Lust of the flesh.

reply to post by wildcat


Not at all.When i type quick my spelling,grammar,punctuation etc usually goes out the window.....actually,the same thing happens when i type slowly.lol.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

And your wanting me to comment on your other points? LOL..
whoa..you have big balls to be saying the quote above.

Originally posted by HIFIGUYl
We spend 1.25 Trillion dollars on weapons to support ideals that people scripted

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
..this says nothing about people as a whole

It doesnt? If I spent 1.25 Trillion on weapons, would that say something about the spenders ideals? ". If that same money was spent on clothing, shelter and food the world wide, wouldnt that send a different message?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i also understand that jesus was most likely nonexistent.

We have 2 Billion people on the planet plus or minus who recognize that Jesus was. Muslims included. Secondly, Jesus said his words would live forever. For a non existent guy, hes done one heck of a job..lol

2000 years ago...I can see it now. Hey, lets create a ficticious man named Jesus and get the whole world to believe. Great Idea. Who wants to be first to die for it? They all raise their hands.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
there were about 17 million CHRISTIAN german soldiers and about 1 million CHRISTIAN SS who had their own religious morality that didn't prevent genocide, they still thought they were right.

not surprising when you're working from a book that praises genocide.

however, the morality of nazi germany isn't philosophically sound, so you really lose the argument...

Im going to have to ask you to back that statement up in terms of the German war machine doing what they did in the name of Christianity.

Morality of Nazi Germany isnt philosophically sound? Says who? Have a little black book in your pocket " The Pocket Guide to Morality? " Did you check the Darwins book on the evolution of morality?

We Evolved to develop a weapon that can extinguish life on this planet as we know it. Is that Moral? Evolutionary? Better hope the Muslim Extremists dont Evolve.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

Words of a Fool

Peace


[edit on 4-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

As far as Lust of the flesh, perhaps Lusting to the point where one goes and masterbates or obssesses about someone to the point of action is the point of excess or " 'Lust of the Flesh ".

How might it be if one saves themselves for their spouses and for those moments of intimacy? How much more powerful might those moments of marriage be rather than moments of anything goes and just another squeeze?

Lust of the flesh is how pornography and advertisers are able to sell more, with the offering of suggestion to a receptive market. But just becaue we can, does it mean we should?

All of us, who have been in relationships, married and or dating usually want that special other person to have us as be the twinkle in their eye.

If a person is running around masterbating and lusting after everything he or she sees, somehow it just seems to lessen the experience that could be.
The physical response and the mental bond that two people make when in a relationship can be effected due to the " Wandering eye " as well as the " wandering mind ". Do we want the one we love to be excited about somone else while making love?

This behavior, once started and partaken is difficult to break.

Personally, Ive been there. Saving ones self for the one they meet and love is best. Reducing the opportunistic male quality within myself to one of mutual respect for everyone and reserving thoughts of intimacy for the woman I love. Resisting that tempation for self gratification and sharing with another when the commitment and the relationship is appropriatte helps us to avoid the pitfall of lust of the flesh.


Peace


[edit on 5-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

Originally posted by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

And your wanting me to comment on your other points? LOL..
whoa..you have big balls to be saying the quote above.

denial of knowledge is stupid. keeping people in ignorance is... well, it's both stupid and against the very concept of this board.

you're kind of a hypocrite if you're on ats and think god was right to deny people knowledge

It doesnt? If I spent 1.25 Trillion on weapons, would that say something about the spenders ideals? ". If that same money was spent on clothing, shelter and food the world wide, wouldnt that send a different message?

but that money isn't spent by the people, it's spent by their representatives who clearly don't always work in their best interests.

you don't see individual people giving money to increase the amount of arms in the world, but you do see them giving money to help feed the world

We have 2 Billion people on the planet plus or minus who recognize that Jesus was. Muslims included.

argument ad populum, it's a logical fallacy.

Secondly, Jesus said his words would live forever. For a non existent guy, hes done one heck of a job..lol

buddha and confuscius have also done a helluva a job, and they've been doing it for longer.
this speaks nothing to the existence of the character.

2000 years ago...I can see it now. Hey, lets create a ficticious man named Jesus and get the whole world to believe. Great Idea. Who wants to be first to die for it? They all raise their hands.

ah, but people died for the dionysian cult, the horus cult, the mithras cult, etc
...do you know what they all have in common? they believed in a messianic figure that was incredibly similar to jesus (and most so with mithras)
it's incredibly likely that jesus is merely a rehash of the mithras story with an amalgamation of claimed jewish messiahs as the one assuming the persona.

Im going to have to ask you to back that statement up in terms of the German war machine doing what they did in the name of Christianity.

never said it did anything in the name of christianity, i said that them being christians didn't stop them.
if your religious morality was so great, it would have...
though i could point out all those quotes where hitler said he was doing the work of jesus

like this:

Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism the destroyer. Nevertheless, the Galilean, who later was called the Christ, intended something quite different. He must be regarded as a popular leader who took up His position against Jewry. Galilee was a colony where the Romans had probably installed Gallic legionaries, and items certain that Jesus was not a Jew. The Jews, by the way, regarded Him as the son of a whore and a Roman soldier,which in christianity is not a belief. The decisive falsification of Jesus's doctrine was the work of St. Paul. He gave himself to this work with subtlety and for purposes of personal exploitation. For the Galilean's object was to liberate His country from Jewish oppression. He set Himself against Jewish capitalism, and that's why the Jews liquidated Him. Paul of Tarsus (his name was Saul, before the road to Damascus) was one of those who persecuted Jesus most savagely.When he learnt that Jesus's supporters let their throats be cut for His ideas, he realised that, by making intelligent use of the Galilean's teaching, it would be possible to overthrow this Roman State which the Jews hated. It's in this context that we must understand the famous "illumination". Think of it, the Romans were daring to confiscate the most sacred thing the Jews possessed, the gold piled up in their temples! At that time, as now, money was their god. On the road to Damascus, St. Paul discovered that he could succeed in ruining the Roman State by causing the principle to triumph of the equality of all men before a single God and by putting beyond the reach of the laws his private notions, which he alleged to be divinely inspired. If, into the bargain, one succeeded in imposing one man as the representative on earth of the only God, that man would possess boundless power.(October 21, 1941)

Jesus was most certainly not a Jew. The Jews would never have handed one of their own people to the Roman courts; they would have condemned Him themselves. It is quite probable that a large number of the descendants of the Roman legionaries, mostly Gauls, were living in Galilee, and Jesus was probably one of them. His mother may well have been a Jewess. Jesus fought against the materialism of His age, and, therefore, against the Jews. Paul of Tarsus, who was originally one of the most stubborn enemies of the Christians, suddenly realised the immense possibilities of using, intelligently and for other ends, an idea which was exercising such great powers of fascination. He realised that the judicious exploitation of this idea among non-Jews would give him far greater power in the world than would the promise of material profit to the Jews themselves. It was then that the future St. Paul distorted with diabolical cunning the Christian idea. out of this idea, which was a declaration of war on the golden calf, on the egotism and the materialism of the Jews, he created a rallying point for slaves of all kinds against the elite, the masters and those in dominant authority. The religion fabricated by Paul of Tarsus, which was later called Christianity, is nothing but the Communism of to-day.(Night of November 29-30, 1944)

Morality of Nazi Germany isnt philosophically sound? Says who? Have a little black book in your pocket " The Pocket Guide to Morality? " Did you check the Darwins book on the evolution of morality?

no, it just doesn't stand to simple logic.

nazi: jews aren't people
me: why?
nazi: (unable to find a logical argument to back up his previous statement)

We Evolved to develop a weapon that can extinguish life on this planet as we know it. Is that Moral? Evolutionary? Better hope the Muslim Extremists dont Evolve.

technology is amoral, it has no morality until it is applied. nuclear technology, for example can be both destructive and constructive. we can blow crap up with it or we can power homes.

Words of a Fool

argument ad hominem, personal attacks are also logical fallacy.

how about this: god commanded a genocide.
ain't that stupid?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
how about this: god commanded a genocide.
ain't that stupid?

[edit on 5-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

reply to post by HIFIGUY


Love does not equal satisfying sex.
As i mentioned earlier;a man will always get his rocks off,but he will usually leave the woman unfulfilled.Is that fare?

Originally posted by jakyll
Love does not equal satisfying sex.

This is true for look at love of your children or of Animals or ones parents.
The topic was Lust of the Flesh

Originally posted by jakyll
As i mentioned earlier;a man will always get his rocks off,but he will usually leave the woman unfulfilled.Is that fare?

Your speaking of the act itself. How did we get there?

Originally posted by HIFIGUY

Saving ones self for the one they meet and love is best. Reducing the opportunistic male quality ( Lust ) within myself to one of mutual respect for everyone and reserving thoughts of intimacy for the woman I love. Resisting that tempation for self gratification and sharing with another when the commitment and the relationship is appropriatte helps us to avoid the pitfall of lust of the flesh.

When Jesus says that we have already sinned when we look upon another woman with Lust, it is in the mind he is speaking of.

Reserve your thoughts of intimacy and your acts of sexuality for the person you are involved with.

Originally posted by jakyll
Love does not equal satisfying sex.

More accurately, Love doesnt = Sex

Peace



[edit on 5-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

reply to post by HIFIGUY


I was referring to the comment you made about waiting for the right person and being in love....

Anyways...

The natural desire for sexual variety has absolutely nothing to do with "lust" as most assume it to mean. Lust is only wrong if it is the selfish desire to take something from another. Lust is wrong if it is about greed and self satisfaction at the expense of another. But there is nothing whatsoever wrong with mutually desired loving intimacy and enjoying sexual variety.

In biblical times man could have as many wives and concubines (breeders) as they wished once the man was age 12 and the women age 13, and adultery was only a sin for a married women. It was never a sin for a married man as long as the other women was not married (owned by another man).

Biblically lust was not nearly such a bad word as those that use it against sexuality seem to think. In the original Greek the word translated "lust" was used several other times for things NOT considered wrong: Jesus "lusted" to be with his disciples. The word is the same as that some use to make lust to be a sin. Did Jesus sin? No, but He lusted. Strong desire for something is not a sin.

Math 5:27-28: An interpretation of this passage is that if you look at the Greek verb (lust more properly translated covet or desire), is the same word used in the Septuagint's translation of the 10th Commandment (not covet). In this case, Matthew has Jesus saying that covetousness, the desire to deprive another of his property, is the essence of adultery. Jesus was then reaffirming a quite traditional understanding of what is wrong with adultery.

The Greek word here is, of course, epithumia, which also means "covet" and is the word used by the translators of the Septuagint to translate the Hebrew, chamad, in Ex. 21:17 "Thou shalt not COVET ." It is not coincidence, by the way, that "neighbor's wife" is included with the other PROPERTY listed in this text...like neighbors ox etc...

It should also be remebered that men such as Abraham,Moses,Jacob,David etc had more than one wife,of a wife and concubines.to your way of thinking they have sinned.but the men who had many wives got married in the sight of God and with his blessing,and God was ok with it!!


There should be a balance in a persons sexual life,as there should be for everything else.Sex is enjoyable,it is not just a tool of procreation!

But if a man sins in his mind because of a woman,that woman should not have to change who she is because of it.As i said earlier,if you sin don't lay the blame on someone else.if JiT believes in God then he should have the strength to resist temptation! He shouldn't cry like a baby and expect women to cover up because he is weak! Men will lust after women no matter what and vice versa.Its nature,its called hormones!!



[edit on 5-10-2007 by jakyll]

Originally posted by jakyll
It should also be remebered that men such as Abraham,Moses,Jacob,David etc had more than one wife,of a wife and concubines.to your way of thinking they have sinned.but the men who had many wives got married in the sight of God and with his blessing,and God was ok with it!!

Yes...there were cases. Some because the wife was unable to have children. In the Muslim culture, sometimes do to situtions of strife, children with no father, etc.

It was common in those days to just come and take a mans wife by force. Raid and kidnap.

Originally posted by jakyll
There should be a balance in a persons sexual life,as there should be for everything else.Sex is enjoyable,it is not just a tool of procreation!

True. But I would caution that marriage and sex within that bond is more beneficial for the inviduals and the community.

Originally posted by jakyll
But if a man sins in his mind because of a woman,that woman should not have to change who she is because of it.As i said earlier,if you sin don't lay the blame on someone else.if JiT believes in God then he should have the strength to resist temptation! He shouldn't cry like a baby and expect women to cover up because he is weak!

There is some truth in this..Last night..funny enough..I had a dream last night where there was a man and a woman who entered a store. The woman was wearing some sexy vinyl skirt and top and dancing on a shelf in the store.

While resistance is JITs responsibility, flaunting and promiscuity can be quite diversionary...and usually they are doing it for money or advertising, or even ego.

Originally posted by jakyll
Men will lust after women no matter what and vice versa.Its nature,its called hormones!!

Men when hungry, will do anything no matter what because they are driven by a pain in their stomachs called hunger.

The next time your with your husband or wife, Boyfriend or Girlfriend, tell them you lust after other people of the oppoite sex. Point them out to them when you see them. Then, ask them how it makes them feel.

Truth, Love, Discipline. Humility. Respect. Trust. Honor.

Be a Man who holds himself to a higher standard

Peace



[edit on 5-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

[edit on 5-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

reply to post by HIFIGUY

Yes...there were cases. Some because the wife was unable to have children.

Had a feeling you would say something like that,lol.
But those situations don't involve lust.

Many times me and my girlfriend have pointed out people we find attractive.We have the attitude thats its natural to look.Its that whole,look but don't touch thing.
I know what you're saying though.Relationships wouldn't last too long if you went around telling your partner you wanted to get busy with someone else on a regular basis.
If you are single though,what is the harm of looking and touching? As long as you don't go on a rampant sex spree i mean,lol.(and both parties are consenting adults.)

" the buttocks is used to stand up "

I did not know that. So he created it to stand and for a cushion.

peace.

" satisfying sex"

God made an orgasm. Its supposed to be the hieght of fealing between true (lovers).

Not for selfish acts of waste. some people destroy others lives (I have seen personally) over a simple orgasm and God doesnt like that.

He also said pray often because the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak.

Peace.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


MIMS?

My friend, I don't object to what you just said, but there are certain things that make my head 'reel'.

Lust of the flesh

Why is it that mankind can have a bona fide certifying example ...of a 'bio-logical lusting' of the flesh', when mankind cannot attain the 'total lust', in theoretical terms?

In other words: "Why can man 'lust', and at the same time, have spiritual thoughts?

Ok...here's a reallly 'off-beat' topic:

"How can mankind achieve a 'boner', while at the same time think in spiritual terms? Is that possible? (I can just see your half-cocked smile as I type this)

Think about this...it's a valid question. (I'm picturing you typing back in a logical form...at the same time concidering what I had just said)

reply to post by JesusisTruth

God made an orgasm. Its supposed to be the hieght of fealing between true (lovers).

If this is so,why is it so easy for a man to orgasm??
And where did God say this in the holy scriptures??

reply to post by TheDuckster

"How can mankind achieve a 'boner', while at the same time think in spiritual terms? Is that possible?

Good question.
I'll throw in my 2 cents worth.

I guess it depends what you mean by spiritual...
Being turned on does not have to be a shameful act.It does not always happen because of base feelings alone.Just because a man finds a woman attractive does not mean he will immediately get an erection.Its not lust thats leads to that,its the fantasy.If you do not fantasize about someone you have seen,then you will not become aroused.This is what happens with strangers,in a relationship you obviously don't need to fantasize.

So maybe the "enemy" here is not lust,its the creative part of the brain!


There are many married and unmarried couples in the world where they live in complete harmony with each other.They connect in mind,body and soul.So you could call that spiritual,yes?

Originally posted byTheDuckster

"How can mankind achieve a 'boner', while at the same time think in spiritual terms? Is that possible?

Probably the same way we as men can delay our orgasm by thinking about topics way off the passion of the moment..Lol.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
God made an orgasm. Its supposed to be the height of fealing between true (lovers).

Love does not equate to a physical function or orgasm.

The Love I have for my daughter has nothing to do with Orgasm and she is the height of my love.

Gods and Christs love for us has nothing to do with Orgasm.

Its concievable, that without the orgasm, mankind may not even be here today.

The Logical mind, in conjunction with avoidance of pain and burden might have been a stumbling block for mankind in both child bearing and economy.

Its safe to say that the orgasm was a gift to man and woman alike. That in the delicate workings of life, that ultimately, we can only speculate on its purpose.

The Evil and the Good that men have done, has been seen in the persuit of the orgasm.

Peace


[edit on 6-10-2007 by HIFIGUY]

Originally posted by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
how about this: god commanded a genocide.
ain't that stupid?

can you not make a proper argument...?
hmm, god commands denial of knowledge to the ignorant
god commands a genocide
it's not foolish to say those commands are stupid

however, you also provide no counter-point to any of the other arguments i made
did you just not read them or are you choosing to not reply?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
did you just not read them or are you choosing to not reply?

Proverbs..26

Do not answer a fool according to his folly,
Or you will also be like him.
5 Answer a fool as his folly deserves,
That he not be wise in his own eyes

Peace

Originally posted by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what god commanded was stupid.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
did you just not read them or are you choosing to not reply?

Proverbs..26

Do not answer a fool according to his folly,
Or you will also be like him.
5 Answer a fool as his folly deserves,
That he not be wise in his own eyes

name calling!
wow, you really must not have an argument if you have to resort to such holier-than-thou name calling.

i'm not a fool, far from it