the illuminati are not anti christ

Im somewhat angry at david icke etc about how they think the illuminati and knights templars are bad people the anti christs. the illuminati where people who fort against the theories of the vatican seeking the truth of life, trying to find who we are. why did jesus appear when many of the aincet civilisations belived in the elements of life, they belived in what kept them alive, yes they maybe on the dollar bill but george bush etc hav nothing to do with illuminati, skull and bones are not illuminati maybe the illuminati are warning us.

another question i saw a documentary on vatican and illuminati, they said the illuminati have infultrated the vatican for many years so does that mean catholics are illuminati, obelisks, swiss garuds the new templars?

i would like to hear your views on illuminati pros and cons or anyone who isnt against them.

There are two quite different views of the illuminati.
In the past they were a group of scientists or scientific thinkers who opposed the common views that the church forced upon the people. They had no specific politial agenda to my knowledge, but tried to preserve science and stand up to the church. Not nessesairily about who we are.
However, this illuminati group supposedly disbanded or disappeared long before America was founded.
The illuminati that Ike and Maxwell talk about is more of a political organization apparently bend on control and dommination. Quite different than the previous enlightened or illuminated ones.
I'm not sure whether Ike is right, but if they are truely as powerful as they are made out to be then it would seem very hard to near immpossible to do anything about it.
Nowadays the knights templar do not exist officially that I have any knowledge of, they were ousted out of europe and some said they fled to America.
"The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail" would be a good book to read for more information.
On another note not all ancient civilizations believed in the elements or just what kept them alive, in fact there are quite a lot of examples on the contrary. The Egyptians worshiped many gods, but they were not related to the elements, Nor does Judaism, though possibly debatable. Buddhism also does not focus on elements and base desires, it strives to overcome them.
Also the knights templar were not heavily into any fighting that I know of, they were the precurser of bankers and very very wealthy, I am unsure of their relationship to the illuminati, I didn't know they were linked.
Personally I do not have near enough evidence to accept the illuminati or NWO as existing; you'd think that if they had so much power there would be some kind in infighting. but I do not see how it would relate to me whether they existed or not, wouldn't be major unless the horrible NWO starts to use us as slave labour without rights like in "1984"

im a memmber of theknights tempalr of britanna and where not masons so ye its still around but like you said if iluminati hav so much power why not use it what are they waiting for. i think it should steer more towards the power of skull and bones and leave the illuminati alone. the illuminati have such a bad name know wonder there in hiding, what if we discovered good things about them and expressed it the maybe hey will come out off hiding who knows?

[edit on 8-6-2007 by Swissgarud]

[edit on 8-6-2007 by Swissgarud]

Originally posted by Swissgarud
im a memmber of theknights tempalr of britanna

WOW I can be a Earl Regalia for only 5000 quid !

www.knightstemplar-uk.co.uk...

To my understanding, illumination comes at the 33rd degree of either masonry or freemasonry, where then you have a choice to join perhaps, the illuminati. They must be big money rollers and influence peddlers. And they likely do hold some secrets, but its likely they are not really looking for peace, truth or reality as they have to keep so many secrets. Which makes them lie im sure, and how is lying to anyone good? So the illuminati is a bad thing by example, so are the masons by doctrine, and according to thebravenewworldorder.blogspot.com... 9-11 was a freemasonic ritual perpetrated under the guise of terrorism, so to protect the craft and quietly take over while making the country love its leadership, who are really just actors for the real takeover. Your countries been F-ed up by the secret cults..sry.

'Illuminati' is a term that's been popularised in recent decades in particular by Wilson and Icke for example. It means different things to different people and for some reason has come be accepted as describing a group of actual people, possessing unimaginable esoteric knowledge, wealth and thus power.

Ordinary folk appear content to accept that a powerful, shadowy group meets in secret luxury to decide the fate of the world's population, wars, establishment of new-worlds in space, etc. Perhaps it's the natural progression as far as beliefs go, for those who accepted Superman, Batman, the Terminator, etc. as true during their formative years.

Take a detached look at Blair, Bush, Kissenger, Cheyney, Rumsfeld and their ilk. What do you see?

If you're seeing the same as I, they are all middle-aged to elderly and in poor physical condition. Listen to them speak: what do you hear? Does 'rank stupidity, ego, arrogance and a certain effeminacy sum it up?

Now look at the European Royal Families: subject them to the same analysis. Anyone grab your attention as far as superior intellect or integrity is concerned? Nope? No, I don't see any of that either.

Ok, swing your gaze now to the 'scientists' about whom we hear so much and with regard to whom we're probably expected to feel at least awe. But are they awe-inspiring? No? No, I don't hold them in awe either. Usually, they are lucky to be able to hold together a relationship with the family cat. Big on math and that's about it.

So next we turn to the rarified world of Big Business. This is where the heads of major mining, banking and financial, pharmaceutical, medical, industrial and other organisations hang out. They're the ones who make/sell the land-mines and bombs, heavily-promoted 'life-saving' drugs and medical equipment, poisonous toothpastes and cola, life-sapping loans, etc. What do you see? Lots of middle aged and elderly men in expensive suits. They have bad breath and prostate problems. They gulp Viagra with their antacids.

Who's left? The military hierarchy? The intelligence service heads? Assorted media barons? Religious big-shots. Sundry politicians and heads of minor nations? The odd legal giant or two?

That's your 'illuminati' today.

Take off their suits and over 90% of them have protruding or sagging bellies. They sleep poorly. Their digestion is shot. They have varicose veins and hearing aids, false teeth, false hair and orthopedic trusses to hold up their sagging, atrophied genitals. Most of them are sexually impotent and addicted to sexually deviate practices. There's usually no one person in their lives whom they even remotely genuinely love. Because they've learned that everyone has a price and can be bought. They believe in no god. They hope that when they die, everything will become black: simple black nothingness.

Put them together in a luxurious 'secret location'. They go through the ritual of lots of Meet & Greet. Lots of back-slapping and Hail Fellow Well Met. False smiles, false laughter. They dont' pretend to look 'serious' or 'deep'. Because what they engage in is neither. It's fun, or as close to 'fun' as these ghouls get. Lots of prostitutes: male, female, child and other. Ho Ho laughter.

Then, they pretend to cut to the chase. There's a short-list. Out of the above, there's a 'secret chamber'. They're only those ennumerated above, just less of them. That way, they keep the others on their toes and can wrest favours out of them for subsequent favourable decisions from those in the Inner Sanctum.

What they discuss is so prosaic, yet so inhumane, it would literally make you dry retch if you were a fly on the wall as they discuss just which nations will be supported, which repressed, during the coming six months period. Boredly, they decide where the next 'war' (or recession, etc.) will break out and who and what will be used to initiate it, based on the country-in-questions natural assets (oil, minerals, etc). And how this will be portrayed and fed to the gullible public by the media. They divide the spoils: the contracts, the supplies, the 're-building', the munitions, those who'll install utilities, those who'll determine the 'educational policies' and marketing and products, the 'health issues' (increases in diabetes, AIDS, ADHD, etc. and 'life saving drugs' to treat same). Just your future and mine and that of our neighbours and children and great-grandchildren, etc.

Then they break for lunch. These get-togethers --- sometimes described as 'summits', are basically the same any other 'seminar' aka: junket. Some will spend the afternoon sight-seeing with a difference (obscene displays organised for the many pedophiles and other deviates, for example). Others will play golf. Others will enjoy a medicated doze.

Most of them don't trust the others, but then they don't feel too anxious, because each has the measure of the other. They all hold information on the rest that would destroy them if it were revealed. They're criminals, common criminals. They speak each other's language. They've always been around.

There's a bit of jostling for position, just as in any organisation. Decisions are made to 'terminate' some while others are brought up through the ranks. Tony Blair is perhaps the most nauseating, with his alternating personaes squealing variously: ' Am I a good little boy, huh, huh, am I?' with the occasional ' I'm an elder statesman in the Churchill mould and you'd better damn well take me seriously, for I am a Man with a wife and children to prove it, no matter what my pink shorts reveal about me ! ' Gimme the money, Gimme the money -- and make sure you have my good profile in shot before you click that damn camera !'

Bush squeaks around, making the usual horses' ass of himself. His contribution is to get drunk, grope everything in sight and make idiotic half-remarks before falling in a pool of his own vomit. He's not a member of the Inner Sanctum: Cheyney is or was. He writes Bush's speeches and when he has the strength, he shoves his arm up Bush's backside and works the Bush mouth for the cameras. Rumsfeld usually spends his time at 'summits' trying to rape the furniture while screaming anti-muslim obscenities. The Goon Squad.

The real deals are made by a select group of the World's Most Ordinary Looking men. National leaders are then memoed their instructions and a cheque bearing a Swiss Bank mark is stapled to the top of the instructions.

Surprisingly, most of the above 'world shapers' are avid occultists, in the mould of your Aunty Daisy. They attend seances and fly plump, semi-stupid middle-aged 'mediums' to their private estates, for a 'reading'. They consult their private astrologer for their horoscope readings. They carry weird amulets and childish 'lucky charms' on their person. They have 'lucky slippers' and their personal assistants have to cart their special foods and childhood Teddy bears around for them.

Illuminati ? Sorry.

Those with real knowledge live in stone cottages in remote areas of France, Scotland, Australia, the US, etc. They say little. They live simply. Very occasionally, they feel compelled to contact each other. When they do, they say: ' It's looking bad around 15th September. We'd better do something. It'll be a stop-gap measure at best. Have to tell you, I won't be around much longer. Six month and that's it. I'll write you with a contact number. He's young with a lot to learn, but he's powerful. Do your best. Bye.'

That's your 'illuminati'. They're the guys trying to put the brakes on the criminal cabals. You wouldn't recognise them if they bumped into you in the street. No wands. No wizards cloaks. No oak-panelled secret chambers. No organised membership. No names.

It's always been this way.

Im looking forward to the book they are releasing will be intresting to read.

The Illuminati probably don't commonly use that name. However, George Bush is a member if a quasi masonic order called the 'Skull and Bones' society which he joined whilst at University. Anyone who is a Freemason or Illuminati member cannot leave the society once they have joined.

These people swear loyalty to the secret societies ABOVE ALL ELSE, and will obey without question the direct orders of a superior. So the great leader Bush would have to obey the word of a superior Illuminati member as if it wsa the Word of God.

If you seriously want to read up, please follow these links:

www.savethemales.ca...

and

Leo Zagami

Zagami was a senior member of the Illuminati, proved by publishing his relevant documents and reveals all the secrets.

Originally posted by MAD47

Also the knights templar were not heavily into any fighting that I know of, they were the precurser of bankers and very very wealthy,

Actually, the Templars were involved in heavy combat all throughout their history. They conquered Jerusalem, and were its defenders for many years.

Their wealth was sort of contradictory. As monks, each Knight Templar was required to take a vow of poverty. So even though the organization itself controlled a lot of European wealth, the individual Knights led lives of self-imposed poverty and asceticism.

Originally posted by Heronumber0
The Illuminati probably don't commonly use that name. However, George Bush is a member if a quasi masonic order called the 'Skull and Bones' society which he joined whilst at University. Anyone who is a Freemason or Illuminati member cannot leave the society once they have joined.

The Skull and Bones Senior Society at Yale University is not Masonic. Also, any member of the Masons who wants to leave the Order is perfectly free to do so.

The same held true of the Illuminati. It's founder, Dr. Adam Weishaupt, himself officially dissolved the Order, and ALL the members left it.

Zagami was a senior member of the Illuminati, proved by publishing his relevant documents and reveals all the secrets.

As our fellow ATS member Cug pointed out in a recent thread, Zagami was never a member of the organizations which he claims to be, and his certificates are forgeries.

Any Mason can leave at any time for any reason.

"the knights templar were not heavily into any fighting that I know of"

The lads were bad. Standing order for the Templars: Stand and fight against 3 opponents to 1 Templar. Typically, they would fight at 10 to 1.

They are the reason so many military words are French. Enfillade, defillade, rendevous, reconaissance, most Army ranks, tactics, srategy... The Templars brought military science to Europe. Others learned from them, and used the words they used.

As always, the same old untruths about the Illuminati. They existed before Adam Weishaupt, and they exist today. Adam Weishaupts Illuminati were not the begining and the end of the Illuminati, just the one band of Illuminati that came out of the closet.

I know a illuminati memeber alledgedly, im not possitive but, he has roots in the hashishans. But is american and worships Bush and fascistic thinking. I personaly have grown to not like the guy. Though I wish hed see the true light, not the masonic light. no offence masonic light.

Originally posted by mastermind77
To my understanding, illumination comes at the 33rd degree of either masonry or freemasonry, where then you have a choice to join perhaps, the illuminati.

Just to clear up any illusions you might have about freemasonry (which is, incidentally, exactly the same thing as masonry), true illumination comes from within. Freemasonry is a mechanism to help you achieve your own personal light, one amongst many in fact, but does not deliver Truth upon a plate. Truth has to be discovered.

... (snipped some twaddle)... and according to thebravenewworldorder.blogspot.com... 9-11 was a freemasonic ritual perpetrated under the guise of terrorism....

Anyone familiar with masonic ritual knows there there is no degree available (at least within regular masonry) that involves flying airliners into tall buildings. I think that blog is winding you up.

Your countries been F-ed up by the secret cults..sry.

Fixed up? Firmed up?

Oh... and what secret cults...? If they are secret how come you know of them?