the atheists are the ones with the non belief, I think we get to apply the label.

We are not a religion. I find it unfortunate that a great many other people can't get that through their heads because they can't conceive of living free of their psychological chains.

[edit on 20-7-2007 by MajorMalfunction]

Originally posted by jbondo
Just keep hammering away at Christians!

Isn't it funny how Atheists have this overwhelming preoccupation with Christians and proving something to us or telling us how stupid we are or calling us abusive for raising our children with a sense of love, spirituality and morality?

Isn't it funny how many Christians automatically assume anyone that doesn't follow one of the main organised monotheistic religions is an Atheist.

It's almost as if they believe their view of God, is the only one possible, and any other view is wrong or blasphemous.

How ego-centric of them!

[edit on 20-7-2007 by VelvetSplash]

There are many good lessons to be learned from a religious education, usually couched in allegory, just as there are bad things to be learned from a religious education, usually in the form of dogma that is out of date with the times...it's up to you and me to discern the wheat from the chaff.

If a lesson is learned that is useful and promotes the commonweal, does it really matter the source of the lesson?

Ignoring a possible source of knowledge because its in the form of religion is being just as foolish as you accuse religious people of being.

That having been said, burying onesself in dogma is to shut onesself out to the possibility that there are answers outside the realm of your belief system.

My own belief is that there is indeed a god. Sufficient proof has been pounded into my skull for me to alter my previously agnostic position on that. I belong to no organized religion, so any dogma attached to me is of my own making, and of no concern to anyone but me. Yet most of my morals, if not all, harken back to the lessons learned via the bible and its allegorical stories.

dude in the vid

en.wikipedia.org...

Tofik Benedictus "Benny" Hinn (born December 3, 1952) is a televangelist, best known for his regular "Miracle Crusades" – revival meeting/faith healing summits that are usually held in large stadiums in major cities

Benny Hinn is well known for his flamboyant, highly theatrical and often controversial style of ministry[2], at which members of the congregation and the choir are frequently "slain in the Spirit" en masse, and purported healings of medical conditions, whether Lou Gehrig's disease, AIDS, arthritis[3] or cancer[3], are televised from the stage

Hinn lives in an ocean-front mansion valued at an estimated $8.5 million in an exclusive gated community in Dana Point, California, travels by private aircraft, and stays in hotel rooms costing upwards of $3,000 per night.[7] In December 2006, he sent out a mailing asking for donations towards a new Gulfstream G4SP jet valued at an estimated $36 million.

Just going to throw my two cents in and avoid the already flared tempers.

In my book, religion can be taught to a child whenever the parents feel the child is old enough/mature enough to attempt an understanding of abstract idas; such as god and an afterlife.

This is not to say, in any way, that I feel a child should be taught which religion is 'right', or that the teaching should be coupled with a subtle (or blatant) indoctrination into any religion. Indoctrination is, in my opinion, child abuse.

My parents allowed me to learn about whichever religion I wanted. I have visited many places of worship in my childhood and feel lucky to have had that oppurtunity. I was never told which may be 'right' or which should be scoffed at...I was simply allowed to learn about religion at an academic level.

So, to make a long point short: Learning about religion is not a bad thing and forces no mindset one way or another (as long as it is encouraged from neutral ground). Hell, I am not religious at all but still maintain my interest in religion as a social force.

However, indoctrinating children is, in more ways than one, child abuse. Plain and simple.

Originally posted by seagull

Ignoring a possible source of knowledge because its in the form of religion is being just as foolish as you accuse religious people of being.

ignoring a book detailing how to live your life, with no evidence to support it is foolish?
i don't agree.

you don't need the bible to teach/learn how to be a good person. how to be decent to others. everything else in the bible is just blabber so i think it's best to ignore it.

i don't see how one can learn things from a book written thousands of years ago over long spans of time, by different people in a different language, and nothing backing up any of what is in there..

matter of fact, that is perfect ignore material for me......
i have used pages from said book back in my younger days to allow me to use certain recreationl things in a pinch though...that was nice.

You know what! *Shakes fist* YOU guys are hypocrites!!

There. That settles it...

Sadly, it doesn't. I just wished you guys knew about Christianity. Because when you lump ME together with that nutcase...*chuckles* well, lets just say thats like saying all agnostics are aethist.

REAL Chirstianity is rarely found in our society. Its all about one thing or another and nothing else. Like, these days, most "Christians" are severely anti-muslim and/or anti-aethist.

That's just crazy.

If I went to school with a Muslim or an Aethist, or worked with one, I just would be there friend as most people would. Because that's what being a Christian is. Leading by example. We shouldn't be asking people to join us, they need to be asking themselves.

Because, you see, that's what make a good christian. One who has the attiude that they want to help the world. And, If willing, spread their lessons of peace. Now as for the original reason of the forum, I would say that they should teach these kids the lessons but not nessarily the more precise ideas of said religon.

It's never a bad thing to teach morales to kids. Take it from me. I'm 15.

Just my little report...

So a lesson that may be applicable to a certain situation, and face it, some situations are timeless; because it comes from a religious text is to be ignored as useless? That makes little sense. But, hey, as long as you got rolling paper, right?

I have to agree with the OP. My friend was telling me about this amazing Rapping priest (which I must admit i did indeed 'lol') that went around the country and sung to little children weather it be at schools or at Church. I thought: Okay, I don't believe In everything he says but It's not any of my buisness, still I gotta hear a rapping priest. So i ask her to send me a song. Well when i get the song i expect "PRAISE BE TO JESUS HOMIES!" or something of that sorta (the usual Christian Lyrics with a Rapesque spin to it) well instead i get a guy who sounds like he's 10 talking about children dying in the streets and what not all because of homosexuality and abortion.

I don't mind (though i agree with the OP that they should be given a chance to make up there own mind) when parents take there kids to church for sunday school or something. but to me that's the worst thing I've ever heard, a Small Child being told that those kind of problems are caused by something unrelated...that's utter brainwashing. The worst part was when i tried to tell her that it was brainwashing, she called me the Brainwashed one and left.

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
We are not a religion. I find it unfortunate that a great many other people can't get that through their heads because they can't conceive of living free of their psychological chains.
[edit on 20-7-2007 by MajorMalfunction]

It is not a religion in the sense of having a structure based on doctrine, but it is most definitely a religious belief, in the same way anarchism is a political theory.

You certainly defend it as one would a religion.

That's because that's all that religious people know.

I don't "defend" anything. I'm trying to tell you that it is not a religion and nobody is listening, because for whatever reason they're incapable of understanding it.

I don't pray to the law of gravity. I don't give offerings to quantum theory. I don't listen to mechanical engineers "preach."

Look up the definition of religion. Atheism is NOT a religion.

I am denying ignorance, not "defending" a belief. Atheism is a lack of belief.

Sorry that certain people are incapable of understanding something so simple.

Originally posted by seagull
. But, hey, as long as you got rolling paper, right?

pretty much.
i keep a pocket king james in my desk drawer at the very bottom for just such an emergency.
at least it works for one thing...