How should the Mexican Wall be built, what should it look like?

Too bad our Representatives and Senators are too busy blowing corporate America instead of representing the people they are elected to serve. Here in Arizona car insurance is out of this world because Mexicans are stealing everything they can get their hands on and running it across the border. Carjackings are a daily occurance. Ditto with kidnappings.

Whoever said we do not need a wall has not been to Arizona. How can you control a border without a wall?

Do we not have hi tech sensors now? Yes Dan, indeed we do. Do we not have border patrols now? Why yes Dan, we do have border patrols. Do we have National Guard troops on the border? Yes Dan, they are there also.

Gee...... the only thing missing is the darned wall. I have heard some people compare building a wall to East Germany. Well anyone who makes that comparison is too young to remember what actually happened there, or was asleep in Junior High School world history class. THE BERLIN WALL WAS CONTRUCTED TO KEEP PEOPLE IN EAST GERMANY....NOT TO KEEP OTHERS OUT. Mexico does not want a wall because they want their vermin and criminals and unskilled labor to come to America.


[edit on 6-25-2007 by groingrinder]

It should be woven together out of Billions of Rabid Mandrills.

Just a thought...

Originally posted by plumranch

Forgot to ask you what systems would best identify and filter out wildlife if that is possible? I'm NW rather that SW but I suppose wildlife would include lots of coyotes, dogs, cats, crows, buzzards, horses, cows, calves, deer, yetti (woops, probably not!), wild and domestic pigs. A pretty good range of body sizes and shapes!

Technology has existed for quite some time that is capable of determining what an object in an image is based on its shape. Have the system filter out wildlife and alert an agent if a detected entity is anomalous.

The problem with a wall, as has been pointed out, is that some illegals will find a way through.

I've been doing a lot of thinking about this, and how to make our borders 100% secure. I think I've hit upon the solution, and it would solve numerous other pressing problems facing our nation.

This idea is a little outside of the box, but please hear me out.

Forget the wall. What we need is a giant dome, or rather numerous connected domes, over the entire U.S. That would solve the problem of illegals getting over the wall, and no one could fly planes in for terrorist acts either. Watercraft would have their own special hangars on the periphery, and we could sink bars across river deltas.

Yes, I know this would require major engineering and massive amounts of manpower--that is one of the side benefits, it would guarantee full employment, and we could cut welfare. There would be no excuse for lazy slackers who don't want to work, there would be so many jobs in all areas, both in construction, and in service positions to meet the needs of the workers. And the need for maintenance workers would mean steady jobs in perpetuity.

There would be designated ports of entry with retractable panels for air and vehicular traffic, isolated from residential and business zones, with the dome walls reinforced to withstand explosions, in the event of a suicide bomber making it inside.

This would be great for climate control, with adjustable louvered panels to permit air circulation, and strategically placed exhaust fans to suck up industrial pollutants and blow them outside the dome. There would be gutters on the sides of the domes to collect rainfall and snowmelt--just think, no more frigid winters, no more spring floods.

There could also be surveillance cameras all along the dome struts [I'm thinking of geodesic domes, of course--the logistics of such massive domes would be insane otherwise] to thwart any homegrown terrorists and other criminals.

Naturally, naysayers would have a fit--the PETA people would be screaming about all the birds smacking into the dome, but hey, who cares? Birds are stupid anyway; they're always making kaka everywhere. Anyone that had a problem with the safety dome would have plenty of time during the construction to get the heck out and go live elsewhere, good riddance.

The important thing is, no illegals could get in, and we'd be SAFE.

Ephemeral:
The problem with a wall, as has been pointed out, is that some illegals will find a way through.

Ah, we never were talking complete elimination of Mexican illegal immigration here. Never thought it was possible. We're sure that a wall will greatly reduce immigration. I said 80-90%. That would be very much worth the price of the wall in the long run IMO.

That means that 10-20% of illegals still get in.

There are conservatively estimated to be 240,000 sex offenders among illegal immigrants, so that would mean 24,000-48,000, conservatively, would still be able to get in.


35% of them are child molesters. 8400-16,800 child molesters crossing the border each year? No sir, that is not acceptable, We Have To Protect The Children!

And then there's the remaining 65%, criminals all, we can't just let them keep waltzing right into our country. Why should we have to house them and feed them in our already overcrowded prisons?

No; The Wall is a good idea, you're on the right track, go a little further though. The MegaDome is the ultimate answer. If we build it, they won't come.

Excavate a ditch 60 feet & 100 feet wide with shear concrete walls manufactured on site. Fill with alligators harvested from Southern Louisana. Transport removed earth to New Orleans where it will be used as fill to bring the city above sea level. Empty trucks could be filled with illegals on the return trip where they would be returned to their homeland free of charge.

I've heard figures like 80% of Americans want illegal immigration stopped. They really don't care how. Border agents have proven they can't do anything stop the flow. I really do not understand how Congress can sit there in Washington and listen to the entire country asking them to stop the illegals and they do nothing. It defies logic. My theory is that the shadow government is paying them to do nothing. The Owls are having their way. That the agenda of the NWO is to innundate the US with 3rd world illegals. I'm sure the Bushes are pushing this agenda. It is a little hard to imagine that the intire Congress is involved but may be?? What do you think?

Well... it should be MASSIVE - 50 feet tall loaded with concertina wire all along the Mexico-facing side and the top. Come to think of it, a 20K volt live wire wouldn't hurt either! It should extend 20 feet into the ground and have senosrs all over the thing to detect digging or climbing. There should be a guard tower every mile with smoked glass so that the illegals wouldn't know which posts were manned or unmanned. Each post should have a high-resolution video camera wired to a central station for monitoring.

The Bill has been voted on, passed and signed! It is time to build this wall NOW!

I like the moat with alligators idea, but I'm telling you, a wall is not going to cut it.

Check out this video debunking the "flying humanoids" in Mexican skies:

enhanced video of "flying witches"

Now tell me, who would have the $ to go flying around with jetpacks? The Mexican druglords, their couriers, actually, that's who. They'll just fly right over the wall.

If it was up to me the wall would be roughly similar to what the Israelis have on their border with the West Bank or something like what I envision:

- 12 feet high wall of concrete with razor wire with embedded sensors at the top.

- Covers the entire border from San Diego, CA to South Padre Island, TX with the only openings at the official points of entry (which will be heavily guarded).

- Guard towers like what they have at prisons situated every few miles (maybe 3 or 4 miles in between each). Towers will be manned by at least 2 agents at all times and each will have a machine gun (either M240 or .50), a few AT4s, and rifles).

- Every 20 miles or so will be like a mini base from which the patrols operate from, handle dispatch, barracks, detention cells, etc

- The creation of a 1 mile long DMZ, anyone crossing into that zone (off of the roads leading to the official points of entry) will get 1 warning shot followed by 2 minutes to turn back (1 minute if in a vehicle) and then its shoot to kill. Maybe we could add some mines and vehicle barriers.

Now; since the Mexican Army and their drug lord and smuggler allies will not take kindly to this wall and will do whatever it takes to remove this severe obstacle to their "business" we will then therefore need some form of paramilitary force to actually man this wall and defend it therefore I propose the United States Border Constabulary Force:

- Run by the DOJ (if DHS is abolished) or DHS if it still exists in peacetime and reports to the DOD in wartime. Personnel will be classified as both law enforcement officers and members of the military, in essence it will be a heavily armed version of the current US Border Patrol but with both military and civilian police status.

- Number at least 100,000 personnel (remember they have to cover the Mexican and Canadian borders plus South Florida, Puerto Rico, USVI, etc).

- Divided into 3 commands; Static Defense, Roving Patrols and Reserve. Roving patrols will be equipepd and organized similar to US Army infantry squads and platoons and will operate from helicopter, vehicles, horseback, etc and will have LMGs, light mortars and such for heavy weapons support. Reserve will be organized into company and battalion sized forces and will also have light armor, etc to respond to mass attacks on the wall and to contain invaders should they get past the wall until the active duty US military can arrive to save the day.

ChrisF231:
If it was up to me the wall would be roughly similar to what the Israelis have on their border with the West Bank or something like what I envision:

OP here. Good post. Just what I was looking for, military experience and insight!

- Covers the entire border from San Diego, CA to South Padre Island, TX with the only openings at the official points of entry (which will be heavily guarded). (additional details, see Chris's orig. post)

Can't argue with this, seems effective.

Run by the DOJ (if DHS is abolished) or DHS if it still exists in peacetime and reports to the DOD in wartime. Personnel will be classified as both law enforcement officers and members of the military

The dual classification is essential IMO.

Number at least 100,000 personnel (remember they have to cover the Mexican and Canadian borders plus South Florida, Puerto Rico, USVI, etc).

Congress and President will determine the final numbers. Enough to do the job is the goal.

Divided into 3 commands; Static Defense, Roving Patrols and Reserve. Roving patrols will be equipepd and organized similar to US Army infantry squads and platoons and will operate from helicopter, vehicles, horseback, etc

Military jargon! Good job Chris!

Originally posted by plumranch

ChrisF231:
If it was up to me the wall would be roughly similar to what the Israelis have on their border with the West Bank or something like what I envision:

OP here. Good post. Just what I was looking for, military experience and insight!

- Covers the entire border from San Diego, CA to South Padre Island, TX with the only openings at the official points of entry (which will be heavily guarded). (additional details, see Chris's orig. post)

Can't argue with this, seems effective.

Run by the DOJ (if DHS is abolished) or DHS if it still exists in peacetime and reports to the DOD in wartime. Personnel will be classified as both law enforcement officers and members of the military

The dual classification is essential IMO.

Number at least 100,000 personnel (remember they have to cover the Mexican and Canadian borders plus South Florida, Puerto Rico, USVI, etc).

Congress and President will determine the final numbers. Enough to do the job is the goal.

Divided into 3 commands; Static Defense, Roving Patrols and Reserve. Roving patrols will be equipepd and organized similar to US Army infantry squads and platoons and will operate from helicopter, vehicles, horseback, etc

Military jargon! Good job Chris!

Thanks Plum! Historians will notice that I basically just copied Rome's famous Hadrian's Wall on the border between England and Scotland.

Well, if we were put all the energy into creating a paramilitary force as well as build a wall, why not just go ahead and invade Mexico and annex it to the U.S., we should of done that way back when.

Its got varied terrain and some great climates and a cheap labor force, be a nice place for retirees once its cleaned up a bit.

Originally posted by ephemeral
Well, if we were put all the energy into creating a paramilitary force as well as build a wall, why not just go ahead and invade Mexico and annex it to the U.S., we should of done that way back when.

Its got varied terrain and some great climates and a cheap labor force, be a nice place for retirees once its cleaned up a bit.

We already have places like that; Guam, American Samoa, USVI, Puerto Rico, Northern Mariana Islands, etc.

Have you ever been to Puerto Rico? The crime rate and the poverty aside it is a great place to visit and they go out of their way to cater to people from the mainland states. And im not by any means a summer/tropics person, ill take a ski resort over the summer anytime and I still love Puerto Rico. Yes, some of them hate us and see us as an occupying colonial power and "evil racist imperialist Gringos" but the majority of them love us and are proud to be Americans.

Maybe back in 1848 it would have made sense but in todays world it would cost to much $$$ and there would be alot of opposition to us. It would make Iraq look like paradise. Besides, Mexico has a totally different culture and wa y of life then the US and even if we did manage to successfully occupy it we would have constant revolts; they already hate our guts to the highest level possible and so imagine what they would do to us if we invaded their country? I say we invest in keeping them out rather then absorbing them and their problems. Mexico HAS NEVER had a democratically elected government until very recently (and even then im sure there was some vote fraud going on). Trust me, you do not want Mexico to be a part of the US.

I've never been to Puerto Rico, But I'll take your word for it. And what you say makes sense.

Here's another idea. What if....

we took the money we will spend on the wall and the paramilitary, and instead build up mexican businesses? Or provide tax breaks to U.S. companies willing to set up operations there, with fair employment practices & good working conditions? Then the Mexicans would have decent paying jobs in their own country, and wouldn't be motivated to cross the border inbto the U.S.

The Mexicans I've known have been hard-working, family-oriented types; I'm sure there are criminals, like everywhere else, including the U.S., but I don't mix with those circles so I've never met them. That element could be dealt with by stepping up border patrols, perhaps as part of training for the military?


Just a random thought.

Originally posted by ephemeral
I've never been to Puerto Rico, But I'll take your word for it. And what you say makes sense.

Here's another idea. What if....

we took the money we will spend on the wall and the paramilitary, and instead build up mexican businesses? Or provide tax breaks to U.S. companies willing to set up operations there, with fair employment practices & good working conditions? Then the Mexicans would have decent paying jobs in their own country, and wouldn't be motivated to cross the border inbto the U.S.

The Mexicans I've known have been hard-working, family-oriented types; I'm sure there are criminals, like everywhere else, including the U.S., but I don't mix with those circles so I've never met them. That element could be dealt with by stepping up border patrols, perhaps as part of training for the military?


Just a random thought.

I like your idea ... we cant do everything and work has to be done to help Mexico and their economy however the problem with this is that Mexico is already a pretty wealthy country; its just that 10% of the population owns 70% of the wealth. The issue of corruption in the government (the police and the military in particular) has to be solved as well in order for us to fix this problem.

The US should do what Australia does with it's illegal imigrants, lock them all up in concentration camps for a couple of years and then send them back to where they came from. It worked for us, we used to have boatloads of immigrants from the middle east, via Indonesia, but we started imprisoning them. Since then, illegal immigration has pretty much stopped. Although, we do have the highest immigration rate in the world, so most carbon based life forms get in pretty easy (Tuberculosis sufferers preferred).

Hmmm...This may sound a bit extreme, but build the wall as a network of lasers. That way, immigrants will either legally come through the checkpoints or they'll illegally come through in pieces (Sort of like Wile E. Coyote through a screen door).

We don't want them here and they know it. We have been very candid about expressing ourselves with this concern. And really, I believe that those with the most of the extreme solutions are serious. As they should be. This is more than just folks looking for a better way of life. This is the PC thing. We are also told the lie about them doing work Americans would not do. We are soft, stupid and gullible.

It is an invasion. If they came over shooting we would shoot back.
Their own "mouth pieces" and their own web sites declare that they have come to "take back" what (they think) is theirs. And they are getting their way. Review all that we have done for them. Imagine what we could have done for our own with that money.

We should treat them as any other invading army. Shoot them!
Put tanks & hellicopter gun ships down there blasting away, and the flow would cease instantly, with maybe less than a dozen of them sent to "heaven". Maintenance ($$) would be minimal. Patrol and fire a few rounds at random intervals. We just have to show them that we are serious. Then there would be no more problems.

Then we can move on the sending the rest of them home.