Messiah

Here is a scenario.
There is a man alive today that many christians believe is the Messiah. The Fremasons say if it is a very bright sunny on the day they see him then he is the bringer of light The Architect. The Born Again Christians say if he is the bringer of light then he is the Antichrist , Lucifer. The Jews ask is he Jewish ? If the Messiah is not Jewish then he is neither Messiah or Christ or Anti Christ, as he must be Jewish. The Muslims ask is he a Muslim ? If not he can not be the Iman Al-Mahdi. The Buddhists say he is not the Messiah , Avalotkiteshvara as he is the Dalai Lama . The Hindus ask is he Hindu? If not then can he be the Messiah Kalki? The Moonies say he is not the Messiah or Christ as the Rev. Sun Myung Moon is God and was crowned in a US senate building on 23 March 2004. Nonsense say Osho Rajneesh devotees God has been and gone already.The Scientologists say this is a lie as Their Messiah is Mr. Cruise is alive but will only save Scientologists. But how can this be true we all know the Messiah is Jose De Jesús Miranda the Puerto Rican Christ / Antichrist. The Pagans ask is he a druid ? The Saviour will be a druid ,Merlin. The Ba'hai say maybe he is Messiah of all the Religions? The Fundamentalist Christians say if he is all the religions Messiah then he is the Anti Christ, Lucifer the bringer of Light. But isnt Jesus Christ Light of the World: (John 8:1) ask the Agnostic Scholars? No the light is Lucifer the Masonic Messiah the all seeing eye say the Catholics. But this is a lie say the Protestants Christ the Messiah is the Light Ps. 27: 1 , Isa. 2: 5 , Isa. 60: 19, Luke 2: 32, John 1: 4 , John 1: 9, John 8: 12, Eph. 5: 14, Rev. 21: 23 , 2 Ne. 10: 14 , 3 Ne. 15: 9 , 3 Ne. 18: 24, Ether 4: 12 , D&C 6: 21, D&C 84: 45 , D&C 93: 9. The Jehovas say there is no God but Jehova . .....and the whole World awaits the Messiah !!!

Why do you think he has not made himself public ? Remeber what happened first time round ? The bickering and strife that his public pressence would bring and the evil chaos and wars unjustly made in his name would be reason enough. But Global Genocide in some twisted horror movie logic end times scenario from the Dark Ages would reduce the Messiah to no more than an actor . Do you honestly believe that the Messiah would follow the pre arranged scripted scene by scene nightmare book of revelations ? He is the Prince of Peace not a genocidal maniac. He saves the children heals the sick . Why do so many people believe he wants infanticde , Global Chemical , Biological and Nuclear Warefare , Ethnic Sectarian cleansing and Genocide just to rid the world of his Adversary that his own father set him up to fight ? Surely you can see that this is the opposite of all that is Good and Godly. What paradise would be left for The Messiah and his followers? Think it through , after Armaggeddon , the Earth would be a toxic wasteland , uninhabitable , radioactive and destroyed for Tens of Thousands of years , possibly Millions of years....sounds like hell on Earth.
But this is all supposing that he survives the hundreds of assassination attempts that would be made on his life and the kidnappings of his family members for political black mailing.How many men in black security guards would he have? How would he meet the people? And what about global goverment ? Many Christians and conspiracy theorists believe Global Govermant is evil. So the King of the World would be opposed by just about everyone.

The Messiah can not be expected to endure such folly , and who can blame him for staying underground living amongst real people living a simple life.

I fear for the day any such messiah steps forward, because so many people will try to kill him, unless he's invincible. . . which i doubt. I believe that if a messiah does come we will only have one chance. i voted u for the way above award, great post.

Right. The messiah will never come because He/She was never here to begin with. Jesus and all the other religious "beings" that were mentioned in the first post only exsist in books and legend. Even though there is proof that many of the Bibles entrants did exsist. Whether in there biblical or historical happenings I doubt that they were anything more than outspoken farmers.

I still would love to be proven wrong bye a visit from any one of the afore mentioned characters. But I seriously doubt that anyone of them would be neither arsed or bothered!! LOL

Seriously though... You up there?

One question is if any of those prophesies were true, what are the odds that it would come to pass completely? meaning, given chance that either the foretold antichrist or messiah (lets think label free and generically) showed up or didn;t follow through, or suppose there is a predestination paradox with the fruition of the antichrist or what some call a causal loop...for example suppose something occurred either to destroy by chance either of these individuals or entities before fulfilling prophecy...why is it something that must come to pass and play completely ? most believers in a religion seem to believe the prophecies will play out exactly and flawlessly....??? when you think of the conspiracy theories it really kind of proves more that satan is real and uses people to carry out the acceleration to armageddon, but suppose armegeddon happened and there was never anything else to come come afterwards that was good? because the messiah never materialized...I don't know this post made me really think of the validity of it all.

[edit on 28-4-2007 by phinubian]

[edit on 28-4-2007 by phinubian]

I feel bad that you took that much time and effort to write about that looney toon.

He isnt the antichrist, nor is he christ, hes a quack. I think we will be able to tell when they actually arrive, i dont think theyd have a small little cult and doing news interviews explaining his "666" tatoo, lol, what a joke.

Seriously.. give him not another single thought.

Originally posted by Haus33
The Jews ask is he Jewish ? If the Messiah is not Jewish then he is neither Messiah or Christ or Anti Christ, as he must be Jewish.

Actually, this is not quite true. The Jews do not have (for the most part) any prerequisites related to ethnicity. Many feel believe (and are glad) that Messiah will be for EVERYONE....all people will be blessed by GOD's anointed representative's presence among us.

Another predominant idea is that Messiah's soul is kept with God until there arises a tzaddik (saint) who both qualifies and is willing to do this service for mankind in the name of GOD - at a time after which they have finally secured God's blessing over their own personal efforts in bringing about the messianic age (these efforts are basically rooted in love, forgiveness, charity, and returning to God's ways).

They believe that in every generation there is a possible Messiah but that Messiah will not emerge/arrive until they have done their best in their own part of the work.

From my personal studies (rather extensive and not restricted according to any certain religious ideas of my own) I have found that, in fact, the Jewish traditions have far less pre-expectations of any other messianic belief system! They have been misled a few times by persons claiming to be Messiah, but who later was proven to be after their own ends rather than God's or the world's. Yet they remain open to any new claims and will not doubt anyone who makes such a claim until circumstances show the claim is false. Because of the unfortunate events which have occurred with past claimants, I do think that there is far less chance of anyone making the claim without divine appointment. I think there is a lot more trepidation because of it.

Just FYI. Also - Messiah will be a 'universal soul' - many Jews believe in reincarnation so they understand Messiah's soul has been here, many time and many places, in diverse cultures/religions, for the purpose of ultimately being able to be empathetic and sincerely compassionate for ALL people!

The Muslims ask is he a Muslim ? If not he can not be the Iman Al-Mahdi. The Fundamentalist Christians say if he is all the religions Messiah then he is the Anti Christ, Lucifer the bringer of Light.

And yet...why not YES to all of those questions? If there is but ONE God then surely one Messiah would suffice for all religions and even atheists and agnostics?

But isn't Jesus Christ Light of the World: (John 8:1) ask the Agnostic Scholars?

That's what I understand! The 'bright and morning star' - which is lucifer (Latin), heosphoros (Greek), or helel (Hebrew).

Revelation 2:26-28
And he that overcomes, and keeps my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. And I will give him the morning star.

So..the one who returns to rule will be 'given' the morning star...yet this is Christ Jesus speaking, so it certainly implies that it will not be him ruling, in person, down here on Earth. Which makes sense, taking into account that Christ is at the 'right hand' of the Heavenly throne. So perhaps someone is going to be ruling mankind/the world according to God's will (through Christ), instead of Christ. Because, surely if he were going to ultimately be in 'two places at once,' there would have been no need to keep us waiting 2000+ years (through some of the worst violence and misery we've known - and much of it done, supposedly, in the various names of God!)

No, the light is Lucifer the Masonic Messiah the all seeing eye say the Catholics.

Well, since the Catholics are NOT Masons, they probably don't realize that there is no standard or official 'messiah' in the Masonic fraternity!

Besides that, whomever that 'eye' might be physically connected to...who is ultimately seeing through that eye? God! At least according to King David:

Psalms 32:
8 I will instruct thee and teach thee in the way which thou shalt go: I will guide thee with mine eye.
9 Be ye not as the horse, as the mule, have no understanding: whose mouth must be held in with bit and bridle, lest they come near unto thee.
10 Many sorrows to the wicked: but he that trusts in the LORD, mercy shall compass him about.
11 Be glad in the LORD, and rejoice, ye righteous: and shout for joy, all upright in heart.

Many believe that this is the 'third eye.'

.....and the whole World awaits the Messiah !!!

You know, from what I know, God is extremely EFFICIENT - which seems logical if He is legit (and I personally am sure that He is). So the most efficient plan, IMO, would be 'ONE for ALL' Messiah.
One size fits all, satisfaction guaranteed, so to speak! ALL in ALL. Last time I checked, all still meant 'all-inclusive' and so there is nothing that won't be in that 'ALL.'

And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which works all in all.
1 Corinthians 12:6

And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
1 Corinthians 15:28

Ephesians 1:20-23
Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set at his own right hand in the heavenly, far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: And has put all under his feet, and gave him the head over all to the church, Which is his body, the fullness of him that fills all in all.

Why do you think he has not made himself public?

It's not quite time for that yet. The 'hot-line' hasn't rang yet with the word of 'All Systems Go.' Obviously we are in the 'lock and load' phase.

Remember what happened first time round?

Vividly. Yes in DEED. Perhaps that was partly due to premature 'game-play?' Or maybe not - that was just a random thought of mine just now.

The bickering and strife that his public presence would bring and the evil chaos and wars unjustly made in his name would be reason enough.

It is definitely going to be the irreversible undoing of many elitist types of religious institutions, certainly including the 9,000 or so various flavors of Protestant Christianity and the Catholic and Orthodox churches, also.
By that, I only mean, definitely, that the dogma of elitist, conditional salvation will be rendered null and void and so many will redirect their loyalties to the 'true' church - it is the institutions, themselves, in their Earthly workings, that will be exposed. No more income or 'trafficking' (which is the same as commercial trade/merchandising) in the House of God! The grand finale of the overthrow of the temple moneychangers? That, in itself, will be quite a sight! Maybe, that is.

Who knows how these things will unfold? That, to me, is part of the anticipation!

But Global Genocide in some twisted horror movie logic end times scenario from the Dark Ages would reduce the Messiah to no more than an actor.

NO doubt. I don't think God would do that to his elected servant, do you? That is what men HOPE and believe will happen...
You'd think we'd of had enough killing and all with the Civil War and the two World Wars! I HAVE.

Do you honestly believe that the Messiah would follow the pre-arranged scripted scene by scene nightmare book of Revelation?

Well, certainly not according to the prevailing interpretation as promoted mainly by the Evangelicals!

Probably the book of Revelation IS a guide and/or road-map to assist those working toward God's wrap-up of the present age (which is in its last death-throes). But if so, then it is in CODE and of such a supreme type that ONLY those who God intends it for would be granted understanding of the true import. That is why that scroll is 'sealed' with seven seals. In the days it was written, Kings (and other high up officials) would seal all their official documents with their own seal (usually kept as a 'signet' ring on their right or left hand). That way, when the document/message arrived at its destination, whomever was in charge of opening in would KNOW FOR SURE that the King DID indeed authorize the contents; and, if received with seal intact, were then NOT tampered with or altered in any way.
Signet Ring

He is the Prince of Peace not a genocidal maniac.

That is CORRECT! The Prince of PEACE! World peace for all mankind! The very thing which the Evangelicals say is EVIL! Ben Franklin said there was no such thing as a 'good' war or a 'bad' peace! I wholeheartedly agree!

He saves the children heals the sick . Why do so many people believe he wants infanticde , Global Chemical , Biological and Nuclear Warefare , Ethnic Sectarian cleansing and Genocide just to rid the world of his Adversary that his own father set him up to fight ?

You know why! Because this is the 'evil' that resides in the hearts of men! It will never be something God kills us all for (again) BUT it is definitely NOT God's way, but man's!
This is the 'anti' christ which is the type which is 'opposition' against all that is of Christ - Christ is NOT divided nor is He a divider....He is the TRUTH, LIGHT, and WAY. The express image of God. And God IS love - long-suffering, merciful, and QUICK to forgive!

(continued below)

Surely you can see that this is the opposite of all that is Good and Godly.

I see it quite clearly and without distortion. But then again, many who call themselves after Christ have pronounced judgment against ME being of the 'devil' or 'misled' by deceiving spirits, etc. Supposedly my fruit is 'rotten' and that proves, to them, that I am of the 'wrong tree.'

I say THANKS! Just as you accused Jesus of having a devil, so do you accuse me! That is GOOD! (for me)

But this is all supposing that he survives the hundreds of assassination attempts that would be made on his life and the kidnappings of his family members for political black mailing.How many men in black security guards would he have? How would he meet the people? And what about global goverment ? Many Christians and conspiracy theorists believe Global Govermant is evil. So the King of the World would be opposed by just about everyone.

Why would Messiah need human-organized protection or security measures?
Messiah is IMMORTAL and KNOWS it.

The Messiah can not be expected to endure such folly , and who can blame him for staying underground living amongst real people living a simple life.

Really. I agree. Although I don't personally believe that Messiah is going to be able to remain in the private and peaceful humble abode that would be paradise for such a one. After all, Messiah will prove God IS real! No more arguing between atheists and theists! Or between various factions of Abrahamic religions as to WHO God loves BEST! God loves us ALL BEST!

Messiah will be forfeiting/sacrificing personal paradise and tranquility for the sake of all mankind. From peace in 'heaven' to rescue on a global scale in 'hell'....and by bringing the real TRUTH of God for all men to prove with their own hearts...it is certainly true that the light will be brought to Earth to light up all of creation. The 'fall' is not something God is mad about...nor is it a bid for heavenly rule...it is a deliberate and indescribable sacrifice of an original seat of honor in 'heaven' so that no human being will ever disappear into nothingness never having known that God IS real and God IS love.

Of course, that is something I have stated before - and will again - and I realize it is way too beyond anyone's ideas of what God is all about (or, rather, MOST people's) and truly, it IS hard to understand from the standard dualistic good/evil human perspective of reality. But if duality is discarded and God is truly understood to be ONE - united and solitary in intention, purpose, and thought...then it becomes more and more clear that there is nothing God created to harm or punish us.

Secret
AgenT
maN

G ood
O rderly
D irection



[edit on 4/29/2007 by queenannie38]

I made the Messianic paradox a hypothetical scenario ,but I did research the information.
According to this website and many others the Messiah of the Jews must be Jewish!

www.jewsforjudaism.org

[edit on 29-4-2007 by Haus33]

TextText Blue


The Freemasons are non-denominational .They accept members of all faiths .
However the majority of the membership are Christian Jew and Moslem and as all three of these faiths expect a Messiah so does the Fraternity. The Masonic expectation is of an Enlightened being that will bring together harmony between the three faiths . He is the Architect and therefore likes symmetry ,order and harmony, not chaos infighting and sectarian strife. However some believe this Messiah is the all seeing eye of Lucifer the bringer of light.

www.his-forever.com...

The evil cretin LeVey says:

"Satanic ritual is a blend of Gnostic, Kabbalistic, Hermetic, and Masonry elements, incorporating nomenclature and vibratory words of power from virtually every mythos."


THE SATANIC RITUALS COMPANION TO THE SATANIC BIBLE
By Anton Szandor LaVey

[edit on 29-4-2007 by Haus33]

Originally posted by blue73
Seriously though... You up there?

No. Down here with you. Alive and in person...and not alone.

What can I do for you?

indeed great post haus33

Messiah has come before and he will come to us and deliver us.
He is our own. He came for us and he will come again for us.
The day Messiah comes forth he will not be mocked, he will not be harmed.
There is but one Messiah who has been and is returning to us.

He will come and bring with him everything we need for our salvation.
Look to him now. Yeshua ha Messiah. Jesus the Christ. The Christians call him Jesus. We call him Yeshua. But whatever you call him, seek HIM! not religon, not temperal things, just place your faith in the Messiah. For he is coming.

Messiah is for ALL people, every people will know it is HE!


Shalom for the Earth

It's wrong to expect someone to resolve all your problems while you cannot resolve violence with your neighbors.

Or let me put that way... If God gave you hands and brain, why don't you all use them to create better living conditions and to oppose those who create bad living conditions? Do you need messiah to tell you that? Get real for a change.

Opposing those who create bad living conditions is us still opposing them, still causing problems because they define good living condtions differnetly than us.
The things we do have weight and importance of course, but Messiah will help to create the perfect balance of how different people with differnet views can live perfecly together, that we, imperfect humans, can not create.

Shalom for the Earth

[edit on 18-5-2007 by Tzuri]

the only people who can be justifiably considered to be the messiah,christ,pahana,lif,Maitreya,Mahdi etc figure is someone who provides evidence to show he has fulfilled all the prophecies of such a person. It'll occur and there is such a person proving that now, magnusalexa.tripod.com...

wot people believe doesnt matter, wot people do does.

Originally posted by thegreatestone
the only people who can be justifiably considered to be the messiah,christ,pahana,lif,Maitreya,Mahdi etc figure is someone who provides evidence to show he has fulfilled all the prophecies of such a person. It'll occur and there is such a person proving that now, ht/magnusalexa.tripod.com

You are expressing your claim a little modestly.
The name given by the messiah, mahdi, maitreya, etc. on your link is Magnus Rawston.
Your own name is given as "The great (i.e.Magnus) stone".
I take it, then, that you are the same person.

If I was the Jewish messiah I would give the following explanation for my tardiness.

Because my prophet John the Baptist was killed by Herod who between him and his father had killed a number of the chosen ones of that day. I slapped them with the curse of Malachi. A two thousand year top level Leviticus 26 curse. As explained by the book of Hosea. They were not ready for the restoration of Israel. And the curse has yet to run out. But the end of the curse is very near now. 2028 at the latest. And remember one thing. The Jews were expecting 3 chosen ones. One is very overdue.

[edit on 15-6-2010 by ntech]

'Es not the messiah he's a naughty little boy!

thank- you Monty Python

Originally posted by Tzuri
Messiah has come before and he will come to us and deliver us.
He is our own. He came for us and he will come again for us.
The day Messiah comes forth he will not be mocked, he will not be harmed.
There is but one Messiah who has been and is returning to us.

He will come and bring with him everything we need for our salvation.
Look to him now. Yeshua ha Messiah. Jesus the Christ. The Christians call him Jesus. We call him Yeshua. But whatever you call him, seek HIM! not religon, not temperal things, just place your faith in the Messiah. For he is coming.

Messiah is for ALL people, every people will know it is HE!


Shalom for the Earth

Seek not for the Messiah, nor worship Him.

Seek instead for His teachings and guidance. He brings nothing new to the world that other great Teachers had not taught.

He comes only to give confidence to you that there is a Creator, and it is Him that your prayers and daily life should be aligned to His concern for us all, having given us free will.

To go againsts His guidance, is to know sorrow and pain, and that is NOT what our Creator wants of His children and creations.

This is the second age of enlightenment already. The first was in the 16th century when some of mankind were freed from the masters hold, and began to question life and existance. It was also the base upon which many national constitutions which gave freedoms back to humanity were composed.

In this second age of enlightenment, the mortal incompetent masters had been exposed for all to see in broad daylight, their greed and manipulations.

Each must be awaken and to help others begining with families, relatives and friends to be awaken and to do what is necessary to regain that freedom, as well as those peaceful aspirations all humans created was entitled to.

Trust not a mortal's word anymore, but seek, study, and comprehend what divine Teachers had taught mankind all along, back to the better path set out by our creator.

Free will still exist and is an eternal promise, but is a double edge sword - use correctly, and evolution will progress. Used wrongly, and only doom will come.

Trust not even my words, for I am only an insignificant mortal, but look around you, christian, jews, hindus, buddhists, atheist, freethinkers, etc, rationalise and contemplate if what I had posted rings true.

Originally posted by Haus33
The Messiah can not be expected to endure such folly , and who can blame him for staying underground living amongst real people living a simple life.

that means that he's just an ordinary man with ordinary fears, then.
GOD wouldn't choose someone who would choose self-preservation over the mission at hand.
Jesus could have done the same thing, too. but he didn't, because he WAS a messiah.
GOD does not anoint anyone who is not a team player (TEaM PLAyeR = templar)

besides that, messiahs are revealed, not declared.