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Iraqi prime minister criticizes U.S. raid that leaves 26 dead in Baghdad's Sadr City

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posted on Jun, 30 2007 @ 09:16 PM
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Iraqi prime minister criticizes U.S. raid that leaves 26 dead in Baghdad's Sadr City


www.signonsandiego.com

BAGHDAD – Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki condemned a U.S. raid Saturday in Baghdad's Shiite Sadr City slum – a politically sensitive district for him – in which American troops searching for Iranian-linked militants sparked a firefight the U.S. said left 26 Iraqis dead.

The U.S. military said all those killed in the fighting were gunmen, some of them firing from behind civilian cars. But an Iraqi official put the death toll lower, at eight, and said they were civilians.
(visit the link for the full news article)


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posted on Jun, 30 2007 @ 09:16 PM
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While public attention is safely diverted onto security and terrorism concerns, news from Iraq of a U.S. raid draws condemnation from the Iraqi Prime Minister.

The U.S. government claims that Iraq should move toward independence, yet takes action which may have embarrassed al-Maliki's Shiite-led government. "The Iraqi government totally rejects U.S. military operations ... conducted without prior approval from the Iraqi military command" The Prime Minister is quoted as saying in the news article.

If we are eventually to turn over all operations to the Iraqi leaders and people, why take actions which conflict with their authority?

Could this lack of respect for the current elected Iraqi leader indicate that U.S. forces will ignore them, and take actions without any regard for their sovereign authority to govern themselves and their own nation?

If Iraq is to find peace within itself, does these actions by U.S. military forces undermine the Iraqis ability to find that very peace?

Are we simply throwing more fuel on the fires of conflict in Iraq rather than trying to help stabilize the country?

Meanwhile in London and Scotland...

www.signonsandiego.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 30-6-2007 by UM_Gazz]



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 01:17 AM
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No suprise there, he is a turn coat bastard. trying to keep Iran happy and the nut balls off his a** ....he will do and say anything to save his hide.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:20 AM
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Originally posted by TXMACHINEGUNDLR
No suprise there, he is a turn coat bastard. trying to keep Iran happy and the nut balls off his a** ....he will do and say anything to save his hide.



you have absolutely no idea at all about politics in Iraq do you.

this has nothing to do with Iran and everything about US forces are trying to undermine the elected leader of the country.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 09:04 AM
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Interesting comments.

Many on both sides of the U.S. political arena agree that the ultimate solution for stabilizing Iraq, and removing U.S. forces from the country would be when a democratically elected leadership and army can take over and run their country.

However now it seems that many do not like the results of Iraqi elections.

The above report seems to indicate that U.S. will not bow to any Iraqi leader, therefore the Iraqi government is irrelevant when it comes to U.S. occupation forces.

It is possible that part of perpetuating a continuous war agenda in Iraq would be to keep the conflicts going, and do things that are contrary to the wishes of the elected leaders.

Iraq can have democracy, but must accept the fact that U.S. forces do not answer to them, nor will have to seek any authorization from them.

Why not simply remove the elected Iraqi government, and replace them with appointed puppets, and let U.S. commanders, and generals run the country as the wish, at least until they have captured or killed everyone they believe is an enemy?

No need to tease the Iraqis with freedom and democracy, then have to undermine their authority to keep the war going in the above scenario!



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 09:58 AM
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Seems that the figures are either wrong or exaggerated,

Sadir Officials put the figure at around 10


A Sadr aid disputed the claim of heavy casualties. Ammar al-Saadi told Reuters that fewer than 10 people had been killed, with three wounded and six detained in the raids.
Yahoonews

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


So who is lying here has to be one of them.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by shots
Seems that the figures are either wrong or exaggerated,

Sadir Officials put the figure at around 10

So who is lying here has to be one of them.


Interesting point, yet the title of your linked report reads U.S. kills 26 militants in Baghdad


Taken out of context perhaps?

The actual conflicting reports read more like this:



The U.S. military said it conducted two pre-dawn raids in Sadr City, killing 26 “terrorists” who attacked U.S. troops with small arms fire, rocket-propelled grenades and roadside bombs.

An Iraqi official, speaking on condition of anonymity due to security concerns, said eight people had died – all civilians – and 20 others were wounded. It was not immediately clear why the death tolls varied.

An American military spokesman insisted all of those killed were combatants.

Source Link


And more from the same source that should be noted:



Witnesses said U.S. forces rolled into their neighborhood before dawn and opened fire without warning.

“At about 4 a.m., a big American convoy with tanks came and began to open fire on houses – bombing them,” said Basheer Ahmed, who lives in Sadr City's Habibiya district. “What did we do? We didn't even retaliate – there was no resistance.”


Winning the hearts and minds, defeating the enemies of freedom and democracy, "a stabilizing force, bringing peace and security to a troubled country"... and all that rot.




posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 12:07 PM
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Iraq has to much internal turmoil due to the corruption in its own government and then the problem of it's difficulties with trying to show legitimacy while the US invasion still shows to be in charge.

No government will survive to gain the trust and confidence of their people when everyday his power is undermined.

Now the Iraqi government is to keep tallies on the civilian deaths to make the American surge look like is working.

But when something like this raid happen is hard for the Iraqi government to keep hiding the death.

June alone was between 1200 from the highest between 1500 to 2000 thousand in the last year during a month, due to attacks or else.

This amount of people dying is nothing more than genocide within different groups within Iraq, but when the death is cause by raids or American exercises then the Iraqi government has to answer to its people.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 12:15 PM
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This is another terrible tradegy for the people of Iraq. Again as in the bombings of police stations and army recruits etc the very people who could bring self governance and stabilty to Iraq are being decimated, and those who arnt are members of the old Baathist Dictatorship.

It is awfull for the civilians of Iraq and life seems to be becoming more and more cheap and not acknoleged in this conflict.

Very sad and as stated this wont get the Press and attention it deserves as we are all being distracted by recent events in the UK.

kind regards

Elf



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by UM_Gazz

Originally posted by shots
Seems that the figures are either wrong or exaggerated,

Sadir Officials put the figure at around 10

So who is lying here has to be one of them.


Interesting point, yet the title of your linked report reads U.S. kills 26 militants in Baghdad


Taken out of context perhaps?



I doubt it given what happened to Reuters and the AP just last week or the week before. They are both running with their tails between there legs on that one. I am talking about the false story they published that was fed to them via insurgents saying 20? had been beheaded or something along those lines. Reuters and AP have since retracted.

Reuters has has been known to EMail Terrorits that alone has to tell you alot.

Taken out of context No I would say they are feeding us with propaganda given to them by insurgents.

[edit on 7/1/2007 by shots]



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:33 PM
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Good News from Iraq?

Iraqi civilian death toll down 36 percent


www.usatoday.com


BAGHDAD (AP) — Iraqi civilian deaths dropped to their lowest level since the start of the Baghdad security operation, government figures showed Sunday, suggesting signs of progress in tamping down violence in the capital.

But American casualties are running high as U.S. forces step up pressure on Sunni and Shiite extremists in and around Baghdad.

At least 1,227 Iraqi civilians were killed in June along with 190 policemen and 31 soldiers, an officer at the Iraqi Interior Ministry's operations room said. The officer spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the figures.
(visit the link for the full news article)

Of course the numbers of civilian deaths couldn't be down because all those being killed are now immediately labeled "combatants" as in the original report in this thread could they?

Civilians? Combatants?

Fuzzy Math?



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by shots
Reuters has has been known to EMail Terrorits that alone has to tell you alot.

Taken out of context No I would say they are feeding us with propaganda given to them by insurgents.

[edit on 7/1/2007 by shots]


Oh shots, and just a couple of hours ago you dissed a completely legitimate story because you didn't find the source satisfactory and then you use the site above. Their tag line reads, "Exposing and combating Liberal media bias."


Propaganda shots? Who's?



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:40 PM
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An American military spokesman insisted all of those killed were combatants.


Curiouser, and curiouser....



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid

Propaganda shots? Who's?


Oh give me a break I could find another link if I wanted it just so happend I pciked th first one because I knew where the story was.


Now if you go back to that alleged source you do not like you will find the link below


I would have used Reuters link but it was Dead But thanks for playing.




posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 02:56 PM
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How to kill "TERRORISTS" in Iraq?

Well - shoot civilians, and then place weapons in their cold dead hand:


US troops on Iraq murder charges

The US military in Iraq has charged two of its soldiers with the murder of three Iraqis between April and June in the Iskandariya area, south of Baghdad. Both of the men are accused of premeditated murder and placing weapons beside the bodies of the dead, who were killed in three separate incidents.


Mod Edit: BB Code.

[edit on 1/7/2007 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
How to kill "TERRORISTS" in Iraq?

Well - shoot civilians, and then place weapons in their cold dead hand:



Like I say countless of time, the death can not tell their side of the story and can be anything you want them to be.

This raid by "coalition forces" comes as a slap in the face to the Iraqi government that is trying to made the tag on civilian deaths look more attractive to match the success of the US surge.

But it back fire.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by UM_Gazz
Interesting comments.

Many on both sides of the U.S. political arena agree that the ultimate solution for stabilizing Iraq, and removing U.S. forces from the country would be when a democratically elected leadership and army can take over and run their country.

However now it seems that many do not like the results of Iraqi elections.

The above report seems to indicate that U.S. will not bow to any Iraqi leader, therefore the Iraqi government is irrelevant when it comes to U.S. occupation forces.



To be blunt the Current government in Iraq is twiddling it's fingers much the way Fatah did in the Palestinian territories. They too never wanted to act on their "brothers" (Hamas) till it was too late.

I could be wrong but I don't think that many in Iraq dislike the results of the elections, they dislike the results or should I say lack of results from those elected officials.

The Shia led govt. in Iraq needs to figure out how to be a "unity" government and needs to learn it very fast. Right now everyone in Iraq knows that the central govt. there is delaying on making important decisions, mainly because they don't want to upset their Shia constituents. I got news for them, if they don't have a real representative government in place with a trained military by the end of this surge of ours, upsetting their constituents will be the least of their problems. The gridlock we are seeing in the Iraqi parliament must cease.

Time is almost up for the Iraqis to get working on solving their own problems, if they can't, then so be it. I'm all for giving them some breathing room to get it done but watching the Political process over there is a little like watching frozen molasses pour out of a jar. If I remember correctly, the Iraqi parliament wanted to recess for the summer rather than solve the pressing problems that need solving. Give me a break! Either the central government means to include everyone in the process or they will have to suffer the consequences of their inaction. They need to walk on their own very soon.

As to your comment about the US army not respecting the Iraqi government, the US got permission before the "surge" started to conduct military operations "anywhere" it needed to. The PM is doing that speech purely for his own constituents, he knows he gave the US the leeway to go into Sadr city. If there were enough trained Iraqi troops maybe they could be the ones keeping order in Baghdad.

The day is coming soon when either Iraq solves it's political problems or it descends into anarchy. Either way, it will have to be the Iraqi's themselves that chooses which path they take. I think most Americans think that the current government in Iraq doesn't take their situation seriously enough, knowing that the US Army is there to keep things together. I got more news for them, it won't always be like that.



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 06:38 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
How to kill "TERRORISTS" in Iraq?

Well - shoot civilians, and then place weapons in their cold dead hand:


US troops on Iraq murder charges

The US military in Iraq has charged two of its soldiers with the murder of three Iraqis between April and June in the Iskandariya area, south of Baghdad. Both of the men are accused of premeditated murder and placing weapons beside the bodies of the dead, who were killed in three separate incidents.




That sent a chill down my spine. I really wouldn't put it past some of the cowboys out there...



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 07:45 PM
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Originally posted by pavil
Time is almost up for the Iraqis to get working on solving their own problems, if they can't, then so be it.


If they can't...

Would you say that our version of democracy in Iraq is a complete failure?

Or if they can't... We will trump their authority and do it for them?

Time is almost up... How much time would you say that the Iraqis have to solve "their own problems"??



posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 08:29 PM
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If our goal was to destabalize the region,
then everything makes perfect sense.

They'll never work together because we're inciting them.


Would you say that our version of democracy in Iraq is a complete failure?

I'd hate to answer a question with
a question, (even one not directed at me) BUT,
What IS our version of democracy?
Is OUR democracy working? lol


Or if they can't... We will trump their authority and do it for them?


I don't think the Iraqis ever
had any REAL authority. (after Sadaam)

We're control freaks.. and we can't let go the reins of chaos.




[edit on 7/1/2007 by aecreate]



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