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The Roman Catholic Church corrupted

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posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 08:28 PM
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Did some searching here on the catholic- what in the world? Grants by the Catholic Foundation? I go to a small church and the gutters aren't even fixed yet!! And these people have perhaps over a 139 million dollars to their disposal?! Thats not including the Vatican.

www.thecatholicfoundation.com...

www.thecatholicfoundation.com...

www.voxfux.com...

www.google.com...

www.catholicnews.com...

www.zenit.org...

www.catholic-foundation.org...

www.catholic-foundation.org...

www.rcab.org...

www.dioceseofprovidence.org...

Look up the Catholic Foundation in google and you will find many links- go and check the annal reports.. You might be surprised. The Catholic church is way out of linethey have too much money. The love of money is a sin. I'm shocked at this finding forgive me for not typing more on this issue. All they ask is to contribute contribute.I don't think God wants your annuities,401k, or life insurance plans. This is way over the 10% tithe offering.

They don't need this much money. I think its time for them to have a chat with the FBI or IRS.

I'm gonna stop here though because I can go on and on.







[edit on 7/13/2007 by Leyla]




posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 08:48 PM
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I've thought this way about the Catholic church for years. The priesthood takes vows of poverty but the upper echelon cardinals and the pope live like literal kings.

That is what the church is upset about, and why the pope has said that all other churches are not the true church: membership is slumping and their cashflow is being cut down.



posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 09:05 PM
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...Sad to say it...But I guess I'm one of thoes people who believe that the

Catholic church has always been corrupted...down through history

until now... I read some history of the Catholic church and I was

appalled...

Not suprising that so many people have a negative view of organized

religion ...and sadly of Christianity...



posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 09:22 PM
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Now the small churches are innocent- these big time on some maybe corrupted. Cosmo- can you contribute the history that you found and post it here please?



posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 11:06 PM
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...I believe their are many histories that have been written that illustrate the historical corruption of the Catholic church...

These are just a few sites from the web

www.christorchaos.com...

www.authorhouse.com...

www.exorthodoxforchrist.com...


...I remember one of my college professors...In Philosophy...

And when I asked him in class, "Who were the Huguenots?"
...Well, he just mumbled...three or four times...and never did tell me...

kind of embarrising that they were French Protestants that were
persecuted by the Catholics...


...Or maybe the fact that some scholars see catholicism as Roman paganism in disguise...

Or heck...The Pope sitting on his big throne with the upside down Cross!



[edit on 13-7-2007 by cosmokatt7]

[edit on 13-7-2007 by cosmokatt7]



posted on Jul, 14 2007 @ 07:28 AM
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Martin Luther made a poster depicting Jesus entering Jerusalem on an ass in simple garb. And on the other side the Pope entering being carried along with his entourage all in their finest silk.
Please read the part of Revelation dealing with the Whore of Babylon and keep in mind in the King James “mountains” was miss-translated from what should be “hills”. It clearly is describing the Vatican.
Personally I believe the mark of the beast 666 is actually receiving precious metal bars that will be minted by the Vatican and be marked as all others are with .999 on their foreheads or front and also on the side or “wrists”. So if you take such a bar as payment you are receiving the mark 666 in payment.
Jews at the time of Jesus referred to Rome as Babylon and whores in Rome wore there names on their foreheads. So yes the Vatican is a Whore for money and always has been. It has persecuted the bloodline of David for ages and did it’s best to remove all things Jewish from the stories handed down of the Jewish King Yeshua/Jesus.
The way established by Jesus should be cut out of the “universal church of Rome” with all it’s cult doctrines from Egypt. All material needs to be condensed as Thomas Jefferson tried to in one story and that story needs to be translated back into Aramaic with all Jewish customs of the day place back into it.
Ok, I’m done with my coffee now. Thanks for bringing up the subject.



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 03:22 AM
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Originally posted by Leyla
...these people have perhaps over a 139 million dollars to their disposal?! Thats not including the Vatican.
...The Catholic church is way out of linethey have too much money. The love of money is a sin.

I'm gonna stop here though because I can go on and on.

[edit on 7/13/2007 by Leyla]


Who said the Catholic Church loves money? You assume i would venture. Now don't let your research stop there - what you have found is only to satisfy a very biased approach to the "wealth" of the Catholic Church. Did you also forget to mention that the Catholic church is about 2000 years old? Hell, if i was able to work for 2000 years i would have more or less the same amount of money. I would also own paintings and property etc. Did you consider that? Nope? Didn't think so. How long has your church been running - 2000 years? It's all relative - don't you think?

Source


Several years ago, author Karl Keating was asked questions similar to yours:
He replied: "The Vatican's yearly budget is about the size of that of the Archdiocese of Chicago. The funds go partly for the upkeep of the Vatican itself, partly for missionary and other work around the world. Not bad for an organization with a billion members. If someone thinks the Vatican is fabulously wealthy, perhaps asking for a little proof isn't out of line. If someone is a conspiracy theorist, no amount of argumentation will work. You could give the person a certified copy of all the secret Vatican financial records, and he'd just say that they're fakes ...
"I suppose we could ask why the Vatican has trouble balancing its rather small annual budget. The wealth of the Church is almost entirely in church buildings, hospitals, schools, and missions, plus artworks. You could sell off the artworks, but the proceeds wouldn't feed the poor of the world for even a day.
"... If the Vatican sold all its artworks, they would bring in hundreds of millions of dollars -- but only once. Then they would be gone, and that money wouldn't go very far. (In the U.S. alone we spend hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars each year on welfare-related programs.) Second, the popes are custodians, not owners. They have a responsibility to preserve these [bequeathed/donated] artistic treasures for posterity, not to sell them off to private collections. Third, these artworks are things of beauty, and all beauty relates back to the one Beauty, which is God. The Church knows that we can approach God in many ways, and one of them is through beautiful art.


The church also has so much money because priests get a small allowance and not huge salaries. Cardinals have been down that road and they live in fine buildings and eat good food but are personally poor. If you earned a salary for 2000 years and did not spend much on your self you would be rich beyond words.

I won't post further in this thread because all roads lead to Rome - excuse the pun


[edit on 17/7/2007 by shearder]



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 03:46 AM
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Now as far as the vow of poverty are concerned, Catholic priests etc NEED to earn some sort of a living or they would not be able to get themselves a toffee or a soda or a razor to shave etc. They are also public servants to some extent. But they, by no means, earn a whole lot, neither do cardinals!

Earnings per anum:
Source


Edward Egan
$18,000
Cardinal, Archdiocese of New York

Rev. Kevin Madigan
$18,200
Catholic priest

Sister Marie of the Precious Blood
$0
Cloistered nun


I reckon we should all rush to become priests because they earn TONS of money - hell no, nuns are even richer!! I mean, who are these people kidding!! They are supposed to have taken a vow of poverty, how dare they earn so much - is this what i am hearing?



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 06:00 AM
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It's just like everything else - those at the bottom who do the actual work barely make enough to survive while those running things cream of all the money for doing nothing except causing trouble.

Sure if I'd been earning for myself for 2000 yrs I'd be rich and have abundant property but if I was setting an example in a religious not material way i would make sure that all those possesions were meted out to those who need them and trying to expand 'my' church.

It's been said before on many threads but the majority of all organised religions are about power, wealth and controlling the 'common man'.

If you want to know the truth you must seek it - I believe in a higher power 'god' but do not attend a church/mosque... as I have not found one that is not completely hypocritical - yet!



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 07:35 AM
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Originally posted by cosmokatt7
...I believe their are many histories that have been written that illustrate the historical corruption of the Catholic church...

These are just a few sites from the web

www.christorchaos.com...
www.authorhouse.com...
www.exorthodoxforchrist.com...
...I remember one of my college professors...In Philos


I have no comment re: the quality of the sites you posted. I would not use these to gain any sort of factual matter. It looks like a couple of fanatics that slapped a lot of the info together.

No offense intended.



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 08:16 AM
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Of course the Catholic church is corrupt. It's been corrupt since the day that Constantine realized that true power wasn't in being the ruler of an Empire, but by being the religious leader of millions. If people don't do what you say in an empire, they'll die for their cause knowing that they'll be ok in the next life. If people don't do what you say in a religion, you can convince them that they'll burn for eternity.

It's been the scam to end all scams for millenia. It hasn't become corrupted, it was founded on corruption.



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by shearder

Originally posted by cosmokatt7
...I believe their are many histories that have been written that illustrate the historical corruption of the Catholic church...

These are just a few sites from the web

www.christorchaos.com...
www.authorhouse.com...
www.exorthodoxforchrist.com...
...I remember one of my college professors...In Philos


I have no comment re: the quality of the sites you posted. I would not use these to gain any sort of factual matter. It looks like a couple of fanatics that slapped a lot of the info together.

No offense intended.



Oh sure- Guess you didn't see the news then hotshot. The RCC is being sued for 660 million. One thing I do try to do is check out my sources. If your doubting me then look it up. Churces are supposed to be non profit. Ha not the RCC they have so many riches its unreal.

Vow of poverty? Yeah right. And their supposed to have taken a vow of chasety too.

Open you eyes Shearder. I'm still some what new here but don't think I'm a pitiful rookie. I can hold my own.

Stocks, bonds, Real estate, gold.. I can go on and on. So before you try your pitiful attept to debunk me- you might want to do research youself grasshopper.


answers.google.com...

This will give you a idea on the RCC

www.cloakanddagger.de...

This will really surprise you here- Guess who's involved? The Rothschild family.



[edit on 7/17/2007 by Leyla]



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 12:29 PM
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Originally posted by shearder

Originally posted by cosmokatt7
...I believe their are many histories that have been written that illustrate the historical corruption of the Catholic church...

These are just a few sites from the web

www.christorchaos.com...
www.authorhouse.com...
www.exorthodoxforchrist.com...
...I remember one of my college professors...In Philos


I have no comment re: the quality of the sites you posted. I would not use these to gain any sort of factual matter. It looks like a couple of fanatics that slapped a lot of the info together.

No offense intended.



Hum...So first you say..."I have no comment"... But, then you make several...!

And, then you end with ..."No offense intended." (irony...?)

...But, none taken... I'll just remember for the future...

"Don't feed the trolls"...



posted on Jul, 17 2007 @ 11:31 PM
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Originally posted by cosmokatt7

Hum...So first you say..."I have no comment"... But, then you make several...!

And, then you end with ..."No offense intended." (irony...?)

...But, none taken... I'll just remember for the future...

"Don't feed the trolls"...

Ok, i meant to spell it out since i have been misunderstood: I have no comment on each of the sites. I have no comment on anything mentioned on the sites. My comment made was generally speaking and not based on their content as such. Not sure if that is explanation enough?



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by Leyla
Oh sure- Guess you didn't see the news then hotshot.
The RCC is being sued for 660 million.

What did that have to do with the church being corrupt? I would say that has proven the opposite - they have paid.



Originally posted by Leyla
One thing I do try to do is check out my sources. If your doubting me then look it up. Churces are supposed to be non profit. Ha not the RCC they have so many riches its unreal.

Well one thing you do is check your sources - fine, if you believe that. So go and check AGAIN what i posted and then you will feel more at peace - you will have more answers as to the churches "riches". Why would i doubt you - but there was no reason for ME to have brought it up - don't see how it has to do with the church being rich - do you?


Originally posted by Leyla
Vow of poverty? Yeah right. And their supposed to have taken a vow of chasety too.

That's chastity and it's the "Vow of Celibacy" they take. I have given my feelings on this already.


Originally posted by Leyla
Open you eyes Shearder. I'm still some what new here but don't think I'm a pitiful rookie. I can hold my own.

Nope, never thought you were a pitiful rookie.


Originally posted by Leyla
Stocks, bonds, Real estate, gold.. I can go on and on. So before you try your pitiful attept to debunk me- you might want to do research youself grasshopper.


It would be in your best interests to actually read what i post and go to the links i post and then you wouldn't lay yourself wide open. Grasshopper - meaning??


Originally posted by Leyla
This will really surprise you here- Guess who's involved? The Rothschild family.

What's your point - i know of MANY instances where the Rothschild family has been involved in the Catholic Church.

In case you may have missed it in your extensive research:

Source

“Early in the 19th century the Pope came to the Rothschild’s to borrow money. The Rothschilds were very friendly with the Pope, causing one journalist to sarcastically say ‘Rothschild has kissed the hand of the Pope... Order has been reestablished.’ The Rothschild's in fact over time were entrusted with the bulk of the Vatican's wealth. The Jewish Ency., vol. 2, p. 497 states, ‘It is a somewhat curious sequel to the attempt to set up a Catholic competitor to the Rothschilds that at the present time (1905) the latter are guardians of the papal treasure.’ Researcher Eustace Mullins writes that the Rothschilds took over all the financial operations of the worldwide Catholic Church in 1823. Today the large banking and financial business of the Catholic Church is an extensive system interlocked with the Rothschilds and the rest of the International Banking system.”


I guess it may lost to the eye, kind of "can't see the wood for the trees" but the Pope borrowed money. What does that say? They have fixed asses but they did not have cash. Property i guess could be accumulated over 2000 years huh? The Rothschilds are business people. That's what they do. They have a finger in a lot of pies and so did Rockefeller and others.



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 01:51 AM
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Corruption is certainly not exclusive to the Catholic Church. Examples of corruption; simony, sexual improprieties and scandal, can be found throughout every religion, sect, cult or, for that matter, organization.

Churches are made up of human beings. Whenever you have humans in positions of power and authority you have an opportunity for corruption.

I know that we would all like to believe that the people who serve in the capacity of priests, ministers, parsons, rabbis, Imams etc should, somehow, be free from such "stain" but, unfortunately, people are , after all, just people. Still, when we hear of a priest turning away from their vows to perform some perversion on a child or when we hear of a minister embezzling funds from his flock we are all shocked. It is painful to believe that our trust is violated and that there is, indeed, nothing sacred.

Still, it is important not to paint all priests, ministers and other religious men and women with a broad brush.

It is important to note the positive efforts that are being taken to correct past wrongs and to prevent future improprieties.

It is, finally, most important to note the countless number of priests, ministers and other religious who have not violated their vows and positions of authority. There are many fine, dedicated and devout men and women in every denomination that have tirelessly labored in an effort to help those who are in need -- physically as well as spiritually.



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 02:33 AM
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Originally posted by benevolent tyrant shortened
Corruption is certainly not exclusive to the Catholic Church.
Churches are made up of human beings.
Still, it is important not to paint all priests, ministers and other religious men and women with a broad brush.
It is important to note the positive efforts that are being taken to correct past wrongs and to prevent future improprieties.
There are many fine, dedicated and devout men and women in every denomination that have tirelessly labored in an effort to help those who are in need -- physically as well as spiritually.

Absolutely benevolent tyrant, this is the point that needs to be echoed over and over, "man" is not infallible and there will be those abusing positions of power regardless of religious persuasion. BUT i believe there is more good being done as apposed to bad. Great post!!



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 08:31 AM
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Of course every organization tat grows that large and that powerful will become corrupt. And just because it's common doesn't make it right. And we can start threads about each of them, however this thread is about the corruption of the RCC specifically.

Now as for more good being done than bad, lets look at it's entire history as a whole, and really think about that statement shall we?

Lets list some of their actions throughout history

The Crusades
The Inquisition
More Crusades
The burning of heretics (scientists) at the stake
The destruction of knowledge and people in the Americas by Catholic Missionaries
Molestations
The covering up of molestations

please forgive me if I left anything out, I'm hard at work here. However, if you can list some of the good that the church has done, maybe we can compare a body count.



[edit on 18-7-2007 by Rasobasi420]



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 11:03 AM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
Now as for more good being done than bad, lets look at it's entire history as a whole, and really think about that statement shall we?

Lets list some of their actions throughout history

The Crusades
The Inquisition
More Crusades
The burning of heretics (scientists) at the stake
The destruction of knowledge and people in the Americas by Catholic Missionaries
Molestations
The covering up of molestations


The Catholic Church has been in existence for two thousand years!
Think of it -- two millennium! This is a time span that is truly difficult to even grasp. Given enough authority and power over such a span of time, any organization would have a list of grievances and historical episodes that we (in the present -- 21st Century) would find quite malevolent.

I could easily take any organization with a lengthy history and find incident upon incident of abuse and corruption, over time, to overshadow any good that might have taken place. Such a list would, however, be meaningless outside of any historical or cultural context. Let us not forget that the Church began in a time when the Earth was flat, witches and demons roamed the nights and superstition ruled the minds of even the most enlightened. Can we really judge the actions of the Church outside of this historical and, often, cultural framework? Within this historical framework, we also must dissect and separate the actions of the Church and the various States.

Nevertheless, under the aegis of the Roman Catholic Church, we can point at many actions and events that have had great social, artistic, scientific and educational impact -- through the ages and even in the present.

I don't mean to sound callous but the cost of the Inquisition, the Crusades and the numerous "purges" of the Churches past have little or no relevant impact on this historical era whereas many of the contributions of the Church still surround us today; the development of economic and social reforms, efforts to overcome poverty, the development of a medieval hospital system that has evolved into our present day system, technology, literature, science, philosophy, music and art.

I look to the work of Catholic institutions at work today to help fight poverty and hunger in the Third World, Agencies that assist refugees from war torn nations and the study of the philosophy of ethics and morality within the development of scientific investigation. These works, while often paling in an historical perspective, certainly are important works that are often beyond the mandates of secular governments.



posted on Jul, 18 2007 @ 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by shearder
In case you may have missed it in your extensive research:

Source

“Early in the 19th century the Pope came to the Rothschild’s to borrow money. The Rothschilds were very friendly with the Pope, causing one journalist to sarcastically say ‘Rothschild has kissed the hand of the Pope... Order has been reestablished.’ The Rothschild's in fact over time were entrusted with the bulk of the Vatican's wealth. The Jewish Ency., vol. 2, p. 497 states, ‘It is a somewhat curious sequel to the attempt to set up a Catholic competitor to the Rothschilds that at the present time (1905) the latter are guardians of the papal treasure.’ Researcher Eustace Mullins writes that the Rothschilds took over all the financial operations of the worldwide Catholic Church in 1823. Today the large banking and financial business of the Catholic Church is an extensive system interlocked with the Rothschilds and the rest of the International Banking system.”





Hmm I believe I already said the Rothschild family was involved Look back on my posts grasshopper.



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