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Free Energy and its Political Economic Reality

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posted on Aug, 28 2007 @ 07:06 PM
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Wade & StellarX

Stellar I read your reply to my post some weeks back and I admit I have perhaps a poor or "dim" view of humanity. I wish I could find reason to hope that we can find away to bring FE out from under the supression of the powers.

I have been away and for almost a week, I met with some inventors downunder, and saw some amazing FE developments. Sadly the key "genius" has been got at!... his inventions sit in the corner of a shed not to be used due to threats and fear for the well being of his family. Elated I was with his achievements but saddened that such regularly occurs.

I ask you guys.... who I acknowledge are way ahead of me in this field .... WHAT and HOW can we do something to get this stuff in the open and defeat the powerful malicious threats to the dark forces?




posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 06:54 AM
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Has2B:

I doubt that any FE denier or “skeptic” will ever attain the credentials of an Adam Trombly:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

which are the credentials of EXPERIENCE, and what experiences they were. Universities do not confer the credential of experience; only the real world does. Other than the dishonest Mr. Skeptic:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

I have never heard from ANYBODY who has ever done any fact-checking of my tale, or bothered to obtain any of the many primary documents that I cite in Dennis’ or my story. That is how “skeptics” can stay “skeptics,” by staying rooted in their armchairs, making their experience-free and useless observations. You have seen the fear in an inventor’s eyes; one who has received the threats and takes them very seriously. Until people have seen the suppression with their own eyes, they almost always deny that it exists. Nothing teaches like experience, but gaining experience in the FE milieu can be hazardous to one’s health.

As I write:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

FE is a conundrum, the likes of which I have not seen before or since. Lone inventors do not stand a chance. They are easy to deal with, one at a time, if they ever become potential threats. The many pretenders and the self-deceived are left alone. But again, the organized suppression is just one facet of the conundrum, and the general population has far more to do with the issue than the Big Boys’ efforts. Dennis has always been hurt more by his “allies” than he has by the Big Boys.

www.ahealedplanet.net...

I do not know of one “safe place” on earth for an FE inventor. My Skeptic belongs to the New Energy Congress:

peswiki.com...

As they have naively allowed him to join it. For all the good work they could do, having him be a part of it is a huge strike against them, and any FE inventor with the goods is going to be gun shy if they see people like him openly involved. My reaction to the conundrum is trying to help educate people:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

but as you can tell from this thread, educating people about the FE reality is not easy. The ATS members have been one of the most receptive audiences to my writings, but as you can see, it is a mixed bag. However, I see no other way that has much of a prayer, either. Greer, Dennis and O’Leary are tying to go the populist route, but that path is fraught with peril. I have watched the populist crowd give Dennis a standing ovation one day, to only cheer at his lynching the next, because that was a good show too. I decided to try something different, not that it has been very successful yet, either (and 12,000 hours of unpaid effort, after I survived my ride with Dennis, is about all I have in the tank for this lifetime). There are no easy answers, and each of us can only do what we can, but united we will stand; divided, we are easy prey.

Hi RogerT:

Yes, many in the New Age play the “I-was-Cleopatra” game. All the past life memories that I have recovered have been mundane ones (and in fact, one WAS as a farmer), and some have had a resonance with this lifetime, but not in a FE way. Helping to melt down Atlantis would not exactly be the bright spot of my soul’s resume, and MAY help explain my FE motivation in this life, and as you can see on this thread, my motivation has been openly questioned. I was also told that the “soul guilt” that I took from that lifetime caused me to block my access to my mystical abilities in almost every lifetime since then. That alleged archangel told me stuff that had some astounding real-world relevance (like events that happened soon after the sessions that validated the readings), so I took the readings seriously. Yes, readings can be ego-traps and are to be carefully undertaken and digested. As I stated earlier, I do not want this to become a mystical thread, but the mystical aspect is very much a part of the FE conundrum, and may well be a key to getting over the hump. All the FE activists that I respect have a mystical orientation to the FE issue.

I have revealed many of my personal issues in my work. Many have thanked me for showing that human side in my work, while my editor always tried to limit it (partly because the unscrupulous can use it to do me harm).

Telling the world that impatience is my Achilles heel may not be considered a good move:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

or that I have imagined killing people:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

or that I have heard voices that led my on my journey, and I do not want to hear from them again:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

You can see that I am the only person who has used his real name on this thread. I am doing what I can to make a public stance, to encourage others to find a little courage. Until people stand up and allow themselves to be counted, the Big Boys will rule with their iron fist, however subtly wielded it may be.

For the record, I am NOT seeking the participation of the New Age community:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

That has been a VERY mixed bag over the years. A New Age activist tried mounting an effort behind me some years ago, and let us say that it was not a pleasant experience, by and large.

Be well,

Wade



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 08:52 AM
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Originally posted by Has2b
I challenge you you spend some time replicating a simple experiment: "Benini School Girl"


I googled this and came up empty. Can you be a little less cryptic?

thanks



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 09:01 AM
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reply to post by wadefrazier3
 


Wade, you may very well be the real deal


That was not meant as sarcasm.

PS. Impatient you say? - that's far from evident



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:27 AM
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Hi RogerT:

I thought that my chief feature was probably arrogance (arrogance is an attempt to cover for insecurity in one’s being), but I was told that it was impatience. Well, if my impatience is not that evident, then I hope it means that I am working on it. My mind and metabolism work on double-time compared to most people. I often have a great deal of frustration living at 60 MPH in a 30 MPH world. I also did not think that I was an artisan, but after I thought about it, it fit perfectly. We can rarely “read” ourselves, as our egos get in the way. I have been very impatient at times that humanity is not turning the corner, and we may be on the way to WWIII, among other joys (over oil that we do not need). I am just coming out of my mid-life crisis, and mine was about my life’s journey being totally futile as far as healing the planet goes. Impatience, as much as it may seem that I am over it, may have been the key driver of my mid-life crisis.

As an FYI, I was told that melting down Atlantis knocked earth off its axis. I was in a place of responsibility, but not all that high in the hierarchy. Those who really owned melting Atlantis down have not yet been allowed to incarnate again on earth. Lower level people like me are getting to work off their penance. Again, that is what I was told. I have no memories of that life other than a vague feeling that I was female in it, but that information seemed to “fit.”

Having delusions of grandeur is one of the hazards of pursuing FE:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

I think that only the humble can get to the FE finish line.

As far as being the real deal, all I can say is that there is nothing but the truth in my account of my journey, and Dennis’ story, as hard as it may be to believe, is also true. I lived through the hardest part of his journey with him, and know people quite well who lived through the other preposterous parts with him. For anybody who does a little homework (the kind that cannot be done by surfing the Internet), they will discover that my role is more central to Dennis’ story than I have publicly admitted, but my hands are currently tied due to circumstances beyond my control. If I revealed some of that information, it would lend a lot more seeming cred to my writings, but I have to try protecting certain people.

Be well,

Wade



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by RogerT

Originally posted by Has2b
I challenge you you spend some time replicating a simple experiment: "Benini School Girl"


I googled this and came up empty. Can you be a little less cryptic?

thanks


Sorry it was meant to get the same response from our resident "spook skeptic"... i.e to see whether he would genuinely attempt to do something to prove it for himself!

The correct spelling is Bedini School Girl

John Bedini a colleague of T Bearden has prepared an experiment replicated by a 10yr old school girl at school fair ( I suspect Dad helped a lot) which shows overunity and extraction of energy from the Aether

www.google.com.au...

Some of it is simple, but tuning of the simple electronics and magnet placement takes some tweaking. Note some web pages seem to have been adjusted to confuse, if serious get his book

ENJOY!



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 05:12 PM
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Perhaps you think you are helping the discussion by being a "devils advocate" and to some extent I agree!

You claim to be an electrical engineer? I challenge you you spend some time replicating a simple experiment: "Benini School Girl"

???



Some of the stuff on the web is deliberate misinfo but there is enough there for you

No, there isn’t.



...after getting of your high horse or as Wade might say "arm chair" and DO something yourself even though it will contradict and smash the false education you claimed to have gained.

What knowledge or authority do you have to call the education I have gained false?



Your "injection of reality" smacks of either a vain retaliation to defend conventional Electrical Engineering falsehoods

Oh, and you know electricity enough to point out some falsehoods?



or a deliberate attempt to squash serious discussion here.

Between Wade’s self-serving moonbat rants and Stellar’s vain attempts at understanding EM fields and Zero Point energy, there’s precious little serious discussion to be had here.



BTW Are you as well qualified as Adam Trembly?

Who is Adam Trembly?



DO IT and prove it yourself!

Do WHAT myself?



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 05:21 PM
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reply to post by Has2b
 



thanks.

looks a bit beyond my current electical engineering abilities, but learning curves never put me off before



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by Has2b
Sorry it was meant to get the same response from our resident "spook skeptic"... i.e to see whether he would genuinely attempt to do something to prove it for himself!

The correct spelling is Bedini School Girl

John Bedini

Ah! Bedini! You believe that huckster? He sells a CD “clarifier” that he claims makes your CDs sound better by bathing them with “electromagnetic beams.”

www.bedini.com...

Oh boy. Please tell me you don’t take him seriously.


a colleague of T Bearden has prepared an experiment replicated by a 10yr old school girl at school fair ( I suspect Dad helped a lot) which shows overunity and extraction of energy from the Aether

It shows no such thing.



Some of it is simple, but tuning of the simple electronics and magnet placement takes some tweaking. Note some web pages seem to have been adjusted to confuse, if serious get his book

No thanks. Smarter than that.

Have a nice day.



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 09:24 PM
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Originally posted by NRen2k5

Originally posted by Has2b
Sorry it was meant to get the same response from our resident "spook skeptic"... i.e to see whether he would genuinely attempt to do something to prove it for himself!

The correct spelling is Bedini School Girl

John Bedini

Ah! Bedini! You believe that huckster? He sells a CD “clarifier” that he claims makes your CDs sound better by bathing them with “electromagnetic beams.”

www.bedini.com...

Oh boy. Please tell me you don’t take him seriously.


a colleague of T Bearden has prepared an experiment replicated by a 10yr old school girl at school fair ( I suspect Dad helped a lot) which shows overunity and extraction of energy from the Aether

It shows no such thing.



Some of it is simple, but tuning of the simple electronics and magnet placement takes some tweaking. Note some web pages seem to have been adjusted to confuse, if serious get his book

No thanks. Smarter than that.

Have a nice day.


So you are not prepared to obtain a junk bicycle wheel a few cheap magnets, some batteries and minimal electronic parts to do the experiment?

Too SMART for that? Bwahahahaha! Your agenda is clear.

Just like criticising without being prepared to even try to disprove?

Have fun with the magnets! Then give us the benefit of your E Eng degree to explain how & why that which you observe and test, happens!?

Come on please, someone as smart of you should be able to achieve it in 2 hours leave it and come back in another 12 hrs and conclusively test!

I will have a nice day thanks!, hope you one too! (Please don't fall off the edge of the flat planet!)



posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 10:02 PM
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Originally posted by NRen2k5



BTW Are you as well qualified as Adam Trembly?

Who is Adam Trembly?



DO IT and prove it yourself!

Do WHAT myself?


As Wade has pointed out it was a play on words his real name is Adam Trombly. Suggest you google & consider! I sort of expected that you are completely naive about anything FE ... a.k.a. by misspelling both Bedini and Trombly... if you had even a slight clue and had some some serious research on FE , then like Wade you would not have had to ask for correct spelling you would know who I was refering to!... and put it down to parody or a typo!

Cheers

PS Tip... the more exhausted the target rechargeable batteries are the more profound the experiment will be... run them completely flat first!



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 09:12 AM
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Hi Has2B:

I do not know how long you have been dealing with people like NRen2K5. I have been doing so since 1986. As you and others have demonstrated, his command of the subject matter is non-existent, as he tries to inject what he calls “reality” into this thread. But if he ever goes away, another will eagerly come to take his place. None of his posts that I have seen have had ANYTHING to do with the political-economic aspect of FE, so it is ALL off topic. I have rarely met anybody with scientific training who has the slightest idea how the real world of alternative energy works:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

It has to do with their mental orientation and indoctrination, which keeps them naïve, controlled and glued to their armchairs. It was once amazing to continually see their irrationality:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

but anymore it is just a distraction, which is why I do not seek to engage the scientific establishment:

www.ahealedplanet.net...

I have watched some very heavy hitters try to engage the big names of science, to see them completely waste their time. Most scientists have the FOX News view of the world, sad to say.

Be well,

Wade



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 11:14 AM
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Originally posted by Has2b
So you are not prepared to obtain a junk bicycle wheel a few cheap magnets, some batteries and minimal electronic parts to do the experiment?

That’s right. Sure, it isn’t a lot of work, but it’s too much work knowing what the result will be.



Too SMART for that? Bwahahahaha! Your agenda is clear.

Is it, really?



Just like criticising without being prepared to even try to disprove?

No need to disprove something that hasn’t been “proven.”



Have fun with the magnets! Then give us the benefit of your E Eng degree to explain how & why that which you observe and test, happens!?

Magnets don’t produce energy.



Come on please, someone as smart of you should be able to achieve it in 2 hours leave it and come back in another 12 hrs and conclusively test!

Someone with even a high school diploma should realize that you can't magically conjure up energy from nowhere.


I will have a nice day thanks!, hope you one too! (Please don't fall off the edge of the flat planet!)

You too. Make sure you tin foil hat doesn’t come loose!



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by Has2b

Originally posted by NRen2k5



BTW Are you as well qualified as Adam Trembly?

Who is Adam Trembly?



DO IT and prove it yourself!

Do WHAT myself?


As Wade has pointed out it was a play on words his real name is Adam Trombly. Suggest you google & consider!



Zero point energy again. You just don’t learn, do you?

As to Wade, oddly enough his posts haven’t been showing up at my end.
It might have something to do with me putting him on Ignore days ago because I got tired of his spam and the administrators’ complacence.



I sort of expected that you are completely naive about anything FE



Pot… kettle… black!!!



a.k.a. by misspelling both Bedini and Trombly... if you had even a slight clue and had some some serious research on FE , then like Wade you would not have had to ask for correct spelling you would know who I was refering to!... and put it down to parody or a typo!

I’ll probably forget more about energy systems than you kids will ever know. I don’t bother to completely familiarize myself with every face in Free Energy because free energy is a pipe dream. Freely available energy for example solar power is viable, but you can’t magically conjure up energy from nowhere!

How much longer are you going to fall for it; how much money are you going to invest before you realize you’re not getting any returns and you’re never going to?


PS Tip... the more exhausted the target rechargeable batteries are the more profound the experiment will be... run them completely flat first!

I have a battery charging device more efficient than any Bedini or Newman machine. Does Rayovac ring a bell to you?



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 12:13 PM
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Originally posted by Has2b
Wade & StellarX

Stellar I read your reply to my post some weeks back and I admit I have perhaps a poor or "dim" view of humanity. I wish I could find reason to hope that we can find away to bring FE out from under the supression of the powers.


Well such a view is the product of centuries of establishment propaganda and social engineering so it's not surprising that many or most believe it to reflect reality. My investigation of REAL history have however convinced me that there is everything to fight for and that i would be in the best of company.


I have been away and for almost a week, I met with some inventors downunder, and saw some amazing FE developments. Sadly the key "genius" has been got at!... his inventions sit in the corner of a shed not to be used due to threats and fear for the well being of his family. Elated I was with his achievements but saddened that such regularly occurs.


I have in past listed some patents that have never made it into commercial production; to get it as far as patenting is already in my opinion quite the achievement.


I ask you guys.... who I acknowledge are way ahead of me in this field .... WHAT and HOW can we do something to get this stuff in the open and defeat the powerful malicious threats to the dark forces?


The very same we get anything else done on the planet! We organize and educated each other and ourselves; one always hope for the lone genius but that has not so far gotten us far enough....

Stellar



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 12:36 PM
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I have read a good portion of this thread, and I find Wade's stories very interesting... but is inducing awareness of possibility enough? While I have no reason to doubt Wade's substantive personal experience, I have to wonder what his end goal is.

I imagine he may answer that it is to wake people up. I would put forward that in order to do so, you must have the demonstrative knack for opening people's eye's.

Plato's "Allegory of the Cave," is the true tragedy of mankind's existence, as it reflects the chosen ignorance of the shadow-play upon the wall. Yet there is some amount of hope... like ancient Socrates we need to "Corrupt the Youth" in just such a fashion.

And as in the days of Socrates, Sophists still gravitate towards the rational battles. Such as NReN2k5, whose very manner of "Debate" is classical sophistry of the highest calibre.

Sophists do not address the actual matters presented to them, they instead attempt to make argument seem to be the manner for winning. Any rational, Socratic being will see the flaw in the tactic; that just because a person can argue loudly or well does not make them right.

NReN2k5 actually commits terrible logical fallacy's in most of their posts; such as the "Appeal to Authority" fallacy. Rather than address the subject matter, refute or disprove, they cite that they are "Educated" and that they "Know Better" than those "Ignorant Fools" which they argue with.

NReN2k5 also commits "Ad Hominem" against the people mentioned in support of a theory or argument. Yet again, rather than refute or disprove, they resort to calling them "Scheisters", "Hucksters", or "Nutjobs".

Mainstream Science has not yet found a method for FTL travel. It's current understanding of energy and energy generation is incomplete. The theorem and understanding of the five forces is incomplete and stands on unsteady ground. It may very well be toppled in the next few decades.

So what if you are a Electrical Engineer? A degree doesn't mean you know anything, it means you are a very well trained monkey who can memorize data and pass tests. A monkey that can apply some of that data in a useful manner, but it is uniquely human to believe that ones self is infallibly correct, and that the fundamental rules and strictures of which your reality and sanity depend upon are like so much brittle glass... if tapped wrong, it could all shatter.

Perception is like that, and you do not have knowledge, friend. You have perception and what you perceive. Knowledge is the venue of the Gods, as Socrates said... Mankind can just make educated guesses.

So please, friend, stop pretending as if you know anything whatsoever.

To Wade: What needs accomplishing is a socratic dialogue, a step by step method to introduce the layman into thinking about the subject freely. A manner by which they can examine their own thinking through dialogue. In my experience, trying to PROVE something to people only results in them trying to PROVE something right back... the proverbial punching the wall scenario in energy transfer.

What is needed is a gentle touch of teacher, which I feel you may be more than capable of, Sir Wade.



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 04:33 PM
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reply to post by TheColdDragon
 


And you mount a fine ad hominem attack yourself.

You can choose to take the viewpoint that the basis for most of my arguments is appeal to authority, and that’s fine. Forget the facts of the matter. Just go right ahead and attack me and my arguments just for their own sake.

Since you seem to know so much about fallacy, tell me whether you have a problem or not with material fallacies, specifically the way yourself and Stellar are arguing from ignorance.



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 06:28 PM
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Originally posted by NRen2k5



That’s right. Sure, it isn’t a lot of work, but it’s too much work knowing what the result will be. No need to disprove something that hasn’t been “proven.”


Well thanks for the reply. I think you are contributing a massive amount to readers of this thread, by highlighting as a classic example of a stubborn & ignorant attitude. You indicate that you have never been prepared to even investigate FE or experiment (even simple ones)... yet you spend so much time arguing (claiming authority) that "it just can't be" and won't look!

You refer to us as "kids" given that I am approx Wades age you must be ancient!? Wow it would have been fun observing your tantrums when the Wright brothers claimed that a man made machine would fly or watching you stomp your feet in denial when your Dad told you a 2 wheel bicycle was safe & stable.... gee how do you get around do you have to walk everywhere?




Magnets don’t produce energy.


Where did you get that Electrical Eng degree out of a Kellogs packet?
So in a DC or AC generator you think the magnets are an unnecessary component? or just some form of catalyst to change the coal into "electrons"?





Someone with even a high school diploma should realize that you can't magically conjure up energy from nowhere.


That comment is acceptable as based on what is taught based on old knowledge I can understand you and others thinking that such is seemingly logical. Yet when shown a way that you can discover it for yourself you refuse to do so!.... scared of the consequences? FE is not magically conjured it comes from a source that has always existed, known about for 100yrs+ (Tesla, Keely etc etc ) and SUPRESSED due to economic and political consequences



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 06:50 PM
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Originally posted by NRen2k5

As Wade has pointed out it was a play on words his real name is Adam Trombly. Suggest you google & consider!




Zero point energy again. You just don’t learn, do you?

I’ll probably forget more about energy systems than you kids will ever know. I don’t bother to completely familiarize myself with every face in Free Energy because free energy is a pipe dream. Freely available energy for example solar power is viable, but you can’t magically conjure up energy from nowhere!


Here you go again. Trombly's homopolar generator has little to do with ZP! Read first!! before you stick foot in mouth. It is simply a sophisticated extension of Faraday's original coppoer disk generator... you have heard of him in your extensive EEng studies I presume?


How much longer are you going to fall for it; how much money are you going to invest before you realize you’re not getting any returns and you’re never going to?


Eureka! slightly on topic!. Not everyone interested in FE is out to make "returns" I would rather see a healthy clean planet than a fat bank balance! It is selfish greedy attitudes that is supressing it!


I have a battery charging device more efficient than any Bedini or Newman machine. Does Rayovac ring a bell to you?


Yes and you are old enough to remember when there was no such thing as a rechargeable disposable battery.... I can just imagine what your authoritive mantra was back then... "it won't happen it is not possible"?


I realise attempts to steer you to a simple experiment and your obstinate refusal to try it means you won't change your mind. That is OK! I completely accept your right to hold tight to your precious knowledge. BUT how can you speak and pretend offer a"balanced view" when you are not prepared to research , experiment , & approach the subject from both perspectives?



posted on Aug, 30 2007 @ 09:12 PM
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NReN2k5


Do you mean the following fallacy, of which you yourself are alluding to?




Argument from ignorance

The two most common forms of the argument from ignorance, both fallacious, can be reduced to the following form:

* Something is currently unexplained or insufficiently understood or explained, so it is not (or must not be) true.
* Because there appears to be a lack of evidence for one hypothesis, another chosen hypothesis is therefore considered proven.

An adage regarding this fallacy from the philosophy of science is that "absence of evidence is not proof of absence": Not having evidence for something is not proof that something is not or cannot be true. Similarly, merely not having evidence for a particular proposition is not proof that an alternative proposition is instead the case. This is not the same as arguing against something that can, by its nature, never be proven.


I haven't made an assertion whether free energy is true or false. I am willing to entertain the notion, as human hubris about absolute knowledge is a famous mistake throughout recorded history.

You attempt in one sense to make a Reductio Ad Absurdum, but you yourself do not provide ample evidence in support of the tactic, you merely make personal attacks on the education and character of your fellows in this thread; Criticize their views as juvenile, accuse them of gullibility, tell them to go back to school, etc.

Your Argument from Authority is that you are an Electrical Engineer, the desired inferrance being that this gives you professional knowledge over what is and is not possible with electric systems. Are you the proud holder of a PHD? Bachelor's degree? Master's? Really, the answer to these questions are meaningless.

Any educated individual knows that there is just as much foolish conceit at the top as there is ignorant conceit at the bottom. You provide example of this by your behavior.

As Wade has said, you are merely a self-proclaimed troll. Do you come here to ATS to shed light on how ignorant the classical conspiracist is? What is your goal here, that you so tenaciously deride those present who either have personal experience in the matter, or are willing to discuss the possibility that the laws of thermodynamics as understood by the general populace may be more flexible and less absolute?



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