The hippies were right all along

I almost hate to inter on this one. I saw the thread tittle and had to look. I too love some backward glances, time to time. Those were heady times, magical times. Maybe it was because we weren't so cynical then, and really thought anything was possible.

You kids who rant against it so much are not "with it man". It wasn't like you think. Stress wasn't even invented till later. And the drugs were soft, a lot better than you work crazed alkies can understand. But the best part was the fact that it was the last freedom in America, and a blessing that we didn't know it then.

Go ahead, tear into this post if you want, you can't change the truth by screaming at it, the establishment tried that one already. The reason old hippies never die is because for a time we could see a better world in the offing. And in our own way, we're still working for it.

I just wish this keyboard had a big PEACE symbol on it.

I missed out on the whole 60's thing, only being 22 now.

However, having gotton into the psychadelic trance scene, I have seen that many hippies still exist, even if they are different from in the past. Clean living, raising awareness of how messed up things are, making a change starting at home etc are all part of the current mindset.

Just 'cos the 60's are gone doesn't mean 'hippies' are. Although to be fair I don't really see them campaigning against stuff, just telling each other how much it all sucks.

Originally posted by NGC2736

... The reason old hippies never die is because for a time we could see a better world in the offing. And in our own way, we're still working for it.

yes there are still groups thriving,
check out these 2 links;
www.vanityfair.com...

DSL MP3 ~Stephen Gaskin, rapping with Mr Hippy
www.breakfornews.com...

((the MP3 takes awhile [it took me 57 seconds] to load as it seems to be a Deep Link within the break for news site))

Lemmie see now... there's some generalizations going on here, me-thinks.

1. hippies lived on communes and were communists.
2. hippies were anti-establishment and called cops pigs
3. hippies were all into drugs

All of the above are general concepts and not the reality.

The primary idea behind the hippie movement was the desire to re-connect with nature and inner spirituality. Whatever thwarted that is what hippies fought against. The concept of group farming for the benefit of all within that group led to the idea of communes. It was a way to distance themselves from the established notion that you could not survive without corporate infrastructure.

In a very big way, when you talk about post-apocalyptic survivalism, you are mirroring the very idea behind the concept of communes. What that has to do with Communism, I have no idea.

Certainly, drugs played a major role in the hippie culture, and, imo, that was the cause of its' eventual fall from grace. The Charlie Manson episode, IMO, was the death-knell of the culture. We had lost our innocence because of it. If smoking pot made hippies what they were, then the world must be full of them since nearly everyone has inhaled.

To those who think it was totally about drugs, all I can say is Frank Zappa.

To those who would expound on the era, you are welcome to your opinions, but that is all they are. If you haven't been involved in or experienced that era first hand, then you will never really know and are forced to depend on the opinions of opinions to make more opinions.

Being 18 years old in '65 and becoming aware of a sub-culture in the years following was a life-changing awakening which has never left me. I am who I am today because of it and if you see me as a drug addled anti-social aberration, then you are very much mistaken.




[edit on 11/5/07 by masqua]

I'm not going to waste my time and yours defending who I was and who I am. I'm here to deny ignorance. And that means mine AND yours. But it does my heart good to see the title of this thread.

Originally posted by NGC2736
I just wish this keyboard had a big PEACE symbol on it.

Here you go, man. In the spirit of the thread, you can use this one.

I wear the hippie label with pride. Now, I look like the successful entrepreneur I am, but I never would have attained the selfconficence I now have if it hadn't of been for the commune, nudity, freelove, drugs and rock and roll that I embraced after my 4yrs in the USAF.

I see many youth today rejecting the tightass, hatefilled, conservative segment that is a large part of current American culture. But that is what makes America still the diverse, creative and vibrant society that it is. Even though there are those that would like to change America into a
faceless, group of nonthinking, robots enslaved by the cooperate, bureaucrat system.

Like BH, I make no apologies for who I was or who I am today. I know some would like to disparage me for my lifestyle, both past and present; but I do detect a hint of envy in them. It's not too late; join us!!

Namaste

Some of the comments here do through their sarcasm indicate a succesful stereotyping applied by the media on the movement.

What it was really about was anti-conformism. The cultural stagnation following the war was prevalent. Whether it was as result of anti-communism or it was the emerging consumer race, I shall not say. But the comformity it caused was taken to new heights. I suppose it was out of fear not to stick out from the crowd.

The hippies were a reaction to that.

Another explanation is we were entering the age of Aqarius, that would create a new man spiritual minded and different from the materialistic focused man of the age of Pisces.

It was a rebellion against the establishment, yes, and it was highly needed with conformity killing any trend that didnøt comply with mainstream. People with long hair for instance didn't exist before the hippies came around. Actually the Beatles were the first to introduce a long-hair look. And who would call that longhaired today.

Most of all it was a spiritual thing and not a political ...and with the spirit of the fifties it was highly needed to be anti-establishment.

I started as a disillusioned beatnik, got politically aroused in the nuclear disarmament campaign and ended up as a apolitical hippie. And I still am.

Are you serious

They nearly destroyed the US once, now the same people are the ones who grew up and are running the US now.

Hippies are like a disease, i feel the same way Eric Cartman feels about them.

There is no sterotypying, that's how they really are, wake up man. Hippies only dream of a world with no technology, made out of cow manuer houses, where we grow our own food, never eat meat, and smoke up all day. That's their utopia, not mine. If they ran the world, they would run it into the ground.

[edit on 11-5-2007 by Royal76]

OK, I am seeing some contradictions is philosophies here. I truly don't care what lifestyle people choose for themselves, because I have chosen capitalism. What I saw growing up in the 60's and 70's is many individuals that were for a peaceful way of life and a life that was completely opposite of capitalism and the American way of life.

I just don't understand how people can call themselves hippies and choose a capitalistic way or life, is this not a contradiction in lifestyles?

Now I can see if someone was a hippie, then basically gave up that way or life and jumped to the other side, but how can they still be a hippie?

I guess what I am saying is what is the true definition of a hippie, because I think that many people may have a different version. Here is Wikipedia's definition.

Hippie


BTW excellent thread and input.

Originally posted by Royal76
Are you serious

Hippies are like a disease, i feel the same way Eric Cartman feels about them.

Remember the big drill tank he used to get through to the center of the drum circle? One of the top 5 television moments for sure.

Thinking about it makes me smile everytime. I hope its my death bed thought I leave this world with.

Originally posted by Realtruth
OK, I am seeing some contradictions is philosophies here. I truly don't care what lifestyle people choose for themselves, because I have chosen capitalism. What I saw growing up in the 60's and 70's is many individuals that were for a peaceful way of life and a life that was completely opposite of capitalism and the American way of life.

Well, shouldn't you be for a peacefull way of life, and why does that have to be in opposition to the American way of life?

Also, I forgot to say earlier the hippies are about spirituality and against material greed, but why that should be against the American way I don't nessecary see. Against corporate greed, yes, but I don't hope that's ALL America.

[edit on 11-5-2007 by khunmoon]

Originally posted by masqua
Lemmie see now... there's some generalizations going on here, me-thinks.

1. hippies lived on communes and were communists.
2. hippies were anti-establishment and called cops pigs
3. hippies were all into drugs

All of the above are general concepts and not the reality.

The primary idea behind the hippie movement was the desire to re-connect with nature and inner spirituality. Whatever thwarted that is what hippies fought against. The concept of group farming for the benefit of all within that group led to the idea of communes. It was a way to distance themselves from the established notion that you could not survive without corporate infrastructure.

In a very big way, when you talk about post-apocalyptic survivalism, you are mirroring the very idea behind the concept of communes. What that has to do with Communism, I have no idea.

Certainly, drugs played a major role in the hippie culture, and, imo, that was the cause of its' eventual fall from grace. The Charlie Manson episode, IMO, was the death-knell of the culture. We had lost our innocence because of it. If smoking pot made hippies what they were, then the world must be full of them since nearly everyone has inhaled.

To those who think it was totally about drugs, all I can say is Frank Zappa.

To those who would expound on the era, you are welcome to your opinions, but that is all they are. If you haven't been involved in or experienced that era first hand, then you will never really know and are forced to depend on the opinions of opinions to make more opinions.

Being 18 years old in '65 and becoming aware of a sub-culture in the years following was a life-changing awakening which has never left me. I am who I am today because of it and if you see me as a drug addled anti-social aberration, then you are very much mistaken.
[edit on 11/5/07 by masqua]

Masqua, well said. I think that too many people derive their ideas of hippies from the media. And there are no end to negative stereotypes there.

Originally posted by CreeWolf
What a bunch of tripe. You people are still being manipulated by the media with this "article". I suppose now they are your friends??

I don't understand what is so positive about this article. All it does is still promote an agenda (a "liberal" one obviously) and soften one thing the "hippies" stood for (anti-establishment). Today that establishment tells you to drive a hybrid, recycle pop cans, eat organic food and, with Al Gore, SAVE THE PLANET! Back then it was save the planet from the coming ICE AGE, and now (40 years later for you older hippies who are starting to have that early senility induced by years of pot smoke) its GLOBAL WARMING!

My point is, you can't remain a hippie if you are pro-establishment, so therefore, I'm throwing my aluminum cans wherever I please (they came from the earth, they can go back!), driving like a madman on under-inflated tires, eating Cheetos for breakfast (and throwing the bag out of my window), and encouraging GLOBAL WARMING so I don't get so chilly at night with my bedroom window open!

Again, a misconception. We weren't worried about another Ice Age, we talked then of global warming and it was back in the late '60's. I rememeber very well reading newspaper articles about the concern over global warming, not an ice age. The rest of your post is equally misinformed, IMHO.

Originally posted by khunmoon

Also, I forgot to say before the hippies are about spirituality and against material greed, but why that should be against the American way I don't nessecary see. Against corporate greed, yes, but I don't hope that's ALL America.

Do you drive a car, use gasoline, use electricity? Are on a industrial processed computer? Do you eat in large corporate restaurants? You live in a house? Do you buy processed foods? Every time you purchase one of these products or use the services it is a vote for greed and capitalism.

We are caught in a catch 22 and most people living in the USA and other civilized countries love their comforts.

The Native American's were the true hippies in my opinion, they lived off of the land without ever leaving a mark and respected everything in nature.

America was founded on greed, corruption, as was most civilized nation, if you think I am joking ask the Native Americans that are left.

In the US and many other countries if you choose to be passive you will get steam rolled over. If you choose not to work and have any property it will get taken away due to non-payment of taxes, but also if your lazy and have many children the system will provide a $hithole and basics just so you can get by. Honestly, our society doesn't make any sense at all. I don't have the answers, but I sure know what it is like to not have any money, live in poverty, and have no say because you don't have a dime to your name. I know capitalism may not be the answer, but it sucks to be on the bottom end of the system.

[edit on 11-5-2007 by Realtruth]

Originally posted by Royal76
Are you serious

They nearly destroyed the US once, now the same people are the ones who grew up and are running the US now. [edit on 11-5-2007 by Royal76]

So, let me get this straight, you're saying that George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, and the rest of the neo-cons were hippies????

Those of us who still consider ourselves hippies are not busy running the U.S. or any other govt. George W. Bush was in the same age group as hippies, but that's where his resemblance to any hippie stops. If that's your idea of what hippies are all about, you are very mistaken.

The basic principles of the hippy culture I can't disagree with

Peace
Love
Charity
Spirituality

et cetera.

However, from what I have read about them and heard about them, they didn't really practice what they preached. It's all well to say, "Hey, we should all go live in a tent somewhere and cook over an open campfire." But, are you doing it? If your not doing it yourself, then what moral right do you have to say that everyone else should live such a lifestyle? You don't have one.



[edit on 11-5-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Just couldn't help jumping in here for a second.

As someone old enough to remember the real hippies but not be one (they were a a few years older than me), I remember them as being incredibly spoiled, self-righteous hypocrites who told people to "do your own thing," but only as long as your thing was the same as theirs.

A lot of doing their own thing had to do with getting high, an activity which started out mellow with flower power and all that nonsense, but quickly degenerated into people taking all kinds of drugs like speed and heroin that soured everything and gave their enemies a reason to start that stupid War on Drugs, which still wastes billions every year and helps finance all kinds of CIA nastiness around the globe (and at home -- shhh). Hippies have a way of spoiling everything they get involved with.

They had a real problem with what they called "authority," which was their way of identifying social norms and legislation that either suggested or required conformity. "You can't tell me what to do, man!"

As far as them being "right all along," goes, they're only right now because "might makes right," and they've had the numbers and the decades to force people to do things their way.

Now, after all these years, they've become "The Man," and you have to do what they say and if you don't, you're a bad person. Heaven forbid you think recycling is just a joke purpetrated by the aluminum and plastic industries to get you to cut their production costs and boost their profits, and encouraged by the government so they won't have to create real programs for the homeless. Lately, you're evil if you don't think humans can have that big of an impact on global warming, positive or negative. And if a person adds a racial slur to his attack on another person, suddenly they get double the fine, which is all about punishing people for their thoughts and attitudes, not their deeds. Again, if you don't think like the hippies, then you're a bad person.

The whole environmental movement arose out of a ridiculous socialist nostalgia the hippies picked up in college from reading too much Karl Marx and Henry David Thoreau. They all wanted to go "back to nature" and live on communes and grow organic vegetables. More selfish nonsense. They could play farmer because they were the wealthy, spoiled kids of hard working WWII vets, and could afford it. It's too expensive for everyone to live like that. Still, it became the ideal, and if you didn't go along with it, you were "bringing them down."

These hippies now drive big SUVs and are pushing toward "retirement." They can be expected to rape our Social Security system to get what they want and leave it a shambles. They've always been there first to take the good stuff, ruin it, and leave behind their garbage. But I guess that's just them "doing their own thing."

Hippies can go to hell.

[edit on 11-5-2007 by SuicideVirus]

Oh, just to add one more thing.

The kids you see these days who are kind of "neo-hippies" are similar to the old-school hippies in that they are equally self-centered and spoiled. They also like to get high and listen to too much loud music. To give them credit, though, at least they admit they're spoiled and self-centered, and aren't nearly as strident about forcing other people to think the same way they do. So far, fortunately, they're pretty apolitical, although that could change as they get older.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
You know Grover, I raise my own food too. I also hunt. I can and preserve and practice fundamental skills like fire starting without tools and rope making and home building and it has nothing to do with the hippie ideal. I do it for self reliance. I do it because I dont want to be dependent on the system now or once the NWO forces it on everyone. Whats this Bahai thing you keep mentioning? I remember some online "whats your faith" quiz and it told me thats what I would enjoy. Not that I would join any organized religion. From what I read its pretty hardline conservative.

Ahh but there is an ideal behind the self-reliance. I learned how to do those things in order to be self reliant because I felt a disconnet between my ideals and the reality. I am not worried about any NWO because the people and the corporations that are pushing it are doing so in such a heavy handed manner that is never going to happen... regionalisms and cultures are pushing back which is so much of what this so called war on terror is all about.
As for the Baha'i's, there is a good article about it on Wikipedia that is very even handed.

en.wikipedia.org...

As for being hard line conservative... if it was I wouldn't have anything to do with it. All religious organizations are by their nature conservative but for the most part the Baha'i's are the most tolerant and humane people I know.

As for the hippies being hypocrites... I have noticed that many of you hard line conservatives hold your opponents to a higher ideal than you hold members of your own ideology to. There are hypocrites everywhere... the disconnect between ideology and reality is often stark but the hippies in their own way epitiomized the American dream of both self reliance and concern for community. Did they succeed? No but that just proves that they were human, it doesn't change the fact that their ideals were and are worth striving for.