Originally posted by PartChimp
What good would have been gathered from government complicity in 9/11?

Gee I don't know... maybe it's a quaint idea, but the *good* might be the public knowing which government officials were complicit in 9/11 so that they could decide for themselves whether to keep them in office or not.

How does it play on the emotions or the security needs of the average American citizen? The official flight 93 story is a heroic, inspiring story. Something that the public needed to hear at the time.

Do you really believe that the sons of daughters of the men "sacrificed" at Normandy need some sort of self-inflicted delusions to cope with FL 93 being intercepted and shot down? That's really pretty insulting to the American public if you truly believe that.

Of course if the government covered it up, it is deadly wrong, but a realist should be able to see the advantage of such a fabrication for the good of the American people and their collective psyche, however miniscule it may be.

No, there is no good in fabricating fairy tales to tell the people who decide who vote for their elected officials. It's criminal fraud, and anybody guilty of it should be charged of treason. Shooting down a commerical airliner, killing 40 people, and covering it up is a bit worse than Nixon lying about the Watergate break-in or Clinton lying about Monica Lewinsky. Yet both Nixon and Clinton faced the prospect of being thrown out of the Presidency for these benign lies.

What do the American people garner from 9/11? Severe paranoia? Higher gas-prices? Dead relatives who met their fates in iraq and afghanistan or other clandestine locales in the world? You are comparing apples to oranges, it seems.

No, it's not comparing apples to oranges. Perhaps what the American people garner from 9/11 is not the proper question. Perhaps the proper question is what did the people that covered-up the truth about 9/11 gain? 7 more years in office? Avoiding facing a Congressional inquiry as to their foreknowledge of 9/11?

Perhaps the real reason for the myth of 9/11 was to instill a misguided patriotism and hatred towards a phantom enemy when the real enemies of America are the people who allowed 9/11 to happen. I suppose it's better to have America's rage directed at faceless arabs than at their own elected officials who at best failed to prevent 9/11, and at worst made sure it happened.

Nick-

I see what you're saying; however, who is the guilty target? I think we can all agree that George Bush is no Cobra Commander. How are conspiracy theorists sure where to place the blame? In a topic chock-full of such uncertainties, wouldn't it be fair to say that our learning-challenged president knew little, if nothing about the alleged "truths" of that day? So much vehemence is thrown in the direction of the figure head of our government.

Nixon was caught on audio-tape; Clinton... well... we all know about the dress. Is Bush the puppet-master, according to your theory?

Flight 93, in my opinion, is the key to the "truth" movement sluffing off the fanatics.

Originally posted by PartChimp

I see what you're saying; however, who is the guilty target? I think we can all agree that George Bush is no Cobra Commander. How are conspiracy theorists sure where to place the blame? In a topic chock-full of such uncertainties, wouldn't it be fair to say that our learning-challenged president knew little, if nothing about the alleged "truths" of that day? So much vehemence is thrown in the direction of the figure head of our government.

Nixon was caught on audio-tape; Clinton... well... we all know about the dress. Is Bush the puppet-master, according to your theory?

Flight 93, in my opinion, is the key to the "truth" movement sluffing off the fanatics.

I think the biggest mistake that the "truth movement" has made is using the 9/11 conspiracy theories strictly to attack Bush because they hate his politics. Rosie O'Donnell wasn't going to bat for the Truth Movement. She was using the Truth Movement as a bat to hit George Bush.

If there is a cover-up, it's bi-partisan. In fact, the key players in the conspiracy would almost have to be left-overs from the 8 years Clinton was in office.

Here's a list of people to start with:

Sandy Berger
Jamie Gorelick
Patrick Fitzgerald
Eliot Spitzer
Lee Hamilton
Louis Freeh, and
George Tenet

The "conspiracy," or at least the cover-ups, go back to the 1993 WTC bombing, TWA 800, the Cole bombing, and Oklahoma City. It's silly, imo, to put blinders on to what happened pre-2001 and then suddenly blame Bush and the neocons exclusively for 9/11.

And did you notice how nobody from either party seemed interested in hearing the testimony from the Able Danger officers?

Please correct me if I am wrong here but wasn't it found that the terrorists fearing that passengers were about to break through put the plane into a header. Thus no real hero of a civilian wrestling away the yoke and nose diving the plane in a glorious act of bravery? In otherwords they tried, but did not get the cockpit door open and the terrorists aborted their mission rather than face the music.

As for twist, there seems to be no real agreement on UA93's intented target. Hitting WTC7 seems like one heck of a hard target and has a reality chance of next to zero in my book. But the NYC focused crowd likes to name it.

Hitting the White House or Capitol Building would be about as tough as the Pentagon as they are smaller targets. Hitting a memorial like Washington's or Lincoln's would have been impossible. Could Langley been the target? It is big enough and isolated enough to be found from the air.

Flgiht 93 was to hit the capitol or the white house. That was the landmark to find and hit from testimony and information I have read.

The US was lucky that 93 was late that day (45 minutes) and that we had to chance to deal with the situation. This is where the CT falls apart. Cheney, MIneta, the mystery man who kept asking anout the stand, the pilots and the tower at the AFB that the jets were scrambled from are the only ones who know what actually happened. This is compartmentalization at its finest.

Major Rick Gibney is credited with the shootdown. There is vague information about this but it is out there. But you want the reason why...

Because we were caught with out pants down and that was proven in the 9/11 comiision testimony. Intelligence failures led to the 9/11 attacks and the last thing after the death of 3000 citizens the administration wanted to do was tell the country THEY had killed over 100 themselves to save the lives of tens of thousands. Remember, hindsight is 20/20 and with the immediate release of the movie, the lets roll tagline and the gov't created CT controversy over WTC 1,2 and 7, the government needed not worry. If you ask alot of 9/11 CT's they do not even have a clue about 93 but are positive lasers and holograms took out the WTC.

The is no official story except the one you choose the believe.

I believe it was shot down, but I have yet to find a reason except for the heroes aspect of the passengers.


They did not shoot the pentagon plane down, which FL93 would of done the same damage to the white house. The president was not in the white house so why shoot down this plane and not the pentagon plane?


Because it was in a prime spot, not many eye witnesses and it created the fl93 heroes which was much needed on this sad day.l

WHile I do believe that we were attacked by terrorist cells on 9/11, I do think that Flight 93 was , in fact shot down to stop its arrival at the Capitol (or whatever the final destination was to have been).

The recreative lore about heroes taking over the plane was a CYA move on the part of the Air Force(FA-18's shot the plane down, is that right?) and Govco. The public would not have tolerated that on a day like 9/11.

It is a heartwarming story about Yankee courage, and sadly, IMHO, malarky. THey got taken down to stop further attacks.

THe reason that there was time to intercept 93 was the delay at the airport. It was 45 minutes late taking off. the problem about this is that once it is public, how do you control it?

The pentagon plane was a full half hour after the wtc planes, how what this not intercepted? fl93 was a full half hour after the pentagon plane, to me it had to be intercepted.


But why? What target was it going to hit that was worth this whole shot down cover up? If the PENTAGON the freakin defense building is not worthy enough to be saved, what is?


If the plane hit the white house I think thats more incentive to go to war rather than the heroes BS.


Idk

they shot it down because the terrorist hate our freedom. they covered it up because Bush felt there was a lot of mistrust in Washington and he was working to elevate it.

seriously though. whether or not the flight was shot down - no one can not deny the amount of patriotic spin that was placed upon Flight 93. were they to admit it right away, it'd be direct and immediate blame placed upon the governement. why ask for trouble when you can use it for advancement of agenda.

we can surmise it was shot down by the debris sites. If it wasn't then it was rigged by either the assumed "islamo-nazi" which i adhere to being real and intent on killing people like ignorace often does stab its problems away. or rather though consider the bigger fish...the rogue puppets from our country, set it up that they knew something was gonna happen, so exploiting the real bad guys, by remote controlling them into the towers, thereby freeing them by circumstance they hoped in the end, as they should see, they f****ed up a tad. lololololol well im not laughing that much, its just that the television i used to watch trained my mind to laugh at things i should take seriously, so im still waining from the mind controlled state of stupid bliss land.

The reason for the cmplicity or duplicity is simple...

PRISON PLANET - POLICE STATE - NWO

The Patriot Act was refused after wtc 93 and OKC but couldnt get passed quick enough after 911.

New Freedom Inititive, Intel Reform Bill, Patriot Act Two.

War is money, control is power, now they have all the money and all the control. Homeland Security is not protecting our borders its spying on Americans in all they do, then flying them off after secret arrests to foreign nations for "Enhanced Interrogation Techniques" <---Read TORTURE...

Originally posted by tyranny22
they shot it down because the terrorist hate our freedom. they covered it up because Bush felt there was a lot of mistrust in Washington and he was working to elevate it.

seriously though. whether or not the flight was shot down - no one can not deny the amount of patriotic spin that was placed upon Flight 93. were they to admit it right away, it'd be direct and immediate blame placed upon the governement. why ask for trouble when you can use it for advancement of agenda.

Nick, I would imagine this is the type of politicizing you are referring to? "Patriotic spin"? I believe the calls were real. There probably even was some sort of struggle aboard the plane; how fruitless it was is another question. If you are willing to believe that the government was involved in 9/11, tyranny22, as i know you do, you have to at least be able to see the other side of this, how the acting government would try to turn a half-truth into an event that reaped some type of hope from that day.

Although I in no way shape or form trust the government, I was not raised, nor do i have the audacity to intrinsically hate it. Our government, believe it or not, does some good for the people, simply to do good for the people. I'm sure you don't see it that way, though. In your mind, our government is comprised solely of snarling war-pigs who thrive on blood, know matter who's blood it happens to be.

Truth-cultists minds were open enough to accept the most damning theory in any nation's history as fact; why can't you open it enough to see the other side of the coin?

[edit on 30-5-2007 by PartChimp]

[edit on 30-5-2007 by PartChimp]

Theindependant-

You know, you're right; I see that "prison planet" coming down the chute in a hurry. I mean, look at all the evidence. I know alot of police states/dictatorships that allow people like Cindy Sheehan to exist. I mean, what police state wouldn't allow protestors to commit sub-human acts like burn soldiers in effigy? Oh, and art too. Thousands of musical/visual artists inspire free-thought and sometimes anti-government sentiment; I'm sure they're next to be publicly beheaded.

Give me a break. Even if you believe in government foreknowledge/complicity in 9/11, connecting flight 93 to the "new world order" is like connecting Steve Erkle to the Black Panthers.

tyrrany22 and theindependant-

I would seriously like at least a time/event line so I can attempt to see the logic in your assertions. A rebuttal to my response would be appreciated as well.