Is Luck Karma?

I've always been a firm believer that "what comes around goes around." In other words...Do something bad karma will bite you in the A$$. Do something good and karma will reward you...

For a real life example.......

About 2-3 years ago I was coming out of a rut in my life. What I didn't realize was how sensitive karma was. Such things as littering or lieing adversely affects your positive karma level.

I came to an agreement with "Karma" and said that I would no longer do anything that my conscience would deem a negative deed. This included throwing away cigarette butts instead of throwing them on the ground which I originally thought was Karma safe, umm I was wrong........

This agreement put me in the neutral zone where Karma thought I didn't deserve anything positive or negative. And for a long time nothing at all bad or good happened to me. This is where the test came in.......

So if I were on a clean slate with Karma then doing something good would make something good happen to me, right? With that thought in mind I picked up some trash I saw lying on the ground.....Nothing happened....Picked up some more trash on another day.......Nothing happened........I was starting to think that little things didn't matter to Karma, I was wrong.........

I recently had a birthday (June 29th) and I was about to refinance my car for a better APR. I was calling my bank to confirm a delinquent charge effecting my credit report when she told me she had no record of any negative credit claim (Which 4 months ago was on the report). She told me that my credit score went up 30 points and there wasn't anything negative at all in my report. Great news I thought.
That same day I was trying to pay off some past delinquent bills. I called up my old cell phone comp and was holding an invoice that was due the 18th of june. The operator said that there was a 0 balance on my account and there was no record of me oweing them anything. I made him double check this with someone that handles the credit score/overdue bills and they confirmed I owed them nothing. I was holding a bill from them for 300 dollars!!! How could this be??? Was Karma wishing me a happy birthday??? Have my trash picking adventures paid off???

Anyway I just wanted to share my experience (not the only example)
Does anyone have any similar stories?
and is good luck positive Karma???

Pick up trash and you will be rewarded!!!

Thanks

Good thinking. I've always believed the use of the term "luck" was a silly way to simplify the grander laws of nature and God. Basically I believe we create the world around us, both individually and collectively, whether we are awakened to that idea or not.

So then why do bad things happen to good people, like cancer or paralysis? Either they actually aren't a good person after all, or more likely it is a symptom of our collective consciousness. The negative actions and thinking of the greater society creates a sort of collective karma, and it effects all its members regardless of how good a person they are.

Sometimes its the small things that count. I also used to litter but rapidly changing spiritual beliefs inspired me to stop a while back. I can't point to any specific reward per say, but I definitely notice an improvement in my mood and outlook on life since.

I thought cigarette butts were biodegradable??

[edit on 5-7-2007 by Vipassana]

Picking up trash (or doing good deeds) for the sole purpose of getting a reward would negate the purpose of karma. Example: Hmmm i'll give this homeless dude some lunch and maybe God will give me a break on my bills.

Karma (Sanskrit: kárma (help·info), kárman- "act, action, performance"[1]; Pāli: kamma) is the concept of "action" or "deed" in Dharmic religions understood as denoting the entire cycle of cause and effect described in Hindu, Jain, Sikh and Buddhist philosophies. The idea behind karma is not only found in Buddhism and Hinduism; it seems that the Bible certainly conveys the same essence:

Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A person reaps what he sows.
(Gal. 6:7)

All things whatsoever you would that men should do to you,
do even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
(Matthew 7:12) Also the 'Golden Rule' of Confucianism makes a similar statement:

Tzu-kung asked, "Is there one word which may serve as a rule of practice for all one's life?"
Confucius answered, "Is not reciprocity such a word? What you do not want done to yourself, do not do to others."'
Hi, I found the info above on the web just for a little bit background but I really wanted to share a thought I've allways had about karma. If karma has some form of control over our fate do you think that maybe we could pay for it (be punished for bad things we've done) before we have acctualy committed the crime?

Originally posted by Fallacy
Picking up trash (or doing good deeds) for the sole purpose of getting a reward would negate the purpose of karma. Example: Hmmm i'll give this homeless dude some lunch and maybe God will give me a break on my bills.

I know im new here but how does one get negative ATS points? Do you just go through people's threads spreading negativity Fallacy?

Sounds like you could use a dose of positive energy yourself. I will think positivly about your comments and wish you only the best......

Thanks guys!

Originally posted by Vipassana
...So then why do bad things happen to good people, like cancer or paralysis? Either they actually aren't a good person after all, or more likely it is a symptom of our collective consciousness. The negative actions and thinking of the greater society creates a sort of collective karma, and it effects all its members regardless of how good a person they are.....

I thought cigarette butts were biodegradable??

Excellent!
What you believe makes logical sense to me. Maybe if we are tuned in to this collective consciousness we can alter our outcome in life. Doing positve things only helps you tune in, making your life better as a result.

I dont know about biodegradable but they certainly do not belong on the ground, am I right?

Thanks!

First of all, I do pick up trash - not because of Karma, but because I'm very conscientous of the environment. I love nature, and it disgusts me how people trash it. I've done this off and on for a few years.

I never really heard anything about cig butts being biodegradable, but I don't think that they are. That stuff inside that they use for the filters does not biodegrade. If you pick up enough trash, you'll eventually run into a cig butt that's been there for quite some time. And although the paper around it is biodegraded by then, the filter is not. I think that's just a rumor, an excuse people use for throwing them out their windows. I always kept my butts until I could find somewhere to throw them away. Well, most of the time. I'd only throw it outside if I was on the highway or something. But that's all over now. I haven't smoked a cigarette since November.

Anyway... there's a thought-pattern that coincides with this somewhat. And people who are into the manifestation thing, will tell you that the more positive you put into your life, the more positive things you will experience. Same with negativity. Basically, the energy you put into the world will deeply affect the outcome. I'm not sure if this coincides with Karma, or if they are related, or whatever.

I can say from my own experience that this seems to be true, though. For instance, growing up, I had a bad life. Although I was taken care of, fed, etc., I was also verbally/physically/emotionally abused by my father. I was extra shy and afraid as a result of this, and never had many friends. As a result, I learned to think negatively.

For the rest of my life, until November, my life was a downward spiral. Even when I got away from my father, I still ended up in crappy places where people took advantage of me and belittled me. Throughout all of this, although I will state that I'm FAR from perfect, even though I had a negative outlook, I still tried to be a good person. I'd help people out if they asked me to, I'd pick up litter, do little things like that.

Then, in November... this guy that I knew for about 5-6 years asked me if I wanted to move in with him and his roomies. I said yes. Well, I have to admit that I've always liked this guy ever since I've known him, and he was the same way with me. But ever since I made that move, things have gotten so much better. I am with a guy who treats me right (I've been with a few who didn't), he loves me for who I am, he shares the same viewpoints as me, and we come pretty darn close to reading each other's minds sometimes. He's the sweetest person ever, and I'd never, EVER give him up. And we've got some kind of connection going on.

Ever since then, I've been able to work on my point of view. I still have my faults, yes, but I'm gradually getting better. I'm viewing things more positively, and well... they are working out more positively, too.

I might not have the best job, but it's better than the ones I had before. I'm with the sweetest guy in the world, and he loves me and respects me for who I am. I get to volunteer at a rehab center for raptors (which is just AWESOME).

So... from my experience, that seems to be true. I'm not sure if it's a matter of one affecting the outcome, or if it's Karma. Could be both, actually. I wonder if they are more closely related than we think.

On a side note, though. If you view things more in a positive light, then you are more likely to notice positive things that happen to you. If you only see negative, then... well, that's all you see.

[edit on 6-7-2007 by MinHawk]

MinHawk:

Thanks for your reply....
I am happy to see you are coming out of your spiral
You are right when you say that viewing things positivly will help you notice positive things happening to you. If thinking positivly actually makes positive things happen, that is the question. I believe the answer is yes, if the intent of the individual is truly good, not just for reaping rewards from karma.

Thanks......

Here are some feelings I have about Karma.. However this is just my veiw, and doesnt mean this is the only way. What works for 1 may not work for another.. Luck is like dice, yet people like me.. If it wasnt for badluck, Id have no luck at all!! LOL yet Im a good person...

The mechanism of karma appears to be a by-product of the design of life and the universe, and as a result provides a natural scheme of salvation. We consequently have what we call karmic lessons. Without this karmic law (referred to in channeling as the 'great karmic law'), entities of consciousness would accumulate negativity and eventually become totally fragmented from the whole, resulting in annihilation. In turn this could ultimately destroy the whole. Thus it is desirable to have a mechanism which protects the whole.

The fragmentation results because in order to do something to another, which one would not want done to oneself, one must block off one's ability to perceive the other person's viewpoint. In doing this, one builds up occlusion within consciousness, fragmenting it, lowering the vibrations, and one gradually sinks into increasing unconsciousness. Note that such a process can't be observed when it is a gradual devolution. Consciousness fundamentally can only know its own state.

The karmic law creates debt whenever harm is done to another, which must be paid back. It is a mechanism which safeguards the whole (All That Is, God) but gives freewill to the fragments. Note that the law also pertains to good actions being returned to one, but the consequences of negative actions is of more concern.

It has been stated that this law cannot be annulled but it would appear this doesn't mean it can't ever be overridden by special procedures, either by the individual or on a grand scale by possibly such authorities as the so-called Karmic Board, or God.

In the East, people have retained an understanding of karma, contrary to Western education which omits it. Nevertheless, there has been a tendency, particularly in the East, to avoid helping another in karmic matters, with the misconception that they will incur karma by interfering with the individual's lessons. However, to the contrary we can know that omission in helping others can incur karma. This is one of the reasons Christianity rejected karma, believing that members would similarly take on this belief in contradiction to the Christian teaching regarding serving others.

Originally posted by Vipassana

So then why do bad things happen to good people, like cancer or paralysis?

"Flowers love the sunshine, but it's the rain that makes them grow." mrwupy.

I know, I know, all life needs a balance of sunshine and rain to become strong and healthy. That doesn't change the fact that we love the sunshine, but we need the rain.

The bad things that people have to go thru are just tempering their soul for a greater challenge on down the line. They are being prepared for something that they must have to face, if they are to keep growing.

What we consider bad things are often blessings in disguise.

As for Karma, It's not a difficult concept. If you hang out with thieves, they will steal from you. If you hang out with murderers, they will probably kill you, If you harm those around you, you will be harmed in return.

Just some thoughts on it,

wupy

Originally posted by mrwupy
What we consider bad things are often blessings in disguise.

That is very true! I feel the same way....execpt for bills they make me sad and are not disguising anything but money out of my pocket

Thanks

I do, I enjoy doing good deeds for people, I know it's funny but I kinda make them out to be like a quest. I know it's silly, but if there's anything video games have taught me it's if you help someone out you will be rewarded! I know it's silly. But anyway, So I will ask someone if they need help if I see them struggling or give a bum 5$ for lunch, or something along those lines. Sure enough I am often rewarded by Karma. I don't know what I've done recently but I know it must have upset the balance, lately I've been having alot of bad karma. I think I have to do something to reset it.

Originally posted by parry noid
....I don't know what I've done recently but I know it must have upset the balance, lately I've been having alot of bad karma. I think I have to do something to reset it......

You must review your past actions. What have you been doing that would upset the "force"? Anything subtle, even a "white lie" will negativly affect you. Be conscious of every action you take for the next month, dont do anything "bad" or "good" and try to see if Karma will throw you in the neutral zone like it did me. When you are neutral experiment with little good deeds and see if your situation turns around for the better. My guess is that it will.

Thanks for the repies people!

Originally posted by IMAdamnALIEN
MinHawk:

Thanks for your reply....
I am happy to see you are coming out of your spiral

You are right when you say that viewing things positivly will help you notice positive things happening to you. If thinking positivly actually makes positive things happen, that is the question. I believe the answer is yes, if the intent of the individual is truly good, not just for reaping rewards from karma.

Thanks......

You're welcome. I'm usuall cautious here, but I saw this topic, it seemed interesting, and I felt I had to say something. Yay for random compulsions.

I believe the answer is yes, too. Sure, you're not necessarily going to win the lottery because you have a positive outlook, but I believe that it will make life a lot more bearable and enjoyable for you.

Intent... is a big thing, though. But then, that's only something that can really be determined by the person themselves. And a lot of people don't want to examine themselves that closely. They are afraid of what they might find.

Originally posted by MinHawk
Intent... is a big thing, though. But then, that's only something that can really be determined by the person themselves. And a lot of people don't want to examine themselves that closely. They are afraid of what they might find.

Maybe this Karmatic force if you will, can determine an individuals intent, thus rendering it "good" or "bad" and adjusting the Karma points accordingly.

You are right when saying people would be afraid of what they could find out about themselves. Maybe that is why so many people shy away from alternative topics such as this....They are afraid of knowing???

Thanks

Thanks for the info, but what do you mean? dont do anything bad, but also dont do anything good? like dont help someone? cause to me that kinda seems like something bad, i don't know, I want to try but I need clarification.

Karma is fairly misunderstood and simplified by westerners to mean basically "what goes around comes around." In Hinduism it's a complicated subject that involves the three gunas (which I'm not going to explain here).

Both good and bad karma are considered undesirable, as karma is associated with attachment to the material plane. It isn't so much what you do as how you think about what you do that creates karma.

For example, if you find a wallet full of money and return it expecting to receive thanks and possibly a reward, you can expect that you're creating good karma; but someone more spiritually advanced would simply return it anonymously and be completely indifferent to any consequences of having returned it, good or bad, thereby creating no karma at all.

You might be thinking, why not indifferently keep it then if it doesn't matter? But of course you can't fool yourself--you know what's right and wrong, and you know you create suffering to another if you don't return what doesn't belong to you, so there is no way to be indifferent to such an act. Therefore, returning it, even with attachment, is essential, but returning it without attachment is the best.

This is the purpose of yoga (I'm not talking about westernized yoga exercises). It is the practice of burning away one's karma through disciplines designed to gain control over one's senses and the objects of the senses, so that one can act without attachment, thereby incurring no karma. And if you have no karma, you have no rebirth into the plane of pain and suffering, where we find ourselves now.

Originally posted by IMAdamnALIEN

Originally posted by MinHawk
Intent... is a big thing, though. But then, that's only something that can really be determined by the person themselves. And a lot of people don't want to examine themselves that closely. They are afraid of what they might find.

Maybe this Karmatic force if you will, can determine an individuals intent, thus rendering it "good" or "bad" and adjusting the Karma points accordingly.

You are right when saying people would be afraid of what they could find out about themselves. Maybe that is why so many people shy away from alternative topics such as this....They are afraid of knowing???

Thanks

Quite possibly. A lot of people seem to be afraid to admit to their faults, where they're wrong, etc. They probably wouldn't want to know what they're doing wrong as a result.

I've always believed in karma too although sometimes something bad might happen to me and i can't for the life of me figure out what i did wrong to deserve it. I also know quite a few people who are really bad people, that scab money off everyone and never pay it back, they use their friends for money, accomodation, etc. that sort of thing, and nothing bad ever happens to them, perhaps they will reap what they sow later on i dunno.

But to answer the question, I'm not sure if luck is karma, simply because you can be lucky even in times when you haven't been good or when your having a really bad day. I think luck is more to do with consciousness affecting reality i.e. mind-over-matter.

I think I figured it out.... I meditated on it last night and came up with a few things. Not to mention the very well written descriptions, thanks guys.
Here are a few things affecting my karma Im guessing,

1. I smacked (not hard, and on the butt) A cat that attacked my kitty
2. I took 5.00 from my wife without telling her
3. I thought bad things about other people
4. probably a little longer of a list than this

I have however changed the first 2 things, I apologized to the cat and gave it some food, and told my wife about the $5. I have stopped thinking bad thoughts, and will attempt from now on to remain neutral!