Careful With Disinfo Accusations.

I don't like calling people disinfo agents. But, I will not hesitate to do it and I hope others don't when people post absolutely absurd theories with no factual support. The Truth Movement's got a reputation to maintain, and while some people might think the posters I'm talking about are harmless cranks at worst, I maintain that they couldn't be more dangerous. Whether they're doing on purpose or not, they're running interference for those behind the conspiracy. If we don't do our best to discourage theories without factual support, we will be a laughable clown circus that makes the Bush Administration look good by comparison very, very soon.

Originally posted by selfless

It's obvious by now that no terrorists did 911...

........

This is getting ridiculous to say the least. Why can't people be open to all possibilities on how 911 was done. There are multiple evidence that suggests all kinds of theories so how can a theory be a disinfo?

The disinfo is the official story, that's about as far as disinfo can go...

This will be my only post on this as I have sworn off 9/11 arguments here, and feel much better for it. These kind of comments are precisely why I don't debate 9/11 things here anymore. The "I have an open mind about 9/11 but I am 100% sure that the "official" story is 100% wrong" line of logic. Lets not even talk about the "evidence" aspect of it, as there really hasn't been anything that screams "smoking gun" every brought out and proved beyond a shadow of a doubt. If any CT had a "smoking gun" don't you think it would be out there and proven already?

You, as others have stated, have already arrived at a conclusion that isn't supported by all the facts out there, yet you will not consider that perhaps your original premise is flawed? I'd rather not waste my breath trying to argue with someone who is already convinced that they are right and no one else could be.

When you start to limit the evidence to just suit your particular theory and deny other evidence not supporting your view as "disinfo" or planted, you run the risk of making a mockery out of your own viewpoint.

pavil, read the rest of my posts on this thread and you might change the way you perceive my reasoning.

This is about dis info and dis info is created by the government and the official story comes from the government. Dis info is not created by individual theories resulting from individual perceptions. If you just believe the government then you did not put forth a theory into the collective stream of thoughts, you are simply believing a dis info story (In my opinion).

I have clearly stated that it was my opinion that the official story is the only possible dis info as it's designed to suite a corrupted agenda and hide the true criminals behind 911.

It wouldn't achieve much in terms of dis info if the government would invent theories that would still support that 911 was an inside job. The idea of an inside job would still be advertised and highly disruptive for the government plans.

[edit on 4-6-2007 by selfless]

Well, my input is this. People will believe whatever they want to believe nomatter what the evidence says.

I used to discuss some of the 9/11 theories for about a year until i decided it was not worth it anymore.

You have some members who start with their own made up theories, those theories are full of flaws and are easily debunked, the member in question and some others claim "the debunker is a disinformation agent", thinking this will make other members believe the theory, even though the proposed theory does not make any sense to anyone with some basic understanding of physics. Then the member who started the theory waits for about a month or two, and then writes the same theory with a few changes in the theory trying to erase the flaws he/she had when starting the theory.

I have seen this done so many times that it gets boring and monotonous after a while trying to show the flaws in such theories.

At the end nomatter what the "real" evidence says, people will always believe whatever they want to believe, and that is the only "truth".

[edit on 4-6-2007 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by selfless

Originally posted by talisman
Your whole premise is flawed. Your basically saying nothing is disinfo unless of course its the official story!

Dis info as in the purpose to hide what really happened.

I clearly stated that it was my opinion that no terrorists did 911 and so i don't force anyone to agree with me on that.

But for a government personal to introduce an inside job theory that is considered far fetched by some people is not a good way to hide the truth from people because it stills enters the concept that 911 was an inside job into our collective consciousness.

IMO it was already there. It hit me like a ton of bricks as I was seeing the news on 9/11. At that rate, there had to be at least a small pile of said bricks in the minds of probably millions of Americans. So they help people clear the bricks by having some disinfo buddied draw up blueprints to assemble them into neat little "Truth" houses built to fall at the slightest bump, then the big bad wolf in the Uncle Sam hat comes by and blows them all down one at a time.

I didn't bother with a house, looked at the blueprints, decided I liked my own plans better, took my bricks and made a nice thick wall that won't be blown over too easily.

Somehow i got of track there with the extended metaphor... anyway, good thread all.

I can't say whether one theory is stronger than any other, but I can say that there is enough evidence to prove that the initial story of terrorists is wrong. As for motive, there's tons of motives.

The ok to invade Afghanistan and Iraq while having U.S. puiblic support as well as international support for such attacks, is first and foremost on my mind.

The ability to make a great deal of money off certain pre-determined stock movements is also big on the list.

A buildup of arms in the region and funds acquired from war profiteering...how much has been spent since 911?

I personally think this is mostly about oil, shifting energy interests around to open up the ability to provide oil supplies to China and India who are growing more than 5% a year currently. Toppling Saddam was the only way to do that.

There is also the possibility that ancient archeology also comes into this on the backend. Since there is a great deal of acheological finds associated with Iraq in the form of stone tablets from the Sumerian culture which predates Mesopotamia and Babylon. The information from these finds directly impact the validity of the Bible and Christianity, citing information that combined with modern science, proves our biblical gods were actually beings from another world.

The following presentation helps with understanding this theory:

Modern Science Versus Ancient Knowledge

As for everyone's push that an NWO is in our future, the NWO is already reigned in and already has control, it just hasn't officially been announced. Let's face it, the U.S. Administration and Congress as well as the United Nations are just window dressing, for an already appointed NWO that has existed and has been in control for the past 50 years. With absolute media control and USAPs taking in 40-80 billion dollars a year, the most recent changes to the Geneva convention for torture, the spying on U.S. citizens, and the complete outfitting of every street corner with cameras, it's all just icing on the cake for what is coming.

Whatever theories people want to pull together is fine. The truth is, we are already screwed, and it is only going to get worse.

'Ten Questions That Every Intelligent Skeptic Must Answer'

video.google.com...

I'm sorry but I have seen no good evidence that contradicts the official story from the American Government. I don't think it's obvious at all that 9/11 was an inside job.

And the amount of '"OH MY GOD 100% ACTUAL PROOF THAT THE TOWERS WERE BROUGHT DOWN BY NUKES PURCHASED BY MISSY HIGGINS! MUST READ THIS!" threads is really getting ridiculous. Of course, there have been no threads actually entitled as above as it is my own theory and will bring it to light later But you know what I mean ...

But I still wish you all the luck in getting to the bottom of... everything! Happy Huntin'

told: plane crashed in shanksville
seen: cartepillar dug hole in an old mining site, plus C130 dropped debri.
+no plane

told: plane crashed at the pentagonz
seen: small anfo bomb, pictured, small asimetrical demo, pictured afterwards.
+no plane

told: planes crashed at the WTC
seen:
*crap digital dubbing + massive anfo (A little bit of brissance there) bombs.
*inverse demolition wave, accelerating faster than gravity; pure explosive force.
+no planes

Everybody around here knows what's going on.

There is a difference between disinformation and propoganda, and i think that is where the line is blurred.

We have what we saw on TV- 2 planes hit the WTC, 3 buildings collapse, a plane supposedly hits the Pentagon and Flight 93 is saved by he passengers.

What we read on the INternet- Reptilian Semetic GOP Bonesmen NWO oil pimps control the world and created 9/11 for personal gain and to invade the world along iwth it taking all of our personal freedoms and bringing big brother to the streets.

So what is disinfo, and what is propoganda? Lets start there. Disinfo is the 9/11 truth movement that has no proof, yet is the 9/11 comission report propoganda since it paints us in such a bad light? Take away the blinders and become the grazing sheep not the horse who ses nothing but what is fed to him, and if you let a horse, he will eat himself to death.

Trust instinct, faith in yourself and let nothing influence you. INfluence is the root of all evil.

Originally posted by esdad71
Trust instinct, faith in yourself and let nothing influence you. INfluence is the root of all evil.

So then don't let your self be influenced by the official story... That's the purpose of it, after all...

I trust instinct and I know that the government doesn't give a rat ass about individuals and only cares about world domination...

They poison our planet and make certain people believe that they are doing it for our own good..... It makes me sick.

Esdad, can you please upload your avatar from an independent internet image service and not ATS so that i can block the image of your avatar with out having to put all the avatars from the ATS server on block...

Your avatar is really annoying when we are reading your posts.

[edit on 4-6-2007 by selfless]

The problem with disinformation is figuring out what's disinformation and what's misinformation. As it's been pointed out before, disinformation is intentional. But how do we know what's intentional and what's honest mistake?

Concerning 9/11 we also have to consider that disinformation doesn't necessarily have to apply to the official story. Although one can say that the official story is disinformation by the CIA or whomever you'd like to blame because it doesn't all add up, it's also possible to say that the 9/11 Truth Movement is disinformation sponsored by say Islamic extremists. When you think about it, assuming that 9/11 was an inside job you may find yourself asking just as many questions as accepting the official story.

A person not believing the official story can point out how it looks like demolitions. A person not believing the inside job theory can point out the lack of motivation for putting demo charges in the World Trade Towers. Someone for the inside job theory can say how unscientific the WTC7 collapse was, yet the opponent in the debate could put out the lack of reason to destroy WTC7. The fun part is that both sides can easily accuse eachother of disinformation, yet neither side may be guilty of such things.

My point is that disinformation can happen on all sides of a debate, yet opposing opinions are not necessarily a conspiracy. It simply means that somebody disagrees with you.

I tend to listen to all sides of the conversation and draw my own conclusions.
I am not saying that everyone should do this, just my way of thinking.

But the official story is created by the government and the meaning of dis info means that it comes from the government.

That's the difference between inside job and official story, the government influenced and indulged perception.

For it to be dis info, it's most likely the mainstream story of the event...
and orchestrated by the government.

The meaning on disinfo is not 'from the government,", that is propoganda. Disinfo is a statement that cannot be proven.

My avatar annoys you? My god man, if that is true you are going to need to grow a thicker skin to get through life. Please get the definition of what you are trying to prove correct.

I mean, you are a disinfo agent if you spread rhetoric that cannot be proven. Can you prove that demolitions were used in WTC? no. Can you prove that a missle hit the Pentagon and not a jet? no. Can you prove the truth about Flight 93? no, and if you do you are spreading disinfo since that is the true meaning. I hate to say this, but the DHS and the government could really give a # less about conspiracy sites, it is only monitored to find the radicals and it should.

The official story also is not propoganda according to your views since in thge eyes of the CT'ers it cannot be proven, so where does that leave us?

Originally posted by Toy_soldier
I'm sorry but I have seen no good evidence that contradicts the official story from the American Government. I don't think it's obvious at all that 9/11 was an inside job.

And the amount of '"OH MY GOD 100% ACTUAL PROOF THAT THE TOWERS WERE BROUGHT DOWN BY NUKES PURCHASED BY MISSY HIGGINS! MUST READ THIS!" threads is really getting ridiculous. Of course, there have been no threads actually entitled as above as it is my own theory and will bring it to light later

But you know what I mean ...

But I still wish you all the luck in getting to the bottom of... everything! Happy Huntin'

But a lot of you OCTers who post always seems to not address POINTS made by people from 9/11 truth Movement. This is what I have noticed. And many, especially the news people from American Fox television etc outright ATTACK people for expressing their reservations about the OCT. Like they have done to Rosie O'Donnell, and Charlie Sheen, etc etc.

So I challenge you then to make an EFFORT to please take the time to view the video i linked this thread to, above, Ten Questions That Every Intelligent Skeptic Must Answer video.google.com...

? Can you? Your a skeptic aren't you.........? So? Have a go. And honestly as you can. Every question, really thinking about the questions.

You have already seemed to dodge it once, will you do this time?

[edit on 5-6-2007 by zoomein]

Definitions used in this thread as I understand the definition. Please feel free to add or correct me. Going simple route, trust me I can do long winded answers.

9/11-An event that hapened on US soil that included planes and buildings.
Disinformation- (disinfo) Deliberate misinformation used to confuse.
Misinformation-(misinfo) Mistaken information.
Conspiracy-Group that plots an action, usually illegal.
COINTEL/COINTELPRO-Counter Intelligence/Program-Gov't sanctioned disinfo/program


OCT--(I have no clue as to what this means, but guessing Official Conspiracy Theory as a alternate way of saying Official Story?)

--zoomein--Started to watch the video, but as it is late here and I still need some sleep I will give an objective debunk angle review for you. I have about a paragragh in my head before the first question and saw the first question. I have at least one sentence in mind for that one. I'll get to it sometime this evening maybe.

[edit on 5-6-2007 by Ahabstar]

Zoomein, the video you posted is disinfo at it's purest. It takes bits and pieces of other issues and tries to apply it to the 9/11 conspiracy.

As a Software Engineer who is a 'intelligent person' as the tape states, I used my critical thinking skills during the first question to realize that the video is not for 'smart people', but for those who cannot think for themselves. So according to your video, you should shop it to fast food workers and people who work in the mall. Now, this is not my quote, I am just using the information in the video.

Please give 3 examples of disinfo from 9/11?