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Australia PM to Ban Alcohol for Aborigines

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posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 10:10 PM
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The oppression of people and taking away rights seem to be an ongoing theme everywhere.


www.topix.net...



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 10:16 PM
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Dang they are banning porn also but the alcohol is gonna be a problem for sure. They will start making moonshine and still get drunk. There are so many ways to make alcohol you could never stop that. I feel sorry for those people for some reason.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 10:50 PM
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Haha wow.
But first off are either of you in Australia?
I doubt it's that simple, it could be only in certain areas or certain times of the day.. I don't have time to read the article.
Anyway, alcohol and petrol sniffing has been a major problem in the aboriginal communities here, and it's holding them back from progress.
Theres something about aboriginies and alcohol that doesn't mix well at all = /
So this could be really interesting.
I know they're not going to be very happy about it at all though!
But I'm sure a large portion of australia would support this move, we're somewhat fed up with their self pity yet lack of action on their part to improve their own communities.
It is abit of a taboo subject here to speak out against it, but this is what I feel the majority of Australia is thinking.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 10:59 PM
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How can they make one set of rules for one set of people and have it not to be considred racist ? Thats ridiculous and its demeaning to people who arent like the problemed ones.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:26 PM
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I'm right with you T0by.

I'm an Australian too and it's hard to explain if you don't live in the country.

It's not a racist thing at all. Aboriginals have had a problem with Alcohol for decades. This isn't a control thing, it's a health thing. They are killing themselves with booze.

It's just the Northen Territory Aboriginals that have a problem. It's ingrained in their community.

Most of Australians are not racist at all. Most Aussie will agree with this for health reasons.

This is one thing this goverment is doing right. Although it is an election year.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:33 PM
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In America, the story is pretty much the same. Introduce intoxicants to a population with no prior experience with them, destroy their society and steal their land, and you have a recipe for a broken people. But heavy alcohol restrictions ARE NOT the answer. This is yet another case of well-meaning but short-sighted supply side restrictions. Aboriginals are still going to WANT alcohol, they are just going to have a harder time GETTING it. Therefore, alcohol will become roughly analogous to heroin or crack coc aine and aboriginals may resort to crime to obtain it.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:36 PM
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This is defintley for the best. I live in the Northern territory of Australia and have visited many of these communities. Also I cant stress how bad these places are (the towns remind me of old zombie movies
). Though removing pornography is probably NOT a good thing as rape is a very common things in those areas.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:38 PM
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uberarcanist, i get your opinion, but it's not as simple at that.

I agree that we stole their land and they got a raw deal and supplied them with the initial alcohol, but Australians have been trying to fix the problem for a very long time.

The goverment has thrown millions and millions of dollars at the problem for housing, health, education and social workers but the problem still stands.

It needs to be fixed and this is a good step towards it. This should have been done years ago.

I don't agree with our goverment most of the time, but this time they've got it right.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:50 PM
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The Australian government is between a rock and a hard place with regards to the advancement of some (repeat some) aboriginal areas. The situation is dire in SOME areas - infant mortailty is sky high, domestic violence is sky high, paedophilia is entrenched, unemployment is extreme, attendance at school is patchy at BEST, diabetes is endemic, alcoholism is regarded as the norm and the life expectancy of male aborigines is up to 27 years LESS than the general populace. Petrol sniffing and alcoholism used to be more widespread than now and has reduced because a few aboriginal communities have introduced regulations (at their own behest) even more draconian than those being proposed. But these communities are few in number and the conditions at communities which have not adopted are unbelievably poor.

These things must not be allowed to continue!

State and Federal governments are at their wits end to try to stop the cycle and bring aborigines into the zone where they can attain the benefits of living in Australia. Much angst has been created and many millions of dollars have been spent on the aboriginal problem and have been wasted because nothing has worked.

I believe that the Australian government has the interests of the aboriginal people at heart (and if you knew how much I hate the current government, you would have a small idea of how hard it is for me to make that statement) and are trying to stop the wasting of so many valuable human lives.

Maybe this is not the way to go but, in the absence of any working progress, at least they are trying.

Some of the measures such as providing some benefits in the form of vouchers and enforcing the requirement that children go to school will be applied to ALL ethnic/racial groups and are NOT racist. The US provides some benefits in the form of food stamps (similar to the proposed voucher system)- is that racist? Others measures do not apply to any other group because of the special nature of aboriginality and are of a temporary time-scale anyway to permit the creation of infrastructure which will be turned over to the aborigines when due. Some measures relating to alcohol will apply across the board in one huge area (the Northern Territory) and will affect everyone:- white black or purple, rich poor or indifferent, young or old, fat or skinny, male or female. Now some (immature morons) will assert that all the "TopEnders" are being discriminated against. Ask them - they will tell you that it's OK, they'll wear it, it's for the best.

This may or may not work but to do nothing is inhumane.

BTW: I am a racially mixed person, part of which is aboriginal. When I see people of my blood hurting themselves through ignorance and behaviour, I cry. I want them to have ALL the benefits that others enjoy.



posted on Jun, 21 2007 @ 11:59 PM
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Well said hippiechick!



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 12:08 AM
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Originally posted by hippichick
The Australian government is between a rock and a hard place with regards to the advancement of some (repeat some) aboriginal areas. The situation is dire in SOME areas - infant mortailty is sky high, domestic violence is sky high, paedophilia is entrenched, unemployment is extreme, attendance at school is patchy at BEST, diabetes is endemic, alcoholism is regarded as the norm and the life expectancy of male aborigines is up to 27 years LESS than the general populace. Petrol sniffing and alcoholism used to be more widespread than now and has reduced because a few aboriginal communities have introduced regulations (at their own behest) even more draconian than those being proposed. But these communities are few in number and the conditions at communities which have not adopted are unbelievably poor.

These things must not be allowed to continue!

State and Federal governments are at their wits end to try to stop the cycle and bring aborigines into the zone where they can attain the benefits of living in Australia. Much angst has been created and many millions of dollars have been spent on the aboriginal problem and have been wasted because nothing has worked.

I believe that the Australian government has the interests of the aboriginal people at heart (and if you knew how much I hate the current government, you would have a small idea of how hard it is for me to make that statement) and are trying to stop the wasting of so many valuable human lives.

Maybe this is not the way to go but, in the absence of any working progress, at least they are trying.

Some of the measures such as providing some benefits in the form of vouchers and enforcing the requirement that children go to school will be applied to ALL ethnic/racial groups and are NOT racist. The US provides some benefits in the form of food stamps (similar to the proposed voucher system)- is that racist? Others measures do not apply to any other group because of the special nature of aboriginality and are of a temporary time-scale anyway to permit the creation of infrastructure which will be turned over to the aborigines when due. Some measures relating to alcohol will apply across the board in one huge area (the Northern Territory) and will affect everyone:- white black or purple, rich poor or indifferent, young or old, fat or skinny, male or female. Now some (immature morons) will assert that all the "TopEnders" are being discriminated against. Ask them - they will tell you that it's OK, they'll wear it, it's for the best.

This may or may not work but to do nothing is inhumane.

BTW: I am a racially mixed person, part of which is aboriginal. When I see people of my blood hurting themselves through ignorance and behaviour, I cry. I want them to have ALL the benefits that others enjoy.


That's fascinating what you write about the results that alcohol prohibition has had already among the aboriginies. I only criticize the proposed legislation because of the utter failure alcohol prohibition was in America. At the same time, I realize that there are a lot of differences between what America did back in the 20s and 30s and what Australia is planning to do now. If Australia's plan works, it should be praised and may even be a model for what should be done with Native American communities.

I would be greatly appreciative if you would cite your sources that indicate successful results from the alcohol prohibitions in aboriginal communities.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 12:11 AM
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I would be greatly appreciative if you would cite your sources that indicate successful results from the alcohol prohibitions in aboriginal communities.


This hasn't been done before, so there are no successfull results. This is the last resort though, it needs to be done.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by T0by
Anyway, alcohol and petrol sniffing has been a major problem in the aboriginal communities here, and it's holding them back from progress.
Theres something about aboriginies and alcohol that doesn't mix well at all = /


If you read your history of the US and learned about Prohibition you would understand that it never works.

By telling someone "no you can't do that" you motivate them even further.

If they want to drink, let them do it.

Politicians should not be the moral police. They haven't fared very well up to this point.

It would be one thing if they were all shining examples of how we all should live.

This is simply not the case.

Another violation of human rights, what a surprise.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:43 AM
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This is totally differenty to Prohibition. These people are sick and dying.

Prohibition wasn't about a community that was literally dying from drinking. The aboriginals are.

Prohibition was really just a crime issue. This is a serious health issue.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:45 AM
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exactly not taking into account the human rights issues.

and a semantics level there is now way it will work. if the people want it they will get it no matter what the laws are. it will just makes things worse because they will have to get it illegaly



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:47 AM
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Is it a human rights issue if we leave these poor people to drink themsleves to death...literally. That is more of a human rights issue.

If people were hooked and dying on heroin, is it right to take it off them. It's the same issue in the Northern Territory. It's their heroin.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:49 AM
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I don't want to influence this debate by putting in few selected URL's. For people who want to learn more, I suggest going to yahoo or google and searching on "australian aboriginal alcohol bans" and "australian aboriginal petrol sniffing bans" and follow up on the results. Don't read only the items that support your views, read them all - think objectively.

You will find arguments for and against. You will find evidence of people who try to circumvent the controls. You will find evidence of communities who asked for permission to introduce bans. You will find communities who want to overturn bans.

One problem is that, pre-european settlement, common aboriginal culture had no mental-state-altering drugs (kadaitcha men had them) and so developed no cultural morality or guidelines to deal with such things. Consequently all the rules regarding substance abuse are rules imposed by European Australia and thus have diminished importance.

It is a VERY complex issue and occurs every time cultures collide. It just needs to be fixed!



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:50 AM
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Originally posted by dingleberry77
Is it a human rights issue if we leave these poor people to drink themsleves to death...literally. That is more of a human rights issue.

If people were hooked and dying on heroin, is it right to take it off them. It's the same issue in the Northern Territory. It's their heroin.



The problem with prohibition is that it doesn't deal with the issue.

It merely makes it illegal to consume or produce alcohol.

So instead of them getting drunk legally now, they will be going to jail because of this law.

If you think their lives are horrible now, just wait.

You will be paying through your taxes to send hundreds if not thousands of innocent aboriginals (who happen to be native to the continent) to rot in jail...

That sounds like a real humanitarian relief to me
.

Use your brains please.


A better way to spend your tax dollars would be to educate them so they can get jobs and not be so depressed.

Or come up with something better.

I can almost guarantee 100% that prohibition won't work.

It hasn't worked anywhere else in the world.

en.wikipedia.org...

You are only going to cause a rift between the nonaboriginals and the aboriginals.

This will greatly increase crime.

Next thing you know, there will be moonshine smuggling rings.

The mafia would probably not exist in the US if it weren't for prohibition.

You will probably see the Japanese or Chinese mafia step in.

Get ready for some real crime


[edit on 22-6-2007 by biggie smalls]



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:55 AM
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My brain is fine thank you.

In all due respect, you don't live in Australia. You haven't seen what we have seen.

Go to the Northern Territory and see it for yourself. It's sad.

I understand it's not the perfect result for these people, but a lot of things have been tried.

We need to get them sober first to deal with the problem.

Use your brain and do some research into Aboriginal affairs.



posted on Jun, 22 2007 @ 01:57 AM
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Oh, by the way it's not prohibition anyway. It's just one communtiy that it's happening in. That's all.

These people are litteraly drunk 24 hours a day. We need to get them sober first then deal with the problem.




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