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[HOAX] Isaac CARET - Drones [HOAX]

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posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 03:15 AM
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reply to post by Sys_Config
 


The four corners are all mirrors,
probably copy+pasted from the Isaac .jpg I put in the center here:


Creating a brush wouldn't be necessary to achieve this, I was just curious if he had one.

That artwork was a concept piece for the 2008 Soulfly album titled Conquer, the finished piece is here, minus the corner circles, the big one in the middle around the head stayed in:



I haven't found anything really interesting that pre dates the Isaac site, but the gallery's idea is an excellent idea.

hahaha, are 2 birds in a bush really that valuable?

[edit on 9-10-2008 by freelance_zenarchist]




posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 09:25 AM
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Finding an obvious connection that predates the Isaac product would be the proverbial Man Bites Dog headline. That's what we are looking for. Someone made this all up, probably several people. It is not impossible for us to figure out who it was. As Sysco has said several times recently, the leads keep pointing to a pretty specific geographic area, which also just happens to be the home base of one of the Legendary Lying "Researchers" of the DRT. This whole episode has an awful stink about it, and some of us are not content to just shovel lime on it and pretend it's all settled. It will come back to haunt the field of ufology if it is not settled.

There are some precedents. For some time, the "Great Lakes Dive Company" fiasco seemed to be closely related to the drone business, and it may well turn out to have been perpetrated by some of the same people, or maybe it was commissioned by the same agency. At any rate, that story is completely dead. The evil Bennewitz affair and the Serpo bad joke both are firmly in the hoax category for anyone who wants to check them out thoroughly, but they both still manage to produce huge amounts of pollution in the UFO field. The more light we can shine on the drone business at this point, the less likely it is to become the next "Dulce Base" black hole of wasted time and brain cells.

[edit on 10/9/08 by Double_Nought_Spy]



posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 10:45 AM
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Double, Star!
:up Move to front of the class..That so much captures my feeling on this and I think of most tinkering with this, like Zen, and nice work by the way.
In fact we can expect many of the hoaxters to actually want us to end this now..as we get closer and closer,and yell let it go or no mas no mas!. They wanted conversation, they wanted buzz, but the Buzz will be the sound of a Hand Drill, ... ...WE will dictate the terms and issues, Now We control the battlefield , the very the center of the board, We control the horizontal , We control the vertical ..and We will certainly take to it to the "outer limits". That is the "nitty gritty". This may very well touch on the machine, the industry generating these obscenities..as opposed to a handful of joksters. Irrespective of our efforts, whether succesful or not, human nature being so different than aliens, we can count on that someone, somewhere down the line will talk.
@ Zen..You put another smile on my face ..you got me by the "goat" on that one..















[edit on 9-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 12:09 AM
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Replying to PJs post, and others previously, I can assure you, I have by no means dropped Alienware. That memo as I stated, shows no names, has admitted typos, made by not the alleged author Alienware, but the presenter of the "document.. etc..
This is how it went..nov 2007..

Got a response in my inbox this morning:
"Hi ___________, Thank you for your email. It’s great to hear that our promotion has reach out to you and your Forum group regarding the CARET document. Alienware did NOT create the information regarding this phenomena or the CARAT linguistics. This is NOT an intellectual property of Alienware. The information has anonymously spread throughout the web for some time. We have taken the CARAT linguistics and have applied this as a marketing tool to draw attention to our promotion. Regards, (name withheld)
Director of PR Communications
Alienware Corporation"

So that's that.
I didn't list her name because the question has been answered and I don't want her bothered since I told her I would stave off further inquiries if she dealt with me, but if anyone REALLY wants to know you can send me a private message and I'll tell you. But consider this definitive.


Why would a director of PR..Ms Gonzalez, be embarassed..to officially disavow..a connection..and later the term Carat..was admitted to be a typo mistake by the presenter..This confuses me as it came by email.

Followup emails by others and myself, remain unanswered.

Hi Ms. Gonzalez,
I don't know if you received my first letter as it was just before the fourth of July.
so I am re sending below . I would sure appreciate any help you can provide or direct me to the right person who can.
Many Thanks and
Regards,
xxxxxxxxx

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 4:42 PM
To: 'jaclyn_gonzalez@alienware.com'
Subject: 2007 GUI design

Hi Ms. Gonzalez,
I am a librarian doing research for an art student. Would you tell me what company did the fabulous gui art seen at engadgets expo in 2007?
www.blogsmithmedia.com... The student sees an evolution from a lot of Star trek art like Michael Okudas,
but in a more robust and creative style. Did the design selection actually take place in 2006 and was there a competition innvolved ? I would love to see the work of all the finalists if that happened. It will make our aspiring graphics artist and student very happy as well.

Thank you for your assistance and time

Sincerely,

xxxxxxxxxxx
Reference Librarian/Outreach II
xxxxxxxxxx Memorial Library
xxxxxxxxxxx


..I recall Yusney Garay of Alienware is based in Ft. Lauderdale, and they continue the use of the lettering and schematics , the most immediate, specific and widespread deployment for use by anyone to date.
Yet they claim they borrowed it. while at the same time the Chief architect Yusney Jay garay,,states he did it from scratch at a fan based interview. I wonder if any of our friends at the other site are from the same area ft. Lauderdale area. It seems as I ran across something to that affect somewhere but I have it at the office. yes, I recall there is no mistake on that. I am quite certain.

Also Warners and Alienware already have a history of cross trademark cooperation such as the movie Superman ..and alienwares line of superman laptops
ati.amd.com...
I find the email disingenuous if anything by a Directotr of PR, kin to the CEO Nelson Gonzalez by any chance?

@Zen..If you use the way back machine internet archive you cans see the evolution..as far back as 2001. By himsellf I think not, as he has fame and fortune already, and very very respected, like Biedny. and highly sought after..He is now into body art..He worked at ILM too, the level of his art is far far above what we see in the LAP. Spf33 has a similar effect in his designs, where you clic on a olor or object on the screen to navigate the site..all much much prior to 2007..The LAP is comapartively primitive. Of course thats only because we know what know now..to be fair.












[edit on 10-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 03:52 AM
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@Zen I did not have enough room here I have posted the link you were looking for at my profile and the relevent pictures.

I have written to both Dell and Alienware Director of Marketing to get a clearer and more specific answer on the source material for the Breed Campaign. It may go unanswrered but i will post my question here.
The purpose being to rule out collaboration by AW with entities like Warner, and Game makers, etc that many Hardware makers partner with in getting their product out.
Their last answer did not address that.

Hi Ms. xxxxxxx,

I posted this at the dell Advertising Blog but it did not seem to take.
I also wrote twice to Ms Gonzalez, the same question, back in early July but for some reason never got a response,
could be to spam filters .
I am directing it it to you as you would be the person to know. I have attached links to help
you reference my question on the Artist used to design the patterns used in the Breed Campaign
and seen at at engadgts and coference/expos in 2007 and current hardware and movie shorts.

its a great way for individual and collective creatitvity to stay connected and be immersed as the popular term in Art and music s used and that Alienware and Dell iare taking The leading roles.
At the same time Its always good to see corporations recognize and use the talents of individual artists incorporated into their produccts to reach mainstream conscoiousness. I enjoyed Dells use of Mike Mings talents on their inspiron covers.
Another design which I REALLY enjoy is the Gui patterns used in Alienwares Breed which are very unusual and "arabesquue"( in Syd Meads words, internationally reknown artist.(bladerunner]
However I did not see the name of the artist responsible for this in AW's blogs or releases
There is one artist very well known who has historically use similar patter patterns, Andrew Jones aka Android Jones.

Did Alienware commision in partnership with a movie or game maker, like Warners, a regular staple, or EA, Sony, this work by an artist?
And why isn't it public ?"Somebody" thought this up and its a great adaption, but many people I am sure would love to know., at least myself who was the Artist!

One more question, how long does this process take from idea of pattern to appearance placement/app on product take? I imagine it must be months..considering the brainstorming selection, etc.
Yusney Jay Garay at AW claimed in an interview with a fansite that He had thought up the Breed program from scratch..with minor influences from various movie makers.So I am sure that will narrow the window a tad.
Here are the links to what I was discussing and sample 2007 art..
I hope you can help.

Mike Ming use at Dell
www.gearlog.com...
android jones
www.androidjones.com...
android jones
profile.myspace.com...
androidjones.blogspot.com...
www.podcollective.com...
www.conceptart.org...




Highest Regards and Keep up the great work!

Edit ME








[edit on 11-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 04:38 PM
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now what interests me , Zen, and I am sure others.. is the timing ..the first pic with blue highlights was made for his dj friend Bluetech a DJ in Oregon. commemorating the Tokyo japan Conference . The pod link mentioned below is the best place for that..He has conducted workshops in WA and even China.

.Android goes world wide..and does work for many friends and associates.
another work he calls mama wisdom who heads the symbiotic movement which meets in SF as well..hold rallies on a much smaller scale than Burning man, but something that for example only, SPf and the people he worked for would have related to, as DNA did appear on one of his posters.
below are is an earlier work circa 2005- 2006 . note the gradual emergence of lettering on the nodes
For some odd reason on the same mama wisdom creation he sent to his friend Alex Grey in NY, a cosmic guru artist himself, he removes the LAP symbols..
much like he eliminated the corners later in his conquer piece..I found that curious.
But not unknown for artists to paint over their old works.



Well Gee Mr. Wilson, why would Alienware, if this is the case, not acknowledge him,? well like Dell..I imagine its the "appearance " and associations that casual..observers
might draw on...Remember..the "Its a Dell Dude"..very popular until he was popped for smoking pot..We all knew he seemed to be slightly stoned or toasted..But..
He quickly disappeared from the scene. I rather liked him..sad..then again,
perhaps..If this is a correct connection (and thats a BIG capital IF)they didn't want people seeing the body art..or occult..or whatever.
Personally..Gamers don't give a hoot..And he did contribute to the Metroid game art development among others .
Check the metroid beserkers and the nodes at the joints..that wsa 2005 and earlier.www.conceptart.org...

But as they are branching worldwide to a greater audience..certain concessions have to be made..Perhaps..this was one of them.
And as Macciavellan as the business is..the ends justifies the means.
This is not a sinister dark artist, nor just a "cool dude"..after more digging..what a bright light he is.He is an influencer..just what Ad Makers like. But he is more than just a good artist..he is a great artist , one of 30 Visionaries from 23 countries around the globe who got together to display their work..which you can see in one place including his by year. I recommend it just for the experience.
www.podcollective.com...
features.cgsociety.org... Great summary on Android.

Note in the letter I sent I made no mention of caret or ufo..But I did ask for affiliations which have historically been there between Warners and others.
Remember caret apperead on scifi on fox etc..
One need only google and you will see who the real "influencers" are and why ridiculous items make it or dont make it to the news, or a program, and yes YouTube.. sometimes, and that is because their is a bigger item at stake like for example a movie in the works..and these can serve to generate buzz, anticipation, much like a trailer.
Do I think Android is our Hoaxter? A resounding no..He has no need to..He is a self made man.Perhaps someone in one of his workshops where he teaches concept art. If he did its part a commisioned use by another entity, like a Warners , Hardare or game. But I don't , knowing what I know about his thoughts and character, believe He would be directly involved. He may on the other hand know who is. I would be curious too if I saw pieces of my work floating around on thousands of laptops.



I feel confident based on the above, the LAP is Totally Dead..
Thanx Zen for the Great Catch and Thanx Banzai for the email help.
Now we can back away from the trees for a moment.. and look at the forest
and wait for our answer




[edit on 12-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 12:02 AM
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Return of the Dragonfly, circa 07/07





posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 01:25 AM
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Fort..did you see the 2005 metroid pic..look closely at it..upper right corner..
I love dragonflies but here I think that was related to several festivals held by Gaia type psytrance groups, involving some art. I noted references to Earth Day april 20/21, burning man, etc. di.onys.us...
Is there another connection you see?
They basically celebrate in the spirit of dionynus God of Wine or Baccus..
by getting stoned. ala woodstock..and have a good time getting tore up.
I think it was LMH who branded these Dragonfly..I would not be surprised if she attended some of these. In fact that whole SF San Jose Oregon Wa circuit is seething with this.
He does have a great time at Burning Man..







[edit on 12-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 01:40 AM
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Only was pointing out the connection to A.J. and the obvious "dragonfly" connection, with it being circa July 07, i dunno just a funny thing to me.

Here's something else interesting about Massive Black Inc.

Massive Black Inc. sues former employees

Hmm.

Sent ya a U2U ya might be interested in my friend.

[edit on 12-10-2008 by fortwynt]

Also, are we going with the suggestion that he merely borrowed those images from LAP? Obviously they are wayyy too similar to be a mere co-incidence or similar "flavor"....which came first the chicken or the egg?

[edit on 12-10-2008 by fortwynt]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 03:32 AM
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Looking at 2005 picture..his stuff came first no mistake..whether he can trademark that..I don't know. but his work imo clearly evolved to that.

that 2006 Massive Black incident where the Chinese branch outfit tried to take over its customers, and there were quite a few of them..is terrible. But thats the danger of outsourcing your work , to places where they can do the work at a tenth the cost..like China. China doesnt care, as it gets to tap all levels of commerce, and have front companies here doing just that..Its not just military secrets they want..its the overall intellectual property we have.
I do wonder like you..if this was tangentially involved..there were quite a few unamed parties in that suit.
www.1up.com...



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 04:41 AM
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Well, hello, ARC-sters,

Thought I would throw my 2 cents in since the final death rattles are few and far in between.

Over on that Other Place, after days of pregnant pauses,
"letters" posted some pictures that he says is just soooo LAP!
...Not even close friends, IMHO!

Well, I thought I saw that drone meme currently, right here:





Amazing what a fish eye lens can do, eh?

Beats running home to fill up and pressurize an airbrush!

Now if they can just get that damn thing working...

Note:
If you want to see more pretty pictures, including the meme of the LOST hatch/DHARMA Initiative logo, go to this site, scroll down, and enjoy:

www.crystalinks.com...

(Might even see a LAP-esque meme diagram at the bottom of the page if you squint hard enough)

I am done memed out.







[edit on 12-10-2008 by klatunictobarata]

[edit on 12-10-2008 by klatunictobarata]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 05:12 AM
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Originally posted by klatunictobarata


Well, I thought I saw that drone meme currently, right here:





Amazing what a fish eye lens can do, eh?

Beats running home to fill up and pressurize an airbrush!

Now if they can just get that damn thing working...










I think we found the 'insperation' for the drone right there. It'd be interesting to find out what images or plans for it were in the public domain over the last year or so just to check its not a weird coinceidence.

Wayne..

[edit on 12/10/2008 by the secret web]

[edit on 12/10/2008 by the secret web]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 05:09 PM
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Sys I just read your U2U, I'm sorry I disappeared again but I'm busy with some work right now. Here's where I'm at:

First I just want to say I didn't think Android Jones was our hoaxter, but I thought it was possible he might have seen the LAP artwork prior to Isaac's releasing it, or even possibly he knows who made it. He created the ConceptArt.org website so alot of artwork gets passed his way and he knows alot of artists worldwide. That was my reason for trying to open a dialogue with him about the brushes.

Now you've posted some great links in the last few posts of yours, and it's taken me some time to look over everything. In his thread here (www.conceptart.org...) where he's talking about his adventures in Japan during June 2007 is interesting, specifically these 2 live paintings:

www.androidjones.com... "This was a painting of the legandary Mix Master Morris in tokyo , Some people refer to him as the father of ambient music."

"Kind of blue-tech", painted at the super delux"

Android was performing at the Crossroads event in Tokyo, Japan with Bluetech and a bunch of others on June 23, 2007. (www.yogajaya.com...)

And again with Bluetech at the Super Deluxe on June 28, 2007. (www.super-deluxe.com...)

I find it very interesting that while he's partying and performing in Tokyo he has time to check out the interwebs and only 2 days after Isaac's website goes up Android is using the LAP circles in his live paintings.

I haven't been able to find an exact date on the Mix Master Morris painting, but if it was painted before June 26, 2007 then maybe Mr. Jones can lead us to Isaac.

I've got to get back to work now, but where is this Metroid pic you speak of with the matching nodes? And is it true that no one, not a single person other than banzai has received a response from Alienware?

And as for the LHC being the inspiration for the drones, it's definitely inspirational but I'm not strongly convinced. I'm leaning much farther towards the Lightwave tutorial rwiggins posted awhile ago,


- www.vtc.com...

In my opinion his theory of a student enrolled in a 3D or game development program is the most likely.



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 07:49 PM
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Hi guys..Its no news to me that accelerators and antigrav units were what the hoaxters wanted us to think much the same way a child will take a bunch of pencils and say hey dad look at my rocket squadron and here..the plate is the landing field and the upside down cup is a moon dome. Whadda ya think?
Thats good son.

Thanx Zen. Excellent! I was trying to get those dates..they are critical,,Now.we are where we need to be. That rwiggins shot is good, and we have androids work not merely displaying a vector brush but appliying an LAP one the game metroid corruption in 2005 and especially the blue tech painting showing other parts of the lap.
Yes Banzai was the only person the head of Alienware PR answered to.
I can't answer why Alienware would not come out with a general announcement that, no they are not connected in any way.

Could it be that then they would really be crossing the line, as opposed to straddling it with half truths or turkeytalk, if they did issue one publicly?
Because of Massive blacks work which I had no idea they had expanded to cover so many gamemakers like ea, movie makers, and other types of businesses across two continents.
until Fortwynt gave that lawsuit link. Thanx Fortwynt.

It looks like its more in their interest not to make a stink about this with a Warners, and Alienware types, given the amount of business they would lose down the road If it was them, and even possible friends or associates as many of the 3d Artists know each other as well. No doubt this incident and any other like it give honest CGI artists in the industry a black eye.
Our goal should be who commissioned the work..rather than get cgi professionals to turn on each other.and given what we know already..we are very close to finding out.

here is androids quote and link
Wayne he loves using zbrush!
www.conceptart.org...



All of this work was originally created back in 2005 for Metroid Corruption!!!,
So I guess now is as good of a time as ever to show it. There is a certain novelty looking back at these concepts, its like looking back in time at a different part of your life, this was the third and last chapter of the metroid franchise and my final "in-house" project with retro studios, and Nintendo.
I know there are still allot of metroid fans out there. And I wanted to share the concepts with you,
I really learned allot during this last game. Creating the concepts for metroid prime, and metroid echo’s, gave me the experience and confidence to try new approaches to creating the third visual installment of this universe
My experience developing the metroid universe gave me the freedom to explore my own creative process, many of the conceptual ideas that I teach now in workshops
and
downloads
came directly from my experiments with metroid, the “ shape theory” and my use of Zbrush and painter together were both brought into being with Metroid, Also i want to give a shout out to Todd Keller the the metroid art director and the rest of the incredible talented retro team. Ive have worked with many a developed since those days and no one yet compares


We can quibble about LHC, we can quibble about the first two nodes here even..


But there is no quibbling about this 2005 picture

2007 figures


No, the dates are much too close..He must know..what transpired.
We can consider that part a done deal for our purposes.
Great work all.











[edit on 12-10-2008 by Sys_Config]

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[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 08:51 PM
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Originally posted by Sys_Config
But there is no quibbling about this 2005 picture



Sys I'm not sure that pic is really from 2005. It's on one of the Massive Black tutorial dvd's from 2008 that Android made.

In his CA.org thread he describes it as "This is the final image from the latest download series, its a not quite a metroid character but i used a refined version of the same technique to create it as well."

It could be from 2005 but it also could be something he made specifically for the 2008 dvd.

I have never played any of the recent Metroid games, and I don't have the consoles to play them on, but if anyone recognizes that character from one of the games that would help clear things up. I'm going to check out the tutorial dvd to see if he mentions anything about the Isaac circles or anything else. I'll post back if I find anything later.



posted on Oct, 12 2008 @ 09:19 PM
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That might be right..If its a final rework of a 2005 image..ifor a 2008 dvd its no good for us..except as an indicator of style. But Remember..we tripped up Lev and his crew with that ..the style..when they sent it to the wrong person..and they continued making drones on their Blog using it.... . That leaves the other work showing a progressive development of his style from 2001 to the present, with the japan concert pieces of june 23 and 28, that still stuns me.
Interestingly there were simultaneous concerts in Au with the release of Terra Nines drone album, using the names Raj That album cover had nothing but grass and clouds..dead end.
But Here the bluetech poster has the vectors and the lap design and letters. So he is not out of the woods..I note the corel box cover on the poster ad..looks like corel 1X or X which picked his art..actually he picked corel as his medium..for its vast arsenal of tools including what he have seen already.

here a youtube demo.. ..he did the pic we just discussed..

Also Blue Tech , the Sound media artist with whom Android partners at times,of Oregon, can be found
on you tube as well. We can use that when that google fails..
Perhaps David Biedny could weigh in also..as He is former ILM and so is Andrew "Android" Jones..A behind the scenes talk with him by them might help here as well.





[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 13 2008 @ 01:40 AM
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That youtube clip you posted is from the DVD I'm watching. I finished the first half and I watched him build that supposed Metroid image from scratch. It's really confusing and misleading how he posted it in that thread along with his Metroid artwork from 2005 because the image really has nothing to do with Metroid. The dvd was filmed Jan 6th 2008.

I was surprised he takes a minute to talk about the LAP image when he brings it into his Corel Painter image:

"The story behind this shape, I did not design this shape, I take no responsibility for this shape. Aliens apparently designed this shape, because it was posted on my favorite Coast to Coast AM website as re-enginered alien technology, and the author said it was actually came from extraterrestrials, and he claimed no credit, so what that means to me is - a really cool shape, and no copyright, yeah, SCORE!"



I'm not sure why he feels the need to deny any responsibility for the shape, but I'll take his word for it that he didn't create it. But as for the dates of those live paintings being so close to Isaac's release date, I still think it's possible he knows more about it. If there's a painting out there with the LAP circles from the June 23rd show he did then there's proof he knows more than he's saying.


[edit on 13-10-2008 by freelance_zenarchist]



posted on Oct, 13 2008 @ 02:11 AM
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Oh Snap Zen yes..why say that and mention coast to coast ? Another Art Bell fan ,hahahaha, That is puzzling!.sounds like an embarrasment if he did, as the hoax had fizzled when the photos were debunked and a good incentive to say that to prevent blowback...That is very strange Zen..but it sure didn't stop Alienware, LMH, and whitley. The latter two are on limbo, and the former still going.
Its reassuringly nice to know the ETs use vector brushes in the manufacturing process too. Is that brush in corel X? or did he create one , looking at the lap, which he knows how to do.. with the same rounded corners you spotted, those were a nice way to sieze on a distinct signature to particular software if not IHEA, which were there before the LAP. And he needs to address the Bluetech timeline. I hope he doesn't avoid that like Linda did. I wonder what caveat emptor statement Alien will give us.,
Their timeline from seeing the Lap , making it to the production line, and distribution points, and having it on display on their hardware bothers me a lot. These things take time. And usually I see those come about from the ranks and files of CGI fans and competition and even skin producers, and contests. and not grabbed off the internet as they claimed in that memo.

If anyone was interested in purchasing some of these, and what living room could be complete without one, they can go here.
r6xx.com...
I let Dan habermann , creator of the IHEA circles know he can purchase some too

















[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on Oct, 13 2008 @ 07:11 AM
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Zen: I woudn't read too much into that the whole drone thing got bombed a few times onto 3d boards by ATS members (in fact cg talk threated to ban instantly anyone posting about it again I belive...) So he'll have been aware of the drone thing from knocking around on 3d boards.

Now as mama jones didn't raise any idiots, he obvisouly didn't want a shed load of conspiracy theorists sending him emails and thought it may be a good point in his dvd to mention that although he was using the image..that it wasn't his. Its called protecting your own arse lol.

So no, I seriously doubt it was Andrew.


Wayne...



posted on Oct, 13 2008 @ 11:10 AM
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Originally posted by the secret web
So no, I seriously doubt it was Andrew.


Wayne, , those of us left you included , all are in total agreement it is highly unlikely, and it may have been one either a student, or known fellow artist. There are the other issues we spoke in private, in which those from the same area as Isaac Caret attorney, Oregon, and yes , that was a good point to bring out the reason for the mention in the DVD, but we still have that unexplained poster of June very possibly the June 23. That has to be resolved as unpleasant as that may sound. If that was adressed in a forum, I would love to see that as it would help tremendously.

As an example,Tom Vance could have shed a tremendous amount of light on this, In fact Close down the entire Case back in September, if not may of this year. but he stopped once he discovered one of the the PIs was an old acquaintance. For whatever reason He chose his old acquaintance over the truth, after that bombastic posturing on behalf of Ufology at Paracast. Odd as its just a PI doing his Job. It should never have made a blessed difference the association, if they were searching for the same thing HE was, verifying the locations.
It was like pulling hens teeth, to even get an admission from the other parties that it was HE who helped find the infamous Chad location.
I salute him, even now for that. But going silent, exacerbated the situation, as it makes it appear as if the PIs held something else back and were just prolonging the inevitable downfall of the hoax.

We can't afford more incidents like this..The trail is cold, and the hoaxters have erased most of their tracks, but not all of them. We may never know the full story, but its worth trying..It was CGI experts like yourself who helped take the hoax down. And it will take the same caliber to help us find an answer in this phase.
So..we can't just walk away from that June poster until we know for sure,
what happened. It may be totally innocent, until then, we will accord everyone sensitivity and utmost respect due in all such matters.
With Springer on board, we can guarantee it.
Regards

Sys





[edit on 13-10-2008 by Sys_Config]



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