could a sniper kill at 1 km?

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posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:43 PM
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me and a m8, somehow ended up having this discussion today

if someone was wearing body armour and was shot at with a sniper rifle at a range of about 1000m - 1600m, would it kill them?

when we said sniper rifles we meant a PSG1/M24.

i argued that it probably wouldnt as some body armour can stop AK47 rounds at close range, and that even if a very powerful sniper was used (M82 etc...) at such distances the velocity would be decrease enough to not pierce the body armour?

as people in here have fired weapons and some have been in the army, maybe you could settle the discussion.




posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:47 PM
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I have not fired any other weapon than a shotgun, and I havent been to the military yet. But I would imagine that you could kill someone wearing body armor at those distances.. depending on the type of the bullet though.



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:48 PM
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Head shot? Probably if not kill one hell of a headache



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:51 PM
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I wouldn't know about with sniper rifles, but my brother was reading a factual book about a marine sniper in vietnam who was using a 50 cal to snipe with. He said the round would cause the victim to literally do a back flip when hit from 2000+ meters.
Not that it answers your question - just putting my 2 cents worth in~



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:57 PM
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i was meaning in the chest

where the body armour is



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 12:59 PM
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All depends on the bullet. Most are teflon coated, which makes them armor piercing, however, you might want to read on this site

www.post-gazette.com...



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:01 PM
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Originally posted by cleggy
i was meaning in the chest

where the body armour is


You can field research this and get back with the results.(If possibe)



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:05 PM
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A good sniper could shoot in the head from that range...


PSG1 and M24 don't use ammo that keeps it's trajectory when shot at ranges above 800m, they are 7,62x51mm and shooting accurately up and above 1000m requires .300 or .338 magnum, not widely used in sniper rifles, more likely in hunting rifles. It is possible to reach 1000m with 7,62x51, I think.
Of course that involves counting the trajectory of the bullet, accurately and fast. Adding the speed of wind, this could be done only by real hardcore pros (such as Homer Johnson
)



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:10 PM
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Its probably in the range of posiblity to make a kill at 1000m with the PSG1/M24, but by that point the bullet will be losing a good deal of its kinetic energy, and may not penetrate thick body armor. A .338 Laupa round however keeps around 1500 ft/lbs of energy out to 915m/1000yds and can probalby reach out even farther with a capable shooter. Here are two links on the 7.62x51mm(.308) and the 8.60x70mm (.338 Lapua)



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by cleggy
me and a m8, somehow ended up having this discussion today

if someone was wearing body armour and was shot at with a sniper rifle at a range of about 1000m - 1600m, would it kill them?

when we said sniper rifles we meant a PSG1/M24.

i argued that it probably wouldnt as some body armour can stop AK47 rounds at close range, and that even if a very powerful sniper was used (M82 etc...) at such distances the velocity would be decrease enough to not pierce the body armour?

as people in here have fired weapons and some have been in the army, maybe you could settle the discussion.


The aforementioned Marine sniper was Gysgt. Carlos Hathcock. He did indeed use a .50cal but it wasn't one of the state of the art machines we have today (ala Barrett), but a scoped .50 used for round spotting.
The story is covered indepth in "Marine Sniper".

According to my associates in the community. The world's longest snipe happened just recently in Afghanistan. It is purportedly at 1800m+. Even if it is apochryphal it gives you an idea of the abilities of today's snipers.

hrxll



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:34 PM
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so really it depends on the round used?

where as a 5.56mm/7.62mm would be kinda useless at those ranges a .30 cal would likely kill the person?



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 01:48 PM
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Don't have a link right now... find one later (if no one else does)... but check out this EXCELLENT sniper rifle...

the Barret 50 caliber recoiless. I don't know what current prices are, but back in the late 80's it cost roughly $1500. Came with 11 round magazine and bi-pod. Scope extra.

But seriously, I would think that this is probably one of the most effective sniping rifles around, it has an excellent range capacity. The only problem is that a 50 caliber is pretty easy to locate when fired...

I would also recommend the Soviet rifle, umm Dragnov?



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 02:16 PM
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Cleggy, here's something that might be useful a quote from someone who used the Barrett in anger:

According to Operation Iraqi Freedom PEO Soldier Lessons Learned [LTC Jim Smith 15 May 2003] "The Barrett 50 cal Sniper Rifle may have been the most useful piece of equipment for the urban fight – especially for our light fighters. The XM107 was used to engage both vehicular and personnel targets out to 1400 meters. Soldiers not only appreciated the range and accuracy but also the target effect. Leaders and scouts viewed the effect of the 50 cal round as a combat multiplier due to the psychological impact on other combatants that viewed the destruction of the target.

“My spotter positively identified a target at 1400 meters carrying an RPG on a water tower. I engaged the target. The top half of the torso fell forward out of the tower and the lower portion remained in the tower.” 325th PIR Sniper

"There were other personal anecdotes of one round destroying two targets and another of the target “disintegrating.”

"The most pervasive negative comment was that snipers felt the Leopold Sight was inadequate for the weapon – that it was not ballistically matched. It the sight was zeroed for 500, 1000 and 1500 meters, soldiers did not feel confident in their ability to engage targets at the “between” distances (e.g. 1300 m). Snipers felt there were better sights available for this weapon such as the Swarovski. Sniper team spotters felt the tripod for the Leopold Spotter Scope could be better designed. COL Bray, Commander, 2d BCT, 82d Airborne Division supported an Operational Needs Statement for a Sniper Sight that would allow the sniper to identify targets as combatants or non-combatants out to 2000m."


Manufacturers: Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc. and Unertl
Length:
Barrel length: 29" (736mm)
Weight: 22 lbs. (10 kg) (unloaded)
Bore diameter: 12.7mm (.50 Caliber)
Maximum effective range on equipment-sized targets:
Muzzle velocity:
Operation: Bolt-action
Safety: Frame-mounted
Magazine Capacity: 5 rounds, detachable box
10 round magazines are available
Modes of fire: Safe, Fire


hrxll



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by cleggy
so really it depends on the round used?

where as a 5.56mm/7.62mm would be kinda useless at those ranges a .30 cal would likely kill the person?


The short answer is again, Yes.

I wouldn't say that they would be useless, just uneffective. The effective range of a 5.56mm is probably 300 m but the round will travel much farther, just not with alot of accuracy.

The Barrett has ZERO minute of angle accuracy at range. Which in layman's terms means it might as well be a lazer beam.

hrxll



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by HerExcellency
According to my associates in the community. The world's longest snipe happened just recently in Afghanistan. It is purportedly at 1800m+. Even if it is apochryphal it gives you an idea of the abilities of today's snipers.


That's damn impressive! Rifle-wise, I've only every fired a Lee Enfield 303 circa WW2 - that was hard enough. Just can't appreciate the skill and patience required to pull a shot like that off.



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 02:34 PM
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www.biggerhammer.net...

that has alot of ifo on the rifle and its rounds. The next is just a picture of the Dragnov... beautiful rifle! Haven't found an info site about it, but it is imoressive!

stormy-night.org...



[Edited on 5-1-2004 by soothsayer]



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by cleggy
i was meaning in the chest

where the body armour is


So the answer is :

With a NATO 7.62 mm, no, you won't kill him/her.
With a .50 caliber, yes. Even if the bodyarmour resist ( and I very doubt that it can resist to such a caliber ), there are great possibilities that the shock of the impact will be deadly.


Originally posted by cleggy
so really it depends on the round used?

where as a 5.56mm/7.62mm would be kinda useless at those ranges a .30 cal would likely kill the person?


What are you saying ? Don't you know that 7.62 mm and .30 caliber are the same ?


The 5.56 mm is useless above 300/400 meters ( Anyway, in my opinion the 5.56 is ALLWAYS useless, no matter the situation you are ) . But the 7.62 mm is still very deadly at 1000 meters.

[Edited on 5-1-2004 by ultra_phoenix]



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 04:10 PM
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if someone was wearing body armour and was shot at with a sniper rifle at a range of about 1000m - 1600m, would it kill them?


Yes



posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 04:53 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk



if someone was wearing body armour and was shot at with a sniper rifle at a range of about 1000m - 1600m, would it kill them?


Yes


Depends on type and caliber of ammo, and the point of the hit.

and type of body armor..

Theres body armor sts that can stand blast from 10kg AT-mine.

so, NO.

also its luck if one actually can hit man at these ranges by first shot.

Cause the weapons are that accurate at extended ranges.




posted on Jan, 5 2004 @ 05:02 PM
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with a m82, perfect conditions, and one hell of a good shot, then yes.





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