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Greatest center ever?

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posted on Jun, 30 2007 @ 12:44 PM
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I got the inspiration for this thread from chissler's Oden/Durant thread. This is a great argument and people may have differing opinions.

Here's how I look at it:

Most Dominating - Shaq/Chamberlain

Shaq probably wins this battle just because of his size and strength. When he gets it in the low post it's almost guaranteed. As a result his shooting percentage is one of the best, if not one of the best of all time (not sure). Wilt was the Shaq of his day, better than Bill Russell, but just by a hair. Both Russell and Chamberlain were far ahead of Shaq defensively in my opinion.

Most Skilled - Hakeem Olajuwon

As far as I'm concerned, without a doubt, all around the best center who's ever played. Defensively/offensively, inside/outside, the most skilled. A lot of people are surprised that Hakeem is the all-time leader in blocked shots. I remember the years when this guy used to get quadruple doubles, which honestly I can't remember any player doing since. In my heart he's the best, but will always be underrated in this argument because he was a foreigner and not able to speak as well as others. Therefore he didn't get the endorsements he should have.

Most Unstoppable Shot - Kareem Abdul Jabbar

The sky hook. End of argument.


What say you BTS?

Peace




posted on Jul, 1 2007 @ 04:27 PM
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hmm, you're right about shaq and the stilt

Hakeem's the man (and I say that reluctantly b/c I'm still waiting for the foul calls against him in the 94 finals agaist the Knicks).

from what I hear Arvydas Sabonis was ILL when he was healthy...

hilights

more hilights



[edit on 7/1/2007 by acegotflows]



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 09:12 AM
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I'm surprised someone would even consider anyone other than Chamberlain as best center ever.

1- Only NBA player to average more than 50 points for a season
2- Only player to score over 100 in a single game
3- Won 7 scoring, 9 FG %, and 11 rebounding titles
4- Once led the league in assists!
5- 4 time league MVP


Oh yeah, track & field? Ran the 100 in 10.9, threw the shot 56', triple jumped more than 50', and won the high jump in the Big Eight track and field championships three straight years!

Played for the Harlem Globetrotters ('58-'59)

Scored more than 20,000 um.... ladies.

Shaq couldn't carry Wilt's sneakers.



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 10:03 AM
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Head to head, in their primes, Shaq would run right over him (or through him). Kobe scoring 80 was more of a feat than Wilt scoring 100. Wilt was playing against white midgets for the most part. I'll give Wilt the 20,000 women thing even though it's mathematically impossible.


Peace



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 10:13 AM
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If the game was "run over or through someone" Shaq might win. Yep, I'll say Shaq was potentially a better Red Rover player.

Shaq swings that big can of his around and takes the illegal hop-step. When you're allowed to swing that big Buick-sized ass around with impunity, and travel across the lane on every play....

Put Shaq and Wilt in their prime on the floor with Wilt-era NBA rules and Wilt-era NBA refs, Wilt would have him spinning on his big keister.



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 02:27 PM
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Originally posted by yeahright
Yep, I'll say Shaq was potentially a better Red Rover player.




If you make a list of the TEN best centers of all time in terms of basketball skill, Shaq wouldn't make the list.

Exhibit A: THE LIST

Bill Russell
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Hakeem Olajuwon
Bill Walton
Tim Duncan
David Robinson
George Mikan
Patrick Ewing
Moses Malone
Wilt Chamberlain


Shaq is a MASSIVE man who moves amazingly well for how big he is...and couldn't shoot outside of three feet to save his life.

Was Wilt much better? Nope...but he nailed way more women.



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 02:36 PM
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Oh, there's no doubt Shaq dominated solely because of his girth and power. That being said, the results speak for themselves. There's not a center in history who could have guarded Shaq one on one inside five feet from the basket while he was in his prime. Hakeem made him look like a high school player in the finals, but Shaq was still wet behind the ears. Later on in Shaq's career Hakeem couldn't deal with him anymore.

I must say his inabilty to shoot free throws and his unwillingness to improve that part of his game always sticks in my craw.

Peace



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 02:59 PM
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Greatest center ever?

Mario Lemieux ?



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 03:03 PM
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Is he that dude that played "Snow White" in the Ice Capades?





posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 03:15 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid
Greatest center ever?

Mario Lemieux ?


No way.

If there was an international center with no NBA experience but huge upside the Seattle Sonics would have taken him with the second pick.



posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 07:07 PM
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I find it hard to believe nary a mention of the greatest player of all time, Bill Russell.

5 league MVP's (and he played at the same time that Wilt did)
12 time all star
11 times led his team to the league championship, 11 out of 12 years.

I've heard the argument that Russell played with other hall of famers, and don't buy it for one second. They didn't win a championship before him, and barely lost with him, then didn't win without him. He made those around him better, and the team was nearly unstoppable because of that.

He didn't have the out of this world stats that Wilt did, but, when it counted, he delivered.


~ Gibbsie

PS - I couldn't find the old ST thread on the greatest player ever, but if anyone digs it up, you'll see the other points I make.



posted on Jul, 3 2007 @ 05:15 AM
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Shaq mentioned in the same breath as Wilt? Puuhleeeze...

Shaquille O'Neil is good, borderline great, but comparing him to Wilt Chamberlain is...is...is...well, just not right.

Chamberlain could score from just about anywhere on the court, underrated passer, defensive force, he'd have several more rings save for the fact he played during the great Celtic teams era. I'd put his Philly teams of that era up against any team of any era, save maybe the Celtic teams that beat him seemingly every year. That includes the oh so great Bulls teams of Micheal Jordan.

Had Shaq ever tried to improve his game, we'd not be having this conversation, he'd have been the single greatest player ever. It wasn't 'til a couple of years ago that he could even be bothered to stretch before games. We won't even talk about his free throw shooting, atrocious doesn't even begin to cover it, and he didn't exactly work real hard to correct that either, did he?

Greatest ever? Nope. Could have been? Oh, my god, yes...



posted on Jul, 3 2007 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by Susquehanna
I find it hard to believe nary a mention of the greatest player of all time, Bill Russell.


Scroll up a bit. Essedarius mentioned Russell. Who certainly ranks among the greatest of all time.

I've got a hypothetical prop bet for the O'Neal fans. Let's say you've got $1000 to bet and you can wager it on either Shaq making his next free throw or Tiger Woods winning the next tournament he enters.

Which would you take?



posted on Jul, 3 2007 @ 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by yeahright
Let's say you've got $1000 to bet and you can wager it on either Shaq making his next free throw or Tiger Woods winning the next tournament he enters.


Let's see...

Tiger is scheduled to play the AT&T National this weekend and is sitting at about 3/1 to win.

Shaq is currently shooting about 42% from the line, down from his career average of 52%.

I'll take Shaq, with a parlay on Zach Randolph in rehab by November and Mickelson dropping out in the second round due to injury.

(We really need an ATS Sportsbook...where we could put our member points up on this stuff.)



posted on Jul, 3 2007 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by Essedarius
I'll take Shaq, with a parlay on Zach Randolph in rehab by November and Mickelson dropping out in the second round due to injury.




Looking at last year's results, Tiger was .533. Seems like he's "slipping" a bit this year. A little more vulnerable, but he could turn it on.

I still think I'd take Tiger. Shaq just never cared much about free throws.

And I'm amazed the Knick fans are so gaga over Randolph. Or were they just that glad to get rid of Steve Francis?

If Francis is a no-show, it's a gift.



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 12:37 PM
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Steve Francis is such a cancer.

I got a cold chill last week when I heard a rumor that the Sonics were looking at Francis to be their PG once he was jettisoned from Portland.

I can't imagine that it's true.



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by Essedarius
Steve Francis is such a cancer.


He could have been great. His immaturity surpasses his talent, and that's saying something. Stephon Marbury (or as he likes to be called....."Starbury") is the same. There's still time for both guys though. I'm not sure if either has a family, but sometimes it takes a rearranging of priorities to see the light, a la Allen Iverson.

Peace



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by Dr Love
He could have been great. His immaturity surpasses his talent, and that's saying something.


Agreed 100%.

I think the perfect example of what you're saying was the 2000 dunk contest when he was pitted against Vince Carter.

THE TALENT

Vince Carter put on the best dunking display EVER (sorry MJ and 'Nique, it's true), and Francis hung right with him the whole time. Now I didn't watch him super close at Maryland, but I had NO IDEA the kind of athletic talent the dude had. Unbelievable. He made me a fan.

THE IMMATURITY

After finishing second to the best dunker in the history of the game, Francis turns to the ESPN camera, shakes his head smuggly and says something along the lines of "They didn't want me to win. What could I do? They knew who they wanted to win." What??!? They fixed it? Did you SEE what Vince just did?!?

And that's how I stopped being a Steve Francis fan about 15 minutes after I started.



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 02:40 PM
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Originally posted by Essedarius
(sorry MJ and 'Nique, it's true)


That was unfortunate for Dominique because I personally thought he was the best before Carter came along. Jordan was known for one dunk, which has since been duplicated even better by Brent Barry. Wilkins got higher and dunked harder than Jordan IMO.

I'm not giving up on Francis though. Unfortunately his contract is such an albatross that most teams aren't going to have a lot of patience. I wouldn't mind seeing him back in Houston someday. If Adelman can handle Bonzi Wells, then he can certainly handle Francis.

Peace



posted on Jul, 13 2007 @ 05:39 PM
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I don't even think that Shaq "I only really try when it is an important game" O Neal should be on this list.

For me it is either Wilt, Bill, or Kareem.



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